Remove Bursas.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

The only real problem I see is that they don't scale according to the planet. Currently they spawn on Mars etc at level 40 or so and wipe new players but if they were lvl 10-12 then they'd be a fun addition to the level, either that or just limit them to higher Corpus planets like Neptune and Pluto. And yes a lvl 100 isolator bursa in a Sortie will be a fearsome opponent as it drags you kicking and screaming away from the others to have its way with you...

BTW they only spawn if the camera spots you, it gives incentive to pay proper attention to the environment and disable the security if you wish to be stealthy.

Edited February 14, 2016 by Zilchy

[motorfirebox]

One bursa at a time is fine, even welcome. Bursas spawning more bursas if you don't kill them fast enough isn't fun.

[TharsianMartian]

I have more than 100 hours in the game by now, but I only started playing recently and still consider myself rather new. I understood that the new player experience was a little lacking, but various forums and the wiki helped flesh most of that out. I even forked over $25 when I got a discount for a daily reward even though I'll only ever use it for slots and cosmetic items and I didn't hesitate to do it.

These bursas have stopped my progress dead in its tracks however. I read to jump kick them but they get right back up before I can land and attack them at all. Slam attacks have no effect either. A single bursa spawned from alarms in a Corpus mission means I WILL fail, guaranteed, no doubts about it. Doesn't matter how much corrosive or magnetic damage mods I install, I die before putting a single dent in them, and in a few minutes solo-ing I'll have used up all my revives and I fail the mission.

Bursas in normal missions make the game unplayable solo and extremely difficult even when partied. They're killing my progression not to mention fun - they're orders of magnitude more difficult than the other enemies in the levels they will spawn into. I'm incredulous that developers would be so tone deaf to the experience of new players.

Edit: Tried some suggestions below and was able to wittle down some of its health, but I was still out of revives in less than a couple of minutes. The issue I'm bringing isn't just how to kill them at all, but how anyone can be expected to kill them when they pop up randomly if only certain frames and weapons can really give you any chance at all. If I'm unable to kill even one, at all, within five revives, something's either really wrong with me or with the enemy I'm fighting. Like I said, I'm still new, but I think I'm experienced enough and informed enough that most of the problem is with the bursas.

Edited February 14, 2016 by TharsianMartian

[-CdG-Zilchy]

^ Magnetic and Corrosive mods are wrong in the first place, Bursa's are weak to Radiation. Also try using your Warframe's skills, there's plenty of ways to neutralise them. What frames do you have?

Edited February 14, 2016 by Zilchy

[TharsianMartian]

It was a Corpus level so I had magnetic anyway, but I was also using the wiki:

 

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Isolator_Bursa

 

I've been running with a Rhino, but stomp doesn't give me hardly any time to run around behind them to attack them, and after that my energy would be spent and I probably wouldn't get another shot at it for a while.

[Hellmaker2004]

It was a Corpus level so I had magnetic anyway, but I was also using the wiki:

 

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Isolator_Bursa

 

I've been running with a Rhino, but stomp doesn't give me hardly any time to run around behind them to attack them, and after that my energy would be spent and I probably wouldn't get another shot at it for a while.

 

I glide past them when they enter Shield mode and shoot them in the rear, no need for any frame powers at all. There is hardly and issue with them except the damn particle effect. Because that stuff is super effective. Other than that they are a fun and engaging foe. Bether than most foes in the game.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

Ironskin will prevent knockdown for a start, just dodge the green ball they shoot as it nullifies all powers. Best way I've found to get behind them is jump directly over and use bullet time to slow their turn around(basically I midair them)

Also if you started the game with Excalibur Radial Blind works wonderfully on them.

And trust me, use Radiation.

Edited February 14, 2016 by Zilchy

[RealPandemonium]

Doable =/= reasonable.

 

They need toned down, period.  It's way too big a challenge hike over everything else in the mission, even when they're alone.

