Psa: Syndicate Alerts: The Support Is Designed To Punish

[ClockworkSpectre]

Well damn, I actively try to get them killed for my own sanity!

I play syndicate missions solo to hunt medallions, not to have derpy AI in tron jumpsuits block my fire at every chance and make so much noise I cannot hear where the enemies are shooting from.

To quote a famous pretend man, "I never asked for this."

Make them optional please!

Yeah this is pretty accurate.  They get in the way all the damn time, they ruin stealth play, and in the case of Arbiters missions, they break my ears. 

 

If they are going to keep them they need to reduce the volume on the weapons, the akboltos the arbiters guys use are freaking loud as hell. 

 

But honestly I'd like to see them removed from every mission type except defense and interception. 

[GamePois0n]

Loki and Ash's invisibilities doesn't work in syndicate missions :(

[Deus_X_Machina]

My main problem with them so far is, that they block non-hitscan shots quite often - in the case of slow firing weapons, were I only shoot once or twice and am usually certain my target is dead, thats especially frustrating.

 

And they run around in my view. Even while hacking one managed to run through the hacking panel and mess up my view.

 

Sometimes they are fun to have though, an option and overall better behaviour would be nice. (Specters seem to be not so annoying, maybe their AI could be adapted?)

[GetsugaTenshou]

I havent tried the other syndicates besides red veil and steel meridian, but these red veil buddies are pretty awesome even if they are using ballisticas, i just dont like that they kill mobs of enemies and the enemy ai is just derping around like nothing happened, maybe its just me. it would be nice to turn them off for actual stealth runs but i give them props for their ruthlessness, that and they shoot everything in sight including cameras.

 

it does get really silly when they are running for no good reason or charging into enemies like they have unlimited revives or something 

[ROSING]

If anything, it should be that we get a bonus when they survive, not a reduction when they die. I'm sure at least some of us would enjoy trying to get through a mission and making sure your support survives to the end.

[Sir_Alex_Traffo]

Woah really??? And I was trying to let them die on purpose to be able to seek for medallions without them alerting the whole planet.

 

I actually would love the option to have their support or not; they're cool and useful sometime like during defense or survivals, but not really if you're trying to take your time and look for medallions.

[Dillon_J]

im curious how they died? the only time i have ever had one die was during a hive mission

[locojuan]

i think is time to dev some AI commands. kubrows, hostages and now our syndicate companions could use a simple "stop / move" pop up menu set of commands by holding G key for example. If it proves to be handy we could upgrade to more advanced commands. Yet, i´d understand if this does not fit some ppl´s playstyle. Some players like to just rush to the objective, so commanding bots may or may not be of their best interest.

 

so i suggest we have both; a toggle option to keep syndicate helpers from participating in our missions and, if we choose to bring em along, some simple commands to tell them what to do.

 

AI commands could become a thing in future game modes. i.e:  "rescue and lead a group of stranded colonists back to their village through enemy lines". i´d rather have these commands tested and polished before those kind of game modes see the light, if they ever, and i hope so, do.

[[DE]Rebecca]

The death of these Syndicate Allies should have 0 Impact on XP/Standing. To quote a morbid dev: "You can let them die all you want with no penalty". Will play through at lunch more to see if I notice anything fishy! Aggro levels also have been noted.

[CrazyCatLad]

The death of these Syndicate Allies should have 0 Impact on XP/Standing. To quote a morbid dev: "You can let them die all you want with no penalty". Will play through at lunch more to see if I notice anything fishy! Aggro levels also have been noted.

 

We're playing hockey on lunch. BE JEALOUS Rebecca.

[OniDax]

Yeah this is pretty accurate.  They get in the way all the damn time, they ruin stealth play, and in the case of Arbiters missions, they break my ears. 

 

If they are going to keep them they need to reduce the volume on the weapons, the akboltos the arbiters guys use are freaking loud as hell. 

 

But honestly I'd like to see them removed from every mission type except defense and interception. 

 

I'd like for them to be on most missions, excluding stealth-based ones, because they are helpful support. If they just have to be changed, I'd like for them to be optional support per player, where each player can request a Syndicate ally each mission. But I'd rather them just stay as they are now.

[http404error]

If anything, it should be that we get a bonus when they survive, not a reduction when they die. I'm sure at least some of us would enjoy trying to get through a mission and making sure your support survives to the end.

 

You know, that's functionally the same thing, so it's just as bad.

 

I thought they were quite helpful, actually, but I haven't tried to stealth either, so there's that...

[Velym]

The death of these Syndicate Allies should have 0 Impact on XP/Standing. To quote a morbid dev: "You can let them die all you want with no penalty". Will play through at lunch more to see if I notice anything fishy! Aggro levels also have been noted.

 

Sounds like the horse-head.

[AureusVulpes]

The death of these Syndicate Allies should have 0 Impact on XP/Standing. To quote a morbid dev: "You can let them die all you want with no penalty". Will play through at lunch more to see if I notice anything fishy! Aggro levels also have been noted.

