Some basic concepts DE needs to understand

[Sennera]

5 minutes ago, ArbitUHM said:

But, that's like, the point. Your operator powers are situational because there are few things that your warframe can't deal with on its own. Your operator is meant to be played as a support character, and most of the focus powers are designed that way - they generate a passive buff, CC, or other such effect, then you immediately switch back to your warframe. There are a few powers that require you to remain in operator mode like the Unairu cloak ability, but by and large operator powers offer an effect that's best taken advantage of in warframe form. 

That's why I don't understand these complaints about "playing" as the operator. You don't really "play" as the operator. Even during a teralyst fight, I spend more time as my warframe because the amp has a significant charge time and it is beneficial to transform back into your warframe and kill the physical form of vomvalysts while the amp is charging. On a regular mission, if I'm void dashing every 30 seconds to keep up energizing dash, that's 1/30 = 3.3% of my time as operator, and that dash can be used to close the distance with enemies, dash into cover, knock over enemies, etc.

You're just reiterating my point on why operators don't fit currently. There's not much reason they shouldn't be in the game so long as they fit in the game, and right now they just don't fit. 

Edited October 17, 2017 by Sennera
Correcting autocorrect

[skinotik]

I personnaly don't mind the operator part.  They just need to make it better with more custom power and stuff.  PoE was a step in the good direction, but I think we still need a couple more step.

[(XBOX)PaoForbilliere]

1 hour ago, CuChulainnWD said:

I used it. Try it yourself. What so i need to prove?

 Use all 4 then void dash to replenish.

Every Vazarin user i talked to says you get 4 revives with your warframe and 4 with  your operator for a total of 8 at max rank and they don't replenish at all.

Edited October 17, 2017 by (XB1)PaoForbilliere

[Liminal]

17 hours ago, SordidDreams said:

WE DON'T WANT TO PLAY OPERATORS.

I do, but they need to be more fleshed out and useful. Only two attacks and two moves don't make them engaging. And ffs, they need to be able to kill things efficiently: remember their OP beam at the end of TSD? Now that felt like True Unleashed Tenno Power™.

17 hours ago, SordidDreams said:

WARFRAME IS AN EASY CASUAL GAME FOR CASUALS. 

Yes and no. The grind doesn't really say "casual". And I'd love for some challenge. Real challenge, not cheesy OHK and unfair mechanics. A real challenge is fun (and with different difficulties, it's fun for everyone), and abilities can be tuned to make us feel powerful without trivializing content. But to do that they'd need to rebalance the entire game, and a perfectly tailored experience is a lot of work. Work they don't intend to do obviously.

The problem is that DE seems to prioritize reducing player power (and I agree that it needs to be reduced in some cases) over making gameplay feel fair (which it doesn't). Ideally, they should do both.

Edited October 17, 2017 by The_Doc

[ArbitUHM]

8 minutes ago, BlackCoMerc said:

And that dash could have just been a Warframe ability. An upgrade/side grade to Slide, through Focus trees. No need for force the Operator to do it.

That's just it: the operator was never necessary. We want to play with our Frames.

It takes a paltry amount of time to void dash occasionally. You are not being kept from playing with your frame.

Who it to say what is "necessary"? It is a fantasy video game. Energizing dash could have been a mod, or an ability intrinsic to all warframes, or a plat only upgrade, or any number of things. This is the route DE decided to take it. If you don't like, that's fine, but declaring it "unnecessary" is pretty pointless.

9 minutes ago, Sennera said:

You're just reiterating my point on why operators don't fit currently. There's not much reason they shouldn't be in the game so long as they fit in the game, and right now they just don't fit. 

DE has created lore and gameplay mechanics that support operators, and they will continue to develop those mechanics and lore. Personally I find the concept of a sort of dual character to be pretty interesting and a good fit. 

[Prophet_007]

In my personal opinion i think that focus 2.0 should have remained the same as earlier. By this what i mean is that unlocking different abilities and all should have been through normal focus farming and not being locked away within the standings of the quills. Im ok with the operator customization, weapons and armor being with the quill. It would be very nice if that lock on the powers were removed though.

