Reifnir Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 19 minutes ago, (PS4)R_U_I-TUGA said: last night i got 154 mutagen samples in odd with nekros and 2 boost resource drop and chance drop in 20 waves of defense Cool. Now imagine you have 4 people who can actively contribute to Sample farm (600 samples per 20-wave ODD) in a Storm clan and rejoice at the prospect of repeating that 4-man, booster-equipped 20-wave ODD run 80+ times. More, if you don't use boosters. For one mastery-fodder grade weapon. That, or you'll have to kick people out because they don't farm and hire new "farmhands". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master-Nachash Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 6 hours ago, Dranaron said: That's not the issue here. The issue is that we as a community need to push back against resource creep before more weapons are released with unreasonable costs. By buying the Hema and weapons like it with plat we're effectively saying that this practice is okay and that DE should release more weapons unobtainable to the general population. Now, I might be off the mark here, but it seems from the attitude of the community that most people don't have the gun and are unable/in clans that are unwilling to farm it (Like mine which is 32k done out of 500k). If I'm wrong I'd really like to know. But I doubt it. I think you're missing the point here. Warframe is DE's game and they can do whatever they like with it. Yes, the community may be a lot more actively engaged in the development of the game than in most other games, but that's pretty inconsequential when it comes to decision making as the community doesn't actually own it. DE does. I for one will never really care what direction they take the game in. I may be momentarily annoyed by some of the things they do, but that annoyance never lasts. If they ever make a change that dramatically impacts my ability to play the game and enjoy it, I'll simply stop playing. No skin off my nose. There are plenty other games out there. I can't see that happening though. I have zero issues with the game as it is now. Even when it comes to content locked behind grind. Why? Because I always find a workaround for "grind." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k05h Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 (edited) I live in a country where it rains often. From my experience on rain I can say with 100% certainty that 1 drop per minute is not considered rain. I went to check the science behind it. The smallest form of rain, drizzle, is considered 14 drops per second or 840 drops per minute. Therefore from a scientific point of view the sentence "It is raining mutagen in the derelict" is wrong. If you are interested in the form of rains:http://www.kgbanswers.com/how-many-raindrops-fall-in-one-second/4191107 If you are intested in the drop chance of mutagen in derelict missions Edited January 21, 2017 by k05h corrected calculation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k05h Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 5 hours ago, Magnar21 said: DE confirmed that the research costs are not a mistake, are intended, and will not be changed. Going forward, however, they will try to keep costs more reasonable for research/building, and implement a better way to acquire the mutagen. I just do not believe this. If you can make payers pay once and get away with it, you will do it again and again. They are a company that needs to make money to make investors happy. And just do not forget they can and very like will gate future research behind the Hema. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)cjdreadful Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 Makin it rain in the derelict. Grinding is addicting. Your either addicted to the grind or your the gotta have it now type and will pay with plat. It's only 225p. You can make that in a few days trade if you know what your doing. DE will continue to exploit this because it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toafarmer Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 3 hours ago, Jaysus41 said: All I can do is voice my disdain for the incorrect course of action and vote with my wallet. I haven't bought much platinum recently, but I don't expect to buy any more in the future unless my faith is restored. Fix your mistake Steve, both of them! This. I got a few 75% and I ignored them all. I also decided I won't buy the next fat Prime Access. Maybe I'll buy the skins, but this is yet to be decided. Most likely I will just not give them a dime. Wallets are the most OP weapon on every game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JyuDragon Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 Last time I checked, our clan needed another 22,800 samples, meaning so far we have contributed 27,200 samples, and I guess we only have 30 players active daily, so yes its a grind, but then what isn't a grind in WarFrame, whilst farming common relics in straightforward, RNG is a *@##$ when it come to Rare Relics, and once you have the rare relic and refined it, RNG again when you open it. Warframe is a grind end of story, no guaranteed rewards, except on alerts, although sometimes even alert is stacked against you, like the blue potato alert i did last night. 50 infested spawning in 8 mins, how the hell are you meant to survive without LS. With both resource boosters, a 40min ODS run solo yields around 80 samples, a good squad with couple of nekros using boosters could yield around 200 each for a 40 min run. So DE want players to spend platinum, but Warframe is F2P. I rarely buy plat, instead i farm prime parts and sell them for plat. I sold an ember set and a frost set, i bought the Nidus bundle, so I know Hema is no worth the research cost, but I am still doing sample farms and contributing to my clan's research. Maybe next weekend will be a double resources weekend. bottomline is either buy Hema or bite the bullet and research Hema. Life is not fair, so why should a game be either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteMarker Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 And spaming topics is not the way to go. Go and post in one of the other topics... