Frost it's just fine right now.

[Felsagger]

lol, this thread became an octagon.  

C'mon guys calm down. We are talking here about frames. We all like Frost. At least that is the perception I got here. If he needs reworks or not, that's subjective to each. In my opinion a review doesn't hurt but he's ok, imo. 

[ant99999]

21 minutes ago, Silligoose said:

You know the best part of this reply of yours in which you try to demonstrate how knowledgeable you are? Once again you are wrong: enemy damage scales faster than enemy HP.

Pretty sure armoured enemies' ehp still scales faster than their damage. But I admit I still think of pre-nerf scaling. Maybe damage outpaces ehp at some point. Not untill high levels though.

You on the other hand continue to be the most insufferable human being I've met on the forums. You didn't read my initial post, you didn't read my initial response to you. You nitpicked a singular aspect of the ability in question and proceeded to insult me over it several times, instead of acting in any semblance of civil way. You even diregarded my clear message of not being interested in conversing with you further.

And you know what? Fine, never used that before, but I guess, you'll be the first to attend my ignore list. Make yourself at home.

[Silligoose]

23 minutes ago, ant99999 said:

Pretty sure armoured enemies' ehp still scales faster than their damage. But I admit I still think of pre-nerf scaling. Maybe damage outpaces ehp at some point. Not untill high levels though.

You on the other hand continue to be the most insufferable human being I've met on the forums. You didn't read my initial post, you didn't read my initial response to you. You nitpicked a singular aspect of the ability in question and proceeded to insult me over it several times, instead of acting in any semblance of civil way. You even diregarded my clear message of not being interested in conversing with you further.

And you know what? Fine, never used that before, but I guess, you'll be the first to attend my ignore list. Make yourself at home.

I read your posts. I corrected your incorrect notions. You didn't like it and tried pivot the point of contention. You are doing it again: You talked about health scaling. I talked about health scaling. Now here you are, trying to pivot the point of contention to armour scaling, once again refusing to own your mistake and learn from it. As a sidenote, there are resources out there that can point you to figuring out at which levels EHP (in the form of armour and health) out scales damage and vice versa.

You are not civil. You are extremely deceptive.

I keep replying because you keep addressing me with incorrect statements. Own your mistakes and I'll stop correcting you. I'll even throw a like your way. All good if you put me on ignore - All that means is the next time I happen to see more incorrect posts from you that could steer newer Tenno into believing the wrong things, I can correct it and not worry about you trying to change the point of contention again. Thanks!

[Silligoose]

2 hours ago, Felsagger said:

lol, this thread became an octagon.  

C'mon guys calm down. We are talking here about frames. We all like Frost. At least that is the perception I got here. If he needs reworks or not, that's subjective to each. In my opinion a review doesn't hurt but he's ok, imo. 

Heh you are right. The above is hopefully the last of that unpleasantness. Coming back to Frost, I agree with what the OP said and your thoughts - Frost is fine. I still think he is good and while I am wary of power creep it would be nice if his 1 and 2 got a little love. 

I'm not sure if changing his 1 to be a pseudo-exalted to help with scaling is just a lazy idea on my part, or something that could end up being far too overpowered (or both). I usually play SP, so I'd use his 2 for the cc, but in all honesty I use it very rarely. Having the Ice Wave Impedance baked into his 2, even if only a diminished version of it, would be quite nice, but again if paired with other abilities and/or mechanics, it could be used to make enemies too little of a threat.

I'd love for DE to address enemy mechanics first, then maybe look into revisiting older frames, but that's the dreaming optimist in me thinking out loud.

[(PSN)rexis12]

I feel like Frost is fine, he's essentially a 'balanced' Frame that can do most missions but excels in Defense.

Only really his 1 is bad, and that's because it's pretty much just like Old Wukong's Iron Jab.

[TeaHands]

Most frames are fine for most of this games content or at the very least shine in their niche. It's just there's people who don't understand how to build, don't want to put in the effort, or just don't like the playstyle needed to get the most out of a frame. And since they can't get anywhere with a frame, they assume very loudly that the best course is changing the frame to more of their liking. I recommend just ignoring them but sometimes people can't help themselves, been there lol.

[Felsagger]

5 hours ago, Silligoose said:

Heh you are right. The above is hopefully the last of that unpleasantness. Coming back to Frost, I agree with what the OP said and your thoughts - Frost is fine. I still think he is good and while I am wary of power creep it would be nice if his 1 and 2 got a little love. 

