pet 2.0 feedback and suggestions from a dedicated 'breeder'

[morningstar999]

As someone who’s been on warframe for nearly 5 years, and in that time have bred 100’s of kubrow and kavats, as well as written breeding guides, price guides along with running a successful (2,700+) kubrow/kavat discord and helping to run the kubrow facebook group (also 2,700+ other members) I figured I should give my feedback on the proposed companion changes, as I talk to a lot of players and other ‘companion breeders’ daily who also share the same sort of feelings and concerns as well. 

A pet rework, especially for kubrow has been a long time coming, and a lot of us have been waiting for changes for a good while now, many of the kubrow breed tend to not be very useful particularly for ‘vets’ and high mastery people, with Smeeta kavats being the most used and the others mostly ignored as a result. 
(Smeeta is good as is, just other companions are in dire need of a buff and change)  

Pet Stasis is being removed completely. Stasis Slots instead becoming Pet/Companion Slots.

This is something that has been needed for a long time, changing pets is currently slow and annoying. 
The biggest request I also see is the ability to be able to make imprints of one companion, whilst being able to use another in missions, this is something we seriously hope you consider adding when stasis is removed. (alongside being able to take imprints from kittens/puppies) 

Being able to see if a kavat/kubrow has had its imprints taken (and how many) displayed on the selection screen would also be good, though not as needed if switching between companions is now quick. 
Another thing to add would be a search and organise function, being able to find a particular breed or name would probably save most players a lot of time. 

Some people are concerned about price changes or wanting refunds on ‘stasis slots’ I am going to assume that ‘pet slots’ will remain 10p each and all stasis slots will become companion slots, thus no refunds or whatever would need to be done. 

Gearwheel-like commands will be implemented, allowing you to tell your Companion to follow/guard/etc.

I have seen mixed feedback on this idea, personally it is a good one, especially if  there is a ‘recall’ function so your companion teleports back to you when it gets stuck in a door or wall for example. 
Really though fit it is a ‘wheel’ we need to have the ability to be-able to hotkey the commands as constantly having to select the wheel will slow down gameplay and make it annoying. 

Genetic Heritage is being looked into. So the more you breed your pets, there is the possibility of special traits being passed along: a Kubrow that is predisposed towards hating Grineer, a Kavat with an innate damage type resistance, etc.

Many players are having concerns about this, partly as not enough information is given and partly some are worried that this will make them too much like rivens. (aka the metta combo will be found out then people will only want that)
When mixing prints with the kubrow get both traits from each print? How many traits can a pet have? Will the traits have % odds, how will this affect existing kubrow will they just be giving random stats, meaning your 8 forma solid gold sahasa suddenly gets some horrible stat you don’t want?
Adding combat traits is in theory good, but it needs to be done carefully so that there’s a limit on the amount of traits that can be bred in and that each trait is fairly equal to each other so there's a use for all of them. 

Kubrows will be getting randomized heads and tails!

Again we’d like a little more information, will there be rare heads/tails like there are rare colors?  (we were told there was not going to be rare colors on kavats, and yet thanks to research we found out that not to be true, even if you can buy all the kavat colors on the market, please this time be honest with us when they come out as if there's a rare factor or not.) 

Will existing kubrow get random head/tails or will they stay the same? -Everyone I have spoken to so far (including non ‘breeders’) are very concerned about this. After spending a tonne of plat to breed or buy a particular combo to then have it ruined by a random head/tail would be devastating to many, please just leave existing kubrow as it is. 

(Persian heads on kavats was changed without the ability to keep the old one, which was very disappointing to some for example)

Will the amount of imprints we can make be changed to three? (we do NOT want this, please, please, please this will make rare and exotic kubrow no longer rare and ruin the breeding aspect of the game, rare color and patterns are the lifeblood of the breeding community, and making them common as to be semi-worthless, many of us has put 1000’s of hours into making perfect combos, it would be a shame ruin that.) 

Another plea in general is to keep color and pattern rarity the same, and limited to breeding only. 

Moa Set Mods are in the works as well.

Perfect moa’s need a little more love. 

Howl on Huras will not make enemies run away, so you can actually shoot them

Firstly howl is a Raska ability, huras is the one that causes invisibility, some people are kinda concerned that you don’t even remember your own kubrow, considering its been 5-6 years since you’ve done anything with them.  

Secondly however this is a good change, having it so howl causes them to just ‘shake in fear’ rather than run away would be nice. A shorter cool down would also be nice. 

Helminth’s maggots will be getting a buff
Good. 
If you're going to add ‘traits’ to Helminth’s it would be nice if we could imprint and mix them as well, even if it will be just limited to mixing them with other Helminth’s only. 

