Lowering Syndicate Rep Cap? Why?

[(PSN)theelix]

Ok, I just want to know why, why did they half the syndicate rep cap? I mean are you serious?

MR 14, and at 30k rep per day, it takes four days to get one syndicate weapon. I did see that they doubled the syndicate missions but are you kidding me? It's going to take 6-8 days now just to get one freaking weapon when, usually, they're not much better over the original.

 

Is it to nerf the S.Gammacor? I'd like a bit of an explanation because this seems absolutely ridiculous already. Because now, I'm just thinking, if I want to get ANYTHING AT ALL on any of the other Syndicates, I'm going to have to start getting them now or else it's just going to take two months to do anything for one Syndicate at all.

 

I know a bunch of people didn't even pick up Syndicates in the first place, the next few dropped it after the cap was introduced, but I think I'm going to drop it after this next nerf to the cap. It's honestly ridiculous to me unless I missed something.

 

So if I did in fact miss something, what did I miss?

 

(I read the 15.13 build notes while I was looking for any improvements to Furious Javelin.)

 

Edit: To make this more feedback-y as I realize now that this isn't PHP:

I like the overall concept of making people be more active instead of getting into the rut of eat, sleep, rep farm, repeat, but I feel it could've been done in some other way, preferably through the means of counting the missions as a whole instead of the affinity you gain in the missions and counting waves in survival.

Edited February 8, 2015 by (PS4)theelix

[(PSN)IIIDevoidIII]

Doubled medallion and daily mission gain.

 

You should be able to get more than 30k a day if you search for medallions.

[bejuizb]

Makes Medallions much more enticing. Lesser rep farming min/maxing bullcrap on regular star chart nodes.

[VKhaun]

Medallions and syndicate mission rewards can be earned IN ADDITION TO that cap from all missions. By moving the amount you can earn from all missions over to the syndicate missions and medallions which go above cap, they actually buffed the amount lower rank players could earn and -hopefully- added more population to the syndicate missions through higher rewards.

 

For high rank players they about broke even, assuming they were doing dailies before and after the patch. 

 

The "nerf" only exists if you farmed but did not run syndicate missions and do not intend to start running them.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/396700-psa-forumites-syndicate-math/

Edited February 8, 2015 by VKhaun

[(PSN)theelix]

Doubled medallion and daily gain.

 

You should be able to get more than 30k a day if you search for medallions.

I did forget about those things.

Should've known that they'd put RNG on Syndicates as well. It was only a matter of time.

 

 

 

Medallions and syndicate mission rewards can be earned IN ADDITION TO that cap from all missions. By moving the amount you can earn from all missions over to the syndicate missions and medallions which go above cap, they actually buffed the amount lower rank players could earn and -hopefully- added more population to the syndicate missions through higher rewards.

 

For high rank players they about broke even, assuming they were doing dailies before and after the patch. 

 

The "nerf" only exists if you farmed but did not run syndicate missions and do not intend to start running them.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/396700-psa-forumites-syndicate-math/

 

I didn't intend to run those darn missions; up until yesterday I had four Syndicates ranked for a whopping twelve Syndicate Missions per day.

 

Edit: Just read it, I could potentially gain more than what I had before, but in practicality will probably break even.

Regardless of if I do or not, thank you for doing the math. It completely answers my questions.

Edited February 8, 2015 by (PS4)theelix

[Genzaio]

Its to entice players to actually find medallions in syndicate dailies and making it less of a grind in missions for that 30k cap.

 

 

I did forget about those things.

Should've known that they'd put RNG on Syndicates as well. It was only a matter of time.

 

How is it RNG ? You dont really expect the same medallions in the same place do you? Wheres the fun in that?

Edited February 8, 2015 by Genzaio

[Adaptor-Face]

lets do some math: lets say you find 14 medallions (one 8 medallion mission and two 3 medallion missions), where 4 of the medallions give 1k rep and the rest 500. thats 10k. now on to the mission (assuming rank 5 in syndicate) 6,5k, 3,8k and 2,8k we are up to a total of 23,1k of "free" rep

 

before that would be around 10,9k

at what rank the change is a nerf: At mastery rank 12 (or 13 depending on luck with mission reward and medallions)

 

and this is assuming you NEVER EVER find a 5k medallion

 

EDIT: just to point out, a rank 19 would get 5-10k rep less, resulting in what took 4 days now takes 5

Edited February 8, 2015 by Adaptor-Face

[SquirmyBurrito]

Doubled medallion and daily mission gain.