I'm not sure if changing his 1 to be a pseudo-exalted to help with scaling is just a lazy idea on my part, or something that could end up being far too overpowered (or both). I usually play SP, so I'd use his 2 for the cc, but in all honesty I use it very rarely. Having the Ice Wave Impedance baked into his 2, even if only a diminished version of it, would be quite nice, but again if paired with other abilities and/or mechanics, it could be used to make enemies too little of a threat.

I'd love for DE to address enemy mechanics first, then maybe look into revisiting older frames, but that's the dreaming optimist in me thinking out loud.

There are good things in the game that we should talk more about, one of those for sure IS Frost. 

It's a fact that Frost provide long hours of fun. That's a fact. This frame helped me a lot through the game because it has a great set of abilities. This frame may support, tank more or less and be offensive in a good way. This frame hosts a great number of players where many are stationary and others are mobile. If people are grasshoppers with the frame, they can do it too. The frame may be used as a rushing melee milling machine or be prudent with the bubble shield and shoot at a distance if the bunker gaming is your thing. 

Frost was well designed. It was and still is one of the best frames I've seen in a long while because Frost is too versatile in many way. I have 8 years and still I do not understand many of the features this frame has. Recently I noticed the uses of the combination of abilities. Helminth gives a fresh air switching one of his abilities making him more to what the player wants. 

I think that DE has something great with Maggy, Frost, Excalibur, Rhino and Nova. This tier of frames is the signature of DE and the reason why Warframe had a strong start. Despite all the reworks, these frames continues to deliver. Can they get better? Of course but for now they do represent what these frames are. These frames allows a lot of approaches and many types of players in them. They were and are a success. 

 

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 1 hora, Felsagger dijo:

There are good things in the game that we should talk more about, one of those for sure IS Frost. 

It's a fact that Frost provide long hours of fun. That's a fact. This frame helped me a lot through the game because it has a great set of abilities. This frame may support, tank more or less and be offensive in a good way. This frame hosts a great number of players where many are stationary and others are mobile. If people are grasshoppers with the frame, they can do it too. The frame may be used as a rushing melee milling machine or be prudent with the bubble shield and shoot at a distance if the bunker gaming is your thing. 

Frost was well designed. It was and still is one of the best frames I've seen in a long while because Frost is too versatile in many way. I have 8 years and still I do not understand many of the features this frame has. Recently I noticed the uses of the combination of abilities. Helminth gives a fresh air switching one of his abilities making him more to what the player wants. 

I think that DE has something great with Maggy, Frost, Excalibur, Rhino and Nova. This tier of frames is the signature of DE and the reason why Warframe had a strong start. Despite all the reworks, these frames continues to deliver. Can they get better? Of course but for now they do represent what these frames are. These frames allows a lot of approaches and many types of players in them. They were and are a success. 

 

This comment is gold.

[Mieo_Mio]

I like the thought of Frost's second ability. I'd like to see Ice Wave get a new Augment where the ice crystals explode and ricocheted when touched.

 

[Marvelous_A]

On 2023-06-21 at 5:21 AM, (PSN)Joylesstuna said:

Why does it still get demolished in seconds in sp then? It isn't a great defense ability unfortunately on sp.

An ability that has a ratio of 1:1 for absorbed damage to damage mitigation is generally just bad. The scaling health is just a gimmick. In high-level missions, Frost has to exploit the 4s invulnerable time. Granted Snow Globe is still one of the best defensive abilities in-game with that 4s invulnerability.

 

Back to the topic while I think Frost is totally still viable in the current version I'd like to see the function of destroying Snow Globe being made into the 3rd and the 2nd getting a meaningful buff.

[(PSN)Joylesstuna]

23 minutes ago, Marvelous_A said:

An ability that has a ratio of 1:1 for absorbed damage to damage mitigation is generally just bad. The scaling health is just a gimmick. In high-level missions, Frost has to exploit the 4s invulnerable time. Granted Snow Globe is still one of the best defensive abilities in-game with that 4s invulnerability.

 

Back to the topic while I think Frost is totally still viable in the current version I'd like to see the function of destroying Snow Globe being made into the 3rd and the 2nd getting a meaningful buff.

One of the best defensive abilitities but  lasts 4 sec is kinda wild

[Marvelous_A]

5 minutes ago, (PSN)Joylesstuna said:

One of the best defensive abilitities but  lasts 4 sec is kinda wild

To be fair it also has a lot of unique properties that make it a valuable defensive ability and 4s invulnerability is just part of it.

[(PSN)Joylesstuna]

7 minutes ago, Marvelous_A said:

To be fair it also has a lot of unique properties that make it a valuable defensive ability and 4s invulnerability is just part of it.

