HEMA Final Word - No Mutagen Drop or Cost change

[Otis.Driftwood]

This is a reply to the people who think Hema is a mastery fodder weapon

GUESS AGAIN

The weapon is useable for all tiers of gameplay.

It gives health back on headshots and these headshots don't even have to be killshots.

 

[(PSN)Sange13]

1 minute ago, Otis.Driftwood said:

This is a reply to the people who think Hema is a mastery fodder weapon

GUESS AGAIN

The weapon is useable for all tiers of gameplay.

It gives health back on headshots and these headshots don't even have to be killshots.

 

That literally changes nothing about the problem being discussed.

[Otis.Driftwood]

16 minutes ago, (PS4)Sange13 said:

That literally changes nothing about the problem being discussed.

and if you bothered to read what I typed it was a reply to people calling it mastery fodder

This problem you speak off isn't a real problem at all. The problem is people want everything for free in as fast a time as they can get it.This is the only thing that leads to burnout nothing else.

Theres this thing called a sense of accomplishment which the majority don't care for, which is fine BUT complaining about getting something for free isn't going to fix anything.

Also they have admitted that the drop rates for resources to research is low and are looking at balancing the amount of resources dropped for everyone to be able to aquire and enjoy the weapon.

Edited January 6, 2017 by Otis.Driftwood

[notlamprey]

14 minutes ago, Otis.Driftwood said:

and if you bothered to read what I typed it was a reply to people calling it mastery fodder

This problem you speak off isn't a real problem at all. The problem is people want everything for free in as fast a time as they can get it.This is the only thing that leads to burnout nothing else.

Theres this thing called a sense of accomplishment which the majority don't care for, which is fine BUT complaining about getting something for free isn't going to fix anything.

Also they have admitted that the drop rates for resources to research is low and are looking at balancing the amount of resources dropped for everyone to be able to aquire and enjoy the weapon.

How magnanimous of them!

They're promising less pressure to buy the weapon, after almost all the people who were ever going to buy it have already bought it.

Wow, so generous. It's the most predictable of revenue-juicing tactics; they want to reap the cash and try to salvage some good PR.

[(PSN)Sange13]

28 minutes ago, Volinus7 said:

From what they said in devstream85, they admitted that they want to "force" people to play. So basically the more supply we stocked up the harsher the future grind will be. 

They don't want players who have a ton of resources to just push the button when the new contents come up.

The problem with this kind of reasoning is that if anyone can afford to just "push the button" on new research, it's because they have been playing so long already.

 

19 minutes ago, Otis.Driftwood said:

and if you bothered to read what I typed it was a reply to people calling it mastery fodder

This problem you speak off isn't a real problem at all. The problem is people want everything for free in as fast a time as they can get it.This is the only thing that leads to burnout nothing else.

Theres this thing called a sense of accomplishment which the majority don't care for, which is fine BUT complaining about getting something for free isn't going to fix anything.

Also they have admitted that the drop rates for resources to research is low and are looking at balancing the amount of resources dropped for everyone to be able to aquire and enjoy the weapon.

You just showed you don't understand the problem, so how about you step back, put yourself in the shoes of people who are complaining about it, and find out where those complaints come from. Then you might understand the problem and have grounds to speak on the topic.

[Otis.Driftwood]

I understand perfectly were the complaints come from "entitlement"

[Tanner_Lindberg]

as a clan with it researched had it day one since i had tons of mutagen  yeah it is crazy and their just avoiding the issue like its the plague for some reason 

[Tanner_Lindberg]

2 minutes ago, Otis.Driftwood said:

I understand perfectly were the complaints come from "entitlement"

assuming every one who doesn't agree with you is just entitled gg

[(PSN)Sange13]

3 minutes ago, Otis.Driftwood said:

I understand perfectly were the complaints come from "entitlement"

Thanks for completely destroying your own credibility. Now everyone knows they can ignore your posts.

