Volt Rework Feedback [Post Update 18.13]

[Wolfnrun]

1 hour ago, Aquasurge said:

(though, now that i think of it, storm-raiders sounds nicer don't you think @Wolfnrun?)

Works for me!  

[Aquasurge]

12 minutes ago, Wolfnrun said:

Works for me!  

yay, we are on page 20! BTW how do you get emojis into your posts?

P.S. it kind of ironic that i have to curse the sky tomorrow for being blue as apparently, its part of the anti-Queensland conspiracy (cause of the state origin in Australia I.Y.D.K. (if you didn't know)).

Edited May 31, 2016 by Aquasurge

[Cytobel]

13 hours ago, (PS4)Silverback73 said:

Your intro paragraph contradicts itself after the very first sentence making the declaration about a "working volt".

1.  Survivability and Scaling don't work at Sortie levels. (Isn't this the benchmark for ALL frames with a competent player who has maxed standard mods and invested a forma or two?)

2.  Synergy is poor. (Wasn't the whole point of Volt's rework to create synergy and give him a relevant "4"?)

3.  The energy cost for his "3" variant cripples the whole concept.

4.  Paraphrasing here: His passive is essentially a non-factor.

I haven't even watched your video yet, but if you can't survive Sorties with him, he's a non-working "rework".

edit:. NM, it's a loadout screenshot.

FYI, I've been working on building something that can at least somewhat use ALL of it's moves.  When I say it WORKS that is largely what I'm talking about, not that this is good.

At Sortie levels this thing comes apart, reguardless of what I try.  I'm moving onto other builds and adding other survival elements.  I'm closer to something that'll handle higher-end play, but there are some issues with the rework that need to be ironed out before Volt scales right.

Don't forget we're gonna have Damage 3.0 drop soon-ish, so things are shifting around on that side as well.  Hell, Electricity may be worth half a damn soon, and Volt COULD wind up doing decent damage.  Anything's possible.  Until then, it's more about scraping by on what we have.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

EDIT:  When I said I'm trying all sort's of builds here, I mean it.  I'm onto this mess now, and I'm playing it for fun before I catch a bit of sleep.  It's... something, I guess.  It has decent potential, but I'm not at the critical point of feeling the scaling work yet.  This is the build:

http://screencast.com/t/X3ETD0nb

Edited May 31, 2016 by Cytobel

[YagoXiten]

10 minutes ago, Cytobel said:

FYI, I've been working on building something that can at least somewhat use ALL of it's moves.  When I say it WORKS that is largely what I'm talking about, not that this is good.

At Sortie levels this thing comes apart, reguardless of what I try.  I'm moving onto other builds and adding other survival elements.  I'm closer to something that'll handle higher-end play, but there are some issues with the rework that need to be ironed out before Volt scales right.

Don't forget we're gonna have Damage 3.0 drop soon-ish, so things are shifting around on that side as well.  Hell, Electricity may be worth half a damn soon, and Volt COULD wind up doing decent damage.  Anything's possible.  Until then, it's more about scraping by on what we have.

I'm hoping Damage 3.0 adds either % missing health, % maximum health, or % current health damage to most nuke abilities. Because otherwise, they just aren't going to scale. Even when they do scale amazingly well, they tend to be very boring easy room clears. Until then, damage is the last thing I'm concerned about with the rework. I really build Strength for Speed. It just happens to be a bonus that I can kill things decently with a few casts of Shock instead of a dozen.

EDIT: I also think you can take Volt into Sortie's with pretty much any build if your weapons are up to snuff and you've got solid teamwork. Though it will definitely be difficult.

 

On 5/28/2016 at 2:41 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

 

It bears repeating that more changes are coming soon. We will be hotfixing like mad next week

 

 

-[DE]Rebecca

 

 

That was said on Saturday. Since Volt's almost in a really good spot, we can probably expect to see some changes to him in the next couple of days.
 

Edited May 31, 2016 by YagoXiten

[(PSN)SupeBoss]

I love the shield changes and synergy with his Shock.

Shock is a great 1, Speed is a nice 2 (not sure how i feel about "Speed Drops", ES + Mobile ES is a great 3, mehhhhhhhh to his 4. I was hoping it would be a damage ability .... but it's basically shock 2.0

[RealPandemonium]

5 minutes ago, (PS4)SupeBoss said:

I love the shield changes and synergy with his Shock.