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABAL Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 (edited) You are mysteriously, (or, rather, suspiciously) excluding the surface area from your "calculations". If you consider all the players desperately trying to grind some, it is truly a downpour on the statistics server. Edited January 21, 2017 by LABAL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilvaDreams Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 17 minutes ago, Reifnir said: Cool. Now imagine you have 4 people who can actively contribute to Sample farm (600 samples per 20-wave ODD) in a Storm clan and rejoice at the prospect of repeating that 4-man, booster-equipped 20-wave ODD run 80+ times. More, if you don't use boosters. For one mastery-fodder grade weapon. That, or you'll have to kick people out because they don't farm and hire new "farmhands". Not sure where you are getting that the Hema is MR-fodder. It's essentially an infested Soma, learn to aim and it chews things up at sortie levels but it is best paired with a high HP frame like Inaros or Nidus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesyol Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 Ok, after a year of playing Warframe it's finally time to take a break from it. Of course it's not only because of Hema, there is just nothing to do in the game after certain level. But before all this situation I at least thought DE is a nice company with some good ideas, I wanted to see what new updates will bring. And they managed to ruin their good reputation in my eyes. The main problem is not Hema cost, it's how they are not even trying to find solution that will be good for everyone, they can't even admit their mistakes. I was already quite irritated by that, when they didn't listen to anyone about making Vault pack for accessories. And now this and that cyst, and charger and bugs... As a paying customer I have only few ways to act against this - stop paying and playing. I really hope I will want to return later and see if things changed for the better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoomFruit Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 (edited) 6 hours ago, Magnar21 said: DE confirmed that the research costs are not a mistake, are intended, and will not be changed. Going forward, however, they will try to keep costs more reasonable for research/building, and implement a better way to acquire the mutagen. Which is, of course, a completely blatant lie. They said the exact same thing about the knux and the sibear. And everyone saying "herp derp just plat out for it" doesn't get the problem here. If you spend plat on it, you're telling them that "yes, I approve of this particular money-grab, I will support your decision to turn up the grind by giving you money". That's completely the wrong message to send. Edited January 21, 2017 by DoomFruit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vermitore Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 18 minutes ago, Hesyol said: Ok, after a year of playing Warframe it's finally time to take a break from it. Of course it's not only because of Hema, there is just nothing to do in the game after certain level. But before all this situation I at least thought DE is a nice company with some good ideas, I wanted to see what new updates will bring. And they managed to ruin their good reputation in my eyes. The main problem is not Hema cost, it's how they are not even trying to find solution that will be good for everyone, they can't even admit their mistakes. I was already quite irritated by that, when they didn't listen to anyone about making Vault pack for accessories. And now this and that cyst, and charger and bugs... As a paying customer I have only few ways to act against this - stop paying and playing. I really hope I will want to return later and see if things changed for the better If your main concern is endgame, the Hema should play no role in your decision. In fact, there is something disingenuous about all these posts portraying the Hema decision as some kind of grave transgression against fundamental human values and dignity. Like the Hema matters, hah! DE is a nice company with a lot of good ideas, beset by people who want instant and easy gratification. That is why we have no difficult content presently that requires the remotest amount of planning, skill and expertise to overcome. That, and for whatever reason DE seems preoccupied with vapid things like fashion frame. I suppose it sells. I guess that's something which it has in common with the Hema, but you don't see droves of people complain about the cost of the latest 'Unicorn Testicles Strewn Across Neon Chopping Board' syandana that we see an iteration of fortnightly. I digress. No solution will be good for everyone. Assuredly not one solution will please every player, developer, shareholder and stakeholder. Not. One. So, let's see. Things are bad because you can't have an easy infested pulmonary bagpipe, because there was some cyst which they promptly released a cure for after the novelty wore off, a boring infested sack of spores tamagotchi and some vault packs you don't have to buy. Clearly your lot in life is most tragic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoomFruit Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 1 hour ago, SilvaDreams said: Kicking them is an option, it's your own personal hang up otherwise if only two play occasionally. All my friends stopped playing so I kicked them and disbanded my clan and moved on to another, sometimes you just have to put your big boy pants on. It doesn't sound like you have many friends. Actual friends, not the perversion of the term that Facebook et al have created. Actual friends don't kick each other out of the group simply because some beancounter set an exorbitant price for a mastery trash item. