Why Isn't Pvp Played More? Lack Of Advertising? Or Is It Something Else...

[Raso719]

My draw to Warframe was the PvE experience. It was being able to unleash awesome ninja moves on baddies with bo fear of all of the vitriol and grief that comes with competitive multiplayer shooters.

I. Don't. PvP.

[DxAdder]

Well the trouble is if you have played WoW pvp or LoL, its extremly toxic and a-holery around. Ive seen this in several games, which causes me and others to avoid pvp for safetys sake.

Now i cant tell how the warframe pvp community is but i rather stay away beacuse i dont trust pvp communitys due previously bad experiences.

 

There are toxic players in every game, in WoW there were just as many toxic Arena players as Raiders.

 

But in Warframe there is literally nothing to compete for or tangible rewards so why bother ? Atleast in Wow Battle Grounds were fun.

[Sebastianx]

I. Don't. PvP.

And it's perfectly fine. The thread was mostly aimed towards people that usually like people but don't do it in Warframe.

[makaloff95]

There are toxic players in every game, in WoW there were just as many toxic Arena players as Raiders.

But in Warframe there is literally nothing to compete for or tangible rewards so why bother ? Atleast in Wow Battle Grounds were fun.

Hmm still pvp in warframe isnt that interesting to me. WoWs BHs were okay, untill the bots and russian/german premades showed up ( no offense to any russians or germans here).

It would be neat if you could use the pvp sigils in pve, they look quite cool

[Lunamare]

host migration

[shinebox]

I tried it once....i spent more time in host migration then in the actual game.  Should let us play liset shootem up instead.

 

 

Then you have guys fully geared up going up against guys with nothing.  What idiot thought that was a good idea? 

That only serves to keep people away.

 

After I get all geared up, I'm going to be whaling away on 0 rank guys?  That's fun how?

Shooting fish in a barrel?  Not very fun.

(This is coming from a hardcore Quake2, Quake3, Half-Life shootem up twitch player) and I want nothing to do with it here.

 

The whole point of PvP is to go toe to toe, head to head, with ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL....here it's lambs to the slaughter for new players and boredom for experienced.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

The whole point of PvP is to go toe to toe, head to head, with ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL....

This. 

[Monster-T]

I tried it once....i spent more time in host migration then in the actual game.  Should let us play liset shootem up instead.

 

 

Then you have guys fully geared up going up against guys with nothing.  What idiot thought that was a good idea? 

That only serves to keep people away.

 

After I get all geared up, I'm going to be whaling away on 0 rank guys?  That's fun how?

Shooting fish in a barrel?  Not very fun.

(This is coming from a hardcore Quake2, Quake3, Half-Life shootem up twitch player) and I want nothing to do with it here.

 

The whole point of PvP is to go toe to toe, head to head, with ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL....here it's lambs to the slaughter for new players and boredom for experienced.

The whole point of the new PvP is that you dont need more than starting gear to beeing able to compete against vets. You should really try the new PvP before debatting about.

Edited November 9, 2015 by Monster-T

[(XBOX)Lorewalker1022]

@ Monster-T - I have played PVP since 17.5. Actually I just played it yesterday. While I agree with you that it certainly has more balance to it then Rails did, I don't think it's all that balanced to be quite honest with you. I also have a ton of Rail experience so I feel like I can speak on both. 

Although I'll first admit that I can't say I'm an expert at PVP conclave, I'm still navigating between Tempest and Hurricane, but I've played my fair share to get a sense of it's mechanics. The PVP conclave still doesn't do a good job of mending the unique 4 abilities of each warframe to a PVP setting. Some abilities still to me seem a bit too strong compared to others and need more balance. There's some other balancing issues with the PVP Conclaves that I feel exist but I don't want to drag this discussion on.

The point is it's still not very balanced imo.

I also agree with you on the dedicated servers. I actually agree with you 100% on that.

Edited November 9, 2015 by (XB1)Lorewalker1022

[Corvid]

Having only gotten into it recently, the most I can say is that it has a long way to go. Maybe in the future, when the weapons are all balanced properly, it'll become a bit more popular. Until then, I shall be waiting.

 

Hell, maybe DE will use Conclave stats to rebalance the PvE sandbox. There's something I'd like to see...

[VocalMagic]

Because my heart rate and blood pressure go but by 27% and 35%, respectively, just from looking at my conclave loadout. My BP & BPM skyrocket actually playing, making me no good for more than 5 minutes of PvP anything.