 

You should be able to get more than 30k a day if you search for medallions.

 

Math done in numerous threads (and apparently dev statements in streams) seems to indicate that we now get less rep per day than was possible before the nerf.

 

lets do some math: lets say you find 14 medallions (one 8 medallion mission and two 3 medallion missions), where 4 of the medallions give 1k rep and the rest 500. thats 10k. now on to the mission (assuming rank 5 in syndicate) 6,5k, 3,8k and 2,8k we are up to a total of 23,1k of "free" rep

 

before that would be around 10,9k

at what rank the change is a nerf: At mastery rank 12 (or 13 depending on luck with mission reward and medallions)

 

and this is assuming you NEVER EVER find a 5k medallion

 

EDIT: just to point out, a rank 19 would get 5-10k rep less, resulting in what took 4 days now takes 5

 

 

I have NEVER gotten a mission that paid out with more than 3 medallions.

Edited February 8, 2015 by SquirmyBurrito

[DarkBabylon]

Alright down with you guys right now!

For everything you complain about "oh they nerfed this, of they nerfed that" YOU KNOW WHAT? I am furious!

Because the people who complain they don't complain about grind wall, they are just used to Triple A titles being so ridiculously easy, holding you hand throughout the game, and now everybody is like "GRIND WALL GRIND WALL GRIND WALL" or "RNG RNG RNG".

 

THE ONLY thing that RNG has to contribute to these missions is if you get certain medallions and get certain amount from missions, but most of the time RNG is in favor in that aspect, most of the time you can get more than 3k rep a mission up to 6k when you are in high ranking with the syndicate just from completing it, and you will get at least 8 low rank medallions most of the time

Each low rank medallion used to be 250, now it is 500. lets do a little claculation:

Let us assume you get 3, 3k standing missions which is again not what happens most of the time, you'll get more than that usually.

Let us also assume each mission has 8 regular medallions in them.

500*8=4,000 standing points

Now add that to the 3k standing you have 7k standing by the end of the mission, all you need is extra 1 minute to walk in the relay and turn them in.

BUT WAIT, that is from a SINGLE mission. Let us go ahead and triple that 7k.

We by now have 21k standing points in addition to whatever your ranking was.

 

Mastery rank 3 can get syndicate missions, and they get as low as 340 per syndicate mission at least to my understanding so far, again add those 4k points you pretty much insta-ranked on the first day, as you took those medallions and there is a chance you'd get at least one that gives you 5k standing, which more than doubles my calculations. The first rank with a syndicate don't give you missions, they didn't previously but MR 4 should be able to rank instantly on the first day if they stick to one syndicate, and rep farm, as the maximum standing for neutral is 5k standing, and they require a certain resource to advance. You get those missions all of a sudden and there is a chance you'd rank about AGAIN on the same day.

Again this is for MR4, what about veterans? Well again they get more than 30k standing if they do everything, so everyday they can purchase another mod or a void key pack with 3 random keys, WHICH IS BETTER THAN the static 5 T4(insert-mode-here) keys.

It allows you to farm prime parts better, and if someone brings out the 5$ for 5 keys you shouldn't be doing it in the first place to be honest, but cash flows from somewhere, so...I guess it's okay, but again you could use those 5$ for something else like customization which has no alternative, or something useful in real life. Or better yet, save those 5$, if you get pocket cash wait 10 times, you get 50$, wait more than that you could reach 150$, guess what you got? PRIME ACCESS! Which is one of the best deals DE actually gives you.

 

buying only the accessories you get 90 day affinity and credit boosters 90/7*80-1028.57 platinum, just from that, you can get about the same amount from the purchase platinum, it is just converted into boosters, and you get 2 more accessories you could use. So if you are a player that still gonna play a lot, this is a good deal. The alternative of course is on the same pack, pay those 50$ into 2 prime weapons and 1050 platinum which is MORE than we actually calculated.

 

So back to my point. Is it good? Yeah, it is a better choice as the game will force you to explore if you want better things, which is completely optional, and actually rewards you for something you actually did, and not because you farmed.

[wtrmlnjuc]

1. Before this patch, you were earning a lot of rep for doing non -Syndicate related stuff. A lot more than the given missions. It just doesn't make any sense logically.

2. Insignias now have a purpose, and exploration is rewarded. The cap doesn't apply to medallions. It also coerces the player to do some interaction in the relays.

