Is there Counter-Play to Shock Eximus?

[IceColdHawk]

4 minutes ago, J1ffyLub3 said:

then learn or play better? 

Please stay away from telling people this as long as you find...

46 minutes ago, J1ffyLub3 said:

I find enemies such as healers and bombards far more annoying to deal with, as if not taken care of immediately you can easily be swarmed or cc'ed to death. shock eximus' don't do anything until you walk close to them, so plan accordingly

Shock eximus don't do anything. Right. Only bombards and healers screw you up right? "as if not taken care of". And if you take no care of shock eximus, what happens? You lose ALL your energy. Ancients? Just dodge the hook and you're done. That's skillplay. Same with bombard. They can't do anything but a knockdown/drag. Shock eximus steals your complete energy, rendering you useless. And this just by coming by. No dodge or whatsoever.

So please stay real at least.

7 minutes ago, J1ffyLub3 said:

There is nothing mechanically intense about the shock eximus

Got to agree with you there. He is just being cheap and must get cheesed to win. Completely poor designed.

[DiabolusUrsus]

• Shock Eximi have had their magnetic auras removed, and now inflict guaranteed magnetic procs through a unique charged projectile attack.
• Venomous Eximi have had their poison auras removed, and now inflict toxin procs through a unique flurry of melee attacks.
• Blitz Eximi no longer use a copy-paste of Grineer Heavy radial blasts, and instead prompt enemies around them to rush forward and attack the player while conferring defensive bonuses to affected units.
• Arctic Nullifier Eximi have been replaced with Arson Nullifier Eximi.
• Energy Leech/Parasitic Eximi will now store energy stolen from Warframes, and restore that energy when killed.
• Energy Leech/Parasitic Eximi auras have been replaced with a draining version of Trinity's Link.
• Sanguine/Leech Eximi will regain health from the deaths of nearby allies in addition to damage dealt to the player.

Imaginary patch notes for "Problem Solved."

[J1ffyLub3]

3 minutes ago, motorfirebox said:

Requiring an extremely narrow range of loadouts and tactics in order to deal with one enemy type is not "depth". Avoiding crowds and sticking to ranged is just as "shallow" is wading into crowds swinging your sword. Enemies that essentially force one over the other are bad design.

Expecting to be able to use a particular weapon/style of play for all missions is a bad mentality for players to have

Edited March 7, 2016 by J1ffyLub3

[[DE]Grzegorz]

On 7.03.2016 at 9:40 PM, Inmemoratus said:

If you're winning 100% of the time it's not a challenge. There's no personal growth happening in that situation, no skill being gained. Just masturbatory repetition. PvE is like a puzzle. Once it's solved, the challenge is gone. You move on to a new puzzle that you haven't solved yet if you want a challenge.

Well that's my stance on "muh challenging PvE content"

Because bovine feces enemy mechanics that ignore previous rules are fun and challenging.

You figured the easiest way to solve a puzzle? Yeah, too bad, the world kinda works like this. You've had your share of fun, anger and grief already, while trying to figure it out.

The puzzle randomly forces you into some arbitrary state of failure while you haven't done anything wrong? Yeah, sounds really challenging.

 

Oh excuse me, this is a game that's all about throwing X+1 sided dices that happen to have certain sides made of either helium or depleted uranium, my fixation on skill requirements and consistency has no right to exist.

Edited March 9, 2016 by Mofixil

[Specific.Zod]

14 minutes ago, J1ffyLub3 said:

then learn or play better? simply because you've been playing for 2k hours doesn't mean you've been playing "well" or "skillfully". This game is more than mind numbingly shooting bullets or chopping people. Sometimes you might even have to think before you act! gasp! There is nothing mechanically intense about the shock eximus, its just people hate change and people hate having to think and adapt to a given scenario. people want to spam to win...but at higher levels sometimes more precautions are needed

There is no adapt to Shock eximus with melee play rather than run away. Tell me what can i do to adapt if one day i have to play sortie 3 coprus survival melee only? Bring Mag? i don't have one. Today sortie 2 survival coprus, after 10 minutes nulifier start to spawn. But in sortie 3, after 3 minutes they already spawm, and one shot lanka is still there, 

There is no counter-play for this eximus if you are playing melee oriented frames, but if you using guns, even nulifier and bursa are not a thing to consider death threat.

Edited March 7, 2016 by Specific.Zod

[(PSN)VariantX7]

41 minutes ago, Mofixil said:

Attacks that are devastating yet consistent and telegraphed well enough a skilled player can counter them with nearly 100% effectiveness.
DE's so fixated on their los checks when it comes to nerfing players' nukes but enemies that should have them (Nullifier bubbles, auras and IIRC Bombard/Napalm projectiles) simply ignore all and any kinds of cover because consistency?

Basically how it should work. Its like you know they understand this basic design concept when they design enemies like railgun moas, shockwave moas, heavy gunners, oxium ospreys, mutalist ospreys, grenades, combas/scrambus etc. But don't implement it everywhere it should be implemented

[Dawn11715]

They definitely need to change.