Also, I don't find it fun.

Also, I didn't sign up for PvP, because aforementioned reasons.

Also, if I do play PvP more, it will look like support for it, making PvP-locked PvE content.

And because I fear if I do play PvP more, there will be a whole planet where you can join anyone's session and have it being PvE and open PvP

[Monster-T]

@ Monster-T - I have played PVP since 17.5. Actually I just played it yesterday. While I agree with you that it certainly has more balance to it then Rails did, I don't think it's all that balanced to be quite honest with you. I also have a ton of Rail experience so I feel like I can speak on both. 

Although I'll first admit that I can't say I'm an expert at PVP conclave, I'm still navigating between Tempest and Hurricane, but I've played my fair share to get a sense of it's mechanics. The PVP conclave still doesn't do a good job of mending the unique 4 abilities of each warframe to a PVP setting. Some abilities still to me seem a bit too strong compared to others and need more balance. There's some other balancing issues with the PVP Conclaves that I feel exist but I don't want to drag this discussion on.

The point is it's still not very balanced imo.

I also agree with you on the dedicated servers. I actually agree with you 100% on that.

Yes. Dont forget that this new PvP-mode is a complete balance rework (nothing like rails...) - it needs time to do something like that. So of course there is a very long road to go.

[stoybot]

Pythadragon pretty much nailed it, but I'd like to elaborate on one of the points he raised.

Given that WF's primary draw was PvE, people who play it, on average, likely don't have a lot of experience with online shooters. A completely inexperienced PvP player who's just starting out won't be given a tutorial, a practice mode, or the ability to spectate players and prepare for what he's about to face - he gets dropped in a game mode that punishes poor movement severely, requires a decent aim ability - which you can only pick up through lots of practice - and favours those that have good map/ability knowledge and game sense (when and how to engage). Furthermore, there's no explanation of what abilities do, so you better hope they're similar to their PvE counterparts. Where's the fun in that?

 

Oh, and by the way, you have a pretty high chance of playing against a veteran that will wipe the floor with you.

Immediately after some PvP mods were made available in PvE, I noticed an influx of new players. They were clearly new to Conclave even though a lot of them had high mastery ranks. The result? It was one pubstomp followed by another. I was getting around 20-25 kills and was dying about once per game. Even when there was an experienced player on the other team, it came down to 1v1s with 6 other players serving as distractions that you had to shoot down. I don't enjoy pubstomps, and I don't enjoy games in which I intentionally handicap myself. At the same time, those new players probably hated playing against me, which I completely understand. Long story short, I haven't played Conclave since then as it was too unpleasant of an experience.

Now add to this the numerous balancing issues and bugs, as well as terrible affinity and mod rewards... I dip into PvP occasionally because there's not much to do in PvE. With the right players, games can be a lot of fun. Yeah, I have to learn the new meta but there's not a huge barrier to entry due to my years of experience in competitive shooters. The average PvE player, on the other hand, won't have the same background.

[Lost_Cartographer]

I don't much enjoy PvP games because of the down right rotten behavior of most players in a competitive setting, often pulling the cheesiest of cheesy crap just to rake in the kills, even if it ultimately costs them the match.  These players are also the most likely to abuse obvious bugs and exploits and glitches and defend their actions with "if the devs want to fix it, they'll fix it."  It's the kind of mentality that is fostered by developers not banning dolts clearly abusing such errors in design and coding.  They'll keep finding new ways to break games because there's no consequences for it, except emptying servers, but they never figure they're the reason people get fed up with an abysmal experience.  In short, developers nowadays are pansies, which is why the most vile behavior continues to fester and spread among players.

 

Couple this with the fact that Warframe's PvP still maintains a semblance of a "level gap" in power between newbs and experienced players, and it's just a horrible PvP experience.  Battlefront 3?  Just more options.  All blasters are balanced against each other.  Warframe?  That guy's Braton reloads 30% faster than my Braton because he can fit the mod onto it.

 

And no, I won't tolerate leveling a weapon just to get on par.  Got two words for that "advice," and they start with an F and a Y, respectively.

[Lightsmith]

I think NPC based dailies would be better than the way its done now. As it stands there is nothing outside of the pvp menu to get your attention.

