Tenno Clock, Discussions Of The Community [Youtube] (Ep 89)

[MDRLOz]

What misson type/ duration if survival/ Wave if defence/??? if interception is that bejuizb?

 

Also post in my thing I want to know your answers:

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/223397-a-quick-warframe-knowledge-check-what-do-you-know/

Edited April 28, 2014 by MDRLOz

[Calayne]

What misson type/ duration if survival/ Wave if defence/??? if interception is that bejuizb?

 

Also post in my thing I want to know your answers:

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/223397-a-quick-warframe-knowledge-check-what-do-you-know/

 

Wow. I just did that. 

[bejuizb]

What misson type/ duration if survival/ Wave if defence/??? if interception is that bejuizb?

 

Also post in my thing I want to know your answers:

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/223397-a-quick-warframe-knowledge-check-what-do-you-know/

T3 Survival. 40 minutes. I ran melee only with my Loki. My other team mates were two Rhinos and a Nekros. The Nekros kept going down and so did one of the Rhinos. That's why we bailed.

[Calayne]

Regarding the Dark Sector's Reward troll, I may have a solution:

 

Currently, Alliances set a reward for a set amount of runs, right? They could say, 5,000 credits for 2000 runs. Or, they could, for a troll example, have 20,000 credits for 1 run. 

 

Now, I'm not sure what's the minimum, but this is clearly something that can be abused, depending on the minimum amount of runs. What I think should happen is this: Allow the clans to set that amount of Battle Pay for a fixed amount of runs. But for everyone who participates, they are guaranteed that amount of reward the moment they see that and enter.

 

So if, say, an Alliance sets 40,000 for 1 run, but 500 players participate: All 500 players get the 40,000 credits upon completion. Where does the money come from? 

 

The Alliance's reserve funds. The extra players' battle pay eats into their vault. It's only fair. 

 

Now, I'm not sure how the clan-to-alliance transfer of credits go, but assuming that they set aside a certain amount of credits and cannot continually top up the Alliance vault while the battle is raging, this is one way to stop the trolling. If they do have the ability to top up the Alliance vault on the fly, perhaps this should be changed: An Alliance should envision how much they need before the battle starts, and having an extra amount is always a good thing. 

 

In this manner, Alliances are encouraged to have the mission runs for allocated battle pay slightly higher, and priced moderately: If you have too little runs with very lucrative pay, you're going to drive yourself bankrupt. Conversely, if you set a somewhat reasonable price for a prolonged time, you're less likely to be over-extending your influence, and the extra battlepay that eats into your coffers will be less than if you bait.

 

(Sorry, I'll reply bit by bit to the topic as I watch! I'm forgetful. :(

 

 

 

Edit: Regarding Auction houses

 

While I can understand the argument against auction houses, and the dojo-shop does indeed sound super awesome, but there's also the issue of trading beyond time-zones, which the auction house solves, as well as the dojo-shop, if it does get implemented. Personally, I think in addition to the dojo-shop, (Which really is quite innovative!) there should be a mail system that most people are asking for. It's earned, because you have to go through the forums to get it, and it allows for trading across time-zones! 

 

It was recommended by someone long ago: A mail system, where you put the mod in, or part in, and you send it to the recipient's inbox. Here, the agreed conditions for the trade are told, and you have to pay this agreed-upon sum before you can accept the items. This also has the fantastic ability of bypassing stupid internet connections which are frustrating to deal with because it is unbelievably stupid and makes life difficult by the sheer amount of stupid oozing from the stupid I call my modem. 

 

... *Cough*.

 

Well, okay! So, I do think the mail system could work. Understandably, the next concern would be this bypassing the dojo's trading. Doesn't necessarily have to be the case. There could be another dojo room for this: The mail room, to humbly call it, and from here, you can send mail with a tax, and proceed with a trade, across space and time. Literally. 

 

There should, of course, be more expensive to use this service so that dojo-trade is encouraged over everyone spamming mail. I'm not too sure what this might be, but an easy solution would simply be to increase the cost of trading items. Or... Perhaps, just leave it as it is, and encourage the trade. 

