Coming Soon: Weapon Balance Pass.

[WeirdoPepsiDude]

I disapprove of these changes to the Simulor and will never understand the communities hate for raw efficiency in a game that to me is about always striving for a more optimal strategy for every situation. 

[-TSA-warramssie]

6 minutes ago, Khlamydia said:

While your at it, can you take a strong look at the bows & sniper rifles in the game? They fall off in damage super quick against armored high level mobs and the only way to get anything close to usable out of them seems to be either going entirely crit or bleed stacks(along with waiting) to ludicrous levels which isn't exactly fun. Both of them just have an impossible task of trying to be anywhere close to as fast and efficient as the rifles, shotguns, and other crazy weapons of Warframe past level 60 content.

maybe use Harkonar Scope If u cannot keep your combo multi up on sniper rifles.. as for bows there is not a single slash based weapon in the game which scales as hard as the Dread... but you are right: either its instantly a red crit headshot which procs bleed and you win but you still have to wait for it to go down,  or its only a normal crit bodyshot with the wrong status applied and it doesnt even even tickle a high lvl armored enemy ... its as of these reasons those weapons are skill based ones and only practice makes you deadly with them

[WatchW0lf]

so depending on these answers there may be a whole lot of mass exodus from this game.

to the telos nerf

  does it still break boxes threw walls?

  what is the cd on the "push and pull" effect?

  will the push pull proc slash?

  does the cd change with attack speed?

  can u still break bombard/napalm rockets?

  what part of the dual mechanic will break them if so?

  is the cd action based like x attacks till reactivated or time based?

  does reach effect the push pull?

to other things.

why are you nerfing things before implementing solid ui changes. at the very least telos required coding changes and not just number tweeks. Will we also be getting improved tooltips and proper stat representation for things like punch threw, reach, or maybe hidden stats like the Zars explosive particles? This was the same issue with the secura lecta nerf while the mutagen sample fiasco was going on. You are nerfing things when other things need to be fixed. you are constantly killing your mid game while completely ignoring your end game (or lack there of). JV is still bugged to hell with a 20% chance of becoming uncompletable. There is still no reason to do endless missions even tho that is your true endgame. So many things are wrong and yet you nerf things that make the midgame grind less hell, causing and even larger rift between the hideous new player experience and late game death gods. I have every frame, nearly every weapon, and I have to test everything because the wiki is wrong 30-40% of the time. stats that should be listed are not. This is just like the secura lecta nerf or the rumbler "fix" for jv you "fix" the solutions and leave the problems intact. We have no endgame and buggy raids, heaven forbid people have nice things tho. Oh and we still don't have universal vacuum, there is that too. This in many ways parallels the fall of Firefall. Player found solutions to problems were removed and the bugs and issues those solutions fixed were left to fester and rot. please DE don't die like Red5, fix things before you nerf their soft fixes

[RacerDelux]

To those who complain about the nerfs - they were OVER POWERED. If you are unable to play this game with the crutch of an over powered weapon.... you should learn quickly.

To think that the weapons nerfed here were NOT overpowered would simply be ignorant.

There are tons of good weapons in warframe, why not try them out.

Also - if the self damage on the tonkor is going to stop you from using it, get good. I have been using the penta for a while. It is fun and challenging. Self damage is a balancing factor, not a "do not use this weapon" factor.

[danitot]

6 forma tonkor: barely used lately, but still feels like there will be no more reason to use it, Just like penta. Or ogris. Or zarr. Or launchers because the self damage: a downed teammate is not a good teammate.
Simulors? that thing was barely useful against armored targets... The only thing that was a good choice against the hated corpus.

Back in the days I used these, but I left them behind, because using them felt a bit boring.
I wasn't using them, and still had the choice to use or not. And I was happy.

Telos Boltace? I'm curious about the new mechanics and I'm pretty sure, its gonna be a piece of cr@p. I loved that thing for the latest bandaid mod (relentless combination), or with a easy-loot build.

Imho, the popular and so called "OP" weapons should not receive a nerf, but the old fodders should get the buffs/changes.
Popular things are popular, because they are fun/good/effective to use, and not because they are crying out for a nerf.(*cough*ash4*cough*)
I am a diehard warframe fan. I love to learn how can you turn things effective thus making them fun..
But with every nerf, I can see the developers taking the fun away step by step.

