i feel like dante is too good ?

[Circle_of_Psi]

8 minutes ago, Arvindal said:

You can theoretically argue that it was deserved, but saying that it's not much of a hit is a joke. It guts his dps and survivability. Nerfed Dante is incredibly energy hungry Kullervo with less damage and less AOE. 

Maybe so but if people didn't gut his energy cost with having NEGATIVE Efficy then, they'll not have this problem

I have 145% EE, I use Equilibrium, have Arcane Enginze and I use Zenrik, I have ZERO energy issues unless I am doing something stupid and my PS is around (192%) and will be higher once I get shards into him and all they added was an LoS thing to stop you from nuking rooms you can't see.

 

What am I missing here?

[JimothyStevens]

Thanks whiners for making yet another frame useless.

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

13 minutes ago, Dunkelheit said:

Anyway, since discussion with self-righteous people like you is neither fun nor intriguing, I sign myself out.

Nice projecting there, pal. But sure. Run away with your tail between your legs because you realized you have no proper rebuttal. It's no skin off my nose.

[OneOmniverse]

1 hour ago, Colyeses said:

Honestly, in terms of design quality? Dante's with Limbo. 

And that's not a good thing.

Yikes smh :|

[Shodian87]

4 minutes ago, JimothyStevens said:

Thanks whiners for making yet another frame useless.

You're welcome. :)

[Waeleto]

GG to everyone who complained about Dante, now he joins the caliban gang.

You guys weren't happy styanax wasn't no the same level as dante ? good now dante is worse than styanax.

[TeaHands]

19 minutes ago, MrDugan said:

The mods always do this when they want to sweep all the negativity under the rug.  Just collect it all in one place so that it can be ignored all at once.

You mean they got added to a thread that DE themselves have commented on? How are they ignoring this thread if they have actually interacted with it? That rarely happens in General Discussion.

Edited April 4 by TeaHands

[OneOmniverse]

1 hour ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

That's a whole bunch of wild accusations you just pulled out of your ass there. If you're getting bored of how easy the game is, go play a different game along with the rest of the tryhards.

Besides, I'm not using any of these frames as a crutch. I'm just sick of these bait and switch tactics DE keeps on pulling after people have already put the time or monetary investment into something. Kick rocks, bootlicker!

Exactly what I said ,they like to tout they are different from the others but here we are yet again after all the money has been spent they pull the curtain off and go nerfing stuff after people have already put the time into grinding things or spent money to get forma or Warframe or whatever only for that to be undone smh. It’s disgusting but of course they get away with it cause people keep letting them 

[Aruquae]

This post aged like sour wine
And yes, I'm the one who's sour because of this

On the plus side his nerfs weren't terrible, a LoS on the ult, along with an overguard cap decrease, but he now regenerates overguard faster
I see this as a win for overguard

[Waeleto]

2 minutes ago, Aruquae said:

This post aged like sour wine
And yes, I'm the one who's sour because of this

On the plus side his nerfs weren't terrible, a LoS on the ult, along with an overguard cap decrease, but he now regenerates overguard faster
I see this as a win for overguard

It's absolutely not a win for overguard, styanax now generates full overguard faster than dante, overguard regen is useless if you can't get a huge amount quickly, overguard is absolutely gutted on dante

[vFlitz]

Well, good job everyone who wanted him nerfed. This is what you accomplished:

• He still is completely incompatible with Chroma/Rage mods
• His overall power hasn't really changed much (with the exception that Archon Intensify doesn't trigger on Light Verse unless it actually restores health, so practically never now)
• He is, however, a whole lot more clunky to play. Requires casting over twice as much for Overguard upkeep and worst of all is the LoS requirement for Tragedy. This is always notoriously inconsistent against groups of enemies, and the ability already had a soft LoS requirement anyway because it needs priming to deal real damage.

Such success for balance. Now Dante players have to deal with Tragedy randomly failing and you can rejoice in your ability to go under the staircase to kill the fodder Butcher or Charger that go stuck there. Unless there's a nuker that's allowed not to endure LoS requirement around, of course. Like anyone with Thermal Sunder. Or Nezha with the new augment. Sure that got range reduced by 50%, but it can still nuke the entire room far better than Dante ever could.