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotallyLagging Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 Back then we had to suffer through AW defense to get weapons, now they're sold on syndicates and nobody complained. We're just glad we don't have to touch the gamemode anymore. Really, if all new players had to suffer the same stuff that old players went through the game would be in ruin. What, so Infested Salvage should have the same buggy spawn because it would be unfair to players that grinded the buggy mess? Should people start farming Vay Hek beacons again? Should Mutalist Salad beacons only drop on random invasions? I don't mind the grind, I mind the fact that they're extremely out of touch with their own game right now and the fact that they decided to set a place as a designated farming spot instead of fixing Eris' drop rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoomFruit Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 8 hours ago, TARINunit9 said: So I made this thread asking for all parties, including the devs, to negotiate instead of hurl demands What negotiation? The core of the problem for the playerbase is the gargantuan resource cost (12x the cumulative cost of EVERYTHING to date). What we want is the cost brought in line with the other researches. How is there supposed to be any kind of negotiation there? Your first post mentioned some kind of understanding. About the only thing I understand here is that DE continues to turn up the grind and that I, my clanmates and everyone else that I know who might possibly have an interest in this game (for instance, I've already told my brother to stay well clear) should perhaps find something else to do which doesn't feel like a second job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Husla Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 Took me two years to get 4k samples. Don't worry guys, I've got this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizodd Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 (edited) On 1/19/2017 at 9:44 AM, Naskoni said: ...Given their podcast immediately after the last dev stream its working as Rebecca was so proud to announce that now as many Hemas were bought as were crafted. It's on purpose and that's why it's staying. It has absolutely nothing to do with "honouring" anybody nor is it about promoting more clan cooperation. It's simply about making more plat out of new content and especially about doing so with people that have played for far too long and have too many resources. I had my suspicions and have voiced them in the past but people are often labeled "tin foil hat conspiracists" when they read between the lines and find the truth. Unfortunate to see [DE] has confirmed my suspicions. Edited January 21, 2017 by Tizodd typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElocFreidon Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 Devs shouldn't worry so hard about how easy it is for grinders and veterans to acquire things. Otherwise it alienates everyone including the grinders from getting something legit in game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunstray Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 58 minutes ago, WhiteMarker said: And spaming topics is not the way to go. Go and post in one of the other topics... At least the op is making an effort of differentiating his take on this mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlerift Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 The problem with the Hema has never truly been the cost but the way that the costs scale discretely rather than linearly. It was clear from the outset that they weren't going to lower the cost because that would enrage some of those who had already bought it. Y'all have been pushing for the wrong solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vermitore Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 2 minutes ago, Tizodd said: I had my suspicious and have voiced them in the past but people are often labeled "tin foil hat conspiracists" when they read between the lines and find the truth. Unfortunate to see [DE] has confirmed my suspicions. The suspicion being that DE's commercial success depends on motivating people to buy things which they can acquire for free, at a greater time and effort investment? I don't think that's ever been a mystery. And yes, promoting clan co-operation is a valid and reasonable secondary aim they have had. They wanted to introduce an incentive to spend money on the game, but they had the tact and decency to do so in a way that furthers some auxiliary, non-monetary goal as well. And yes, it did increase co-operation, did it not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilvaDreams Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 11 minutes ago, DoomFruit said: It doesn't sound like you have many friends. Actual friends, not the perversion of the term that Facebook et al have created. Actual friends don't kick each other out of the group simply because some beancounter set an exorbitant price for a mastery trash item. I wouldn't know, I've avoided the cesspools that are social media sites since they first popped up. And like I said not long after that post I actually talk to them outside of the game, so they know already. They quit and weren't going to come back and I didn't want to run a solo guild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volinus7 Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 (edited) You don't play warframe, Warframe plays you. ...like a damn fiddle... Edited January 21, 2017 by Volinus7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GKDK Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 That's the way the cookie crumbles. My money will also be raining, but too bad raining on other games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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