[Otis.Driftwood]

6 minutes ago, MrFoxAos said:

assuming every one who doesn't agree with you is just entitled gg

Never called any one specifically entitled.

I'm a clan of 1 who has played for years even I didn't have the resources to research it at 1st I persisted and got it researched.

You have the right to ignore what you like not bothered by what anyone thinks.

Edited January 6, 2017 by Otis.Driftwood

[Doc-Orange]

I really feel pranked. Does Steve thinks we believe this??????

There are so many examples in the past where DE cares nothing about the effort players took into their equipment.

Nerfing Frames after formaing them several times!

Nerfing weapons after buying it from the market with platinum!

Changing hard earned Void keys to something where I cannot farm upcoming Frames with because existing relics contains no new parts!

Nerfing Riven mods which are bought with platinum!

And whats with Damage 3.0? This will have impact on most weapons and mods we grinded.

DE I feel insulted with these kind of "reasons".

Edited January 6, 2017 by Doc-Orange

[(PSN)Sange13]

5 minutes ago, Otis.Driftwood said:

Never called any one specifically entitled.

I'm a clan of 1 who has played for years even I didn't have the resources to research it at 1st I persisted and got it researched.

You have the right to ignore what you like not bothered by what anyone thinks.

And you have shown that nobody should bother with what you think.

[Celthric317]

Only problem I have with the weapon, is that it takes 50k salvage to make. 

[T1t4n_43]

Love most of the new contents of the past year, but...

Hema's muta cost is so wrong, I'm surprised about it won't be corrected.

It requires so insane much efforts, it doesn't unite clans, it burns ppl out.

Possibly 80% of clans are still in struggle with Hema, referring to protect that 20% who completed it is so wrong.

I'm sorry, I don't have my whole life to give to this game by repeating the same again and again. I have work, relation, family, friends, hobbies, parties with serious drinking...

and I also can't buy Hema with plats for the 50 active (signed in the past 3 weeks) ppl of my storm clan it's 500 $ hard cash, can buy 10 new epic game from that price.

I saw there were "protest against Hema requirements" titled articles also, they were a misstake. DE doesn't tolerate these, even they are right, will be rejected, DE only accepts gentle requests, because of... many reasons.

[Zyion]

On 1/2/2017 at 4:00 AM, Momaw said:

So, this is something I have a problem with. Warframe players are very very used to "pre grind". They put in time playing, they get all this material and resources laying around, and then when something new comes out they expect to have enough to just get it instantly. What is so bad about having to earn things AFTER they arrive instead of BEFORE?

And what you said is something that I have a problem with. The people who have "pre grinded" materials have already put in the time and effort. They spent hundreds of hours of playing beforehand so that they can skip hours of grinding when new content comes out. If you set up costs specifically to force clans with large stockpiles to grind, then new players and new clans will feel the hurt allot more. It's like choosing the nuclear option over a surgical strike, the collateral damage will be tremendous.

[Volinus7]

32 minutes ago, Zyion said:

And what you said is something that I have a problem with. The people who have "pre grinded" materials have already put in the time and effort. They spent hundreds of hours of playing beforehand so that they can skip hours of grinding when new content comes out. If you set up costs specifically to force clans with large stockpiles to grind, then new players and new clans will feel the hurt allot more. It's like choosing the nuclear option over a surgical strike, the collateral damage will be tremendous.

You've just destroyed my upvote button with a tactical nuke.

[theraot]

Going forward, it seems that playing the game and gaining any resource would be contributing to move the average of that resource people have, and thus increasing the risk of another jump in costs for some future item [1]. Playing with that mentality is not healthy. So I propose this: if you think Warframe is going to a dark place, dicide if you wanna enjoy it while it last or halt playing. Otherwise, this is not important; you just keep playing as usual.

[1]: Aside from trying to waste resources (which I don't want to encourage), the only thing we could do to counter that is invite players (which I'm not enticed to do).

