DE_Steve sees the problems with the update - Chapeau.

[OniDax]

2 hours ago, Tricky5hift said:

And what exactly did they "promise"?

Well, a while back they promised to have it out by the end of June I think...

[treltheblue]

No one at DE deserves any understanding until they fix this mess and stop hiding away credit menus or scumming for plat other ways (Kavat starter kit that doesn't come with the module or enough materials to make it, let alone it and a cat I'm looking at you.)

 

They sold this update on appeal to new players and this is what they do. Disgusting.

[--RV--LadySpiderwick]

2 hours ago, (XB1)Gray Silhouette said:

I'm more peeved by the fact they released an update that they apparently knew was unfinished at all.

 

There's no reason for that. Delay it; the flak will be lesser than what i've seen from releasing it at an unfinished point.

Even Lunaro had SEVEN hotfixes to address it's problems. Second Dream needed hotfixes. Every major update has needed to get hotfixes regardless of how little or big the problem was. Patience~

[AresTheLegendary]

finally, a straight forward explanation. now i have something i can understand, sympathize and empathize with. someone said DE's promise of the patch was what set the expectations so high. this clearly was a product unfit for release, but was due for release anyway. i understand. i patiently await the results i feel steve intends for us. take your time, if time is what you need. Clearly, quality is what we're hungry for, and im 100% sure everyone can wrap their head around the concept that good food takes time to make. my apologies, and yours accepted.

[Zaniel_Aus]

Just now, LittleArachnid said:

Even Lunaro had SEVEN hotfixes to address it's problems. Second Dream needed hotfixes. Every major update has needed to get hotfixes regardless of how little or big the problem was. Patience~

Second Dream was slick as hell compared to this ill-conceived mutant update.

[--RV--LadySpiderwick]

Just now, Zaniel_Aus said:

Second Dream was slick as hell compared to this ill-conceived mutant update.

My point is, EVERY UPDATE has needed hotfixes.

[Wandering_Cyberdragoness]

1 hour ago, notlamprey said:

The whole mess just has me really disappointed with everyone.

With DE, with the community, with "DE's business partners"... I would ordinarily be angry, but there isn't any angry left. I'm just disappointed now.

It's good that people call an unfinished mess what it is. It's good that negative feedback happens where warranted. It's not good when people cross over from talking about the game into kicking people when they're already down.

That doesn't help get us what we want. It has been established that DE are working according to someone else's timetable now, and you people have got to understand just how soul-crushing it is to work in "crunch" mode. It sucks the humanity right out of you. It's a damn travesty.

In light of all that, I'd rather we focus on talking about the game as opposed to impugning the character or capability of our development team. They don't need that right now. They really, really don't need that right now.

If we push too hard, it will totally kill their ability to put love into this game. Maybe that's already gone. By all means, let's hold people accountable who have asked us to hold them accountable. Let's just remember that they're human beings, working under some very... potentially unpleasant conditions.

Very well said. We still love you DE, we all make mistakes, and all that's left is to correct them and hope for the best. Besides, under the surface issues, the new update is quite promising. Tears are fun, Kavats are neat. Archwing is still Archwing

[Nidaria]

3 hours ago, Tricky5hift said:

"[...] DE isn't stupid enough to make promises they can't keep."

lmao when DE always makes "drop dates" but never fulfills them

[Silverton]

I love this game, but honestly I am just tired of it now. I have been playing for three years now and since 18.5 I only log in to get my login reward. This game has nothing for me anymore. The things I do enjoy are being changed in ways I can't stand and I don't see the future of the game going in a direction that doesn't change more for the worse. U19 is so big that it has to be split into 3 parts...why couldn't some of this of been released 3+ months ago when the game had no new content coming in. Instead of giving us steady content like they had done in the pass, we now get one large "content" patch with to many bugs.

 

We should of gotten Kavats awhile ago. We have known about them for almost 2 years it feels (I know for one year at least) and I believe they were supposed to come out in U17, but got pushed back. Kavats would of been some nice content to pave the way for the bigger things. The map rework is a mess, but better than we had. The changes to the void are fun at first, but honestly just because you change the map and the initial game mode, we are still going to be playing the same 3+ minute long segment for the chance to get one item that we want. Sure the void got boring, but at least we had several game modes to play it on. Now we have one minigame in missions that will never change and has some BS spawn mechanics.

 

The thing I am really salty about is the changes to Archwing. A game mode that had it's problems that I still enjoyed, I can no longer play. I'm not normally one who can get motion sickness, but the new archwing is destroying me. Who was asking for 6DOF in the first place? That wasn't peoples' problem with the game mode. They wanted more to do and a faster way to get exp, but instead we got two new modes and neither of which I can play.