Also, primed example how the current riven system sucks.
I like the idea of being able to obtain a mod that gives me multiple random stats.
If all the weapons would be balanced the rivens could be all "neutral" and still give a chance for a better setup.
Don't get me wrong, I dont think every weapon should oneshot the whole game, but I expect a weapon with 6 polarity+potato to be viable for some kind of meta.
Thats the reason, why players keep doing the same mission over and over and over. We love to see that our weapons shred through hordes of enemies after the proper amount of care of that weapon.
Warframe is a grindfest. If developers take the fun/efficient part of the game, it's gonna lose the playerbase on a faster rate.
3 months passed and we barely had content this year.

Scaling is bad, nerfing is worse.
(Apologize if my thoughts are a bit inconsistent)

[proanigame]

5 hours ago, clemza said:

What does that means ?

It already does 10% critical chance.

It will be 15% or 5% i don't get it :D

 

its being added so it would be 5 on top of what it had, so if it had 10 then it will now have 15.

Edited March 22, 2017 by proanigame

[Pieguy]

Being an avid user of the Ogris these changes seem nice, but the biggest change it needs is the ability for the rockets to go through allies.  One person bullet jumping or walking too close in my way equals instant death with the high base damage of the Ogris.

[RawGritz]

GLAIVE love??!!?

All that and we still have the clunky swing-before-throw mechanic for a weapon that's main function is to be thrown for maximum damage?! Dang, DE! Come on.

Edited March 22, 2017 by RawGritz

[(XBOX)CannyJack]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)nyo13 said:

Finally no more noobmulors!!! 

Let's not get ahead of ourselves here. It may take them some time to realize it's not working like it used to. 

7 minutes ago, ShadowFox14 said:

I just don't understand that so many people cried/cry because others use strong weapons so they can kill faster, and that limits their gameplay. Now those weapons are about to get nerfed, which means that people who used those weapons will have their gameplay limited. Am I wrong?

Nope, not wrong at all. Like I said, it's just a matter of weighing the importance of one group's fun against the other's. Simulor/Boltace/Tonkor people -- or rather, the people who want those weapons to remain unchanged -- lost out on that one.

Personally, of the three, I have only the Tonkor and I really don't like it. The changes make it somewhat more interesting to me, but I'm mostly a "guns are things that shoot bullets" person so Braton, Latron, Soma, etc...those are my primaries of choice. 

[BloodReaperWolf]

5 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Glaxion

The Ice Beam weapon: the Glaxion. Probably one of the most exciting weapons to imagine in combat, yet it has received a cold reception.

• Cold Damage has increased to 333 from 250.
• The rate at which ammo is consumed has been decreased.
• Increased the Accuracy of the Glaxion.
• Reduced the range from 30 meters to 24 meters

I love all of this but where in game does it say the glaxion currently does 250 cold damage?

[00zau]

Just now, Kransis said:

Hitting a marked target only.

That means nothing to me. I understand that it gets "Critical chance increased by 50% on [marked] targets." I'm asking how that increase interacts with mods. Say I have point strike on my Buzlok, giving 150% increased crit, for 37.5% crit chance. Does that 50% increased crit stack additively with point strike, giving me 200% increased crit, for 45% crit chance? Is it multiplicitive/increase the base crit chance, meaning I get 15% *1.5 *2.5 for 56.25% crit? Is it a flat crit bonus like maiming strike, giving me 50 + 37.5 = 87.5% crit chance?

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

5 hours ago, Cyborg-Rox said:

YES, YES, ALL MY YES!!!

Let's get ready, guys and gals!

On a side note though, no buff to Tiberon?

Mmaann, guess I'm just going to have to hope it get's one with it's Prime variant.

[4ldrago23]

Still no glaive prime buff

[Grimden.]

Maybe i'll jump back in the game and dust off my ogris and Attica

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

Just now, 00zau said:

That means nothing to me. I understand that it gets "Critical chance increased by 50% on [marked] targets." I'm asking how that increase interacts with mods. Say I have point strike on my Buzlok, giving 150% increased crit, for 37.5% crit chance. Does that 50% increased crit stack additively with point strike, giving me 200% increased crit, for 45% crit chance? Is it multiplicitive/increase the base crit chance, meaning I get 15% *1.5 *2.5 for 56.25% crit? Is it a flat crit bonus like maiming strike, giving me 50 + 37.5 = 87.5% crit chance?