It's not valuable but I guess there is worse.

[0_The_F00l]

So now with the overguard changes ,adaptation stacks and arcane avenger can be acquired with icy avalanche ,

Not a gamechanger , but still helps.

[stormy505]

He's one of the few frames that powercreep has actually helped him feel way better to build and play and actually increased his use cases.

His issues a while ago were:
1. You needed enough str to reach 100% armor strip break point on his 4 and give bubble a decent amount of base eHP, enough range to hit a ton of enemies, enough duration to get good cc and to take actual advantage of his augment that boosts damage on frozen enemies and enough efficiency to spam his 4 and 3 cause they required high up time.
2.  His energy economy was trash. His max was bad, and he needed to spam his abilities to function.
3. His survivability at high levels was tied to staying inside your bubble. And as I've said numerous times about any frame, if you have to sacrifice mobility in warframe to stay alive, that makes the frame trash in my eyes.
4. His second ability was (still is) useless. His first ability kinda is as well but its used to delete his globes which is important if you don't want to annoy everyone else.
5. He Needed natural talent because he relied on ability spam.

1. The str needed to reach optimal play was lowered and molt augmented/shards have made it very, very easy to hit that requirement without sacrificing other stats.
2. Energize, Archon flow, Zenurik, etc, we have a bunch of ways to sustain energy.
3. Shield gating has basically made surviving on any frame with shields fairly easy and very cheap in terms of build capacity. But unlike nyx and her 4, his globes still have a use for defense objectives which SP circuit actually values again. Not needing to invest in survivability at all also allows him to get a nice stat spread because he wants fairly high values in ALL stats to function.
4. Helminth makes frames with a useless ability feel way better to use. Gives access to more cc, more damage, grouping, shield gating abilities (although I don't recommend pillage since stacking armor strips makes playing frost feel kinda redundant) etc.
5. Shards save you a slot for casting speed.

https://imgur.com/a/Jc9doTP
What I use. You don't need all that forma. That's just for other builds/experimentation.

Also, SP circuit being the flavor of the month content has helped him a lot cause frames that can get by in general killing stuff have value since you don't always have access to the frames that commit war crimes to enemies. And defense objectives show up pretty often so him and other defense-focused frames' stock have gone up due to that as well.

[ant99999]

3 hours ago, Marvelous_A said:

To be fair it also has a lot of unique properties that make it a valuable defensive ability and 4s invulnerability is just part of it.

The thing is, it has to compete with such abilities as Cataclysm and Resonator. No matter how unique it is (and it is), it's still a pain to manage on top of that. There's a reason I've hardly encountered any Frosts during Scarlet Spear. The majority of players just don't want to bother and rather bring less consistent but more convenient Limbo or Octavia.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 3 horas, ant99999 dijo:

The thing is, it has to compete with such abilities as Cataclysm and Resonator. No matter how unique it is (and it is), it's still a pain to manage on top of that.

It's a pain to manage for some ppl cof, cof, cof.  I have never been the most mechanical player (I'm bad in general) and I don't have any problem.

[ant99999]

4 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

I have never been the most mechanical player (I'm bad in general) and I don't have any problem.

That's great, awesome, I'm so proud of you, seriously.

But can you provide something more substantial than "I don't have any problems personally and that's why it's fine"? Cause that's the arguemnt literally everyone defending any piece of gear that is underperforming uses. It doesn't mean much really. A lot of people probably don't have any problems using Hydroid. I myself don't have any problems using Inaros. That doesn't mean they don't need any changes. Their abilities are still have lots of weak sides, just people playing those frames are good at working around them.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 11 horas, ant99999 dijo:

That's great, awesome, I'm so proud of you, seriously.

But can you provide something more substantial than "I don't have any problems personally and that's why it's fine"? Cause that's the arguemnt literally everyone defending any piece of gear that is underperforming uses. It doesn't mean much really. A lot of people probably don't have any problems using Hydroid. I myself don't have any problems using Inaros. That doesn't mean they don't need any changes. Their abilities are still have lots of weak sides, just people playing those frames are good at working around them.

How dare you compare Frost with Inaros or Hydroid? it's a joke right?

[Felsagger]

Wait what? Who compared Frost with INAROS or Hydroid? 

 

lol, he chose INAROS out of all the frames.....lmao, I'm done with this thread......rofl

He must be joking. 

 

 

[CosoMalvadoNG]

Just bored.

I just don't like defenses, they are suuuuuper bored for me.