 

---

Steve, find differences in kind. The same way that you are trying to make the combat more tactical for advanced player, and not so much dependending on the numbers (damage, crit, etc...). The same way you should be trying to make the acquisition of new items more tactical for advanced players, and not so much dependending on the numbers (prices, rgn, etc...).

 

---

 

I think that's the last thing I want to say on the topic. We got an answer anyway. I don't want to go over the same arguments with people who care just enough to post but not enough to read... and I get that, this thread is 250 posts longs (well, 251 with this one). This is in part why I moved to make suggestions, we can debate how bad the cost is, but this effort has diminishing results.

[(PSN)Sange13]

If they really don't want people who have done the pre-grind for new content to get immediate access, they should find alternate ways to bring loot into the game (old Void for non-Prime stuff would be okay with me).

[AshenHaze]

On 1/2/2017 at 2:14 AM, (Xbox One)FCastle74 said:

hahahaha jokes on DE. I don't grind for days and hours for 1 MR fodder weapon   lol GG DE

 Its really simple tho,(this game has become casual IMO)  stop leaving feed back and buying plat. Thier attitude will change. As with any business, when you dont have customers you dont have a business. done.

so i log in, log out ✌

edit: loving FFXV right now, and im keeping an eye on wild lands, for honor and Mass Effect Andromida. 👍 

 

Unless, of course, those folk overseas see no issue with grinding forever

China

[Chakravikari]

What I want to know is has ANY moon clan finished research?

[Volinus7]

Reduce the cost.

Give clans that finished the cost they paid.

This way clans both finished and unfinished will have excessive ms, no good, players will not suffer from harsh grinding no increased playtime/player count/plat sales. NOOOOO GOOD.

 

vs

 

Raise drop rate

Finished clans still approach 0ms stock and unfinished clans will still have to grind. This is good!! Players can not proof drop rate or rng, we can even increase stack size and stealthy reduce drop rate to give illusion of easier grinding. Genius!!!!

 

logical decision don't you think?

[BBOTAA]

This Hema situation and how it's being handled is just disappointing.
Nice that steve start playing now so he can make a clan and grind for those sweet mutagen samples.

[Naskoni]

I'll just leave this here:

 

(No, this image is not my creation, although I may have been quoted in it, and as such I take no credit for it)

[Takkov]

so, why should the clan get the resources a single player paid for it?

This would really be kinda unfair for the contributers, and when the guy that played for 2.5 years only has ~770 mutagen samples, well, lots of people I know had more than that.

also if you kick inactive players, invite new ones and ask them to contribute for the hema there should be a way, because the research cost is 500 if everyone contributes, 1000 if half contributes 1667 if every third player contributes, 1700 is the amount of samples I have left after building nearly every mutagen mass needed for clan research by myself and not very actively farming them within a time of 9 month, running 40 waves of ODD is not a bad way to get resources that you need anyways/farming relics

[Ciaus]

I have just updated the OP with the following edit:

DE has suggested that mutagen will drop in packs of two or three now. 

What does this change:

• It reduces the grind time, assuming you are farming somewhat optimally (ie: On Derelict AND ONLY Derelict).

What does this NOT change?

• The extremely boring nature of the grind.
• The tilesets on which you can viably find mutagen (Eris will still NOT be an option).
• Their single outlier cost of the Hema. It should never have been so far out of line with other costs.

What damage does this do?

• All other clan research becomes comparatively cheaper now, when the pricing was quite fair for intermediate players before. 
• Community damage remains. This cost is still insane for less than full clans. It needed a 10x reduction, not a 2x easier to farm, to prevent the destruction of social clans that is still ongoing. 
• Shows DE is going to stand by this decision, with reasoning they have never followed in the past with any nerf or price change they have used. 
• Addressing this so late after dropping the Hema during holiday period, and then not putting in an adequate, high effort fix (like I outlined in point 3) leaves me very sour. It's hard not to jump to conclusions. 

In short: No DE. Not good enough.