After some practice, the Bursas are no problem for me solo with that setup, as long as I don't mess up badly and somehow get 3 or more of them on me at once.  A team of 4 should have no problems taking down the Bursas, so long as they are competent.  I feel like a lot of players don't try to learn and practice, and instantly shy away from a challenge whenever their gear appears to be insufficient to play the game for them.  I don't think the game should be balanced around cowardice, coddling, and a sense of entitlement.  A basic level of competence should be expected.  

 

The constant mook reinforcements are a pain, though.  I think one wave of them is enough; do away with the respawns.  

Edited February 14, 2016 by RealPandemonium

[fatpig84]

Bursas are extreme downgrades from the original false profit ones.

They are fine to remain.

 

And the corpus desperately need another heavy unit that can tank and deal some damage.

Edited February 14, 2016 by fatpig84

[DeHACKtivate]

oh w0t, they're actually staying this time? love me some bursa, and more variety is good for you OP (ﾉ◕ヮ◕)ﾉ*:･ﾟ✧ 

[starsrift]

As a new player (a month in), I finally managed to finish Neptune yesterday. The Hyena Pack was much easier to take down than the Neptune bursas.

Maybe you like the bursas, maybe you don't. But it comes to my mind that a mob shouldn't be stronger than the area boss.

 

 

You're acting as though MR12 is still some sort of effort to achieve. As I said, I haven't tested any others yet, I'm sure there are other ways, there's also plenty of Warframe abilities that deal with them comfortably. It's also really easy to stop them spawning in multiples, it seems most people don't want a challenge, they just want to complain that the game is too easy without enemies like this in it..

Would you feel comfortable suggesting that they be gated behind an MR 12 wall (don't show up unless anyone in the squad is above MR12)?

A reminder - you get The Second Dream at MR3, you can't perform Sorties until MR4, and you can't fight Vay Hek(Earth) until MR5.

[ImNotJellyAtAll]

Shamelessly plugging my Bursa thread.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/609907-bursa-feedback-too-little-butter-on-too-much-bread/

Edited February 14, 2016 by ImNotJellyAtAll

[-CdG-Zilchy]

As a new player (a month in), I finally managed to finish Neptune yesterday. The Hyena Pack was much easier to take down than the Neptune bursas.

Maybe you like the bursas, maybe you don't. But it comes to my mind that a mob shouldn't be stronger than the area boss.

Would you feel comfortable suggesting that they be gated behind an MR 12 wall (don't show up unless anyone in the squad is above MR12)?

A reminder - you get The Second Dream at MR3, you can't perform Sorties until MR4, and you can't fight Vay Hek(Earth) until MR5.

I think an easier solution is to simply scale them appropriate to the level like every other enemy. They're a great challenge and can add to the learning experience for early players.

[TharsianMartian]

"Learning experience"? I already knew about ALT + F4.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

^ Really witty, did you think of that yourself?

[TharsianMartian]

What exactly is there to learn? It takes no damage from the front at all, cannot be out-strafed so you can't attack it from the back, and as you attempt to do so you get knocked down for five seconds at a time while multiple bursas attack you.

 

To go back to my experience with Rhino, Charge doesn't affect them at all, Iron Skin gets negated or depleted nearly instantly, and Stomp doesn't give you anywhere near enough time to do any real damage. I would love to see an example of a solo player fighting two off at the same time with only basic weapons and mods.

 

Characterizing them as a challenge just shifts the blame of their design onto the player in my opinion.

Edited February 14, 2016 by TharsianMartian

[ShikiRen]

Use Mag. But, talking serious for a moment, there are so many Frames that make dealing with them reasonable, some of them even being starter frames. Radial Blind is your friend.

 

Also... The Tonkor is an MR 5 weapon buyable from the market with a reasonable ressource cost, and with it killing Bursas is about as hard as snapping your fingers. Even without having a high rank serration or having the vital sense mod. I think it actually kills lower level Bursas while being unranked in one or two shots(it even tends to oneshot round 1 enemies on Draco when not modded).

