September 11Th: Community Hot Topics!

[(PSN)WRAITH3601]

I Love This Game. I love the mods concept . I only have a problem when u need a certain group to go past 60 min in survival. And my main problem is fix life support time in ODS

[Talvisolta]

the main problem i see with endless missions rewards is that some parts have different rarity. I mean i have limited void access and if i spending 10+ keys and receiving in everytime the same parts it doesn't help me really. I know the void trader have nice things for sale but it doesn't get me closer to the part i was looking for. Even in the trading chat some parts are very "common" so nobody wants them.

I think it would be nice if the void trading would selling prime parts or if the reward rotation would be removed (all parts at every rotation available
) and all parts have same rarities.

[(PSN)LIGHTNINGCOMBAT]

Yes, essential mods and weapons should be rebalance, not just super-nerfed. Things should be able to hold up in long endless missions.  Buff older weapons to bring them inline with the weapons that people use in endless missions. If you want to nerf weapons then also deal with enemy scaling.  They don't need like 80k health plus 90% damage reduction from armor.

 

I like the concept of the Exilus slot, but the non-plat costs are unfair. At least make the BP reusable.  I don't mind the other costs, but the photography mini-game is not fun, and it breaks the flow of the combat, making the combat (which is actually fun) less fun.  Alternatively, give that faction it's own syndicate missions based on spy missions, capture missions, hijack missions and so on.

 

Also, the Exilus slot should be energy cost free. 

 

Aura slot       - (positive) -    gives energy

 

Exilus slot     - (neutral) -     neither gives nor takes energy

 

Regular slot  - (negative) -  takes energy

 

My initial impression of the Brawler frame is that it just looks goofy, and I am not a fan of melee in Warframe anyway.

 

"Difficulty" already scales quickly enough.  However rewards in endless missions should be better the longer you go in them. Going 70 minutes in T3S should not reward multiple forma per C rotation. Going 10 waves on Sechura should pay slightly more credits than doing 2 seperate runs of 5 waves each.  However, you need to fix enemy armor scaling before you try to make them scale more quickly.

 

I like this because now I can make the analogy that a Warframe is like an Atom. 

[(PSN)lionhunter55]

I loved the idea of a new mod slot, but you have to PAY for it?

But seriously good game except wait times

[Nineart]

i think the reason required mod exist is because every gun goes for same target(everything) and kills everything with simple one value, more damage.

here is what drunken me thought...

 

current system:

 

y= damage dealt

x= damage of a bullet

a= damage reduction in percentage

r= rate of conversion from damage of a bullet to damage dealt

 

y=ax

r=y/x=a

 

multishot increases dps, rate of fire increases dps, because of this formula.

it doesnt matter how heavy your target is, every bullet is treated equally, making us to use same mods with highest dps weapon

 

now here is my suggestion:

b= damage reduction in numeric value

 

y=ax-b

r=(ax-b)/x = ax/x -b/x= a -b/x

 

the difference is -b/x and how it changes r, the rate at which damage is converted.

if b, DR in number, is constant, bigger x, dmg per bullet, will have better r, rate of conversion.

if x, dmg per bullet, is constant, bigger b, DR in number, will decrease r, rate of conversion.

 

this changes system so that not all gun will go for the same mods for more dps.

this system will change guns with high dmg/ bullets to be suitable to kill heavily armored targets.

rate of fire will increase dps in the cost of dmg/bullets making guns with high rate of fire weak to armored targets.

 

players can find middle ground of rate of fire and dmg/bullets and based on their build different targets will have different difficulty based on their armor and dmg per bullets.

simply put, no set of gun and mods that can kill everything.

[-TSA-voshond]

I dont think the base dmg and multishot need a rework, ofc some argue that some weapon outdps some warframes but i think sometimes you need that dps. endless enemys scale very hard after a 40min mark and weapons sometimes deal like a laughable amount of dmg to highlevel enemies. its no fun when you shoot a complete clip into enemies while watching them feel scratched while you get oneshotted. you never outdps a mesa or saryn on a whole grp of enemies on a large radius, which is the current meta anyway. singletarget ofc but what happens to frames that simply dont provide a good dps, trin, banshee, mag, oberon, vauban, nekros, zephyr for example would be a joke without the weapondps.

 

there will always be a meta, but i like the dmg to be increased with serration and multishot since some weapons ONLY work with them AND you can play some offmeta Weapons WITH them. Amprex without multishot or mutlishot with higher ammoconsumtion? it would be simply S#&$ what is now a great weapon! i still think its a fun mechanic to play with when you consider the endgame.