Edited February 8, 2015 by wtrmlnjuc

[DarkBabylon]

Math done in numerous threads (and apparently dev statements in streams) seems to indicate that we now get less rep per day than was possible before the nerf.

 

 

 

I have NEVER gotten a mission that paid out with more than 3 medallions.

The so spoken "math" is if you are above a certain rank and already did the medallions thing.

And if you never had more than 3 medallions, ok, then abort and restart the mission, should give you 8 if you do it a couple of times, and especially with online squads. To my impression it seems that the game favors you when you don't go solo.

[akira_him]

So people won't go to Darco and spam RJ for hours

They want you to play the game, but not go to work in the game

They want you to explore their fine tilesets, which always being ignored

Edited February 8, 2015 by akira_him

[Morgax]

Doubled medallion and daily mission gain.

 

You should be able to get more than 30k a day if you search for medallions.

Doubled gain for the lowest and mid medallion reward, highest tier is still the same.

 

30k is VERY optimistic.

Edited February 8, 2015 by Morgax

[DarkBabylon]

Doubled gain for the lowest and mid medallion reward, highest tier is still the same.

 

30k is VERY optimistic.

But highly realistic.

[SquirmyBurrito]

Its to entice players to actually find medallions in syndicate dailies and making it less of a grind in missions for that 30k cap.

 

 

 

How is it RNG ? You dont really expect the same medallions in the same place do you? Wheres the fun in that?

 

I don't find easter egg hunts fun, having them always spawn in the same places would make it more bearable and therefore more fun for me. Also, it isn't just the medallions that are controlled by RNG, the missions spawned for me to do also seem to be dictated by RNG. Which gives me a 99% chance that I won't like the mission/mission type that I'm forced to do.

 

The so spoken "math" is if you are above a certain rank and already did the medallions thing.

And if you never had more than 3 medallions, ok, then abort and restart the mission, should give you 8 if you do it a couple of times, and especially with online squads. To my impression it seems that the game favors you when you don't go solo.

 

I never bothered hunting for medallions pre-nerf because I HATE easter egg hunts. Now I have to choose between only getting 16k per day or doing something I HATE to try and make up some of the difference. And I always solo when I do choose to go on an easter egg hunt because otherwise there is no guarantee the others will have the patience to wander around searching for the horrid things.

[(PSN)theelix]

-snip-

This was more of a thread on why it happened because I didn't understand. The whole concept of them halving the Daily rep gain and doubling syndicate missions (which I've never seen more than the usual 250, 500, 1500 set up) seemed absolutely stupid.

 

Its to entice players to actually find medallions in syndicate dailies and making it less of a grind in missions for that 30k cap.

 

 

 

How is it RNG ? You dont really expect the same medallions in the same place do you? Wheres the fun in that?

Are you guaranteed X of A medallion, X of B medallion and X of C medallion?

From what people have been saying, it seems like it's a lot of RNG and that I'm most likely only going to get 2/3rds of my current rep.

 

Why don't they just put a set amount of rep gain per mission and for endless, per wave? I don't understand why we need three hoops to jump through just to get a slightly better Ballistica, Akbolto, Dual Cestra, Marelock or an OP S.Gammacor.

 

Like, it's not a grind for me, I usually get 30k rep by the end of the day having fun doing whatever I want. Then there are the people who just play for twenty minutes and get those 30+k in that small amount of time. I can understand not wanting people to just come in and rep farm. From what I just read, the Syndicate math, it's probable that I can get slightly more than what  I have currently but it's pretty much a gamble.

 

IDK, I'm not here to tell DE what to do about this, I just wanted to know why they did it, and I got my answer.

 

 

 

The so spoken "math" is if you are above a certain rank and already did the medallions thing.

And if you never had more than 3 medallions, ok, then abort and restart the mission, should give you 8 if you do it a couple of times, and especially with online squads. To my impression it seems that the game favors you when you don't go solo.

 

Also, from this post right here, I'm already seeing a broken mechanic here; this is the same reason why they removed ciphers to "fix" them and from what I'm seeing, they haven't given any news or anything on it.

RNG what missions and how much set S.Rep you'll get on it and where.

RNG how many medallions you get.

RNG what medallions you'll get.

Don't get what you want quit and restart until you do.

Just get rid of the first part, change the medallions to "prime part" and it sounds exactly like what happened to the Orokin Ciphers.

So... inb4 medallions taken to fix.

Edited February 8, 2015 by (PS4)theelix

[Rogunz]

But highly realistic.

Not when a lot of tilesets have 3 medallions max, and some mission types don't have any medallions.

