Saryn Rework Gallipoli All Over

[TARINunit9]

Please list her Crowd Control and Utility contributions. I don't care what Saryn used to do, just give me what Reworked Saryn does.

For CC, her Miasma is now an Avalanche-style stun

 

For Utility, she can basically drop every enemy on the map to 1/8th health in less time than a Nova would take to kill them

 

 

GJ more flesh targets why does everyone base how good something is based on low level flesh targets?

Since Saryn is Viral, and Infested Flesh resists Viral, the fact that Spores were working so well long past level 45 is a point in Saryn's favor

Edited November 6, 2015 by TARINunit9

[CelticMoss]

For CC, her Miasma is now an Avalanche-style stun

 

For Utility, she can basically drop every enemy on the map to 1/8th health in less time than a Nova would take to kill them

My god you people that never played saryn she always had a stun in her 4....

[TARINunit9]

My god you people that never played saryn she always had a stun in her 4....

The stun lasted for less than 1.5 seconds because that's how negative duration works

[CelticMoss]

For CC, her Miasma is now an Avalanche-style stun

 

For Utility, she can basically drop every enemy on the map to 1/8th health in less time than a Nova would take to kill them

 

 

 

Since Saryn is Viral, and Infested Flesh resists Viral, the fact that Spores were working so well long past level 45 is a point in Saryn's favor

Uh no viral halfs flesh targets hp so yeah it's great vs mobs we can kill easy anyways gunners will not give one S#&$ about your combo.

[Cubewano]

I did watch the video and take in the info. I see the signs of it elsewhere on the forums. Improvements can happen, but first people have to accept what they have and give suggestions how to go from there. Simply complaining doesn't cause changes.

so then why not say that? instead of just being disruptive to the discussion and non-constructive.

[CelticMoss]

The stun lasted for less than 1.5 seconds because that's how negative duration works

Ok some people lowered the stun time doesn't change the fact she had a stun in the first place.

[CarrotSalad]

Took her (solo) into a 40 minute t1 survival.. she was doing fine until 38 minutes.. spamming spores ability throughout the whole time. The ability use on itself with clever shooting is fantastic now.

I'd still like to see adjustments made. (give her health back, more energy and 5x more health on Molt).

 

I wish the forums would be locked down though early on though so people would'nt jump to conclusions and then post feedback on those conclusions. Looking at the feedback thread theres allot of fluffy words that dont actually contribute anything.

Edited November 6, 2015 by CarrotSalad

[UrielColtan]

Im always the one with the most kills, even with Excals, Embers or Daynoxes, perhaps some people simply arent building Saryn right and are still relying on their negative duration press 4 builds or whatever. Only thing i dislike is rhe HP and armor nerf.

[Heatnix.]

You fellow Anzac people know the drill. The fan boys will tell you its awesome, sacrifice yourself for the empire.

 

Stand up and say no!  No S#&$ Saryn rework we demand quality! No Bandaids, you made it work with frost and excal. so DE we know you can do it if you try.  

 

It's not just the fanboys, it's the DE loyalists that thing they can do no wrong. They only change their minds when they are affected too and since Saryn was never good for most of these loyalists anyway they don't give a crap.

 

Most people saying that she's fine now are not even main Saryn players. A lot of them have not even played Saryn to begin with.

[vrdwrst]

Yeah, I get that she was the only cheap, lowbrow option to kill everything instantly, and we're all crying that we have to spend ten seconds to do just as much damage. But viral is always good. Would you rather attack a bombard at full health or half health? Yeah, armor scales and stuff, but really. Half health.

[MaverickZero]

For CC, her Miasma is now an Avalanche-style stun

 

For Utility, she can basically drop every enemy on the map to 1/8th health in less time than a Nova would take to kill them

I want to hear what Vargas has to say since he is without a doubt, more knowledgeable than you (no offense). But, I'll take a crack at it anyway:

 

Let's start with Utility: Viral proc does not stack. So it only halves their HP. Toxic procs are based on 50% Base Weapon/Ability Damage so you will not drop them to 1/8 their HP using the procs. In fact, almost all your DoT damage aside from wombo-combo Miasma will deal next to no damage vs lvl 40 grineer (for example a Heavy Gunner).

 

CC: the stun lasts for 3 seconds in a 15 meter radius. There's a ton of abilities that achieve or exceed that for example Reckoning. And they will scale just as well Miasma's stun if not better (example Rhino's Stomp).

 

There's no way in hell that your Saryn can outperform my Nova, not in terms of CC, utility or Damage.

