My mr6 friend just made a lich

[Tamatu]

Person is only learning the ropes: has not fully grasped modding yet, has only base frames and base mods at not even max.

How is a few weeks old player supposed to know what it means when the game tells you there is a red target, and commands you to press x on it?

Why do you torment newbies with this terrible system?

[WhiteMarker]

To be fair your mate did something without knowing what might happen.
He chose to do it before getting further information.

And don't you have to finish The War Within before you can create Lichs? How did your friend manage to do these quests without learning simple things like modding? Did you help him? Then help him now with the Lich.

11 minutes ago, ToaTamatu said:

Why do you torment newbies with this terrible system?

To be fair this system was always meant to be a nightmare to players. It's just that for long-time players it's nothing more than a breeze.

[-Bv-Psykiik]

22 minutes ago, WhiteMarker said:

To be fair your mate did something without knowing what might happen.
He chose to do it before getting further information.

you cant blame him .. the game told him to press X on downed target and he did that .. anyone one would do the same in any shooter game 

poor guy dont know he will have to suffer for weeks to kill the lich 

[Drachnyn]

I do think that liches should be locked after a later quest. While it can get slightly above sortie levels (which you also unlock after TWW i think), you're also stuck with the lich and it will probably reach lvl 5. With sorties you can just not do it if you realize you arent geared enough. Right after War Within you just arent ready for Liches.

[WhiteMarker]

1 minute ago, -Bv-Psykiik said:

anyone one would do the same in any shooter game 

Seems like I am noone then...
If I don't know what might happen if I do something, I will get information.
It's completely optional to kill the larveling. If it never came up before, why rush to stab it without knowing anything about it?

3 minutes ago, -Bv-Psykiik said:

poor guy dont know he will have to suffer for weeks to kill the lich 

OP should just help his friend. Getting rid of a Lich takes 2 to 4 hours...

[Syasob]

55 minutes ago, ToaTamatu said:

How is a few weeks old player supposed to know what it means when the game tells you there is a red target, and commands you to press x on it?

Why do you torment newbies with this terrible system?

Well, that's exactly how liches are supposed to be: you kill a weakling but woah wait it's now a freaking monster full of hatred towards you!

BTW, ingoring that lich for some time won't hurt anybody.

[kyori]

1 hour ago, ToaTamatu said:

Why do you torment newbies with this terrible system?

So he is leaving the game? Ah... DE need to think of appropriate MR level for certain things to happen, before losing more potential customers. lol

[Baterial]

TBH killing lich for him will be like hitting a wall with bare fist end expecting something to heppen. NGL with MR6 he has to relay on other ppl to down lich for him because on lvl 100 he probably won't even stand a chance. To slay lich preparation must be done. I presonally always go with easy setup which is Loki, Bramma and Redeemer Prime to make sure i don't die in the process by random attack

[WarmongerExtraordinare]

its not like he's, you know, FORCED to play on lich-specific subnodes - he will just have to listen to some script talk S#&$ about him for like a half of year of whatever

[-skimmer-]

Next time you gonna complain about being forced to play missions to get loot.

[Saravind]

its not about appropriate mr its more about being open and maybe a 20 second tutorial about this lich system

no one thinks oh why can i press x on this guy.... when you can press x on many many enemies to finish them

[Tamatu]

1 hour ago, WhiteMarker said:

To be fair your mate did something without knowing what might happen.
She chose to do it before getting further information.

And don't you have to finish The War Within before you can create Lichs? How did your friend manage to do these quests without learning simple things like modding? Did you help her? Then help her now with the Lich.

How is she supposed to know that killing an enemy, (where previously she had to kill everyone on sight) would cause a bad thing?

Just get further information, that is a poor advice fellow tenno. You just take for granted how much stuff we actually went through and learned about the game, and it only expanded since we started. For a brand new player right now, the amount of stuff required to know is just insane. Every day I coach the person, link the wiki, explain everything in depth and I just realise how much info I had to go through that I now take for granted.