It most likely works the same way the Lanka does when fully zoomed in, wherein you just get a flat 50% Crit Chance bonus on top of the Lanka's 25%, automatically giving you 75% outside of Mods.

[Fallosssss]

OMG!!!

FINALY!

Thank you very much DE, you have done good job!

[Stokesy007]

Well that will teach me to sink hours worth of Kuva into a Riven or buy an expensive one.  Lesson learned!

Had multiple chances at multishot for my Simulor ...

[Epilogia]

7 minutes ago, (PS4)nyo13 said:

Finally no more noobmulors!!! 

Sorry but the changes they made to the Simulor is a buff, now not only Mirages will use the Simulor but everyone else, because you only need 3 balls to make a vortex. The only difference is that you have to press MMB to make the vortexes explode to maximize damage output. Such a big deal, right? Now instead of Mirages, you might see more Volts and Nezhas sprinting across the map. Inb4 cries for Volt and Nezha nerfs because they rush through the mission too fast with their Simulors.

[00zau]

7 minutes ago, AnarchyBlast said:

I'm 100% with you mate! This kind of people are just too stupid... Nerfs in a mainly PVE game and people are actually celebrating like it's christmas eve. "This weapon is too overpowered" Stupid mentality in a PVE game imo. When are this kind of "overpowered" weapons that can deal with some high level enemies. If you think the game is too easy with this kind of weapons go kill a lvl 100 Corrupted Heavy Gunner with a Lato then, it might take you a while no? This or that weapon are too weak! Then just buff it buff leave the other good "end game" weapons alone. Let's see when will the slash damage tigris prime will be lowered to 10 per pellet or the crit chance of soma prime will be lowered to 5% (I know that i'm exagerating!).

So, what I'm saying is: Buff the weapons that need, don't nerf the others...

It's about power creep and dev time. Buffing 200 other weapons instead of nerfing a couple takes a lot more time, and just leads to more power creep. If every time something OP comes out, they buff everything instead of nerfing the outlier, then soon enough everything is OP and trivializes content.

And yes, PvE games still need balance. Player retention, for one thing. Make a game a cakewalk with any half decent setup and people won't keep on playing. If we power creep weapons up instead of trying to keep a consistent power level, then eventually you'll be able to clear all content with basic weapons with ease. An easy game gives no incentive to keep trying to upgrade your gear. Look at it from a monetary PoV; if every new player just gets a tonkor "'cause it's oh pee" and is the be all, end all of weapons, then what reason do they have to build more weapons (and buy weapon slots for them)?

[Cytobel]

Alright, I'm gonna lay this out as simply as possible:  I have an issue with self-damage weapons in Movement 2.0, and I almost never use the Tonkor as is.

Self-damage isn't a good thing.  In Warframe, with it's scaling enemies, we all too quickly find that weapons that can hurt us all too quickly cease killing foes, instead becoming just another hazard for us in mission.  The "git gud" arguement falls totally apart when we include enemies like Leapers and teleporting foes (or just those damn Grineer bunny legs), as any of those foes can very suddenly appear without warning well witin your "safe zone" and cause you to just DIE.  (Ospreys, you sneaky little S#&$s, I'm watching you)

I'm in no way against a nerf to the Tonkor.  I'm in no way a fan of self-damage.  It is the reason I don't use many launcher weapons EVER.  The Zarr is a notable exception due to the fact that I CAN (occasionally) switch to a not-painful method of killing my enemies (should I ever recall to) and thus may be the only weapon in the category to ACTUALLY fall within the "git gud" "logeek".

Sidenote:  My Buzlok and Paracyst are too of my favorite weapons, and I have some BEASTLY rivens for them as is.  Any "pain" I feel at the thought of more self-killing is QUICKLY replaced by the hot, throbbing joy of knowing these guns are gonna be BEASTLY!

[Budknap]

What a great way for DE to make more money.......Remember the thousands of cumulative Forma's that players have spent on Tonkor/Simulor.....   Well ha ha those are now useless,   Please buy more Forma from the store and repeat on some other weapon........ tell we nerf them...   LOL  

[Adam_Vulpes]

5 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Weapon Balance Pass.
 

As we near the staggering number of 300 weapons (including variants), the task of balancing grows increasingly daunting. At its core, Warframe is a co-operative game; having powerful tools is a boon to a team rather than a disadvantage. However, there are a few weapons that have such a dominating effect in missions that co-operative missions essentially become solo. Aside from the handful of dominating weapons, there are even more that have been overlooked.