Would be nice if they where more visible, if they had some kind of shock-bubble that looks like the ones from the hive missions.

That way you could see it coming at least.

If theirs like 20 enemys on the  map with 5 of them being eximus its really hard to even notice that one of them is a shock eximus.

For me,  its just something i randomly crash into, without any way to prevent it.

All I can do is suppressing the rage  jumping away in panic and wait for the proc to end and kill the damn thing after regaining some energy.

 

 

[[DE]Grzegorz]

1 minute ago, (PS4)VariantX7 said:

grenades

It took them like 2 years to actually realize that grenades shouldn't be completely silent.

[Sunfaiz]

2 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

• Shock Eximi have had their magnetic auras removed, and now inflict guaranteed magnetic procs through a unique charged projectile attack.
• Venomous Eximi have had their poison auras removed, and now inflict toxin procs through a unique flurry of melee attacks.
• Blitz Eximi no longer use a copy-paste of Grineer Heavy radial blasts, and instead prompt enemies around them to rush forward and attack the player while conferring defensive bonuses to affected units.
• Arctic Nullifier Eximi have been replaced with Arson Nullifier Eximi.
• Energy Leech/Parasitic Eximi will now store energy stolen from Warframes, and restore that energy when killed.
• Energy Leech/Parasitic Eximi auras have been replaced with a draining version of Trinity's Link.
• Sanguine/Leech Eximi will regain health from the deaths of nearby allies in addition to damage dealt to the player.

Imaginary patch notes for "Problem Solved."

We don't have problems with the rest you know. Just Cheap BS that we can't counter

[(PSN)VariantX7]

4 minutes ago, Mofixil said:

It took them like 2 years to actually realize that grenades shouldn't be completely silent.

It wasn't the silence so much as the exploding almost instantly the second they touched the ground and wiping out your team or the objective if you didn't have a frost bubble for the thing to bounce off of. Even if you saw them throw it, some frames were simply not fast enough to move out of the way without coptering back then like frost.

Edited March 7, 2016 by (PS4)VariantX7

[J1ffyLub3]

7 minutes ago, IceColdHawk said:

Shock eximus don't do anything. Right. Only bombards and healers screw you up right? "as if not taken care of". And if you take no care of shock eximus, what happens? You lose ALL your energy. Ancients? Just dodge the hook and you're done. That's skillplay. Same with bombard. They can't do anything but a knockdown/drag. Shock eximus steals your complete energy, rendering you useless. And this just by coming by. No dodge or whatsoever.

you make it seem like shock eximus teleport onto your face (they don't btw). I don't care about healer hooks, i'm talking about the huge armor boost they give nearby enemies. Not taking them out first means you waste a lot of ammo or get swarmed very quickly. Bombards shoot homing rockets from afar that can knockdown. Both of these pose threats without having to be near you. As ive stated several times before, shock eximus don't do anything until you walk into them

Edited March 7, 2016 by J1ffyLub3

[IceColdHawk]

Just now, J1ffyLub3 said:

you make it seem like shock eximus teleport onto your face (they don't btw). I don't care about healer hooks, i'm talking about the huge armor boost they give nearby enemies. Not taking them out first means you waste a lot of ammo or get swarmed very quickly. Bombards shoot homing rockets from afar that can knockdown. Both of these pose threats without having to be near you. As ive stated several times before, shock eximus don't do anything until *you walk into them*

Yes and suddenly coming by should drain all of your energy? Does that really sound like a successful mechanic to you? Ancients are good, THEY are actual important targets to get rid off. And they don't always got their aura on..Anyway, he isn't screwing you completely up like shock eximus does.

[TheSadisticDragon]

Enemies that can sap away all your energy in an instant or in just a few seconds without giving a part of it back at the end of the scarmble are never fun.

The fun of this game come from abilities, shooting, modding & fast movement. Enemies that you have to dodge like the fire eximus, scorpions or bombards make the game fun and challenging because if you get stunned for a just a small amount the enemy can overwhelm you, same goes for proccing enemies.

The difference with full energy sapping enemies or with the nullifier shields is that they don't give the player a hard time but completly remove a big part of what makes warframe fun, since sometimes timing your abilities instead of using ability spam is someones prefered modding playstyle. 

And lot of times the player does not have a way of recovering enough energy (also since you still pick up orbs when you are scrambled, wasting the orbs)

 

Energy sap enemies does not make the game harder, it makes the game more tedious.

[J1ffyLub3]

1 minute ago, IceColdHawk said:

Yes and suddenly coming by should drain all of your energy? Does that really sound like a successful mechanic to you? Ancients are good, THEY are actual important targets to get rid off. And they don't always got their aura on..Anyway, he isn't screwing you completely up like shock eximus does.

Where are you getting "suddenly coming by" from? Seriously, where? Like i said before if you put more intention behind your movements you wouldn't mindlessly flail into one

[Richtor2415]

Viva la revolution, baby.

 

However on a more serious note... I agree completely. These Shock Eximi have been getting on my nerves, pressing my buttons, and grinding my gears. 