Edited October 17, 2017 by Prophet_007

[(XBOX)CannyJack]

17 hours ago, SordidDreams said:

I feel a lot of the changes in PoE are ultimately due to DE not understanding some key concepts about Warframe and its players. I'm going to try to explain them:

 

WE DON'T WANT TO PLAY OPERATORS. Simple as that. If anything, this update should have removed operators from the game, not shoved them down our throats even more. The Eidolon fight mechanics and the changes to Focus are very clearly designed to motivate players to use the operator, and by "motivate" I of course mean "force". Nobody plays operators because they enjoy it, they do it only for the shortest amount of time required. Why do you think the SD meta for the Eidolon fight spread so quickly? Because nobody wants to play operators. The fight is not fun, it's a tedious chore, an obstacle on the path to rewards. Is anybody going to continue playing it once they have all the rewards, just for the enjoyment of it? I seriously doubt it. Same thing with Focus. Need energy? Even die-hard defenders of the new system tell everyone to just press 5, ctrl+space, 5, i.e. spend as little time in operator mode as possible. Nobody wants to play operator. Nobody wants to play operator. Nobody. Wants. To. Play. Operator.

 

WARFRAME IS AN EASY CASUAL GAME FOR CASUALS. This is equally as important as the above, and it directly relates to the changes to Zenurik as well as the mechanics of the Eidolon fight. Previously I could have constant passive energy regen, which was great. I could run around spamming my abilities and slaughtering hordes of enemies with barely any effort. It was fantastic fun. Now I have to perform some convoluted button press combo every thirty seconds to maintain that energy regen. That is bad in and of itself, because it interrupts the flow of the game for no good reason, but it's especially bad in fights. When I'm fighting, I have other things to worry about than whether a little icon in the corner of my screen has disappeared. Killing grineers is fun, watching a little icon is not. Yet that's exactly what I'm now required to do if I want to continue killing, otherwise I find myself short on energy and forced to retreat to refill in safety. The game now requires more 'skill', if you want to call it that, but that's not a good thing. I play Warframe to unwind, not to get stressed out. If I wanted to spend my time on the edge of my seat watching cooldowns like a hawk, I'd play Dota 2.

 

I feel that every single terrible design decision made in PoE boils down to DE's failure to understand the two above points. Thank you for reading.

 

Hundred percent agreement one both points. I'd pay them a monthly subscription to have the option to completely disable the Operator; and I have no interest in playing against hard enemies. Warframe is about omnibrutalizing hordes of cannon fodder and then busting out space magic to omnibrutalize slightly tougher fodder.

[NightBlitz]

31 minutes ago, Prophet_007 said:

In my personal opinion i think that focus 2.0 should have remained the same as earlier. By this what i mean is that unlocking different abilities and all should have been through normal focus farming and not being locked away within the standings of the quills. Im ok with the operator customization, weapons and armor being with the quill. It would be very nice if that lock on the powers were removed though.

the locked powers are super easy to unlock, once you've done Saya's Vigil, all you have to do is go visit the Quills, no standing required to unlock the rest of the focus trees. and in the future, new players will likely have done Saya's Vigil long before TWW, so literally all they'd have to do is visit the Quills at that point.

that said, it doesnt really make sense why all the operator stuff is locked behind that, they could have made it just the Cross-passives.

[DrProfSirCarmen]

First off, don't speak for everyone because you don't, I do want to play as the operators an I do want more difficult content but more importantly I want them to be good so that everyone else will enjoy it. Since its evidently here to stay, rather then bullheadedly continuing to oppose its existence you should think of ways to improve it rather then ranting about its implementation being there every time they attempt it, it helps nothing, proves nothing and does nothing.

Your second point isn't even actually about difficulty, its more QoL if anything. Frankly, I don't understand this idea whatsoever, just because Warframe is more casually inclined doesn't mean there is no place for resource management or any kind of difficulty. There is a time and a place for "just casually killing Grineer and watching them going flying" and you know what, in those places resource management doesn't matter in the slightest. If you just wanna $&*^ around, the starmap is there, but the only place an actual attempt at resource management is necessary in the slightest is in places like extended runs, sorties or other high level content like kuva floods. There is already a distinction between more casual things and more difficult things in the game you just fail to understand it and want to try and force your way of viewing and playing Warframe on others and then have the gall to act like you're the voice of the community.

Its unfortunate that this is what is the hottest thread on feedback right now because its not feedback, its a rant. Some of the discussion that has cropped up around it has been good and productive, interesting perspectives to consider like how it doesn't match up to how dangerous void energy should be and how Operators are good in the support role or how some of these powers shouldn't require changing into another mode to access; but that doesn't change that this only exists as a rant rather then productive feedback because you know what? They almost certainly won't take your feedback seriously when you talk like this and with an OP like that all of the good suggestions and feedback here are just going to be skimmed over completely.

Edited October 17, 2017 by DrProfSirCarmen
another paragraph.

[Prophet_007]

25 minutes ago, NightBlitz said:

the locked powers are super easy to unlock, once you've done Saya's Vigil, all you have to do is go visit the Quills, no standing required to unlock the rest of the focus trees. and in the future, new players will likely have done Saya's Vigil long before TWW, so literally all they'd have to do is visit the Quills at that point.