 

Thanks for the confirmation on this, Rebecca. Seems I had a derpy End of mission screen or something else. I'm glad that I was wrong.

 

Updating OP.

[Gelkor]

 

Lol, Lotus'ed

[CY13ERPUNK]

+1 OP

 

these allies need to be optional

 

IMHO it's fine if they are auto-included in missions like def/surv/intercept, but not other mission types

 

but just making them optional across the board would be better, or make them another syndicate standing 'purchase', whatevs

[kevbob]

Last night i ran some syndicate missions, and honestly i felt kind of bad.  The syndicate operatives are pretty much being sent into a suicide mission.  That's kinda depressing to deal with.

 

From a gameplay perspective, there is no way in hell i'm going to babysit/Rescue 2.0 the syndicate operatives through these missions.  Finding the Synd Rep Pickups is already tedious enough for me.  

 

From a game world perspective, these 2 syndicate operatives are being asked to escort a Tenno into enemy forces.  I can use one ability, and kill everyone in a room (or more).  Their syndicate secondaries clearly have no mods on them, they are having to multiple shot enemies with a Vaykor Marelok. 

 

It's just unsettling.

[Phaenur]

I noticed the OP's issue myself in a...second-tier Arbiters mission, I think it was.  Mobile Defense on the Asteroid tileset.  My troops dropped repeatedly but revived each other almost every time - Napalms and Arson Eximus blasts were one-shotting them, but only at the end did they go down together.  At the end of the mission I had <1100 points on a ~1500-point alert.  Now to be fair I was wearing a Meridian sigil, not an Arbiters or Suda one, but there's clearly something causing us to hemorrhage points right now.

 

As to the concept...I like it in general, I'm just not sure their weapons scale well enough to be worthwhile, and they could stand to either have passive health regen, lifesteal, or at least be open to healing effects (orb pickups, team health restores, abilities, whatever).  And I'm also not very convinced by their accuracy, especially with pistols - when the Grakata trooper is hitting harder and more often than the Vaykor Marelok one, you've got an issue, and I think my two Arbiters troops killed maybe five Grineer between them despite the minigun-tier rate of fire because they didn't compensate at all for the projectile scatter and drop.  Haven't tired Suda's or the Veil's people yet, and I'm opposed to Loka and Perrin so I won't get to try theirs either, but so far I'd have to say the Grakata-wielding Meridian soldier was the cream of the crop so far.

[Kamikiri]

I do agree with multiple points in this thread.

Primarily that they:
- Ruin stealth.
- Obstruct views/shots.
- Are quite loud in certain cases.

But I also feel like one thing is not being mentioned.. they deny affinity!
On General rank with lvl 30-35 enemies, my steel meridian followers still manage to score a kill here and there.
It's a little frustrating when I have missions like swordsman and they finish off whatever target I've been hitting.
And then all that lost affinity that would otherwise go onto my standing gain...
Them being there directly reduces the amount of standing the player obtains unless they rush like a madman and nuke everything instantly since the followers are on the player's heels at all times and shoot everything that moves.

[Gelkor]

OK, weird thing either I just didn't pay attention and didn't notice them but: I run the Spy missions set to Solo so that I don't have players crashing my stealth missions, and I don't notice syndicate helpers showing up when I do that?  Do they not spawn if you set it to Solo?

[SgtFlex]

The death of these Syndicate Allies should have 0 Impact on XP/Standing. To quote a morbid dev: "You can let them die all you want with no penalty". Will play through at lunch more to see if I notice anything fishy! Aggro levels also have been noted.

Could we still have an option for them? Its useful for people who want to get the most affinnity they can get, or for people like me who like stealth. I dont want to use them if I stand behind a crate whilst my syndicate allies stand out in the open and get spotted

[Yezzik]

The death of these Syndicate Allies should have 0 Impact on XP/Standing. To quote a morbid dev: "You can let them die all you want with no penalty". Will play through at lunch more to see if I notice anything fishy! Aggro levels also have been noted.

 

That sounds like the sort of thing Scott would say on-stream while reaching for another beer.

[AureusVulpes]

OK, weird thing either I just didn't pay attention and didn't notice them but: I run the Spy missions set to Solo so that I don't have players crashing my stealth missions, and I don't notice syndicate helpers showing up when I do that?  Do they not spawn if you set it to Solo?

 

Syndicate Operatives were patched out of Spy and Rescue missions due to the inherent stealth nature of the missions, and they made the mission impossible to complete 9/10 times.

[Gelkor]

Syndicate Operatives were patched out of Spy and Rescue missions due to the inherent stealth nature of the missions, and they made the mission impossible to complete 9/10 times.

 

Ok, that would be why.  I don't really try to stealth in anything but Spy and Rescue (and therefore run public in the rest).  But I can imagine they make it difficult to stealth in everything else. 

Edited February 11, 2015 by Gelkor