Shock is a great 1, Speed is a nice 2 (not sure how i feel about "Speed Drops", ES + Mobile ES is a great 3, mehhhhhhhh to his 4. I was hoping it would be a damage ability .... but it's basically shock 2.0

Shock is a better damage ability than Discharge.  Overload's damage potential increased without limit when many enemies were clustered together, while Discharge's bonus damage from grouped-up enemies is artificially capped by a coded-in limit to the power.  It's also currently being abused to permaCC whole tiles of high level Grineer, while against the other factions both its damage and CC are artificially limited by the health cap.  

[YagoXiten]

2 minutes ago, RealPandemonium said:

Shock is a better damage ability than Discharge.  Overload's damage potential increased without limit when many enemies were clustered together, while Discharge's bonus damage from grouped-up enemies is artificially capped by a coded-in limit to the power.  It's also currently being abused to permaCC whole tiles of high level Grineer, while against the other factions both its damage and CC are artificially limited by the health cap.  

Discharge's damage potential is actually quite amazing. It's capped because the damage potential rises exponentially and without that cap could realistically hit values that are three or more times more DPS than our best T4 weapon's damage potentials. Even capped, the damage it can deal in realistic scenarios can compete with pre-rework Sayrn's Miasma. What holds the damage back from being higher is that it is Electric damage, and that damage is just not what really matters for our powers.

[bubbabenali]

39 minutes ago, (PS4)SupeBoss said:

I love the shield changes and synergy with his Shock.

Shock is a great 1, Speed is a nice 2 (not sure how i feel about "Speed Drops", ES + Mobile ES is a great 3, mehhhhhhhh to his 4. I was hoping it would be a damage ability .... but it's basically shock 2.0

Oh damn such a shame Volt got only one of the best CC abilities with his rework...

[Brasten]

25 minutes ago, bubbabenali said:

Oh damn such a shame Volt got only one of the best CC abilities with his rework...

The CC on that is actually quite variable and depends on enemy resistances. On high resistance high armor targets like Grineer and many Infested, yes the CC of turning larger numbers of enemies into twitching Tesla Towers is very noticeable. Do it to even 120+ level Corpus Proxy robots, and there is virtually no CC at all, as the damage fully discharges in 2-4 seconds.

The more armored the foe the better the CC. The weaker the armor the worse the CC. It is very inconsistent.

[RealPandemonium]

49 minutes ago, YagoXiten said:

Discharge's damage potential is actually quite amazing. It's capped because the damage potential rises exponentially and without that cap could realistically hit values that are three or more times more DPS than our best T4 weapon's damage potentials. Even capped, the damage it can deal in realistic scenarios can compete with pre-rework Sayrn's Miasma. What holds the damage back from being higher is that it is Electric damage, and that damage is just not what really matters for our powers.

Overload's damage was uncapped and rose in a similar way where each enemy within 5m of another enemy increased damage to all those enemies by 50% of base, leading to huge damage potential rivaling Miasma's (damage would exceed Miasma's if 7 or more enemies were within 5m of each other.)

7 minutes ago, Brasten said:

The CC on that is actually quite variable and depends on enemy resistances. On high resistance high armor targets like Grineer and many Infested, yes the CC of turning larger numbers of enemies into twitching Tesla Towers is very noticeable. Do it to even 120+ level Corpus Proxy robots, and there is virtually no CC at all, as the damage fully discharges in 2-4 seconds.

The more armored the foe the better the CC. The weaker the armor the worse the CC. It is very inconsistent.

Just a note for consistency: Infested only gain armor from the Swarm effect, which is rarely in place in a significant capacity.  Ancient auras that reduce damage, however, allow Discharge to act as a mass permaCC the way it does for Grineer.  

[Toramaru]

On 29/05/2016 at 0:50 AM, Toramaru said:

Sir, here's my suggestion! Funny thing is, I never changed a single Mod... I use Volt the same way for a long time, and have been complaining about scalability for a shorter time, but still, here's my 2 cents on how to build him:

 

I loved the FoV pre-rework. If you check the video above you'll see I get lost several times, as camera is too close. A better FoV is a must for Speed.

I disliked it as well sir. I may have been too wishful, and I'm usually open to testing, but what they did was a catastrophe, at least from my perspective.

 

4 hours ago, Cytobel said:

FYI, I've been working on building something that can at least somewhat use ALL of it's moves.  When I say it WORKS that is largely what I'm talking about, not that this is good.