 

There is a benefit for auction houses, though: The exchanging of plat will become very rapid. This is an advantage for DE. The more plat changes hands, the more plat is used. Plat is perishable. Therefore, the nett amount of plat in the world diminishes. Someone has to buy plat to increase this stock. The flow of money speeds up. 

 

Wouldn't be a surprise if they do implement an auction house, with some limits. It does have its benefits, though at the risk of making it feel "Wrong". 

Edited April 28, 2014 by Calayne

[Xenogelion]

Just posted my shop idea:

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/223876-dojo-shop-possible-alternative-to-auction-house/

[Lorche]

First of all, I promised myself to be more active in forum, yet what I've done is the total opposite.

Second.....

What misson type/ duration if survival/ Wave if defence/??? if interception is that bejuizb?

 

Also post in my thing I want to know your answers:

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/223397-a-quick-warframe-knowledge-check-what-do-you-know/

I write some stuff in that thread. Most probably some bull XD

I approve about that thread. We are yelling left and right, demanding lore and some backstory stuff. But how much do we already know about the current story so far? I'm curious to see how that thread goes

 

Right, with that out, let's continue.

 

Well, perhaps the better way to deal with this is to make them cannot change the battle pay when the contest is live.

With then, they will think carefully about how much battle pay they wanted to throw to Tenno's faces in order to support their rail.

And actually stick to their words. If they want to give big battlepay, they better make sure to keep that word, even if that battle will bleed their credit reserves.

 

*Disclaimer* I'm not attacking a certain aliance here. Just voicing opinions

 

And honestly? I believe we will move past forward "I'll support whose side give me more stuff" phase, and actually have a competitive rivalry regarding rails and stuff.

 

Auction House are a 50:50 for me.

In one side, this can organized the already messy Trade chat into blocks that are definitely 100 percent easier to navigate.

In other side, this will speed up the platinum circulation in the market. And without proper regulation, it will become D3 all over again. A big step toward P2W environment, and I hate if Warframe goes that way.

if I want to say, make it like an actual market, where people who want to sell specific stuff gathers there. With that, people can browse in more leisure way, helps trim the spammers, and organized the whole trading process. Think of it like a more organized version of Ragnarok Online's shop system.

 

As for Trinity's Blessing, increase to the energy cost of vanilla Blessing and adding cooldown to that skill can help balance the usage of Blessing. For Link, removal of the self-damage is the most plausible solution I can think of

Edited April 29, 2014 by Lorche

[Calayne]

I'm surprised Xeno hasn't said a new episode is up yet! :D

Btw, it is! Check youtube!

Edited May 6, 2014 by Calayne

[Xenogelion]

 

Image goes to first post. So this week Loz and I went for movie themed emblems, next week will be animal/beasts:

 

 Drew's Find

 

 Loz's Find

 

 

@Calayne:

    I was going to but YouTube took forever to process the video and I decided to head to work in the mean time.

Edited May 6, 2014 by Xenogelion

[Calayne]

Haha I watched it over my mobile, and an abundance of time in between massive bouts of mathematical diarrhoea.

Interesting topics this round, regarding exclusives for the ps4. I gotta admit, Loz has a point on the ps4 players getting pretty much the short end of the stick all the time.

Also, you have convinced me to never build a Cosmic Spectre. Seriously. The AI is worse than a plank's. I kind of wonder why they didn't establish a maximum for conclaves, and instead used a minimum. Really quite strange.

Like, if you wanted to build a cosmic Warframe loadout, but it's only 1700 but with your favorite gear, they should just let you. And 1800 becomes the max your spectre can be, so it's not overpowered. Leave the logistic worrying to us, and all.

Then again, I'm sure it's still under development and improvements.

[Traeyze]

I must admit Rescue 2.0 burnt me out a little and resulted in me taking the last week off the game because it just feels like it completely failed to do what it wanted to.

Yes, you can run a good duration build Loki [i have one that has about 22 or so seconds invisibility and is pretty efficient, so I can do invis runs pretty easily] and do okay.