And it goes without saying that we will slay the lich together, it's just not really a fair thing to do to a new player. What if I wasn't there? Just how many new guys are there that don't have coaching from a player, that do these things, what do you think? You can say that help can be asked from others, and the wiki, but is that really a valid argument when you gotta rely on others and the fan wiki to even get by?

1 hour ago, WhiteMarker said:

To be fair this system was always meant to be a nightmare to players

To my mind, justifying a terrible and nightmarish piece of content by saying it is supposed to be like that is not much help to further the discussion. What justification is that, even? You are supposed to feel terrible as a new player because the game pointed you towards an objective, like in all the missions before, and now it is suddenly a different outcome?

1 hour ago, -Bv-Psykiik said:

the game told her to press X on downed target and she did that

Exactly.

1 hour ago, Drachnyn said:

I do think that liches should be locked after a later quest.

My personal opinion is that, since they are kuva liches, the fortress should be the one and only place you could even find one to make. Besides that, i'd install yet another safety belt to make sure people won't make one by accident.

1 hour ago, WhiteMarker said:

Seems like I am noone then...
If I don't know what might happen if I do something, I will get information.
It's completely optional to kill the larveling. If it never came up before, why rush to stab it without knowing anything about it

You are speaking from your position, where you are already experienced enough to know these.
Game always tells new player to do X, Y, Z, and they do them. Newbies are also used to mercy kills, just think about it: They will see them all the time! They don't oneshot everything from day one like us, they'll be using the X's far before they meet a larva,(on normal folks) and once they do meet one, they'll press X to mercy kill just like they did many times before. The entire system is so backwards and messed up that it's crazy to think about.

1 hour ago, WhiteMarker said:

OP should just help his friend. Getting rid of a Lich takes 2 to 4 hours...

Yep, and imagine the fun she will have during it. Not yet proper enough gear to kill them, i'll have to do all that. So person is left spectating. I helped many new players, and the one consistent thing noone likes is getting carried without being able to do much. But she can't do much if liches start at level 50-60, so if i refrain myself from killing to let her kill like I did in the beginning, we won't make it through. I can bring wisp, rhino, chroma etc. to help her with speed and/or damage, but that's only a bandaid in the grand scheme.

1 hour ago, Syasob said:

BTW, ingoring that lich for some time won't hurt anybody.

On a planet that is supposed to be farmed. Infested with lich, that might steal mods that you do not have, or frame parts you do not yet have. I can't imagine it hurting anybody.

27 minutes ago, Baterial said:

TBH killing lich for her will be like hitting a wall with bare fist end expecting something to heppen. NGL with MR6 she has to relay on other ppl to down lich for her because on lvl 100 he probably won't even stand a chance. To slay lich preparation must be done. I presonally always go with easy setup which is Loki, Bramma and Redeemer Prime to make sure i don't die in the process by random attack

Yes you are right, it needs proper setup and gear, which new player won't have. Carrying is out of the option because that just sucks all the fun out of the game too. Now we have to get her a bit better gear and have that tumor on her planet in the meantime.

27 minutes ago, GerberaOverture said:

its not like she's, you know, FORCED to play on lich-specific subnodes - she will just have to listen to some script talk S#&$ about her for like a half of year of whatever

I think i am not forced to take my hand out of hot boiling water if i ever drop it in, doesn't mean I shouldn't. 😄 For early players having an entire planet infected is a huge issue.

 

What I do notice in DE defenders in general is that, people are more than likely to watch the game from their own perspective, because for us it all ties together (kinda), but once I do look into it from the perspective of starting players I do realise that the obscene amount of info-dumping that has been happening for years is unacceptable.

You guys say just do this, just do that and it's easy enough. One step at a time is how we are going, but the game has certain quirks to it that will not let that happen, f.e. lich content.