At Sortie levels this thing comes apart, reguardless of what I try.  I'm moving onto other builds and adding other survival elements.  I'm closer to something that'll handle higher-end play, but there are some issues with the rework that need to be ironed out before Volt scales right.

Don't forget we're gonna have Damage 3.0 drop soon-ish, so things are shifting around on that side as well.  Hell, Electricity may be worth half a damn soon, and Volt COULD wind up doing decent damage.  Anything's possible.  Until then, it's more about scraping by on what we have.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

EDIT:  When I said I'm trying all sort's of builds here, I mean it.  I'm onto this mess now, and I'm playing it for fun before I catch a bit of sleep.  It's... something, I guess.  It has decent potential, but I'm not at the critical point of feeling the scaling work yet.  This is the build:

http://screencast.com/t/X3ETD0nb

Sir, Sorties are doable, mad dog them all the way with a melee build! ;D

The skill set is currently too underwhelming to be considered.

[(PSN)WINDMILEYNO]

1 hour ago, bubbabenali said:

Oh damn such a shame Volt got only one of the best CC abilities with his rework...

CC is what got us here in the first place, look at the mirage post next door. No one here wants the same crap being thrown at volt, until endless nerf threads which result in Discharge being restricted, so it's useless at damage and crowd control, it would just be great if it was a (pitiful) damage ability again, like overload rather than a pitiful CC ability after an impending nerf with no damage

[RealPandemonium]

35 minutes ago, Toramaru said:

 

Sir, Sorties are doable, mad dog them all the way with a melee build! ;D

The skill set is currently too underwhelming to be considered.

ROFL, "mad dogging" with shadow step.

[Toramaru]

48 minutes ago, RealPandemonium said:

ROFL, "mad dogging" with shadow step.

The only way, sir.

[Wolfnrun]

On 5/31/2016 at 6:11 AM, Aquasurge said:

yay, we are on page 20! BTW how do you get emojis into your posts?

P.S. it kind of ironic that i have to curse the sky tomorrow for being blue as apparently, its part of the anti-Queensland conspiracy (cause of the state origin in Australia I.Y.D.K. (if you didn't know)).

: smile : (Remove the spaces and I already know ) 

Edited June 9, 2016 by Wolfnrun

[continue]

my main complaint is that, with all the talk of synergy, riot shield's energy drain with distance traveled has anti-synergy with volt's passive and speed

if you want volt's abilities to actually synergize, why not take away the additional energy drain with distance traveled, making a speed cast actually improve current shield's performance by allowing you to cover more distance?

volt has two stuns, a mobility boost, a shield which discourages mobility, and a passive which encourages mobility. being able to pick up the shield could potentially have great synergy with volt's other abilities just by virtue of how they affect gameplay, so why disincentivize that while adding in other "synergy" mechanics that don't actually affect gameplay beyond flat numbers (two stuns interacting with each other to add a bit of bonus damage)?

[Slythrower]

Here are my thoughts of volt after the rework. 

Passive: I absolutely love it, Damage + depending on distance traveled is totally genius. 

Shock: Honestly feels very weak of an ability like previous posts have mentioned in terms of damage because if my build has a lot of Power Strength I expect more Damage to be outputted, but that is not the case. Partially also because Electric Damage alone isn't very effective against most enemies in the game. Very good CC ability though.

Speed: Very nice, that this ability still grants me speed since, I built my Volt to be speed demon because it's just so much fun going zoom-zoom. But, like previous posts in this thread, there's issue on the Speed Coil spawning behind Volt, so if allies are in front of Volt they would have to go back and pick it up if they want the speed. Volt also cannot to see the Speed Coil dropped so a Volt player cannot mark the location of the coil to help squad mates that want the speed (Previous posts mention this). And that 1/2 sec-1 second delay before casting which I find very annoying because before the rework the speed would be instantly activated once I pressed the button. Feels like it breaks the flow of movement. Would really like Volt Speed to be activated instantly again. 

Electric Shield: Loving the visual update on the shield, looks very crisp and edgy. Keep it. As cool as it looks though, casting Shock through Electric Shield again does very negligible damage. I don't have much incentive to pick up my shield when my is energy draining and movement speed is reduced and the Shield only covers the front of Volt and limited to weapons that can be used and only max of 4 shields can be cast. Too many limitations here. I would rather cast another electric shield than to pick it up because picking up the shield just doesn't feel fun. The prompt for picking up shield should disappear when aiming. I would recommend reverting the shield to what is was before and cap the number of shields being cast because I know infinite shields was fun, but definitely very broken. 

