Shield Gating as a Mod

[(PSN)theelix]

What if DE made shield-gating, however perfect it needs to be balanced, usable, and suitable for low tier and high tier content, but created it as a mod? 

Would you accept it(be happy with it)? Why or why not? 

 

[Fliktor06]

No, because we are hurting to fit mods in our frames as it is.

[ComCray]

That would not be desirable. Having to sacrifice a mod-slot for this.

[Slaviar]

Most builds are already tight on mod space so I'd rather not see it happening.

[Tsukinoki]

I could see DE doing that.
Especially considering that there are currently 2 frames (and possibly more in the future) that don't have shields and this would be one ways to balance between frames that have shields being utterly incapable of being 1-shotted with shield gating while the frames without shields wouldn't have any of that protection and would be 1-shot.

[aligatorno]

Nope. It has to be an actual feature not a band-aid similar to mods like  Drifting Contact/Body count.

[Tsukinoki]

Just now, aligatorno said:

Nope. It has to be an actual feature not a band-aid similar to mods like  Drifting Contact/Body count.

And what about frames without any shields?  How would they be balanced against shield gating where the frames with shields are 100% unable to be killed in one hit while nothing at all stops the frames without shields from being killed in one shot.
There has to be some balance between the two.

[aligatorno]

2 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

And what about frames without any shields?  How would they be balanced against shield gating where the frames with shields are 100% unable to be killed in one hit while nothing at all stops the frames without shields from being killed in one shot.
There has to be some balance between the two.

There are two frames without shields as of right now. Inaros and Nidus, both with heavy tanking abilities and native health regeneration. They can't be one shotted unless you go to ridiculous levels. They already have a lot of advantages over other frames, it's not like you are gimping them. 

Edited May 10, 2017 by aligatorno

[Fliktor06]

1 minute ago, Tsukinoki said:

I could see DE doing that.
Especially considering that there are currently 2 frames (and possibly more in the future) that don't have shields and this would be one ways to balance between frames that have shields being utterly incapable of being 1-shotted with shield gating while the frames without shields wouldn't have any of that protection and would be 1-shot.

There's no real balance issue in this considering how tanky the no-shield frames are that will still survive MUCH better than a simple shield gating will provide.  The shield gating feature was probably intended to deal with self-damaging weapons.

[xXDeadsinxX]

It's an interesting idea but that wouldn't really work well with it as a mod instead of it being in the game.

[Kemokkoryuu]

Just now, Fliktor06 said:

There's no real balance issue in this considering how tanky the no-shield frames are that will still survive MUCH better than a simple shield gating will provide.  The shield gating feature was probably intended to deal with self-damaging weapons.

Inaros could use some tweaks to his sarcophagus before those are completely even, a bit of mobility in the mode to prevent enemies from just calmly walking away from him for one.

But indeed Nidus revolves around building stacks mechanically so as long as he is played "as intended" he effectively already has something akin to a more powerful but expensive method of surviving insta-death damage REPEATEDLY with fairly significant invul added too.

[(PSN)theelix]

7 minutes ago, aligatorno said:

There are two frames without shields as of right now. Inaros and Nidus, both with heavy tanking abilities and native health regeneration. They can't be one shotted unless you go to ridiculous levels. They already have a lot of advantages over other frames, it's not like you are gimping them. 

 

4 minutes ago, Fliktor06 said:

There's no real balance issue in this considering how tanky the no-shield frames are that will still survive MUCH better than a simple shield gating will provide.  The shield gating feature was probably intended to deal with self-damaging weapons.

There is a balance issue, as Shield Gating is meant to work at any level to prevent being one shot. Inaros would have to be factored in, since he can still be one shot, but Nidus has a better Undying passive, allowing him to ignore fatal damage one time with at least 15 stacks, as well as become invulnerable for 5 seconds. 

Inaros Undying passive allows him to revive himself, but I don't believe it's as useful. I haven't played Inaros much, and will be doing some testing right now. 

[Chewarette]

11 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

And what about frames without any shields?  How would they be balanced against shield gating where the frames with shields are 100% unable to be killed in one hit while nothing at all stops the frames without shields from being killed in one shot.
There has to be some balance between the two.

Well, Nidus and Inaros will simply get the same kind of thing... Natively or through the same mod. "Shield-gating" is the commercial name, you know, can be called "anti-one-shot crusade" if the word "Shield" bothers you so much.

As a mod, that would bother me. As an Exilus, that may be acceptable (even though I'm not that ready to forma all my warframes duh).

[Genitive]

1 minute ago, (PS4)theelix said:

Inaros Undying passive allows him to revive himself, but I don't believe it's as useful. I haven't played Inaros much, and will be doing some testing right now. 

His sarcophagus is a waste of time at higher levels.

[GLTHX]

No, unless it's about as good as Vitality survivability - wise, so that players could actually choose between them. And seeing as Redirection is simply weak with all these Slash and Toxin procs and no Armor protecting shields, I'd rather see Redirection or our shields buffed than yet another Mod.