Or you can do what I do: find a Corpus rescue and run a Mag Prime and pull your way to victory! Because enemies can't be alerted if they are killed instantly! And this applies to pretty much any blaster frame. The Saryn I ran with liquified everything and we were getting max point runs.

 

'Stealth' is a joke and the mission was faster and easier run with nukes, just like it used to be but now it is 8% more frustrating. Hooray.

The idea of a point being 'no kill' is a good one, even if that would assure only Loki and Ash could do it. At least then 'stealth' would mean more than 'assure they die in one hit'.

 

PS4 stinks of second tier citizen and you have to wonder how many times they can blame Sony before questions are asked. I personally have no idea whether Sony is indeed that hard to deal with in terms of certifying but I am generally inclined to think that they aren't. That said I will be keeping my eye on FFXIV to see if that proves the rainbow road is able to be done successfully.

Spectres are... yeah. I don't hate the idea but by golly I sure do wish they would drop the whole 'pet' thing and get with the Focus sytem so I can get back to grinding and not feel like its a complete waste of time.

I also optimised my laptop settings and managed to really up the quality of the graphics and framerate and was once again reminded it is a really pretty game. My Nekros eases the pain of what I feel has been a universally halfbaked Update series lately.

[Lorche]

Quite a long episode, this one. Not that I personally mind.

 

Myself, I was kinda involved in the discussion, and aside from all the 'so-called-exclusives' we have (which I agree DE should just bundle it into a pack and give it to PS4 for free), the only thing I'm flat out disagree is original Primes available for Founders. Not because 'exclusivity yay', but more because of the circumstances this things are are. I'll stick to my stance regarding Founders. It's the reward for supporting them waaaay before the game's even entered Open Beta. I missed them because I can't buy Plats here in my country, but I won't fret and respectfully respect DE's decision to keep this thing in disney vault, forever. Also, the extension of Founders till 1 November last year is unnatural for myself.

 

I don't know really well about certification on Sony's side aside from a week time to certify the build is not buggy. But, PS4 and new players are soo beaten up by the blunt end of the baseball bat atm, even myself as spectators are not happy about it. I also agree for a 'total-code-cleanup week' at DE's side. And more involvement for us as beta testers of the game, while also ask PS4 players for their involment on this matter as well. For a better game

 

I sounded like giving a speech, geez.

 

Sceptres are good to help soak the damage, if I forced to go solo with a squishy frame. But I agree the building costs is borderline stupid

 

Rescue 2.0 at least heading to a right way, but still need tweaks and polishes left and right. Lots of it. One of it is stealth mechanics.

And you guys knew about bypassing the rear entry to the cell as well, huh?First time I found it, I was asking if that's not a development mistake in the map or not.

But, it's actually a good thing so some will learn how to stealth. Because most of people I've met online didn't know how (and forced my team to quick-kill wardens and quick-hack the cell).

Edited May 8, 2014 by Lorche

[MDRLOz]

Whats your views on the removal of stats from helmets. 

 

I have all stated helmets and will not part with any of them. Some are so important for min/max builds. However in some ways that can e a good thing. E.g. Trinity losing that duration helmet will reduce blessing for most. However it wont affect me MuHAHAHHA

[Sixty5]

I'm ambivalent. 

 

Personally I'm a function over form kinda guy, DE could release a helmet that looked like a massive turd, but if it gave me a bonus, I'd run with it. 

 

I'd prefer that all helmets have stats in all honesty since it encourages different playstyles, but then again stuff like Vanguard is broken on Rhino Prime.

[Traeyze]

While part of me wishes they just got rid of all stats and didn't waste a bunch of time on this silly new system I do suspect they did so to sidestep what would have been a forum crashing tsunami of complaint posts and to that end I guess it is pretty considerate of them.

Personally I didn't see the stat helmets encouraging much variety as they were just so poorly balanced in general. Either one helmet was overwhelmingly good or there were two helmets that were both kind of meh in general. As a result, and due to the tendency players have to min max in this game, certain helmets became integral while a fair few were completely redundant. It was unusual to see certain frames not using the 'good' helmets if they were wearing an alternate.