Not a secret at this point how many new guys leave the game, and I wanted to shed some light on it how your info-dumping and content--dumping without proper thought is just hurting the already terrible new player experience. She tried to enter fortuna and poe as soon as she was allowed to, and it happened to be night and you know what. Why is the game letting these things happen, even?

[Drachnyn]

vor 33 Minuten schrieb ToaTamatu:

What I do notice in DE defenders in general is that, people are more than likely to watch the game from their own perspective, because for us it all ties together (kinda), but once I do look into it from the perspective of starting players I do realise that the obscene amount of info-dumping that has been happening for years is unacceptable.

You guys say just do this, just do that and it's easy enough. One step at a time is how we are going, but the game has certain quirks to it that will not let that happen, f.e. lich content.

Not a secret at this point how many new guys leave the game, and I wanted to shed some light on it how your info-dumping and content--dumping without proper thought is just hurting the already terrible new player experience. She tried to enter fortuna and poe as soon as she was allowed to, and it happened to be night and you know what. Why is the game letting these things happen, even?

New player experience is kinda garbage but chasing the new hot thing (and scrambling to fix it later) seems to be something DE is more interested in. Remember when Steve put "new player experience" on the whiteboard? Neither does DE.

[WarmongerExtraordinare]

54 минуты назад, ToaTamatu сказал:

I think i am not forced to take my hand out of hot boiling water if i ever drop it in, doesn't mean I shouldn't. 😄 For early players having an entire planet infected is a huge issue.

i hunted down every lich weapon and "FROM WHAT I SAW" that "infection" doesnt mean S#&$ if you just stay away from lich-owned MISSION inside EXACT NODES

if i get the whole system correctly after clearing it 100% - you can play while having a lich without ever contacting the lich and his taxation thievery (simply by choosing the, you know, REAL MISSION instead of the "lich-owned lich hunt mission")

[SPEKTRE76]

Spawning a Lich for the first time is like a kick in the nuts or a busting a piñata full gummy penis candies.

I hope he/she is watching this:

 

STEP ONE: DO NOT fight your lich (ESPECIALLY ALONE) until you have all three requiem MOD's. Trust me you can do this. They walk slow. If you get caught you deserve to die. (this prevents the lich from leveling up)

STEP TWO: Once all Requiems are revealed, go punch the 'Esc' key > 'Navigation' then there is a red icon on the bottom right. Click that then click 'Modify Parazon'. Put the Requiem Symbols in any order (black stone MOD cards with ancient symbol thingy's).

STEP THREE: Take a look at your liches 'RESISTANCE' and 'IMMUNITY'. Then MOD your weapons without those types of DMG.

STEP FOUR: Go hunt your Lich in territory they control. When it spawns start wrecking it. You'll notice THREE yellow health status bars above the shield bar (cyan). You have to bust that shield and then after that, the first life bar (far right) will start to go down. Once it is down your Lich will kneel before you.

STEP FIVE: Preform your 'MERCY KILL'. If you order for the first one is correct it will whisper it's name in a demonic Gregorian chant tone of voice. REPEAT STEP FOUR. If the second symbol is wrong, your Lich will disappear and rank up. Not to worry just reverse the #2 and #3 Requiems. If the first one was wrong, then swap the #1 and # 2. You have a 33.33% of getting things right the first time.

STEP SIX: Player Choice, if you Convert your lich you'll get the blueprint for the weapon and Ephemera if your Lich came with one. This will allow you to sell it for plat and a high premium. Weapons alone will not garner a premium unless you get a Kuva Bramma with 60% of (insert damage type here). If you kill your Lich, you get the weapon instantly and the Ephemera (if it came with one) but.....you cannot ever trade it.

*Side Note = If your Lich was Converted, it will fight along side you when you need help the most. And the type of damage you used to kill the Larvling will determine the weapons damage buff).

 

He/She will get better and he'll/she'll be giving Liches Stiches in no time flat. I have been doing one Lich a day. I'm about to fuse a second Bramma with my current Bramma (Kuva).

Edited March 3, 2020 by SPEKTRE76