[Nighttide77]

As a PvP player on the PC, I would say the reason it's not very popular is for the following:

 

1) P2P hosting is terrible.  Dedicated servers are necessary to avoid unnecessary frustration and lag issues.  As well, few things are as frustrating as a string of host migrations because no one wants to host or something.

 

2) It's still pretty much in Alpha state.  It is super super basic in setup.  Only CTF and DM modes...and CTF is more like a game of "Keep Away".

 

3) Matchmaking.  Newbies get stomped, veterans can get bored.  There are some good newbies that port their skills from other games into WF, but unfortunately a large part of avoiding damage in WF PvP is being mobile and knowing the controls.

 

4) Some amount of balancing issues.  Right now, many veterans are asking for a lower TTK, but personally, I think it's starting to shape up pretty good.  AOE weapons still need improvement because they have such a small AOE size for such low damage, not to mention small magazines with almost no reserve ammo.  Melee is rather underpowered, etc etc.

 

---Note: there is a bit of debate concerning TTK of most weapons, but combining with powers and such, personally, it does feel like it's coming together.  Some don't like having to balance powers into the mess of it, but the thing is that Warframe is not just guns and blades mixed with Parkour elements.

 

5) Ported PvE mechanics into PvP don't always work.  Namely the melee system.  Quick melee is about as effective as equipped melee, and equipped melee has no benefit other than blocking, but blocking is minimally effective when the DPS of most weapons is so high.  Veterans will easily avoid melee users with Parkour, while newbies will get cut apart by it.  Aerial melee has no combos nor being able to consistently hit other aerial players, which is a problem of itself.

[GoneBlank]

PvP just isn't my cup of tea - no matter how polished/balanced/upgraded/dedicated-server enhanced/........ you make it. Before deciding to invest my time in Warframe I specifically made sure that PvP played little part in the game.

 

Every few years I jump back to different PvPs - not much has changed. TTK so fast that half the time you don't even know where your enemies are. Constantly moving/jumping/flying to be a harder target to hit. Cheese tactics like spawn bombing.

 

I can sit in a Tower survival solo for an hour and find it relaxing (sounds weird I know). PvP is the opposite of relaxing - you need to be hyper alert with all senses on maximum twitch response. I understand that some people enjoy this - it's just not what I find enjoyable when I come home from work and want to blow off some steam.

Edited November 10, 2015 by GoneBlank

[Eminem2420]

Atlas killed PVP for me. That is all anyone ever uses, and he is a tank, so i'm pretty much dead in the water.

[Kastorius]

I've played more than my fair share of co-op, team vs. team, and/or arena shooters over the years, and more than a few MMOs featuring PvP (Ultima Online, Star Wars Galaxies, EVE Online, Ragnarok Online, even a few text MUDs). 

 

Tribes: Ascend is one of my favorites from recent years (RIP).

 

The PvP in this game is just complete junk compared to what I'm used to. In fairness, it can't be easy to try to make a third-person shooter with RPG stats and extreme balance issues work. I do very much appreciate that Warframes move fairly quickly, because I gotta go fast, but other than that it's pretty bad.

Edited November 10, 2015 by Kastorius

[Recro]

Lag.

[LavenderLaser]

basicaly, only one thing that makes me hate PvP is PvP players.

 

Insulting, animal behaviour, typical rage and drama follows every PvP game.

Animal behaviour? What are you talking about? Now bend over and bite down on something

[Lightsmith]

Animal behaviour? What are you talking about? Now bend over and bite down on something

Animal, I guess he means, them mounting you without forming a proper bond.

[Cidolfus]

Taking away development resources from the pve game like mod designing yet we didn´t even have a complete augment set for all frames or general new pve mods in a while.

 

That´s why i hate it. Plus all the other stuff mentioned already.

 

I'm sure someone already answered this since it was on page 2, but: The dev team for pvp is completely separate from the main dev team. Work being done on pvp has absolutely no bearing on work being done anywhere else.

[(XBOX)neldogger38]

no time. grinding to get S#&$. maybe make game less grinding?

[Judgebanks]

Energy and Audio are the two weakest aspects of Warframe.

 

While the Audio is fine for casual PvE gameplay. Good indicative audio to alert players of incoming damage is imperative. Overwatch is a perfect example of how audio should be in a PvP shooter. 

 

Energy, well I've gone over energy a thousand times on these forums, you know exactly why energy sucks in both pve and pvp for Warframe.