 

I love this game as I said at the top of the page, but for the longest time my love has been awfully one sided. When this game goes from being the only game you play to the game you "actually play" once every two weeks or so then something is wrong. This game has long since stopped giving me "real" content. It was better a year ago when grinding for a prime part didn't mean spend 20 keys in a t3 survival to get one of 5 parts that has been added to endless mission rotation C. Rathuum was a fun and challenging game mode and for the 1st time in a long time I was actually having fun (and that was months ago at this point). With these last few updates nothing is being added for veterans really. Lunaro I mean who asked for that game mode? Why was time spent giving me a fusion of El Durado and Rocket League? Sure if the game mode was fun and not a cheap shot show I'd consider it content, but it isn't. It is again another half baked idea being handed to us and it is expected to hold us over until another half baked idea comes out.

 

This game is great, but time and time again DE is showing themselves to be out of touch with the player base. How many times has us the player base gotten outraged over something that DE has put out. I came to this game from Allods Online who at some point started charging people real money for deaths. Warframe though has caused more outrage than Allods Online could ever hope to cause. Warframe though it is constant, Viver gate, Saryn, Mag/volt rework, this update, and a few other updates have caused the player base to revolt to a level that charging your players to die couldn't even begin to cause.

 

This all comes across as rambling, but twice now I have said it and I will say it again...I love this game. I get salty and type up all this, because I love this game. I want the game to flourish and I want other people to enjoy it, but cranking out crap update after crap update is starting to get old and it shows, two years ago threads like this wouldn't be popping up. Since Viver though the players are becoming more and more houndish. We expect better and want better.

[Hesyol]

Yeah everything went so wrong with this update. I said before that previous updates were rushed and poorly executed, well I didn't know THIS was coming. And I can't say I don't like the new content, but the execution was really bad. Nice that they understand it. Inb4 100 hotfixes

[F-Minus]

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

My problems with the update are the following:

1) Nullifiers spawning on top of you: the whole point of them having a big shiny bubble is so you can spot them coming and move away

You're 4 in the game, let one deal with the rift and take the flak, while other stay away and shoot from afar. It's a problem with it being new, and everyone wants to pick up those globes and close the rift, whilst it's not needed and then a cluster f... of spawn happens when all 4 are closing the rift at the same time. 

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

2) Bombard spam: please don't spam Bombards, especially for the T4 missions any frame that isn't inaros get's shafted

Same as above, really. 

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

3) Void fissure hitbox detection: Not only is the interaction with the power thingies wonky, but so is putting them into the fissure

All interactions with objects, panels, etc.  are a bit wonky this patch

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

4) Solo-unfriendly: Especially for missions like survival, there are just too many things to manage

As they were ever, as this game is meant to play in a group. 

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

5) Weird names: Too unforgettable to remember :(

The Horror!

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

6) Void traces drop too few :(

Agreed

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

7) Kavat scans have a drop-chance? WHY?

Agreed

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

8) Archwing material requirements increase: It isn't nearly popular yet to do that, DE-no-one asked for this

Minimal requirement, but I agree. 

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

9) Junctions having wonky detection: sometimes it won't record my completion

Obviously a bug

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

10) Asking bad tasks of vets: Why do I have to rebuild a weapon I mastered and finished just to clear the junction? Waste of time and resources

Agreed, it should scan your history if you already crafted those things. 

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

11) Assignment of archwing parts: So, parts for the same weapon are spread across different opposing syndicates. ....WHY-

Design choices, so people go for those syndicates, or promote trading between people, anyway it's not end of the world. 

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

12) Market design is poorly done

Agreed

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

13) Holsters are broken and cost too much. Animation  sets can be applied for all warframes and weapon grips, but holsters are for very few weapons.

Holsters are fine from the get-go, for the most part, but you can break them if you move them in weird positions another obvious bug that there's no positional limitations. 

 

4 hours ago, Evanescent said:

14) Void has become pointless

As it was announced 1  year ago, and it's not really pointless. 

 

Otherwise it's nice.

 

It's mostly bugs that are problematic, everything else is design decisions really and for the most part A-OK. But due to those bugs, it should have been held back at least until the major bugs are ironed out. Content wise, as said, it's fine and a major change of some warframe components, and people need to adapt as with any major changes.

[arch111]

DEsteve can correct me on this any time, but I have allways felt that he is the visionary Engine of Warframe. 

And as such he thinks BIG, bigger than is acheavable in the timeframe they have. Abd this is a good thing. 

Where it goes bad is when too much is worked on at the same time,  so that individual parts are not given full attention. 

This is the patch-mentality called Hotfix. While it works well most of the time, it allso leads to bugs that become a mess real fast. That was the very reason this update was aplit into parts in the first place.

Maby the lesson for devs and players alike, is to actually wait between added content before rushing to the next.

The very HOUR Vauban Prime was released - threads like "So who do you want the next Prime to be?"