Sheldon mentioned a Sunika rework!
 
Sunika has been the most useless breed for a while now, the whole ‘take down a capture target’ barely worked when you could move faster than the kubrow could. 

A suggestion would be change it so it gives a random buff to your warframe (or a weakness to surrounding enemies, like amour reduction or something) 

General notes on abilities: 
Chesa got reworked but everyone hates it,  its desecrate needs to proc more often, work with frames like necros, etc and perhaps have a slightly higher chance of getting rarer resources to drop, this would make usable and good for ‘younger’ players. 

Sahahsa only digging up stuff when no enemies are about, means you have to slow down and hide a lot if you want it to try and get energy for you, breaking the flow of the game. This is annoying to allow it to be-able to dig during combat, every x seconds or something. 
 
Attacking and damage output for kubrows in general needs to be buffed. We have status mods for companions yet they all do basically no status to start so it makes them almost useless, some base status and more crit base would be nice, just for starters. 

Another suggestion I saw by someone else was having it so ‘attack’ mods and survival mods have their own separate modding section (so like sentinels have their main body then their weapon separate) This personally I feel would be a good idea, there’s now a lot of mods for kubrows/kavats now and it's hard to fit in the combination you want, you tend to be able to have ‘ability mods and survival’ or ‘attack and ability’ but not really both, as there's not enough mod slots to make a kubrow ‘good for high end’ especially in terms of it being able to kill anything above level 30. 
 

also an improvement to fur texture on kubrow would be appreciated, they look a lot less 'fancy' than the rest of the game now, and sometimes look a bit out of place and have slightly buggy texture in general. 

@[DE]Sheldon (can't seem to figure out if they are on here/wont let me ping) 

I recommend considering dropping into the kubrow/kavat discord for more feedback from other dedicated breeders, as there's plenty of us that drop 1000's of plat just into breeding, so would appreciate it if our feedback was even just considered. thanks. (In Fact some of mainly play the game for the sole aspect of breeding virtual pets, and the community that surrounds it) https://discord.gg/w8uH4mF

 

Edited February 6, 2020 by morningstar999

[(PSN)corpusbonds]

I agree with everything here, especially the command wheel.

I may be a minority but I’m not looking forward to that aspect at all. Being that on a PS4 user with a controller, I already have issues with with main features wheel (over clicking being one of them), and having to pause and open it to find what you need in the heat of battle breaks the flow of the game. 
 
 If- like mentioned above- we could map this to something easier that won’t get in the way, I’d be all for it.

Edit: Also like to add about how would it affect our current gear wheel? Would we have to open that up, then tap all the way over like gear/emotes? Or will it be something like R1 and left Dpad (command for Railjack)? How can it be made to be viable enough that it won’t stop Tenno dead in their track from their missions?

Edited February 6, 2020 by (PS4)corpusbonds

[Caoin]

Even if attack mods and survival mods aren't given separate segments, at least splitting off the species precepts into their own thing would be an improvement.

[morningstar999]

also want to add another suggestion; can kubrow eggs please be updated to be affected by resource boosters? Now there's no limit to pick-up and kavat dna is affected by them (both drop chance and double scans) it only seem logical kubrow eggs should be affected by the boosters as well. 

thanks 

[(XBOX)Red Dough Boy]

Will my Kubrow's health still degrade over time? If so I'd rather have stasis slots that are instant instead of having a Kubrow degrade if I'm not able to play much, or if i'm leveling other things and letting my Kubrow chill. 

[(PSN)BlightDragon89]

Pets just need a big buff all around. Their current place in the game is a furry friend that hangs in our orbiter. That makes Oberon's passive pretty useless as well. Sentinel's are the most useful and longest living companions, and the rest are flatly unused as they just die at meid to high level missions. I feel like the game grew, a good start on endgame has been made, and pets and Moa's are so not able to handle it at all.

I like the idea of being able to bread stronger pets, but if that is going to be for kubros and kavats, please make kavat genetic codes way easier to get. Farming them is such a pain rn that a lot of players don't even bother anymore. I'm guessing this might be like our ability to combine kuva weapons, only with breeding animals. There are a few niches that vets have the option of going into, such as the Eidolon hunters, the Arbitration masters ect. Breeding I think could be make a fun nich if a new system really takes into account the things said here in this thread.

Personally @morningstar999 I would like to check out your breeding discord if you are interested in new members. PM me if you like. I'm max rank on PS4 now and am always looking for something to do to have fun and help out my clan with info. Either way thank you for your feedback on this, was all very well said and written.

MAKE PETS USEFUL AGAIN!