Discharge: This ability looks very nice. Great CC ability, Range is lacking compared to pre-rework Volt. Damage is also something this ability lacks compared to what it was before. And not being able to cast this ability while being in midair like it was before just doesn't fit because like a previous post has mentioned, lightning travels in any direction. (Volt goes where he pleases)

I think at the moment, Volt is in an identity crisis of should Volt deal tons of Damage frame or a CC frame? Right now at the moment he is looking a lot like it is better to build him for CC rather than to build for damage. Hard to decide which direction to lean towards. But at least I still have my Volt Speed! 

[Sofy_Safwat]

I hope if they could make his ultimate (4th skill) like a chargeable skill since he is VOLT then he releases certain amounts of energy such like inaros 4th,  charged till 100%.I'm right??

[RealPandemonium]

2 hours ago, Slythrower said:

Discharge: This ability looks very nice. Great CC ability, Range is lacking compared to pre-rework Volt.

Overload also had a 20m radius; the range is unchanged.  If anything the maximum effective radius is increased due to the coil effect.  

Edited June 1, 2016 by RealPandemonium

[Yazeth]

After testing Discharge for a bit, I found a flaw. If you have a large amount of range, you may be actually reducing the duration of the cc effect. This mainly applies when the tesla coils arc towards each other. By increasing the range, you increase the radius of the teslas' range. If more arcs make contact with each other, then they take more damage, which makes them reach the dmg cap faster and end the cc sooner. Of course, this only applies when the teslas are close enough to each other. When the enemies are alone, the ability is amazing at cc. But, if you want the cc to last as long as possible, negative range would be beneficial in that case, which is pretty much the opposite of every other cc abilities that I know of. Putting in Power Strength also does nothing really to extend the duration of the cc, since it increases both the dmg of the ability and it's dmg cap proportionally. I say either remove the dmg cap, or keep the dmg cap but make the stun duration based on Power Duration only.

The damage cap being removed would be a very, very, very scary thing. 240% Power Strength would be 1080 DPS per target to each target in range. That might not sound particularly great, but five enemies clustered would deal 25k DPS. Ten targets clustered would deal 108k DPS. Twenty targets would deal 432k DPS.  That said, the delay before self-damag being removed would be nice, as would making the CC not end so abruptly when the damage cap has been hit. It can currently swing wildly between doing a lot of CC or a lot of damage based upon what targets are near each other, and that's a rather difficult thing to account for whilst playing.

How about the ability deals diminishing dmg instead. After dealing about x amount of dmg, the ticks' dmg gets reduced by some sort of percentage, maybe like 50% or something. That way, the ability will still be able to have cc based on duration while also not dealing extreme amounts of dmg.

Edited June 1, 2016 by Yazeth
Quoting another person.

[Aquasurge]

just can't wait till i log into warframe and recieve a free forma!

[ElectronX_Core]

Well, there shall be HotFixes. Lets just hope that they are buffs, not nerfs. Where's that scaling damage from Devstream 72? I have an idea for that, but it's complicated to explain and probably to implement as well, so I'll spare you guys the wall of text unless you ask for it.

46 minutes ago, Aquasurge said:

just can't wait till i log into warframe and recieve a free forma!

Really? What log-in day is that?

[Aquasurge]

59 minutes ago, ElectronX_Core said:

Well, there shall be HotFixes. Lets just hope that they are buffs, not nerfs. Where's that scaling damage from Devstream 72? I have an idea for that, but it's complicated to explain and probably to implement as well, so I'll spare you guys the wall of text unless you ask for it.

Really? What log-in day is that?

this is what i mean.

[YagoXiten]

15 minutes ago, Aquasurge said:

this is what i mean.

Well, they didn't mention Volt. But...I don't think the Energy cost on picking up the Electric Shield is a bug. So I don't know if we can expect to see that changed. Still, here's to hoping!

[Aquasurge]

1 hour ago, YagoXiten said:

Well, they didn't mention Volt. But...I don't think the Energy cost on picking up the Electric Shield is a bug. So I don't know if we can expect to see that changed. Still, here's to hoping!

we should really start spamming topics about the movement energy cost of RES. that should really get DE's attention.

Edited June 1, 2016 by Aquasurge