Are we really THAT stressed out now we can't even stop and enjoy what we have for a week or two?

 

[TheBrsrkr]

6 hours ago, GreyEnneract said:

I have to agree that this isn't the worst update in the history of DE though.

 

Literally every update has been the worst update so far in the history of DE to someone. 

[Sir_Alex_Traffo]

7 hours ago, Awazx said:

Perhaps, Steve can write this in the forum.

Only, perhaps.

Note: This update is worst disaster in the history of Warframe.

Lol, really? How long have you been around? 

 

Anyway, this happens with almost every update and as 90%  of the cases DE will make it right shortly. 

No drama! 

[Omnimorph]

7 hours ago, treltheblue said:

No one at DE deserves any understanding until they fix this mess and stop hiding away credit menus or scumming for plat other ways (Kavat starter kit that doesn't come with the module or enough materials to make it, let alone it and a cat I'm looking at you.)

 

They sold this update on appeal to new players and this is what they do. Disgusting.

I have never been paranoid in that way about DE before, but I fear that they're now dancing to the tune of our Chicken Overlords.  I saw something like this happen with Cryptic and PWI - their MMOs have gradually become less holistically games, less unique gestalts with their own inner logic dictated by game design, and more just a series of sneaky ways to get people to fork out dough, disguised as games, with the developers obviously fighting a sad rearguard action to try and keep the games as gamey as they can within the constraints.

I've been gladly giving DE money this past couple of years, just because I've been enjoying the game.  But if things like this bit of sneaky Marketplace design are the way of the future, I'm going to be less inclined to give DE money, so will many other players, and eventually our Chicken Overlords will have squeezed another good development team dry and will have moved on.

I hope the scenario I'm painting here is not true, but I fear it might be.

Edited July 10, 2016 by Omnimorph

[notlamprey]

1 hour ago, Omnimorph said:

I have never been paranoid in that way about DE before, but I fear that they're now dancing to the tune of our Chicken Overlords.  I saw something like this happen with Cryptic and PWI - their MMOs have gradually become less holistically games, less unique gestalts with their own inner logic dictated by game design, and more just a series of sneaky ways to get people to fork out dough, disguised as games, with the developers obviously fighting a sad rearguard action to try and keep the games as gamey as they can within the constraints.

I've been gladly giving DE money this past couple of years, just because I've been enjoying the game.  But if things like this bit of sneaky Marketplace design are the way of the future, I'm going to be less inclined to give DE money, so will many other players, and eventually our Chicken Overlords will have squeezed another good development team dry and will have moved on.

I hope the scenario I'm painting here is not true, but I fear it might be.

That stuff has been in the back of my mind ever since the first partial acquisition took place.

These are packaged goods people. I know I don't need to remind people about some of the appalling things Bobby Kotick has said regarding Activision/Blizzard and the culture he wanted to create at that company.

"...we're really good at keeping people focused on the deep depression."

This is the ethos we're dealing with. This really isn't the place to post the Jimquisition video on "Crunch," but oh boy. I'll let it be enough to say that I think the corporate, "give us profit" mindset is a plague on games. It is a baleful poison that ruins all it touches, including the people who make these games we love to play.

 

[(XBOX)Drunken Swede]

11 hours ago, (XB1)Gray Silhouette said:

I'm more peeved by the fact they released an update that they apparently knew was unfinished.

Sounds like they have they been using EA as their publisher lately.

[Evanescent]

5 hours ago, F-Minus said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's mostly bugs that are problematic, everything else is design decisions really and for the most part A-OK. But due to those bugs, it should have been held back at least until the major bugs are ironed out. Content wise, as said, it's fine and a major change of some warframe components, and people need to adapt as with any major changes.

!, 2 and 4) Tell me, if content can be scaled up for group play, why can't it be scaled down for solo play? You don't want to always play with other people, that's the reason 'Solo' is an option. And as long as it is an option you can't really justify it being shafted as 'game is made for coop'. It's made for solo too.

5) Horror indeed. How can you really organise your farming if you have to check up on the wiki every few seconds for what relic you're supposed to use? It is a problem with the system, and should therefore be addressed. Your system should be memorable and striking.

13) No, try equipping alt shoulder holster for galatine, for the nikana on base excalibur. Just Floats a feet away.

14) It's just become another part of the chart, something I was hoping they wouldn't do. The Lore hypes it up as a mystical, dangerous place: now it's just a dumping point for some resources.

I guess I was forcing what I wanted into what DE envisioned, but I was wishing you would enter the void from the tear and do something special, that would root the sense of awe inside you.

Also about the archwing parts:

No, you could have said that if you had different complete weapons on different syndicates. Having the same weapon scattered across opposing syndicates makes it frustrating. You're making players choose sides, then penalising them for choosing? Wtf? I'd prefer weapons being assigned to syndicates rather than being scattered.

