The Problem With a Possible Dual Wield Feature and a Suggestion

[Music4Therapy]

The Problem With a Possible Dual Wield Feature:

In Dev Stream #90 it was brought up that they were considering allowing players to equip their 1 handed melee with their 1 handed secondary. This melee wouldn't be able to perform the combos given to them from their stance, they added. This is in response to that.

What does being able to dual wield add to the game that we already don't have? It seems to be purely aesthetic due to it seemingly not having any advantages over what we have now, the ability to quick melee. We still fire our secondary, we still quick melee. Only while dual wielding, we'll look cooler doing it.

That said, I have a proposal. There is an issue I and many other players run into that I believe can be resolved with a similar feature. Why not make a "quickdraw" or "quickfire" feature similar to the "quick melee" feature where we can quickly draw our secondary without having to fully equip it while we have our melee equipped? This would solve an issue in-game. Lets say you are playing Chroma, you live and die by your buffs. You are using Venka Prime, a weapon that is deadly up close but sacrifices range. A nullifier appears. If you had a weapon with range like any Polearms/Whip/etc..., you'd be able to destroy the bubble no questions asked without entering it. Venka Prime? Unless you want to risk losing your buff, you are going to swap to your Primary or Secondary, then back over to the Venka P once the Nullifier is disposed of. My proposal of adding a "quickdraw" feature would give you the option of pulling out your pistol and firing shots at reduced accuracy to destroy targets like Nullifier Bubbles from a range and minimizing the down-time.

Edited April 17, 2017 by Music4Therapy

[artemisfortune]

I imagine there will be some sort of combo system with the dual wield. Though you do pose a good point and a good idea.

Preferably I'd like to see the ability to equip whatever weapon into any 3 slots. Primary, Secondary, or Melee.

[Kalvorax]

1 minute ago, JSharpie said:

Preferably I'd like to see the ability to equip whatever weapon into any 3 slots. Primary, Secondary, or Melee.

that would add a ton of versatility to the game :D

[YUNoJump]

This is a great idea to improve game flow, I've thought about this before and the main thing I figured would get in the way is whether or not DE wants to evolve their (currently somewhat outdated) weapon system. Currently the system works like many other shooters: primary, secondary, quick melee without fully equipping, weapon switching is generally faster than a reload but not something to do at any random moment (Of course there's proper melee equipping too but that's just a modification of the standard system for Warframe).

A quick-secondary function would be very useful for the whole "synergy between gun and blade" system that the Tenno are supposed to fight with, but in order for it to happen, DE needs to think about evolving their equip system away from what it was back when Warframe was slower and more tactical. The fact that many enemies have anti-melee mechanics when the melee system is supposed to allow for using only melee in a mission is a clear indicator that being able to quickly switch to a gun would be really helpful. Also, it'd look cool as heck.

Naturally the other option is to just increase weapon switch speed like a lot of people have talked about, but this idea is much cooler and also keeps a bit of the "primaries are bigger and less versatile (eg cannot use while bleeding out or while holding stuff), in case DE wants to keep that as a thing.

[artemisfortune]

Just now, Kalvorax said:

that would add a ton of versatility to the game :D

Right? Imagine wielding a Nikana and having the Karyst as your quick melee. So now you deal the combos of the Nikana but can strip armor with a quick slash of the dagger. While carrying a bow for those long range moments, or a rocket launcher, automatic rifle, and pistol. The opportunities are endless.

[StinkyPygmy]

I think it will come with more significance then being purely aesthetic. That being said, I personally couldn't care less if it was purely aesthetic, it looks awesome (where as quick melee looks so silly to me, especially with anything that's not a dagger), it helps circumvent the slow equip speed that plagues the game, and it gives secondaries a new life and purpose. Giving them a sort of niche that primaries don't fill.

I'm not opposed to your idea though, but I'm so hyped for duel wielding. I've been suggesting it for years. I can't wait to go all assault marine on some grineer booty. All we need now is an actual chain sword.

[xXDeadsinxX]

33 minutes ago, JSharpie said:

I imagine there will be some sort of combo system with the dual wield. Though you do pose a good point and a good idea.

Preferably I'd like to see the ability to equip whatever weapon into any 3 slots. Primary, Secondary, or Melee.

Would be sick to have that.

[kyori]

Before they announce there will be new dual-wield stances.... for now it is all just for looking cool.

[xXRampantXx]

I'm only going to reply to one part of the OP:

45 minutes ago, Music4Therapy said:

What does being able to dual wield add to the game that we already don't have? It seems to be purely aesthetic due to it seemingly not having any advantages over what we have now, the ability to quick melee. We still fire our secondary, we still quick melee. Only while dual wielding, we'll look cooler doing it.

It seems to me like the idea is to give us the ability to have access to our melee combos (and possibly blocking and/or channeling and your any syndicate abilities your melee weapon might have) while also having access to the range from your primary.  I may be wrong here, this is just how I saw it.

[Music4Therapy]

32 minutes ago, xXRampantXx said:

I'm only going to reply to one part of the OP:

It seems to me like the idea is to give us the ability to have access to our melee combos (and possibly blocking and/or channeling and your any syndicate abilities your melee weapon might have) while also having access to the range from your primary.  I may be wrong here, this is just how I saw it.

They already stated that you wouldn't have access to your melee combos and I'm sure they won't allow your melee and secondary syndicate mods to work together. If you don't have access to your melee combos with your melee out, is that not just a glorified quick melee attack?

That is why I proposed a quick draw feature, so that you can have full access to your melee combos and some range. This would make Primed Reach less necessary. 