The recent non stat helmets have actually lead to a lot more variety and hopefully this opens the door for DE to focus more on cosmetics without the bane of stats looming over them.

[Calayne]

While part of me wishes they just got rid of all stats and didn't waste a bunch of time on this silly new system I do suspect they did so to sidestep what would have been a forum crashing tsunami of complaint posts and to that end I guess it is pretty considerate of them.

Personally I didn't see the stat helmets encouraging much variety as they were just so poorly balanced in general. Either one helmet was overwhelmingly good or there were two helmets that were both kind of meh in general. As a result, and due to the tendency players have to min max in this game, certain helmets became integral while a fair few were completely redundant. It was unusual to see certain frames not using the 'good' helmets if they were wearing an alternate.

The recent non stat helmets have actually lead to a lot more variety and hopefully this opens the door for DE to focus more on cosmetics without the bane of stats looming over them.

 

 

I have to agree. I use Swindle and Essence helms for a small shift in play style, though. However, for Trinity, Excalibur, and quite a couple of other frames, there are clear winners. It really is quite poorly balanced in most cases.

 

However, I do find one thing absolutely annoying: Arcane helmet trading. 

 

I just can't quite appreciate that so much, though I understand where it comes from. True, people should keep what they've spent so much time to earn (Though to be honest, that Brakk nerf and Damage 2.0 would have caused a fair bit more commotion, since they were more universal). A long list of new topics created by angry ranters longer than my arm, just flowing in unabated by reason or patience. But they all ended up better. 

 

Then again, I can see this easily dying off as time goes by. Or perhaps, it will get even worse, when players increase, and the elusive Arcane helmet either starts to die with retiring players, or remains constant, making it one of the few exclusives that can be traded. And these are stat-bonus equipment.

 

At any rate, what's done is done, though I did wish they didn't allow Arcane helmets to be traded. The players who have it, earned it. But allowing it to be traded... It'll be another Prime Chamber mess eventually. Amongst new players, I'm willing to bet that over-obsessed min-maxers will be a certainty.

 

On the bright side, I hope all Warframes have a whole new set of cosmetic helms! Man, been waiting for another one for my Loki!

[Lorche]

In a sense, I'd wish they purged all of the remaining stat helmet.

On the other side, I know some people use their real money (whoever money they used) to buy the helmet.

 

So, to put it simple, it's like stuck between rock and hard places.

Well, stat-altering cosmetics always bring bad news after all.

 

Anyhow, the arcane helmet will slowly died out. Either in retiring players or from depleting stock.

And finally I can use Thrak without getting slow as truck

Edited May 9, 2014 by Lorche

[Xenogelion]

Oh Em Ef Gee, there's a cap on the number of images you can have on a single post!? Regardless ep 30 is currently out and can be found on the first post, I'm stunned by that cap... Anyway so Loz is a cheating b****** and stole this win so deviously. Anyway, we haven't discussed what the next theme should be as of yet but we come up with something. Here is the submission and the trump card:

 

 Drew's Find

 

 Loz's Find

Edited May 12, 2014 by Xenogelion

[Sixty5]

Great episode as always.

 

Firstly, on Lore, there is actually a fair bit of hidden lore in the game, including unseen stuff stuff in the game files.

I always look into lore stuff, and I'd like to think that I have a pretty good handle on it.

 

The Dragon Nikana does look godly at first glance at its stats, however, it doesn't have a huge amount of utility in terms of CC or mobility. Furthermore as you saw attack speeds for the most part are hardly telling, some weapons (Fangs) will hit multiple times per melee as well, so it isn't necessarily the DPS king. Finally certain stances have hidden damage modifiers, the two I can recall off the top of my head are Crimson Dervish's first three attacks, and Cleaving Whirlwinds spin attack. In both cases these damage buffs catapult the respective weapons damage above the Dragon Nikanas. Even so, the melee weapon I've been running a lot lately is Iron Phoenix Heat Sword. It has nowhere near the DPS of other melee weapons, but the basic combo has a very nice lunge attack that gives you a lot of mobility, and ground slams and the finisher of the fancy combo unleash a fire explosion that will proc all enemies within its radius, making them do the wiggle dance as they slowly burn. I just find that the utility is nicer to have, since no melee will ever compete damage wise to my main guns.