Edited April 4 by vFlitz

[Waeleto]

2 minutes ago, vFlitz said:

Well, good job everyone who wanted him nerfed. This is what you accomplished:

• He still is completely incompatible with Chroma/Rage mods
• His overall power hasn't really changed much (with the exception that Archon Intensify doesn't trigger on Light Verse unless it actually restores health, so practically never now)
• He is, however, a whole lot more clunky to play. Requires casting over twice for Overguard upkeep and worst of all is the LoS requirement for Tragedy. This is always notoriously inconsistent against groups of enemies, and the ability already had a soft LoS requirement anyway because it needs priming to deal real damage.

Such success for balance. Now Dante players have to deal with Tragedy randomly failing and you can rejoice in your ability to go under the staircase to kill the fodder Butcher or Charger that go stuck there. Unless there's a nuker that's allowed not to endure LoS requirement around, of course. Like anyone with Thermal Sunder. Or Nezha with the new augment. Sure that got range reduced by 50%, but it can still nuke the entire room far better than Dante ever could.

This describes the situation perfectly, everything bad about him stayed but now he feels terrible to play

[Shodian87]

Just now, Waeleto said:

This describes the situation perfectly, everything bad about him stayed but now he feels terrible to play

I feel like you haven't played with him long enough and are just saying it to say it.

[Waeleto]

2 minutes ago, Shodian87 said:

I feel like you haven't played with him long enough and are just saying it to say it.

Have YOU played him after the nerf ? because i have and i think i know how I feel about playing him now 

[C11H22O1]

It is unfortunate that he got the Khora treatment, they seriously need to take a look on how line of sight works, it can feel very miserable when it doesn't work properly

[JimothyStevens]

On 2024-04-03 at 11:22 AM, Corvid said:

No, you did not. You did not in any way address the fact that player power is exponentially stronger today than it was in the past (again, we went from a game where level 30 enemies were tough, to one where some players regularly fight enemies at level 9999), which is the exact opposite of what would happen if your statement about DE "always listening to the nerf crowd" were true.

It would be more accurate to say that the "no nerfs ever" portion of the community has a long history of going into hysterics over the slightest reduction to their power, claiming that whatever got nerfed is suddenly "useless" even when it literally does the exact same amount of damage as before the nerf. Considering the aforementioned increase in our average power levels, I find it hard to sympathise.

Except they don't do it on impulse. They literally have criteria that they have publicly stated for what it takes for a tactic to end up on the chopping block, and in all but the most extreme cases they tend to leave OP items untouched for months, if not years.

So which is it? Do DE nerf against the wishes of the community, or do they always listen to the "nerf crowd" which, like it or not, is part of that community.

I would like to reiterate everything I said in the response you are quoting here. Have a good day.

[MrDugan]

18 minutes ago, TeaHands said:

You mean they got added to a thread that DE themselves have commented on? How are they ignoring this thread if they have actually interacted with it? That rarely happens in General Discussion.

And where, in this massive pile of feedback they're not going to listen to is that response buried?  Not that it actually matters.  Y'all will eat up everything they say, and no matter how many times they prove to you that they're going to say one thing and do another, you'll still act like it's gonna be the truth this time.  Let me guess, something along the lines of 

"Thanks for all of your great feedback Tenno~!  We're totally going to take it into consideration!"

Because if it's that, I'ma let yall guess what that actually means.

[Corvid]

Just now, JimothyStevens said:

I would like to reiterate everything I said in the response you are quoting here. Have a good day.

Y'know, you could just answer the question if you actually thought I was wrong, because regardless of how many times you reiterate them, none of the things I quoted there were actual answers to it.

I'll put it here one more time for ease of reference: If DE truly always listen to the players who want nerfs, how is the average player power so much stronger than it was back in 2013 that we've gone from level 40 being the peak to level 9999?

If your next response isn't an answer to this very simple question, then I will take it as you conceding the point.

[EdinaMonsoon]

16 hours ago, MrDugan said:

Wow.  You people could at least make an effort to look like you didn't get your responses off the same tired script.

what script? i logged into this hell site after a couple of years to see what megan had said

[JimothyStevens]

Just now, Corvid said:

Y'know, you could just answer the question if you actually thought I was wrong, because regardless of how many times you reiterate them, none of the things I quoted there were actual answers to it.