[Hemmo67]

22 minutes ago, aligatorno said:

There are two frames without shields as of right now. Inaros and Nidus, both with heavy tanking abilities and native health regeneration. They can't be one shotted unless you go to ridiculous levels. They already have a lot of advantages over other frames, it's not like you are gimping them. 

all it takes is not have vitality in sorties and nidus/inaros falls to snipers or railgun moas

where as nidus and inaros need vitality to survive valkyr and the one who shall not be named (you know him) use steel fiber to prevent been oneshot why couldn't frames with shields use shield gating mod?

Edited May 10, 2017 by Hemmo67

[Jackviator]

No. Because it would just be yet another band-aid mod, and frankly, I'm kinda getting sick of band-aid mods at this point. Primed Regen, Harkonar Scope, Body Count, etc etc. Not to mention that in order to make Shields actually useful, one would have to invest in both Redirection and another mod, meaning that two mod slots would be used on your Warframe, which is usually starved for slots anyway.

They should just rework shields (aka actually fix the problem at its source) because if nothing else, there's no benefit to it being a mod, no good reason for it to be done like that.

Edited May 11, 2017 by Jackviator

[(XBOX)TheMadCash]

42 minutes ago, (PS4)theelix said:

What if DE made shield-gating, however perfect it needs to be balanced, usable, and suitable for low tier and high tier content, but created it as a mod? 

Would you accept it(be happy with it)? Why or why not? 

 

What exactly is Shield gating?

 

39 minutes ago, Fliktor06 said:

No, because we are hurting to fit mods in our frames as it is.

I never read a comment more true than this one.

[aligatorno]

2 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Cash201293 said:

What exactly is Shield gating?

 

I never read a comment more true than this one.

Shield gating stop enemies from oneshotting you  if you have shields up. Now, if an enemy shoots you with a high enough damage it will drain your shields and then your health from the same bullet. With shield gating, it will only drain the shields for that bullet and only the next one can affect your health. 

This is more against Snipers, Bombards, Techs, etc. 

Edited May 10, 2017 by aligatorno

[(PSN)theelix]

7 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Cash201293 said:

What exactly is Shield gating?

 

I never read a comment more true than this one.

Shield gating is the ability for high damages to be temporarily ignored as they pass through one form of your defense, in this case Shields. You gain a moment of invulnerability to stop further sources of instantaneous death. This ability is only activated once, and is thus put on a short, multistep cooldown.

Generally, it can't be activated more than once in a few seconds so that standing on a shield pad gives you permanent invulnerability and also cannot be activated again until your shields have been fully recharged. 

For an in-game example, I would suggest looking at Nidus' passive. He has the closest thing to shield gating in this game at the moment, though it requires that you work for it. 

Also, a very good forum post about it: 

 

Edited May 10, 2017 by (PS4)theelix

[bonamb]

IDEA.

Add another shield related effect along with the shield gate.So maybe shield regeneration, extra shield, or an aoe blast when you you hit the shield gate.

OR

Attach it to vigor.

I mean, who even uses vigor? But now you'll actually have a reason, plus it adds health and shield. Basically the ultimate survivability mod. 

[Vox_Preliator]

In a vacuum, on its own, I wouldn't mind it.  We've been doing alright without it for so long, having it as an option for frames that need it would be acceptable to me.

However, when viewing the history of the game as a whole, there's a trend of making buffs into mods instead of just buffing, which is, generally, not acceptable.  Were this history not here, and Combos had a default ten second or so window, Sentinels could be repaired with a gear item, etc. etc. I'd be saying a mod would be fine, but there isn't, so I'm not.

That said, making it as a mod would likely be the easiest method to prevent Gating from applying to enemies.

[(PSN)theelix]

1 minute ago, bonamb said:

-snip-

In all honesty, I made this thread not to propose the idea for DE to do it, but rather to try and spark the conversation now and warn DE against the idea. 

I thought about melee for a little bit, and how they approached the problem of the melee combo counter. Mod after mod of ways to increase its duration before timing out, and all it did was just add another mandatory mod to the table: Drifting Contact(Body Count 2.0) 

I remembered that they recently mentioned an idea for Shield Gating in a devstream, and feared that the same fate would become of Shield Gating: Another psuedo-mandatory mod to reduce our already crowded modding space. 

 

However, I would agree with an idea to additionally buff Vigor by adding a bonus to shield-gating within it. Assuming Shield gating is implemented as a global passive, and Vigor increased the invulnerability period or decreased the cooldown would give a very good reason to use the lackluster mod. 

[Zoretor]

What? Why?

Shield gating is conceptually a "rework", or a "redesign", of how shields work. It's not a "band-aid".

There is absolutely no logic or reason that would lead to shield gating being a mod.

[Last_Hope2299]

Shield gating for the warframes with shields, and a different mechanic for the ones without? Will that suffice?