[,,,]
We have buffed 10 underpowered weapons which have unique mechanics that have been overlooked due to their poor stats (!)

 

Note: it is not my intention to sound 'inflamatory'...

Look, some weapons have cool mechanics but in the current state of the game are totally useless. Let's take weapons like the Hind: you have a burst fire which is highly ineffecient against large groups of people, it punishes bad aiming and it's highly dependant on RNG to be effective (the burst has 5 shots, sometimes a target may only die with six bullets, which requires an entire second burst to be fired). The Panthera is pretty bad and it's capabilities to use a saw as a close-quarter combat weapon is a good idea, but highly irrelevant since melee weapons got that covered and way better, and the bounce from the main proyectile is so unpredictable that is not even worth it for AOE capabilities.
 

And the Buzlok. Oh God don't even get me started on that one. The weapon designer ever played a high level defense, interception or suvival mission? Does he or she really believe that you can sit still for a moment, locking a lvl 90 target and then releasing a lot of bullets while you receive a huge ammount of damage for doing so? The Buzlok was not 'overlooked', it is punishing for the player, it was used and then people threw it into the garbage can because it was useless. The Buzlok was used because it provided mastery rank. Most of these weapons were not 'overlooked', players made a choice to not play with the worst weapons you provide. Insted of nerfing competitive stuff, you should be buffing and revisiting mechanics. Don't treat the players as the ones that are the responsable for this, you are the developer and the players work with the tools you provide to them. This is gaming Semiotics 101. Obviously most people will take the path of least resistance.

Again, I did not tried to sound offensive. If somebody thinks this comment was rude: it was not my intention.

Edited March 22, 2017 by Adam_Vulpes
emphasis

[00zau]

Just now, Cytobel said:

Alright, I'm gonna lay this out as simply as possible:  I have an issue with self-damage weapons in Movement 2.0, and I almost never use the Tonkor as is.

Self-damage isn't a good thing.  In Warframe, with it's scaling enemies, we all too quickly find that weapons that can hurt us all too quickly cease killing foes, instead becoming just another hazard for us in mission.  The "git gud" arguement falls totally apart when we include enemies like Leapers and teleporting foes (or just those damn Grineer bunny legs), as any of those foes can very suddenly appear without warning well witin your "safe zone" and cause you to just DIE.  (Ospreys, you sneaky little S#&$s, I'm watching you)

I'm in no way against a nerf to the Tonkor.  I'm in no way a fan of self-damage.  It is the reason I don't use many launcher weapons EVER.  The Zarr is a notable exception due to the fact that I CAN (occasionally) switch to a not-painful method of killing my enemies (should I ever recall to) and thus may be the only weapon in the category to ACTUALLY fall within the "git gud" "logeek".

Sidenote:  My Buzlok and Paracyst are too of my favorite weapons, and I have some BEASTLY rivens for them as is.  Any "pain" I feel at the thought of more self-killing is QUICKLY replaced by the hot, throbbing joy of knowing these guns are gonna be BEASTLY!

Easy solution to self damage weapons: Self damage only uses base weapon damage, no mods. Boom, fixed. Base weapon damage is actually somewhat within the realm of warframe HP pools. With falloff, as long as you don't point blank yourself with an ogris shot in a no-shield loki, you'll live.

[(PSN)bullet1351]

Alot of this makes sense some of it doesn't.

The buffs are mostly good have to try them out but why increase the master requirement? Lots of players won't be mr6 at ceres for the miter and buzlock at mr9 makes no sense only a handful of weapons are past mr8 and they all earned those spots and soma will still be better in every way.

The nerfs tonkor yeah it was a long time coming stow your salt. The telos boltace is just confusing if you want to make it not murder everything in AoE just reduce the damage and not proc slash this just sounds clunky to use and not worth using and a cooldown makes even less sense. The visuals were bad you could just tone that down but no mention of that. The synoid simulor ok worth noting i use mirage and this will hurt the mirages everywhere. This makes the strategy of spamming the shots bad and instead you have to slow down and detonate them to get the same effect. I don't think this was that bad it just weeds out the lazy people, I don't mind using the alt fire. But the regular simulor was already bad so no it didn't need to be reduced as much.

We will have to see the final results but this is not finalized so leave some constructive feedback

[brewedjuice]

love the tonkor nerf. RIP boltace though. you will be missed.