 

And anyway, there is a very easy way to not get overwhelmed (especially in Extermination): Pay the f*ck attention and kill the Corpus trying to activate alarms. And if they manage to activate it, use a CC of any sort (Radial Blind, Rhino Stomp, Volt Lightning etc.), a defensive Ability (Rhino Iron Skin, Frost Bubble, etc.) or go invisible and hack those petty 3-tile-corpus puzzles instead of ignoring them. It's not like Lotus isn't telling you the alarms have been set off.

 

 

In short, don't play like a dumbass and you will be fine; and if you are so new you haven't ever gotten in that situation before, learn from your mistake and shut down the alarm next time you play that misison. Geezus.

 

 

The only thing Bursas need is spawning a little less frequently...but then again so could Nullifiers in higher missions. And Nullifiers are still worse than Bursas.

Edited February 14, 2016 by ShikiRen

[bubbabenali]

A low lvl solo player can have great problems to kill the bursas no doubt.

The are rather bullet spongey compared to their counterpart the Combas and the newer "starchart" players often dont have the right element mods.

 

Pathogen Rounds for example took me severeal months of Jupiter Survival farming for.

 

 

Edit: Pathogen ROunds of course, not Pistol Pestilence

Edited February 14, 2016 by bubbabenali

[akira_him]

Well at least it's way less annoying than nullifier I guess

[Rorgal_Sina]

They sort of need to be toned down, but I welcome them as enemies for diversity, aesthetics, and reasonable challenge.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

What exactly is there to learn? It takes no damage from the front at all, cannot be out-strafed so you can't attack it from the back, and as you attempt to do so you get knocked down for five seconds at a time while multiple bursas attack you.

 

To go back to my experience with Rhino, Charge doesn't affect them at all, Iron Skin gets negated or depleted nearly instantly, and Stomp doesn't give you anywhere near enough time to do any real damage. I would love to see an example of a solo player fighting two off at the same time with only basic weapons and mods.

 

Characterizing them as a challenge just shifts the blame of their design onto the player in my opinion.

Oh I don't know. Perhaps that cameras are not merely for decoration? Or perhaps that not all enemies can be face tanked and require you to learn what your abilities do to deal with certain enemies? Or that Air Support Charges are extremely useful? Or that bullet time has more uses than to simply look cool? Pick one. Try using a different frame other than Rhino if it's not working for you, be flexible.

Edited February 14, 2016 by Zilchy

[LeeAmatsu]

So you like the Nullifiers then? Cause they're easily one punch KO-ed eh?

[-CdG-Zilchy]

I don't mind nullifiers as much as most people do, I tend to just enter the bubble and kill them if they're alone or give them a wide berth if they're not damaging an objective and in a big clump of overlapping bubbles. You always have a choice whether to engage or not, I like to pick my battles and my battlefield.

Edited February 14, 2016 by Zilchy

[Specific.Zod]

Fun and deadly. BURSAesus!

[EvilChaosKnight]

Oh I don't know. Perhaps that cameras are not merely for decoration? Or perhaps that not all enemies can be face tanked and require you to learn what your abilities do to deal with certain enemies? Or that Air Support Charges are extremely useful? Or that bullet time has more uses than to simply look cool? Pick one. Try using a different frame other than Rhino if it's not working for you, be flexible.

Oh I don't know. Perhaps not all enemy designs introduced are well-thought out and/or implemented?

Or... idk... a normal enemy having more than TWENTY F****NG TIMES the durability of any heavy unit of the same level is... you know... WRONG? Didn't such thought occur to you?

You didn't happen to think that there are people without maxed mods or prime stuff or syndicate weapons? That mods and cores to rank them don't grow on trees? You didn't even consider that said weapons are in fact TERRIBLE overkill for lvl 20-30 save for that ONE enemy?

 

I am MR21, I can laugh at those Bursas with my gear and 1,5k+ hours of ingame experience. But it doesn't mean that person with a Karak should have no damned chance to take on them.

Edited February 14, 2016 by EvilChaosKnight