[CataReverb]

Required mods rework/rebalance:

The first focus should be more on base damage mods, as they are the mods that are most considered a "tax" as opposed to multishot, which is a mechanical upgrade to weapons instead of a flat stat mod.

If you're going to rework multishot, make sure that the mechanics are appropriately powerful for when you get them (a rare mod that's not much better than an uncommon mod is irritating, see Primed Slip Magazine.)  Make sure it doesn't screw over all weapons the way that multishot consuming ammo would.  In the situation described, where Multishot would consume ammo, it would become nothing more than another variable in fire rate.  

If you want to nerf multishot mods as opposed to the mechanic, you might be fine so long as they are still viable for their cost and slot.

Give players the option to refund the forma when you nerf a weapon in drastic fashion.  There's nothing more irksome to most players than a six forma weapon turning unusable when it's not the weapon they invested in. 

 

I love the exilus slot, but I feel that it's inclusion just serves to highlight that the full modding situation needs to change.  If this is a herald to Modding 2.0 (or 2.5/3.0, idk) I wouldn't be opposed, and it would serve as a better front for rebalancing the mods than the front of "Nerf Hammers: most OP weapon in game."

 

"Brawler" frame... I don't think I've seen anything other than the initial concept art which was drawn without a helmet? If it doesn't have a head, that'd get kinda irksome to look at.

 

Endless missions and scaling:

The biggest enemy of every Tenno, the god they fear, is RNG.  Because before we enter the void, every weapon is "three more Neurodes" away, and we know where and how to reliably get Neurodes that the RNG of farming the void (or draco for access to the parts of the void wherein treasures lie.)  From this farming happens, which can become tiring that creates the mindset of "How can I do this more efficiently" in which the root of modding and tactics that are OP, so they get more out of each key, so they don't have to farm more keys.

 

Consider some alternates:  Level scaling starts high but stays flat.  Risk of failure is a revive for everyone on the team until the team decides to quit or extracts, if the mission fails, people keep what they've already earned.

 

Maybe consider restructuring the void so that more similar parts will always be grouped in the same tier, so that the parts about to leave the void, and the staple weapons that won't leave the void will remain easier to access.

 

Maybe introduce a single reusable or craftable T5 key that has level 50-70ish enemies, with objectives that constantly change with a bit of player influence on its direction, say "Eliminate this squad of 100 enemies" > "Now that the enemy's numbers are thinned, do [one round of interception at this location,] or distract the reinforcements so that an operative [survival]" which branches off several times to several different mini-tasks, perhaps capped with a Sabotage like boss ending.

To each game system a certain amount of risk is required to validate the value of each run.  The biggest risk in each void run is time: the time to farm up a key in Draco, the time of the mission to run to completion... I get that key packs are meant to be a way that warframe makes its money, but I have to wonder if many people buy them for plat rather than syndicate or pay expert farmers for the parts or try to farm it themself from draco/triton up.

 

I wonder if, in place of short feedback, more consideration through the forums could come up.  If there would be a temporary forum as a mixture of Fan Concepts and Feedback would come up, so something like "How would you change X" comes up, after which the design council votes on the top five or so based only on the initial post, which is then given consideration of "is this a realistic change, can we test to see how it feels" by DE, then put into a test build... or something less bureaucratic...

[MechaTails]

The only way this game will get balanced is by giving enemies a level cap, then balancing everything else as needed. I understand that's a huge undertaking and it'll probably never happen, but you know that's the most effective solution.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/527554-a-few-suggestions-for-weapon-balance/

[(PSN)lionhunter55]

I loved the idea of a new mod slot, but you have to PAY for it?

But seriously good game except wait times

Lol checked and you can get it for syndicates

But those wait times ugh

[Ershk]

BRAWLER

 

No ranged powers

 

No buffs, debuffs, or auras that are duration based or with toggles

 

it sounds stupid but that's what a brawler is... stupid

 

as what has been said he is supposedly simple and i think 4 actively used melee moves not abilities is simple

 

just mess around with number of targets, movement, invincibilty frames and oh i've seen the ninkondi frontal finisher attack it looks like you guys know how to make grapple animations with certain models... if brawler were to throw anything let it be enemies he grabs

 

on to aesthetics

 

I found out about Keith Thompson while my brother was just looking up art for no apparent reason and I freaked out when i saw that the guy drew concept of Volt 

 

I like the the guy's style, I like the disturbing organic qualities of the brawler art up right now

 

ive got nothing against the 'head' of the brawler i think it fits thematically, i hear boxers are always to keep their chin down to prevent whiplash or easy knockout so i love the look even more since it makes sense 

 

 

I want me some Bacon-brawler

 

 

 

 

oh and survival 5 minute waves hurt my butt and i get even more butthurt when 20 minutes pass in a tower survival and i only have 1 thing to turn into 10-20 ducats

 

[--Q--WaffleZ]

In your opinion, should “required” mods be reworked (with appropriate rebalancing)?