 

As for the Specter thing, I believe the 1800 point requirement is still needed even after subsequent builds as when building a second specter set you are asked if you want the loadout to change to your current one. 

In all honesty I really have no problem with that, since it isn't too much trouble to just stick on some high conclave gear for 10 seconds. Though it might just be me there since I don't ever use the Rhino/Ogris/Brakk/Galatine that I flick on to build copies of previous specters.

Then again, Cosmic Specters still seem like a waste to me, I only really run Force anyways.

[MDRLOz]

Great episode as always.

Your kind words sooth me but I feel I just ranted like mad all over the place this time :(

Edited June 10, 2014 by MDRLOz

[Traeyze]

Actually Loz, I concur with a lot of what you were saying [bar one point I'll get to below]. I don't think you were too ranty, or at least a lot of that frustration seems reasonable.

That lack of 'on the horizon' sensation is exactly why I have recently been less inclined to log on. After the initial dazzle of Melee 2.0 wore off and what I consider the failure of Rescue 2.0 to then be left with no clear idea of what to look forward to other than more pets leaves me a bit dry.

Regarding the points in the video:

I agree these comps are a good idea and hope they don't lag too hard on bringing them out. I hope this starts a trend of more of that sort of thing, it is such easy gimmick points and keeps everyone hype.

Lore I am not so stressed about. It would indeed be interesting to have a lot more since the Lore I did read up on [on the wiki] when I did my entry for the fanfic comp was kind of cool. The teasers for Melee2.0 [the infamous double countdown] did seem to suggest a hefty Lore or at the very least 'context' hit was coming and if turkey Hek was it then I suspect lore is as far off/on the backburner as Xeno suggested.

I personally think the general criticism of the Dragon Nikana is off base for a lot of reasons. The main one being it is just nowhere as good or useful as the stats suggest it should be.

This is partially because of the stances associated with the weapons. They are sort of 'jack of all trades' in their approach, not being the best in any particular area but being pretty okay in most. Its attack speed can be dwarfed by a fair few weapons, a lot of Nikana stance attacks lack utility or proc modifiers, the reach is only 'okay' even when moving, the DPS output despite the stats of the weapon is not outlandish compared to what you can still achieve with the Orthos P, Ichors or even the Bo.

It is sort of like the Soma, it is just reliable in every department but not all that interesting. But there is one major difference: it is mastery 8, the highest of any melee. This would make its power seem a lot more reasonable, heck, the stance itself needs to be buffed to compliment the weapon better.

To me this reeks of arguments that erupted over the Boltor Prime. People saw a big number increase [double!1!11] and argued it was the end of the world and the weapon would break the game. But it didn't, not even close. It didn't end up achieving all that much, all things considered. The D Nikana is strong, no doubt, but to suggest it is not the jump people seem to suggest it is... heck, I still here that Ichors are the best DPS melee right now so who knows.

I like Warframe and keep track of the updates as they come but lately it has been a little frustrating. The lack of consistent updates recently undermines one of the elements of the game I liked most: consistent content. As a result I have been playing other games, though I am aware I do so with the mentality 'until Warframe gets a decent update'.

Still the update with the details of the frame rebalances was a great idea, it actually got me hype again.

Full forma joke was legit. And dat Hook reference.

[Sixty5]

Your kind words sooth me but I feel I just ranted like mad all over the place this time :(

Meh I have heard far worse as far as rants go.

 

TBH I didn't notice you were really ranting at all.

[MDRLOz]

*SLICE*

Full forma joke was legit. And dat Hook reference.

YES TRAEYZE IS REFERENCE MASTER! 

 

The problem with all these damage comparisons is that it is actually very hard to do a test of weapons in game. Why we don't get a shooting gallery / Target dummies in dojo to give us relevant damage comparisons. 