[Omega-Shadowblade]

so then why not say that? instead of just being disruptive to the discussion and non-constructive.

So I slipped in my regular helpful behavior, nobody is perfect. That said if I could change something I would make molt be scalable and have it use absorbed damage as a booster for when it explodes.

[Eminem2420]

a) there is a mega-thread, use it.  You may think the devs won't read it, but they were the ones who signed up to have everyone post saryn feedback in a single thread.

 

b) post actual feedback, how the powers are working for you, what steps you personally are performing to come to your conclusions.

 

It may lead to nothing, I'm not a dev here, but the logical conclusion would be if so many similar or exact feedbacks are provided saying the same thing, the devs may at some point see the logic of it.  Saying "saryn trash, saryn bad, me delete saryn now!" or anything along those lines just aren't helpful in any way.

Well said. +1

[(PSN)SancticuS]

Because a 250% damage buff is totally a botched ability

 

OMG higher numbers.... L33t skilz

 

It is really hard to consider any change to Peacemaker not being anything other than a nerf. Now peacemaker is affected by Strength (dmg), Efficiency (energy drain) and Range (size of reticle). That is 3 out of the 4 options. The last being Duration which is needed for her 2 best abilities. Namely Shatter Shield and Shooting Gallery. So we got a ultimate that is so heavy to mod for that it almost becomes pointless to mod for all 3 instances it require unless you want to forgo the rest of her abilities.

 

The ultimate of any frame should be useable and a part of their kit, but since Peacemaker was so powerful it was turned into a novelty instead. Even my 3 forma Duration Mesa had a useable Peacemaker that I could use if I all of a sudden found myself overwhelmed by enemy numbers. In addition to this she now becomes even more vulnerable even if you have a shatter shield active due to the fact that she does not have 360 protection with her Peacemaker.

 

The reticle has to be turned and will decrease all while the rest of your view is being blured. At the same time you are rooted in one place. So any mission that has any slightly high level enemies you are susceptible to being one hit by enemies from your blindspot. Bombards, Napalms, Draks, Butchers, Prodmen any radial disarmed enemy can walk straight up to Mesa and whack her to death as Shatter shield only reduce bullet damage. Not melee.

 

So from being useable from low level to high mid tier it now has the possibility to become just a low level skill unless you find a tunnel spot and stand in one spot defending it. Which is exactly what DE does not want. On PC players can use macro's to make her turn 360 all the time and be less affected by such a change than the console players. Since I play on PS4 holding down a mousebutton and going AFK to watch youtube has never been a actual playstyle.

 

Mesa is actually one of the best designed warframes that have arrived lately. She has one of the most amazing visuals designs. Have 3 really good abilites and only one a bit underpar. Namely Ballistic Battery. Even so all 4 can be used and useful. How many other warframes can one say that about? But since the nerfherders started screaming everyday in the forums she is already got a rework which I find kind of sad. Her Peacemaker was powerful but not as all winning as people would have it to.

 

As all the other things that got nerfed they mostly worked with a good constellation of frames that complemented each other to make a good farming group. If you want there is no problem swapping Mesa for a Excalibur in a Draco run as his Radial Javelin can still clear the map with ease. So what do you really accomplish rather than move the meta to something else while possibly stomping over Mesa along the way?

 

Fixing the immense grind that causes such instances to appear would be a more solid approach than destroying X amounts of warframes along the way just because they helped the players alleviate the grind.

 

 

Guess what is tooted over the recent Saryn rework. OMG more damage numbers......forget forced synergy, reliant on massive amounts of energy, damage over time, lower EHP, turning her into a melee frame, loss of corrosive proc on miasma, comboing all her abilities to do less damage than before:

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/3rq0sy/long_saryn_build_analysis_comparing_old_and_new/

 

but boy them numbers, derp derp....

[UrielColtan]

Turned her into a melee frame? You realize she had other abilities besides press 4 right? Contagion always existed, they just improved it.

[Cubewano]

So I slipped in my regular helpful behavior, nobody is perfect. That said if I could change something I would make molt be scalable and have it use absorbed damage as a booster for when it explodes.

didn't figure you were, was just pointing out that comments like that are of no use. seeing as we've reached an understanding though all is well, hopefully in the coming weeks (really hope it doesn't take that long honestly x3) saryn can get the proper treatment she deserves to be a well balanced frame that everyone can enjoy. 

[Brozime]

Woah didn't expect to see myself when I came into this thread.  I very much appreciate you spreading my video around.