- Yes, because we have too many required damage multiplier mods right now.  Better free up a slot for more interesting property mod.

 

Overall, what is your opinion of the Exilus mod slot?

- It's OK, good to have it but not required.  Need more mods.

 

What is your initial impression of the “Brawler” warframe?

- I both like and dislike it.  So, it's OK... I think.

 

In your opinion, should endless mission difficulty scale more quickly with quicker rewards?

- Everyone will say yes for sure.

[SirWolfen]

I had a small discussion among my alliance members about 3 and 4.

I have been spoiled on this "Brawler" frame

It isn't a brawller frame it's an earth-bender frame... what the hell DE.

A friend came up with an idea atleast in terms of the rewards. Why not have it so that the further you into an endless mission you get more rewards. IE 1-20 in defense you get 1 reward per 5waves then why not from 25-40 you get 2 rewards per 5 waves and 45-60 you get 3 rewards per 5 waves and I guess that could be the cap 3 rewards per 5 waves. This would give more incentive to actually go beyond 20.

[DelialFallen]

From what I've seen here we're heading into even more nerf territory.

[Cray]

Voted other for...

 

Required Mods

Easy Way: Remove Serration, Point Blank, Hornet Strike, and Pressure Point, and make damage scale with level such that a level 30 weapon would have the same stats that it has now. Multishot isn't so simple, so I won't comment on that one just yet. But making it act like a corrupted mod (taking more ammo) is definitely NOT a good idea.

 

A harder, but potentially better way: I feel there should be two separate customization systems for weapons. A new one for just damage, and the one we have now for everything other than damage. All mods that affect physical and/or elemental damage, would fall under this system.

 

Exilus

I like the idea, but the non-plat cost is too high, and I personally don't like the limitations of what mods and how it still takes capacity. I know they both make sense, but it still feels a little wrong.

[Skarokin]

Personally, I cant seem to enjoy warframe as I used to as much. SIMPLY because of all the things that DE is doing. They think "Oh, nerf multishot! Nerf serration!  Nerf hornet strike! NERF ALL THE THINGS!" But they do not care about the community. They arent listening to what we say, all they do is this: They see a cool suggestion, they think "eh i guess its okay" and then they copy the suggestion and then MAKE IT FREACKIN TERRIBLE! DE! LISTEN TO THE COMMUNITY! WE DONT WANT HARD NERFS! PLEASE! I'VE BEEN PLAYING WELL OVER A YEAR ON WARFRAME AND ITS GETTING WORSE! AND WORSE!

[TriggerHappyWhiteGuy]

Required Mods: the rank 5 multi-shot should be tweaked because it does not take a lot of cores to max out a rank 5 and it gives alot of power. If you choose to keep it as a required mods then I would suggest making it a rank 10 mod, ignore the ammo nerf that was talked about, and have it increase 10% each level making 100% multishot. I feel Serration and Heavy Caliber <---other "required mods" should not be touched because the fact when you start out as a newer player you are choosing to allocate your resources and gradually increase your power through those mods ultimately giving a sense of progression. 

 

If you make Multi shot mods pointless then the whole community is going to switch over to the next best thing "elemental damage". If removed all required mods including Rank 10 ones then we will once again have the full rainbow build. 8 mod slots= Normal elemental damage mods + dual stat elemental mods(rearranging order based of off faction).

 

Exilus Mod Slot: My only issue with this is that the Blue Print is not reusable. For an extra slot we have to add 2 more forma on to our warframes, complete a quest to unlock the blue print, get 50k standing with simarus, and the high foundry cost and wait time per item. We have enough penalties on this item and making the blueprint not reusable is cruel. If you want to make a syndicate point sink for simarus, people will gladly do it for a pack of Rare Fusion Cores. 

 

Warframe Brawler: With the Brawler warframe, the only thing that has been visually released was really the concept art and I really need to see more of it to have a real opinion.

 

Endless Missions: These are what is causing most of your issues. People hate rotation C because its 20min for a chance at that one new prime part that you put in there and its a poor chance at that. In non endless missions that we could complete in 5min we have a chance for that part which I feel is fair because yeah that part has low chance but we can do them a lot faster. Time VS Reward, Endless missions are unfair in that respect, I feel that because we have to go so long for a chance that the drop tables should have an equal drop at rotation C and not weighted so heavy.