[(XBOX)Red Dough Boy]

21 minutes ago, (PS4)BlightDragon89 said:

Pets just need a big buff all around. Their current place in the game is a furry friend that hangs in our orbiter. That makes Oberon's passive pretty useless as well. Sentinel's are the most useful and longest living companions, and the rest are flatly unused as they just die at meid to high level missions. I feel like the game grew, a good start on endgame has been made, and pets and Moa's are so not able to handle it at all.

I like the idea of being able to bread stronger pets, but if that is going to be for kubros and kavats, please make kavat genetic codes way easier to get. Farming them is such a pain rn that a lot of players don't even bother anymore. I'm guessing this might be like our ability to combine kuva weapons, only with breeding animals. There are a few niches that vets have the option of going into, such as the Eidolon hunters, the Arbitration masters ect. Breeding I think could be make a fun nich if a new system really takes into account the things said here in this thread.

Personally @morningstar999 I would like to check out your breeding discord if you are interested in new members. PM me if you like. I'm max rank on PS4 now and am always looking for something to do to have fun and help out my clan with info. Either way thank you for your feedback on this, was all very well said and written.

MAKE PETS USEFUL AGAIN!

There are some decent ways to heal Kubrows and keep them alive at higher levels, but the main thing I could see helping would be keeping them close so they don't run into high level enemies and die constantly. That I will agree makes them a bit of a liability. My main Kubrow I deploy with is a Raksa so he has the predisposition to stay closer and only attacks enemies that are a bit closer They can be more aggressive at lower levels, but at high levels they need to stay closer so they don't get jumped by groups of enemies. Phoenix renewal applies to Kubrows as well as far as I know so that's another way to keep them alive. I'm not much of a fan of Sentinels since they can't be revived, and only get to revive themselves the one time, they do have the advantage of range and staying close to the Warframe though. 

Edited February 6, 2020 by (XB1)Red Dough Boy

[morningstar999]

54 minutes ago, (PS4)BlightDragon89 said:

Pets just need a big buff all around. Their current place in the game is a furry friend that hangs in our orbiter. That makes Oberon's passive pretty useless as well. Sentinel's are the most useful and longest living companions, and the rest are flatly unused as they just die at meid to high level missions. I feel like the game grew, a good start on endgame has been made, and pets and Moa's are so not able to handle it at all.

I like the idea of being able to bread stronger pets, but if that is going to be for kubros and kavats, please make kavat genetic codes way easier to get. Farming them is such a pain rn that a lot of players don't even bother anymore. I'm guessing this might be like our ability to combine kuva weapons, only with breeding animals. There are a few niches that vets have the option of going into, such as the Eidolon hunters, the Arbitration masters ect. Breeding I think could be make a fun nich if a new system really takes into account the things said here in this thread.

Personally @morningstar999 I would like to check out your breeding discord if you are interested in new members. PM me if you like. I'm max rank on PS4 now and am always looking for something to do to have fun and help out my clan with info. Either way thank you for your feedback on this, was all very well said and written.

MAKE PETS USEFUL AGAIN!

you  can  just join via the link in  the original post 🙂

the discord is open to anyone interested in kavat/kubrows, old and new players. 

kavat codes are a lot better to farm then they used to be (25% chance now) and there's lots of methods to increase the odds (drop chance boosters, using the balistica prime and scanning the ghosts, farming in a team to make more spawn etc) 

[morningstar999]

Another very important thing a lot of people would really love to see is the ability to be able to link imprints in chat! 

being able to link then rather than constantly having to go to the dojo to show them in trade would save people a lot of time.  (people i've met didn't even know you can preview them in trade, its not the most obvious thing.) 

 

[KittyKath]

On 2020-02-05 at 9:00 PM, KittyKath said:

"Training" our pets into certain spec instead of genetic heritage would be simpler on everyone.

 

There's still gonna be some grind to teach our companion to (This is only an example😞

-Take reduced damage against corpus. (Would require to do 15 corpus mission of at least level20 without the kavat dying.)

-25% to confuse enemies on hit. (I don't have any idea for that one.)

-Or anything DE has in mind as bonus we could get.

 

On 2020-02-06 at 5:34 AM, DoomFruit said:

Use Nyx abilities when you have the pet equipped. Learn by example.

I was too lazy to re-write it so I posted my quote and the answer of a kind soul (Thanks DoomFruit!) because I think that it would be a good idea and deserved a re-call here.