[xXRampantXx]

2 minutes ago, Music4Therapy said:

They already stated that you wouldn't have access to your melee combos and I'm sure they won't allow your melee and secondary syndicate mods to work together. If you don't have access to your melee combos with your melee out, is that not just a glorified quick melee attack?

Okay, if this is the case, than I agree, there is no point besides appearance, I only watched a little bit of the demonstration.  That being said, I'd still use it just for how cool it looks.

Edited April 17, 2017 by xXRampantXx

[TheChaotic1]

What I would like to see is duel weild stances for melee that merge your secondary and melee into one. No swapping between, no giving up combos because you have a whole animation set that includes using the secondary during attacks. 

[midtarget]

13 hours ago, JSharpie said:

I imagine there will be some sort of combo system with the dual wield. Though you do pose a good point and a good idea.

Preferably I'd like to see the ability to equip whatever weapon into any 3 slots. Primary, Secondary, or Melee.

Then equip twin Grakata, twin grakata, and twin grakata

[(PSN)Final_Dragon01]

4 minutes ago, midtarget said:

Then equip twin Grakata, twin grakata, and twin grakata

Your suggestion holds many similarities to a certain shotgun wielding overwatch character.

[Music4Therapy]

-

Edited April 18, 2017 by Music4Therapy

[Volinus7]

Quick fire button with crit timing while using existed melee stance

kinda like Phantasy star or FFVIII

[Ikusias]

I'm more interested in seeing the time invested in this used to fix the mess they made of all glaive weapons.

Due to the damn charging animation they are currently unusable.

And if they want a decent equip system, copy that from Fantasy Star Portable 1,2,3:

- you have two hands to equip with gear, you choose what to slot in each for each loadout

- you can carry rifles, heavy weapons, lauchers and bows with 2 hands;

- you can carry single melee + single secondary or dual melee or dual secondary/ 2 different secondary weapons

 

And when we will be able to split the dark Split Sword IN COMBAT?

[Xzorn]

it entirely depends how they implement it.

Melee as a damage source has become completely reliant on the combo counter and stance multipliers. Without making use of both I don't see it being much use but if you can perform stance combos while dual wielding this would make it superior to quick melee which I don't even do anymore since Blood Rush + Body Count.

[FireSegment]

19 hours ago, JSharpie said:

Right? Imagine wielding a Nikana and having the Karyst as your quick melee. So now you deal the combos of the Nikana but can strip armor with a quick slash of the dagger. While carrying a bow for those long range moments, or a rocket launcher, automatic rifle, and pistol. The opportunities are endless.

when i read your comment, Violence's combo of destreza+venka pop up to mind.

that being said, i would expect a lot of bugs if they even try to implement it. We would also need some new UI element on arsenal to choose which weapon main at wat too (which melee do quick melee and main melee, ...)

[artemisfortune]

Just now, FireSegment said:

when i read your comment, Violence's combo of destreza+venka pop up to mind.

that being said, i would expect a lot of bugs if they even try to implement it. We would also need some new UI element on arsenal to choose which weapon main at wat too (which melee do quick melee and main melee, ...)

No you wouldn't. You're over thinking it. Whatever weapon you had equipped last is your quick melee. So if I have a nikana, karyst, and glaive, and I had just fully equipped the glaive and now have the nikana, the glaive is now my quick melee, and the nikana is now my full melee. The only thing we would need is for a separate button for quick melee and full melee.

[Music4Therapy]

2 hours ago, JSharpie said:

No you wouldn't. You're over thinking it. Whatever weapon you had equipped last is your quick melee. So if I have a nikana, karyst, and glaive, and I had just fully equipped the glaive and now have the nikana, the glaive is now my quick melee, and the nikana is now my full melee. The only thing we would need is for a separate button for quick melee and full melee.

J, you got a lot of ideas. You should start making threads, we've talked about this before lmao

This thread is about adding a quickfire option to the game :P

Edited April 18, 2017 by Music4Therapy

[FireSegment]

2 hours ago, JSharpie said:

So if I have a nikana, karyst, and glaive, and I had just fully equipped the glaive and now have the nikana, the glaive is now my quick melee, and the nikana is now my full melee

they u would need to specify what "fully equip" is, does it count if u just enter then exit mod section of that weap, or do u need to switch from another weap that that weap to make it quick melee. In the other side, what u just did is use the order of equipping weapons to determine their roles, that count as another (hidden) UI element added for me (also, call me overthinking but i still see bugs creep out with that idea).

back to main topic (OP idea), im having problem imagine how weaps with alternative fire behave with the "quickraw" button, like should quanta shoot beam or cube? or should the alter fire being ban from the dual set up for simplicity

Edited April 18, 2017 by FireSegment

[Music4Therapy]

13 minutes ago, FireSegment said:

back to main topic (OP idea), im having problem imagine how weaps with alternative fire behave with the "quickraw" button, like should quanta shoot beam or cube? or should the alter fire being ban from the dual set up for simplicity

Not sure, maybe there can be a separate button for the alt-fire? All in all I feel being able to fire a secondary, especially with a short ranged melee equipped, would be amazing for taking out nullifiers without having to risk entering the bubble.

[midtarget]

15 hours ago, (PS4)Final_Dragon01 said:

Your suggestion holds many similarities to a certain shotgun wielding overwatch character.

I'm using this to explain the OP ness of having the ability to equip anything, like Opticor and ferrox at the same time, or something like that

[Drejzer]

I guess that the dual-wield would eliminate time wasted on holstering...