 

Another part of the issue with Endless missions is the scaling making the community feel like we need more damage and have to use all of these required mods to beat these endless missions. What we need is a level cap then the devs to re-balance the guns& powers so we know how strong we are suppose to be. 

 

Lets say you made the level cap on all endless missions go to the max level at 50 and one of the strongest guns used only Progression mods like Serration/Heavy caliber and with those two mods on that weapon we could kill everything fairly easy to the point that it would be pointless to add more damage. Now if you stack all damage mods VS someone that has those 2 Damage mods+6 other utility mods, the damage build would do worse because they could both do the required damage at the same rate but the person with the utility has more ammo,bigger clip and faster reload. <---after this happens you should be able to balance guns more effectively thought the MR along with stats, this would also help distinguish what weapons are downgrade,side grades, and upgrades. Example a MR 10 weapon with be a side grade to other MR 10 weapons while its an upgrade it MR9 and a downgrade to MR11. The Devs will now have more control over the "balance of power".

[tinyranitar]

I think Serration and Hornet Strike is Ok, since they shows progression like in RPG where you gain levels and power up. Since you have 8 slots, one mandatory mod wouldn't hurt much.

 

Pressure point needs to buffed.

 

Exilus is ok. It's not mandatory but it makes you easier to live.

 

Yes I'd love quicker rewards. Playing survival for 40 mins makes me feel like doing a chore. I had fun the first three times but then, nah.

 

HYPING FOR BRAWLER

[(PSN)Sum1ne_Else]

Exilus Slot - I am sure people have said before but its just way too expensive.  I understand 20p but to build is ridiculous.  Considering the fact that you have to forma the warframe at least another 2 times to fit an extra mod into the slot.  So in total a minimum of 4 days is required (forma building) plus you need simarus standing, for a MR19 its 2-3 days but for someone that is a lower MR it just loses the appeal after a week of farming just to get an Exilus slot on 1 warframe. 

 

Dedicated slots – YES particularly for Augments only.  I know this was available before but I am sure with every Exilus slot purchased/farmed another slot for augments could have become available right next to the Exilus slot or something.  It should be a slot that cannot be forma’d and has the augment symbol to lower the ‘cost’.

[foxxess]

What about the plans tweaking Serration, Hornet Strike and Point Blank? I still feel like those Mods are a must have in almost every weapon.

How about adding +% recoil to serration (and also adding the ability to up and downgrade mods once they are maxed), +% reload time to Hornet Strike and +% Damage fall off for Point Blank.

Adding a negative effect to every overpowered Mod seems to be an interesting way for balancing, because no weapon is the same, we don't need complex weapon mechanics, we just need different mods with several ways to use. This way it's not easy to distinguish what is OP from what is not. Leaving time to reblance things every season or year.

 

I also want to add: How about giving Ember a passive/skill, where she emits fire from her Body during reload? The amount of ticks per second are based on the equipped Firearm's fire rate and the duration by the reload time. Giving long reloads a purpose and Ember a niche?

[[DE]Grzegorz]

What about the plans tweaking Serration, Hornet Strike and Point Blank? I still feel like those Mods are a must have in almost every weapon.

How about adding +% recoil to serration (and also adding the ability to up and downgrade mods once they are maxed), +% reload time to Hornet Strike and +% Damage fall off for Point Blank.

Adding a negative effect to every overpowered Mod seems to be an interesting way for balancing, because no weapon is the same, we don't need complex weapon mechanics, we just need different mods with several ways to use. This way it's not easy to distinguish what is OP from what is not. Leaving time to reblance things every season or year.

I'm going to hit everyone in the face with the following quote

...before we balance the tools we have to deal with nearly broken infinite scaling, we need to fix infinite scaling first...

 

Raw +damage builds are mandatory to keep players relevant. Enemies turn into bulletsponges really quickly and the only way to overcome this issue for a short time is more damage.

 

If we had finite scaling with balanced difficulty and weapons rebalanced accordingly, then we should move onto mods and indeed change them to tradeoffs instead of straight upgrades.

[BrazilianJoe]

NECESSARY MODS: 

 

Mostly the 'raw damage' Serration-like mods: replace the mods with innate, damage-scales-with-weapon-level bonus, so that players can still reach the current damage levels. Reward players of previous mods appropriately. I would gladly take one Primed Reach for each maxed Serration I have. 