[Devin]

I know we have minimal info on the whole genetic heritage/buffs/traits thing, but I think a neat way to keep it "fair" to existing pets would be to add the classic "nature vs nurture" debate into it. Perhaps your pet is bred with a specific trait, and maybe by mixing pets with the same trait, it can get stronger as generations pass. But also, for people who don't want that sort of investment, "nurture" could come into play. Maybe through Master Teasonai, or some other mean, you could re-select what bonus your companion has, or enhance it through training or something similar. So you could get the same bonus as a companion bred with it, but through a different method. This could be fair to old/existing pets and new ones, and also could benefit differing play styles (people who enjoy breeding kavats and kubrow, or those who would rather invest standing or other resources instead). Plus, there's that bonus of referencing a very genuine debate in science. 🙂

 

Edit to add: My MAIN concern with all of the new changes, personally, is keeping things fair to old companions (those loyal, multi-forma'd pets people are used to) and new ones. I have kavats I've crossed dozens of times to get the perfect look I want naturally. Sure, I could do it again and pop on a trait I want, but I want to keep the ones I have, and I know many people do as well (especially given how many are around that are based on late real life pets). But I still want to have a cool new feature to play with in my mixes, too. 

Edited February 8, 2020 by Devin
Addition.

[(XBOX)Red Dough Boy]

4 hours ago, KittyKath said:

 

I was too lazy to re-write it so I posted my quote and the answer of a kind soul (Thanks DoomFruit!) because I think that it would be a good idea and deserved a re-call here.

I can agree with training the pet being more apt for giving them bonuses, depending on which enemy they fight more could level up small bonuses. This would be nice to players that have the one Kubrow they like and not having to breed new ones. Such as seeing fire and knowing to run away, or liking the taste of Grineer blood so they'll deal more damage to the Grineer. Through my times of bringing my Kubrow on missions the main thing that downs him is fire damage from Napalms and the like, Jupiter seems to be a no go since the vents that spew flame kill him in a few seconds yet he stands in the fire. 

[(PSN)BlightDragon89]

One thing I did forget to mention that I would love to see. Kubrow and Kavat AI rework. All the other posts on here reminded me that one other reason I don't use them is that their AI is crud. I get aggressive AI vs. more defencive AI is a thing, and a valad thing. But aggressive AI should not make these poor dogs and cats stand right in front of fire spewing hazards, run right into large mobs, stand in Nox toxic gas procs ext. I mean most animals that would be used by people for combat would be better trained then this. 

Hell, make training a entire game mode! Have a pet training center in the dojo, where you can train your pets, thus upgrading their base stats like Pokemon! I fully admit I would pay this mode. If they want to implement a training mechanic, I think this would be a good way to do it. Sure, have some in mission options and well, but lets get a dojo room for super pet lovers.

[(XBOX)Red Dough Boy]

10 minutes ago, (PS4)BlightDragon89 said:

One thing I did forget to mention that I would love to see. Kubrow and Kavat AI rework. All the other posts on here reminded me that one other reason I don't use them is that their AI is crud. I get aggressive AI vs. more defencive AI is a thing, and a valad thing. But aggressive AI should not make these poor dogs and cats stand right in front of fire spewing hazards, run right into large mobs, stand in Nox toxic gas procs ext. I mean most animals that would be used by people for combat would be better trained then this. 

Hell, make training a entire game mode! Have a pet training center in the dojo, where you can train your pets, thus upgrading their base stats like Pokemon! I fully admit I would pay this mode. If they want to implement a training mechanic, I think this would be a good way to do it. Sure, have some in mission options and well, but lets get a dojo room for super pet lovers.

I would play Kubrowmon constantly, getting a really buff Kubrow with Oberon would be well worth it. I wish his passive had both things that were on him at one time, bonuses for friendly Kubrows and relaxing other animals. Would make Earth missions even easier, and the Drahk could also be pacified. 

 

I'm curious how pet stance will work, maybe double tapping the power button to change between defensive and offensive stance. Putting it on a wheel like gear items might take too long to activate reliably especially in combat. 

[Grey_Star_Rival_Defender]

I made my own thread dealing with similar things to this one, and the only major issue not mentioned here that I brought up is that pet mods need to have a serious reduction in capacity drain so every Kubrow doesn't need literally all but one mod slot polarized. Or every mod slot polarized if you wanted to use Primed Pack Leader.

[(PSN)Onder6099]

Pets 2.0 doesn’t solve General problem: “Why should I Formae 5 Kubrows min 7x and buy 5 Slots for 1 Precept each while I can do that once for Smeeta with 6 decent Precepts?” 

[morningstar999]

4 hours ago, (PS4)Onder6099 said:

Pets 2.0 doesn’t solve General problem: “Why should I Formae 5 Kubrows min 7x and buy 5 Slots for 1 Precept each while I can do that once for Smeeta with 6 decent Precepts?” 

part of the change is they are going to make the other pets more useable. 