 

I to am spreading my time into other games / TV shows. I do like melee 2.0 it is awesome however, as was my guess at the time, we don't have anything good to do with it. Its like being given a formula 1 car as a gift but live in a desert so you can play around with it. 

 

I want to be hyped with stuff on the horizon but there is nothing good to see. Last weeks sound live-stream did not have anything worth time in it. (non-main group live-streams should always end with some cool sneak peaks to keep people going imo). 

 

In fact I have seen thread comparing game play a year ago to today and the sounds, voices, effects back then were soooooo much richer than the game has today. E.g. the corpus ship AI giving out messages made the game feel bigger then you saw. "Engineering crew report to deck 8" did get repetitive but at least it made you think there was other things happening then you. This has been removed and I did not notice at first but looking back it feel rubbish and generic now that we don't have these little touches. 

 

I am tempted to play with sounds and music on tonight (no-teamspeak to distract) and see if these "newer" sounds actually give anything to the game.  

Edited May 14, 2014 by MDRLOz

[Sixty5]

The older version of the game definitely did have a nicer feel in some parts. Might have also been because back then I hadn't run through missions millions of times, and was running gear that made the game feel more challenging. Then again that might just be nostalgia talking.

 

The new music coming with the game seems cool, cool enough to warrant me turning in game music back on.

 

Also thinking about the old sounds i am reminded of when I first found Metal Auger, I ran a Corpus mission afterwards and shot a bunch of crewmen through the guardrails they were hiding behind. It made me smile.

 

More imersive sounds are definitely something I would like to see re-added, though judging by what went on in the sound stream, the guys who do it seem pretty busy

[MDRLOz]

Pfft busy with what. 

 

They make soundtracks but need to focus on the little sound effects tot bring the spirit of the game back. After watching more old school vids I think things like that sound before the corpus AI speaks and the effect on the old lotus are key things that the current game lacks. 

 

As an example I will use the matrix film trilogy. To be this seems obvious but not to the directors/produces. 

 

The first matrix film is a classic. Whenever the characters are "in the matrix" the camera has a green filter over it and other simple camera affects. It makes the world feel surreal and alien. I would bet good money a reason they stuck it in was because they did not have that much money to do the first film with ($63mil). In the next two installments this effect is complete absent from all "in the matrix" shots, I would bet because they had more money and so dropped it in favour of more expensive things (~$150 mil each on the sequels). It completely ruins the feel of the matrix and it just becomes another place they go rather than this alien oppressive world that they must brave.  

 

The same is becoming true of warframe imo. The sounds and lighting no longer echo a dark oppressive place we have to survive in. Instead we have a bland bright open place that only shines light on the easy of game and lack of real story. :( 

 

HOWEVER! 

I though I might ask you guys if there was any topics you wanted us to discuss this weekend. There seems to be a lot on peoples minds atm with the frames reworks, new cosmetics and dawgiies. So what would you like us to natter on about. 

Edited May 16, 2014 by MDRLOz

[Sixty5]

Any time DE makes new stuff to put into the game the sound guys have to work on it. Things like Lore writing and Balance go unimpeded by the guys that make weapons or levels for the most part, but the Sound guys always have stuff to do. This is in addition to their own projects like the music and rework of the infested sounds.

 

As for the aesthetic of the game, it has gotten lighter, but a lot of that is due to us. Walk down the same dark hallway a thousand times, and it no longer feels the same as it did the first few times.

 

I would really like to see them add a story mode however, where each mastery rank you gain unlocks a new chapter, each telling a bit of a story. Stuff like the past event missions could be a part of that story too. And it is a long shot but having ceratin missions tailored to the frame you are playing would also be awesome, like leading an assault as rhino, stealing data as loki, or conducting a stealth assassination as banshee. meh it's a dream.

 

As for discussion points, the past week I've been unusually active topic wise, I've posted more constructive content than I think I ever have.

First there was a post about how the ammo system needs a rework, Then a topic co created with my clan leader about how Loki needs a rework then a lore system concept and finally a rant about how bad 13.3 was for Banshee. 

Any of those might work for a topic to discuss.