[J-Reyno]

35 minutes ago, J1ffyLub3 said:

if you are going to make an analogy at least make a reasonable one. shock eximus' don't sap energy whenever they attack you. its proximity based, so completely avoidable unless one spawns on your face (which doesn't happen). Saying there is a lack of counterplay is just a plain lie. People want to use whatever loadout they want in whatever mission they choose, but that's not how the game works. I'm sorry if you only want to swing your sword all day long, but this game is a little more in depth than that. There is a reason so many damage types exist, why you can spec warframes differently, its so you can adapt to different contexts

They don't have to spawn in your face to be unavoidable.  Unless you have access to some unreleased frame with x-ray vision that can see through walls then you have no way of knowing whether you are turning a corner straight into a magnetic proc.  And yes, you CAN be proc'd immediately upon entering the aura of an enemy that is not even within your field of vision.  There are definitely situations where it is completely unavoidable unless you camp in a location where enemies cannot reach you without being seen for some distance, long enough for you to spot and kill them.  Is this what you mean by adapt?  To conform to a feasible strategy that prevents you from being sapped of all energy without warning?  

Being drained of all energy is crippling for many frames.  Beyond that, it's not fun at all, ever.  Most especially when it happens without being avoidable.  The gameplay is stale without powers, frankly, and I don't feel like camping 24/7 just to avoid it.   

[Giantconch]

A shock eximus drains ALL of your energy, 3/4 of your shields, AND scrambles the screen, while being called a "shock" eximus. The very name implies an electric proc, not magnetic+energy drain+screen scramble.

 

Why even bother having an energy leech eximus type? Shock eximus does a much better job at screwing you over.

 

Why bother having a melee at all if getting into a crowd of enemies can instantly remove your energy and shields when you're already in harms way?

 

The simplest way to say this, is that these shock eximus units are broken good. They need a change.

[Katinka]

17 minutes ago, J1ffyLub3 said:

then walk around slower and more intentionally! this community simply wants to do whatever they want and get away with it in this game

How does it make any difference whatsoever what speed I approach the point they spawn at?  Seriously, I'm walking, running, rolling, whatever down a corridor and in the adjacent room a Shock Eximus spawns with me already in range and I lose all energy and shields and have my HUD scrambled.  How is my movement speed in any way relevant when they can spawn with me in range?  Sure I can be aware of the enemies around me but I can't be aware of the enemies who don't exist yet!

[Sunfaiz]

3 minutes ago, J1ffyLub3 said:

Where are you getting "suddenly coming by" from? Seriously, where? Like i said before if you put more intention behind your movements you wouldn't mindlessly flail into one

So When Im running from one extractor to another, I should move Cautiously ? When I'm Chasing after a capture target I should stay away from him if Mag eximus are nearby. That's a bad response. I Play this game for the movement system. I enjoy it. I don't want to change it because DE cant Balance for S#&$.

[RahuHordika]

29 minutes ago, Sunfaiz said:

We don't have problems with the rest you know. Just Cheap BS that we can't counter

Well instances like the Leech and Venomous eximi are pretty much cheap, un-counterable BS (just less awful than magnetic aura). I think his suggestions not only take away from the cheapness of the units but also make them heck of a lot more interesting.

(Except for the shock ones, the mere effect of magnetic proc is awful, period so I'd rather have the shock eximi get a proper element)

I also agree with an earlier comment, shock proc needs a rework.

 

Edited March 7, 2016 by RahuHordika

[motorfirebox]

28 minutes ago, J1ffyLub3 said:

Expecting to be able to use a particular weapon/style of play for all missions is a bad mentality for players to have

a) No, it really isn't, especially when some frames are deliberately built around those playstyles, and b) again, you're advocating for just as narrow a range of equipment and playstyle as the people you're arguing against. 

[(PSN)horridhal]

The thing the defenders seem to like to ignore is this mechanic existed before and was purposefully removed for a reason.  It isn't "challenging."  It is cheap.  It is a ridiculous thing to allow an enemy to entirely shut down everything that makes a Frame a Frame.  

There is no counter.  Either you see them before they get close, or you don't.  That isn't something that allows for counters.  

[J1ffyLub3]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)horridhal said:

The thing the defenders seem to like to ignore is this mechanic existed before and was purposefully removed for a reason.  It isn't "challenging."  It is cheap.  It is a ridiculous thing to allow an enemy to entirely shut down everything that makes a Frame a Frame.  

There is no counter.  Either you see them before they get close, or you don't.  That isn't something that allows for counters.  

I hate this logic. the game is significantly different than it was when the mechanic existed previously. And just because they removed it once, doesn't mean that was the correct thing to do at the time, let alone currently

[motorfirebox]

The energy mechanic hasn't changed since they were removed. Nothing's changed, really, that affects the interaction between these guys and players.

[R34LM]

Here's my say. Leave the energy drain as is, BUT make it LOS checked, that way it doesn't surprise us so much. Hell, just about every enemy ability in the game ignores LOS; why are we the only ones that have to deal with it for certain abilities?