I'll put it here one more time for ease of reference: If DE truly always listen to the players who want nerfs, how is the average player power so much stronger than it was back in 2013 that we've gone from level 40 being the peak to level 9999?

If your next response isn't an answer to this very simple question, then I will take it as you conceding the point.

I'm not concerned with the average strength overall. The problem is that today, they are nerfing dante into irrelevance. In the past, they nerfed the kuva bramma into irrelevance. Going on et cetera on many things. The power level required for the game continues to increase, and unnecessarily nerfing things into irrelevance now will just make them even more irrelevant in the future. 

[EdinaMonsoon]

12 hours ago, Colyeses said:

Abilities, plural? 

He has one thing that can be considered a problem, and that's Triumph. Everything else in his kit is bog-standard or worse.

my tragedy can clear whole tilesets on regular content so i can see them nerfing the radius on that

[MrDugan]

Just now, Corvid said:

Y'know, you could just answer the question if you actually thought I was wrong, because regardless of how many times you reiterate them, none of the things I quoted there were actual answers to it.

I'll put it here one more time for ease of reference: If DE truly always listen to the players who want nerfs, how is the average player power so much stronger than it was back in 2013 that we've gone from level 40 being the peak to level 9999?

If your next response isn't an answer to this very simple question, then I will take it as you conceding the point.

Because they have to introduce power creep.  That's why player power has changed.  You can't release 700 weapons that all do the same damage.  The reason they nerf things is because it forces players to shift meta constantly.  "This is dead now, what's next?"  Then that gets nerfed.  The power creep that gets introduced is small, and then that gap widens shortly after when they go on a nerfing spree.  It forces engagement, which gets metrics up, and it sells forma and reactors/catalysts for people moving to the new, next best thing.  Part of the reason it looks like they always listen to the people screaming for nerfs is because they are listening to them.  It's free goodwill and ammo for the people that like to claim DE actually listens.  But it's also partly coincidence.  Because DE nerfs anything that eats up too much of the general meta.  A frame that can actually clear Corpus Ship Defense in a reasonable time?  Can't have that for a dozen reasons.  Oh, and there's the squeaky wheels, calling for him to get nerfed.  Convenient.  

"But why nerf Dante then, since he's new?"

Because it's not power creep time.  Look at his weapons.  Mid, at the absolute most generous I can be.  Dust hasn't settled from the last round of power creep yet, with easier access to shards and legendary melee arcanes.  Gotta let those sink in first.  They don't want the new frame this popular.  That sounds crazy but look at all the other frames that released to lack luster reviews and low player usage that they just left.  They get a burst of engagement and then it's back to business as planned.  Dante taking off like this and being a good low level grinding frame isn't acceptable to them, obviously, since they're nerfing him a week out of the gate.  And the people crying for nerfs get to feel special!  It's a win for everyone!  Except the majority of the playerbase that constantly gets shafted by this crap.

Also, I'm not the one you were talking to, but that last line about "if you don't respond to me then I win!" is both condescending and childish.  This is why I had you blocked on my original account, before cross save took it from me.

[Waeleto]

ISTG now they'll make an augment that says something along the lines of "tragedy now ignores line of sight" or "triumph now gains double overguard" 💀

[McRibbles]

21 minutes ago, EdinaMonsoon said:

my tragedy can clear whole tilesets on regular content so i can see them nerfing the radius on that

My brother in christ I assure you we've long since passed the point where things are actively balanced around star chart level enemies. There's a dozen frames who can just snort glue while mindlessly nuking the entire mission leaving your squadmates with nothing to do, a good few can easily do it well into Steel Path. Dante was no bigger menace in the star chart than a sizable portion of the roster.

[EdinaMonsoon]

2 minutes ago, McRibbles said:

My brother in christ I assure you we've long since passed the point where things are actively balanced around star chart level enemies. There's a dozen frames who can just snort glue while mindlessly nuking the entire mission leaving your squadmates with nothing to do, a good few can easily do it well into Steel Path. Dante was no bigger menace in the star chart than a sizable portion of the roster.

my brother in christ i did not ask