 

Edited July 10, 2016 by Evanescent

[Berserkerkitten]

Regarding forum censorship - I so looooooove my profanity, but personally, I think giving up on a bit of swearing also reduces forum toxicity. I find these forums to be rather pleasant, which is in no small amount thanks to the moderators. 

As for update 19 and Steve's apology - I just wonder what's gonna happen next. Are we gonna sit on this broken update for a while now and hope on daily fixes? Is the whole thing gonna be rolled back? The market is messed up, the holsters don't work, credit boosters were bought and do nothing... content-stopping bugs, the void mess - can this all be sorted with smaller fixes within a realistic time frame or is it so broken that a reset to a former update is the more reasonable option? o_O

Edited July 10, 2016 by Berserkerkitten

[SatouJin]

fissures aren't really that different than when survival first came out. not enough life support, weird enemy spawns, broken scaling. probably just ran out of time and made up whatever was handy for the tables.

thing will get fixed but some long before others. 'needs a bugfix' is kinda different than 'feature is unfinished'. it's not the end of the world no matter what the mayans said. just strapped on deadlines like any other business. honestly i thought the game might have died of void fatigue long before this update even happened so it's not all bad right?

at least they fixed second dream cause being trapped on the liset was far more crushing to gameplay than some wonky enemy spawns.

[BlackCoMerc]

13 hours ago, Evanescent said:

Trust=restored.

For me, the trust will be restored when they ACTUALLY fix it, not when they promise to.

[Tricky5hift]

11 hours ago, Monchopin said:

a good update

Something being "good" or not is 100% subjective.

In a broader view, I think this update really sets Warframe on a better path even though its delivery wasn't very successful.

[wathor88]

was looking forward to get info about the specter of the rail in tennocon livestream and then thought they would release it few days later....now im just very updset about all these very bad bugs and changes

[Fionntan]

14 hours ago, DioBrandoTheHotVampire said:

well

yea...

like, dude, THE ONLY thing that made this update so trashy is DE's PROMISE

they should've announced the whole update yesterday at tennocon

hope they'll take this lesson

From what I gather is the suit folks that did the final call, so I do hope they learned their lesson.

Edit: Makes sense since I am use to DE first tease update and then give us the update... most forum folks agree it was going get shipped mid/end July. 

Yet, here we are into having to deal more bugs due to $$$ profits.

Yes most major updates in past had been buggy but if DE had chance to push it later I bet we would be dealing with less bugs then now. /rant

12 hours ago, notlamprey said:

The whole mess just has me really disappointed with everyone.

With DE, with the community, with "DE's business partners"... I would ordinarily be angry, but there isn't any angry left. I'm just disappointed now.

It's good that people call an unfinished mess what it is. It's good that negative feedback happens where warranted. It's not good when people cross over from talking about the game into kicking people when they're already down.

That doesn't help get us what we want. It has been established that DE are working according to someone else's timetable now, and you people have got to understand just how soul-crushing it is to work in "crunch" mode. It sucks the humanity right out of you. It's a damn travesty.

In light of all that, I'd rather we focus on talking about the game as opposed to impugning the character or capability of our development team. They don't need that right now. They really, really don't need that right now.

If we push too hard, it will totally kill their ability to put love into this game. Maybe that's already gone. By all means, let's hold people accountable who have asked us to hold them accountable. Let's just remember that they're human beings, working under some very... potentially unpleasant conditions.

Well said +1

2 hours ago, notlamprey said:

That stuff has been in the back of my mind ever since the first partial acquisition took place.

These are packaged goods people. I know I don't need to remind people about some of the appalling things Bobby Kotick has said regarding Activision/Blizzard and the culture he wanted to create at that company.

"...we're really good at keeping people focused on the deep depression."

This is the ethos we're dealing with. This really isn't the place to post the Jimquisition video on "Crunch," but oh boy. I'll let it be enough to say that I think the corporate, "give us profit" mindset is a plague on games. It is a baleful poison that ruins all it touches, including the people who make these games we love to play.

Couldn't have said it better myself

Gosh darn suit people and their poison touch.

Edit: Actually mind I screenshot this quote? It just rings too true man.

Edited July 10, 2016 by Fionntan

[KoshLovesYou]

14 hours ago, (PS4)Doctor-Blitz- said:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/4rz6s7/hate_me_all_you_want_but_sotr_was_and_is_a/d55gwi4

Quote DE_Steve:

Sorry for the mess. :(

Seconding that being a spot on rant that echos my own feelings/experiences, spot on. And glad Steve called it what it was.

I'mma put playing Warframe on hold till this gets all sorted, frankly. It just ain't fun. That "Gift From The Lotus" joke alert with the broken, constant kicking/rejoining issue due to players not realizing the otherwise unlisted melee requirement kinda sank the last threads of enthusiasm on top of all this.