 

VECTIS PRIME  still not fine BTW, and Depleted Reload makes it crappier than Vectis.

 

Face the demons ppl.

 

 

 

EXILUS SLOT: 

 

What a crappily phrased poll with NO useful questions for objective measurement of improvements!

 

EXILUS Needs to cost half modding points by default. When forma'ed, cost full points - but not penalty extra points - for mismatchedpolarity, and 0 mod points for matched polarity. 

 

INFINITELY FORMA'ED STUFF (not a hot topic): Should get +1 or +2 mod point for every extra forma which didn't change a polarity.

 

 

 

ONE MORE THING:

 

EQUINOX still misssing a balance pass, some power aspects are crappy, needs some QoL. Year of Quality folks, don't move on to the next thing until you made the new release real good. 

Edited September 14, 2015 by -TP-BrazilianJoe

[Bladelaw]

Required Mods:

I'd rather pull things like serration/split chamber/crit mods out of the game completely and have weapons "earn" the damage that comes from those mods organically as they rank up. Change elemental mods to alter the %-age of a weapons damage type to the mod's element, maxing out at 100%, additional elements would still create the combos that exist today with the appropriate %age based on the mods used to create the combo. Corrupt mods can stay while being rebalanced around the new damage levels. Heavy Caliber and critical delay would especially would need work to keep them from being "required". Of course enemies should also be balanced around this new normal.

 

Exilus Slot: I love the idea of a Utility slot. I'm not too crazy about it requiring mod points basically forcing a forma on every frame that we want to use it on. So far I haven't found a reason to use any non-mobility mod in that slot. Open up a few more mods that can be placed in either the exilus slot or the normal slots will open up some potentially interesting builds.

 

Brawler Frame: I love the concept and I hope it plays as well as it looks. Like Excalibur and swords I want to use Brawler and fists/sparring all the time.

 

Endless Scaling: I'd be happy to keep the ramp as is but let us start at a higher difficulty with better scaling. The ability to start a tower survival at the 15 minute/wave difficulty and get a tier C reward would be grand. We already burn through non endless keys in less than 5 minutes for the most part and get a C level reward, might as well do the same for endless. To keep it from being too easy start the difficulty at 20/25 minutes as long as it only takes 5/10 minutes to get a C level reward I'd be fine with that. There's also the added difficulty of not having a ton of life support capsules to pop right away if it starts at the "hard" point.

[Jackel7]

Regarding Multishot Mods

 

they are fine as is there never been a problem with them, nor are they hard to get. Also there stranded multishot mods: Split Chamber, Barrel Diffusion, Hell's Chamber. But there multishot mods with special traits: Lethal Torrent increased fire rate. Note: they don't consume addition ammo which is great seeing  A) there guns with low clip sizes B) guns with low ammo reserves Ex. SMG's with a clip size of 100, and reserve of 210.

 

Also if multishot mods were to consume more ammo Braton Prime will be the First trash prime weapon! T^T

 

Before anybody freaked out on me guns in real life are modifiable be it magazine size, ammo cap, sights/scope and ammo.

 

When I say ammo I mean multishot mods turns normal rifle rounds into metal jackets, hollow points or alter it output.

 

Also the Grineer, Corpus and Infested don't care if Tenno are underpowered.

 

**Please be aware nobody is forcing people to use multishot mods, but make a test were you do a Saturn Survival mission up to 30-40 minutes with a weapon with multishot mod(s), then replay the mission without said mod(s).

And regarding guns there no size fits all, you can't compare a sidearm to and assault rifle nor a shotgun to a rocket launcher.

Edited September 14, 2015 by Jackel7

[foxxess]

I'm going to hit everyone in the face with the following quote

 

 

 

Raw +damage builds are mandatory to keep players relevant. Enemies turn into bulletsponges really quickly and the only way to overcome this issue for a short time is more damage.

 

If we had finite scaling with balanced difficulty and weapons rebalanced accordingly, then we should move onto mods and indeed change them to tradeoffs instead of straight upgrades.

I don't mind infinite scalings, that just means: tough missions getting even harder, so what? I don't see the problem with the weapons. The Warframe abilities are broken in terms of scaling, like Mag's Shield Polarize and Trinity's 1-2-Combo. Their damage is dependent on the infinitely rising enemy stats like HP and Shield, which is broken. That's why raw extra damage on weapons isn't the problem here.

[(PSN)Junguler]

i don't really care about you ignoring people's opinion about carrier and vacuum, most people want that ability on every companion and the stats show's that, so why don't you give them that option?

i don't feel like giving more feedback when you just gonna ignore what i have to say.