 

You get 3 alerts, at least 1 generally is a type that gives no medallions.

 

Your assumption that you will get tilesets that have 8 medallions, will be able to find all the medallions, and you will get missions that have medallions is not at all realistic.

[DarkBabylon]

 

 

 

Also, from this post right here, I'm already seeing a broken mechanic here; this is the same reason why they removed ciphers to "fix" them and from what I'm seeing, they haven't given any news or anything on it.

RNG what missions and how much set S.Rep you'll get on it and where.

RNG how many medallions you get.

RNG what medallions you'll get.

Don't get what you want quit and restart until you do.

Just get rid of the first part, change the medallions to "prime part" and it sounds exactly like what happened to the Orokin Ciphers.

So... inb4 medallions taken to fix.

Again like I said, RNG is fairly forgiving in the syndicate missions, the amount of rep is usually going to average above 3k per mission.

And yes I do agree restarting is a problem, but I offer a solution for the time being. We definitely need more occurrences in which there is at least 5.

And RNG medallions you get? I have assumed all the medallions were the absolute tosh ones, and you can get a lot from them.

Edited February 8, 2015 by DarkBabylon

[DarkBabylon]

Not when a lot of tilesets have 3 medallions max, and some mission types don't have any medallions.

 

You get 3 alerts, at least 1 generally is a type that gives no medallions.

 

Your assumption that you will get tilesets that have 8 medallions, will be able to find all the medallions, and you will get missions that have medallions is not at all realistic.

Actually I've had this exact occurrence in which I have 8 medallions almost every time and as far as I know they always have fixed locations just so many locations and so little medallions they are in random location between those fixed locations. so idk what is up with you getting such happenings.

But yes there ARE bad days in which you get no medallions that is in fact something I am not going ignore, but my assumption was on a good day in which RNG felt like giving treats. The amount of Rep you get is fixed globally and is set in a pretty far range, and most of the time I had 8 medallions, so really talking about removing it entirely because of 0.001% chance of having NO MEDALLIONS and below 3k average, is not a good idea to begin with.

 

First of all we need to get statistics from a decent amount of plays and see whether RNG is in our favor or not. But I am not willing to run these statistic tests.

Edited February 8, 2015 by DarkBabylon

[Rogunz]

Actually I've had this exact occurrence in which I have 8 medallions almost every time and as far as I know they always have fixed locations just so many locations and so little medallions they are in random location between those fixed locations. so idk what is up with you getting such happenings.

But yes there ARE bad days in which you get no medallions that is in fact something I am not going ignore, but my assumption was on a good day in which RNG felt like giving treats. The amount of Rep you get is fixed globally and is set in a pretty far range, and most of the time I had 8 medallions, so really talking about removing it entirely because of 0.001% chance of having NO MEDALLIONS and below 3k average, is not a good idea to begin with.

 

First of all we need to get statistics from a decent amount of plays and see whether RNG is in our favor or not. But I am not willing to run these statistic tests.

I don't have any issue with finding them, my issue is that the rng with what missions you get can easily make it so you don't have a chance to find any.

If your missions are on certain tilesets, you can only ever get 3 medallions.

[Steelleef]

I think it is more "favorable" if you run multiple syndicates compared to the old system.   As is, I have 9 syndicate missions I can do daily.  Worth about 4-6k on average, lets just say 5k each.   45k rep right there.     Already stomping old value of 30k I could hit from mastery, then add in syndicate for  only roughly 15-20k.  Medalions were buffed overall, regardless of what you say, so boost regardless compared to old patch.   And I still have 15k from mastery rank.  

 

 

Yes, this is a much higher effort system, and heavily pushes you to have as many syndicates as possible, which is expensive as hell to get through (3 syndicates cost 2820000 credits to max), but it is overall better if I am not lazy.  It slows down how much you can rush through one syndicate pretty heavily, but I can get more if I wanted to.

Edited February 8, 2015 by Steelleef

[VDeorsum]

Why nerf daily rep? Because we LOVE GRINDING!

[Gilmaesh]

that was a good move from DE. Now you have to play the game instead of spamming your RJ.

[(PSN)Lord_Gremlin]

WTH are medallions? And draco on ceres is a pretty dead place. I kinda agree with op. But I think we're not getting these changes yet. TBH without booster I rarely hit my 38000 limit, but with booster.. Guess they don't want to sell prime access.

Edited February 8, 2015 by (PS4)Lord_Gremlin