[morningstar999]

7 hours ago, Grey_Star_Rival_Defender said:

I made my own thread dealing with similar things to this one, and the only major issue not mentioned here that I brought up is that pet mods need to have a serious reduction in capacity drain so every Kubrow doesn't need literally all but one mod slot polarized. Or every mod slot polarized if you wanted to use Primed Pack Leader.

if they have one section for the body (health etc) and one for battle (maul/bite etc) then it would help solve the issue, but yes it would be nice if some of the mods cost less. 

[(PSN)Onder6099]

7 minutes ago, morningstar999 said:

part of the change is they are going to make the other pets more useable. 

Will each Kubrow get another 5 Precepts?

[morningstar999]

28 minutes ago, (PS4)Onder6099 said:

Will each Kubrow get another 5 Precepts?

smeeta only has a % random chance of one? so its really rng based on if you get a good buff when you want it, 

they'll be getting something different but hopefully useable for different missions and scenarios. 

[(PSN)Onder6099]

28 minutes ago, morningstar999 said:

smeeta only has a % random chance of one? so its really rng based on if you get a good buff when you want it, 

they'll be getting something different but hopefully useable for different missions and scenarios. 

You should say that to players which prefer Smeeta, would be interesting to see some Statistics of Companions usage before rework and then. I’m absolutely OK with Kubrows now, but I have worries that lots of players are expecting from, with high hopes, a miracle, but it can easily hit pattern of most reworks: not more but less players will use them.

[morningstar999]

link mods (like link-health etc) don't show in either beast or robotic sections of the mods as they are listed as 'companion' so you can only find them if you search in the all section. Can we have a fix so they show in the beast /robotic sections pls? 

[Grey_Star_Rival_Defender]

10 hours ago, morningstar999 said:

link mods (like link-health etc) don't show in either beast or robotic sections of the mods as they are listed as 'companion' so you can only find them if you search in the all section. Can we have a fix so they show in the beast /robotic sections pls? 

That’s been pretty annoying. I think the flat +stat% mods suffer the same deal. Enhanced Vitality, Enhanced Fiber, whatever.

[morningstar999]

this is semi-related and something else that needs addressing thanks 

[Braneman]

I STRONGLY advocate for the base armor/heatlh/shield stats of Kubrows to be looked at so that mods like metal fiber can be useful and actually have a purpose in keeping your dog alive, Shepherd needs looking at as to how it would tie into that because as it is now, it's kinda not worth it unless you go all in with four people, and even then you're pitting that against mods like Energy Siphon and Corrosive Projection.

 

I would like the ability to summon my dog to me and clear status effects on them like once every 30 seconds, and generally summon them to me anytime after that, I find there are places with damaging map objects like the forge conveyors on Ceres that can stunlock a pet to death forever if they ever touch them. Either that or some sort of limit as to how many times your dog can be stunned like that in a row so eventually they can get out of that.

 

the Mecha mod set needs to be made consistent with itself either armor or shield, since it's not designed like say the Vigilante sets it needs to be balanced like you're going to be equipping every part of it because right now the set bonus is just kind of geometrically worse the less you have of the set, having a dramatically worse timer and area of effect(along with the rest of the dog/cat mod set bonuses). I also need to be able to see the effect of the Mecha mod set. It would be nice if this status focused set allowed you to bring a dog with a shield focused frame into high level content while being reasonably sure the dog you can't control won't be stunlocked to death by a Napalm fireball too often. however with how armor focused this game is I don't think that would work out and I would prefer the 90% shield recharge bonus to be changed to something else like a slot in for medi-pet kit or pack leader or something.
 

While not as urgent the strain set needs to be looked at for balance as well, replenishing 4% of missing health is basically useless even on inaros it's a pitiful amount compared to what you get from any other mod like Odomedic, Hunter mods, even Medi Ray heals off of total health. I would also like to ask for a bit of decay from these mods when the cysts spawn maggots, like your helminth's damage and melee crit damage decay over a couple seconds to smooth things out so they aren't just worse mods over half the time.

 

The main concern I have with the removal of stasis is pet health and Kubrow happiness, if they're all out all the time then I need to be feeding them DNA stabilizers and petting more than six dogs every day otherwise I have to spend a couple days getting them back up to full happiness because of the 3 interaction cap. I need some kind of assurance that is being looked into because that sounds like a lot of busywork for not a lot of rewards.

 

I would like the ability to equip Kubrow Armor sets on all of the standard Kubrow-like skins for them, most notably the Feral Kubrow skin.

Edited February 11, 2020 by Braneman