[(PSN)SancticuS]

Turned her into a melee frame? You realize she had other abilities besides press 4 right? Contagion always existed, they just improved it.

 

Nice way of overlooking all the other things I mentioned and bringing out the "press 4 to win" argument.

 

I main Saryn and had several reservation regarding this rework. In her previous state I used Molt, Miasma frequently and occasionally Venom. Regenerative Molt for the excellent removal of status and health regeneration. Miasma for stun and nuke when things get out of control and Venom when I wanna have a bit of fun and spread some mayhem in a choke point with high level enemies. Contagion I never used. Simply due to the limitation it's has to only affect melee. So yes Contagion always existed and was always her worst and among the very worst of ALL warframe abilities.

 

Now she is even more gimmicky to play and less more straight foreward. Yes there is more synergy but why should I cast Spore on several enemies, cast molt, cast spore on my molt, cast toxic lash, hit enemies with my melee and then cast miasma to get max out of my potential? When I simply can shot the enemies with my weapon and get rid of them a lot faster than exhausting all my energy and having to use all my 4 abilities to reach some sort of peak with them.

 

And as I mentioned in another thread:

 

Lets make it so that you need to scan a enemy, shot him with your secondary, hit him with your melee to do any damage with your primary weapon. Great synergy and also great fun right? Would you all hail that as a great rework?

[Culaio]

 

Well its not exactly right, For example: its not 3 times as much work to achieve same result, its actually 3 times as much work for lesser result which is direct nerf also  , most people dont have problem because they need to do 3 times as much work but because even with the "combo" damage is inferior to previous one. Also She is wrong when she said that saryn was over powered previously, it wasnt, yes it was very strong against low-mid level enemies but against high level enemies it was pretty bad, you couldnt solo 40 min on T4 survival(miasma alone taken whole minute to kill level 70 bombard) with it previously and now its even worse.

I was originally VERY excited to rework of saryn, I like frames that have synergy of powers so I got big hopes of saryn rework,  I even prepared plat to buy her new skin expecting to play her a LOT but after seeing that she doesnt have power synergy but  depenedency, I was extremly disappointed since powers of other frames that have power synergy are good on their own and amazing together but saryn powers alone are bad and when used together they are mediocre (usable but not something you can bring to long endless run)

Edited November 7, 2015 by Culaio

[Kaotyke]

 

 

Well its not exactly right, For example: its not 3 times as much work to achieve same result, its actually 3 times as much work for lesser result which is direct nerf also  , most people dont have problem because they need to do 3 times as much work but because even with the "combo" damage is inferior to previous one. Also She is wrong when she said that saryn was over powered previously, it wasnt, yes it was very strong against low-mid level enemies but against high level enemies it was pretty bad, you couldnt solo 40 min on T4 survival(miasma alone taken whole minute to kill level 70 bombard) with it previously and now its even worse.

I was originally VERY excited to rework of saryn, I like frames that have synergy of powers so I got big hopes of saryn rework,  I even prepared plat to buy her new skin expecting to play her a LOT but after seeing that she doesnt have power synergy but  depenedency, I was extremly disappointed since powers of other frames that have power synergy are good on their own and amazing together but saryn powers alone are bad and when used together they are mediocre (usable but not something you can bring to long endless run)

 

[CelticMoss]

 

Hey look two videos showing low level mobs or low armor mobs

 

ok GJ you can kill things with weak hp or no armor what about the heavy gunner over there with alot of hp and armor above level 60.

[CarrotSalad]

Hey look two videos showing low level mobs or low armor mobs

 

ok GJ you can kill things with weak hp or no armor what about the heavy gunner over there with alot of hp and armor above level 60.

Try Use the spore ability on the Heavy gunner followed by 1 charged or half charged shot of a dragkoon shotgun. This gun is amazing when combined with shots on spores. I've seen clusters of mobs die from 1 shot (much like nova's Mprime) only in a much smaller area.

 

I just tried with the strun and it did'nt prove effective at all. Also tried it with the phage and spira its also not as good as the dragkoon. Need to show patience for more testing with more weapons. I suspect theres some really good potential for high aoe damage with slash dmg focused weapons.

[(PSN)Xurokhan]

You should also include Valkyr as a good tweak. With Mesa they only botched one ability but with Saryn they went full retard.

Botched? I love Peacemaker now.

And I've got more reasons to use her 1, 2, and 3 as well.

[Judgebanks]

Just keep quoting it.