That's the fun bit. With the arrival of PoE the system specs needed to play the plains have been changed somehow and the game crashes everytime I try to access the plains. Apparently PoE cant be run on low end PC and when i say low end....reallllyyyyy low end(geforce210 2gb gpu and a pentium processor)...Guess what that means for me..no operator, no new abilities or even gara. LMAO!!...I thought i was the only person  with the same issue but there were others too (dedicated to play the game even at low end pc's) that faced this rather traumatic experience. Now what happened is im playing warframe as it was before second dream which is a major setback for me.

Two solutions:

1.either buy a new pc or upgrade the existing one(which id do if i could afford to)

2.some magic happens and DE would be kind enough to optimise it by taking into consideration all those potato pc's out there

Thus the reason for me saying the powers atleast should have been available as earlier.

Edited October 17, 2017 by Prophet_007

[-Temp0-]

4 hours ago, Fallen_Echo said:

I need to point out what the previous guy thinks of "skillfull" gameplay is basically how limbo operates. You go up to a target hit him as long as you please, enter rift when danger comes, leave it and continue attacking, rinse and repeat.

Figured as much.

Just because mechanics is somewhat new doesn't make something take skill out of nowhere. And it's not exactly that new either

Quote

an I do want more difficult content

There will not be any difficult content in warframe, there was none so far and there won't be any unless you just replace warframe with emo *** entirely - funny how many games that have pve even as a side option make it more difficult than warframe to boot. The only thing you'll ever get is another giant time/grindwall. Having to burst 1500 shields down IS NOT DIFFICULT. It's only time consuming. And it's NOT rewarding. Sentients literally do no drop anything worth getting and neither does the Quills. 

The most idiotic things about operators update that you can't even buy your way out of this with annihilation of SD because you can't even buy an okey-ish amp. It's not diffcult. It's something that makes you not want to play and regret all the money spent on this game and ever playing it. Because that's the only big update you got in so long and many people either don't want to play it or not enjoying it. Nothing in this makes sense.

Edited October 17, 2017 by -Temp0-

[NightBlitz]

13 minutes ago, Prophet_007 said:

That's the fun bit. With the arrival of PoE the system specs needed to play the plains have been changed somehow and the game crashes everytime I try to access the plains. Apparently PoE cant be run on low end PC and when i say low end....reallllyyyyy low end(geforce210 2gb gpu and a pentium processor)...Guess what that means for me..no operator, no new abilities or even gara. LMAO!!...I thought i was the only person  with the same issue but there were others too (dedicated to play the game even at low end pc's) that faced this rather traumatic experience. Now what happened is im playing warframe as it was before second dream which is a major setback for me.

Two solutions:

1.either buy a new pc or upgrade the existing one(which id do if i could afford to)

2.some magic happens and DE would be kind enough to optimise it by taking into consideration all those potato pc's out there

Thus the reason for me saying the powers atleast should have been available as earlier.

its kinda funny, i play on my laptop which is 3 years old, but its by no means a gaming laptop, in fact, my only graphics card is the integrated intel one tho i do have 8g ram, so i end up playing the game at 15-20 fps, yet the only issue i have with the plains and cetus is how freaking long it takes to load into one from the other, well, besides the fact that i get 5-10 fps in cetus due to the number of players there. personally id love to upgrade to a gaming laptop, but i dont have the money atm, as I'm a full time student in college.

[Tzarl]

I one hundred percent disagree with both points.

Quote

WE DON'T WANT TO PLAY OPERATORS. "

I do. Please don't presume to speak for the entire playerbase, or even a majority of it They aren't being "shoved down our throats", and as far as endgame systems go it's very inoffensive how often you have to use operators, which is almost never. I feel there's a subset of players who don't like operator gameplay and that group can be divided into those who dislike the whole thing and those who think it's been implemented poorly and don't like those past/current iterations of it. If you're part of the former, then suggesting alternatives to operator mode would be infinitely more constructive, and if you're part of the latter giving suggestions for how to improve it is the way to go.

It's clear transference isn't going anywhere, so it's way more realistic to say what PARTS of being an operator bother you and what changes to it would make it more tolerable for you, rather than just saying it's "shoved down our throats". How *specifically* is it being shoved down out throats. Do you think we have to use it too much? Would you prefer less instances where we have to use it, down from two specific instances to one, or not at all? Do you dislike how squishy they are, or think they're too sluggish? Maybe give suggestions for ways to change it into something you might like to use instead of suggesting they scrap an endgame system that's been delevoped and implemented for years now.

Quote

WARFRAME IS AN EASY CASUAL GAME FOR CASUALS

This seems to actually just be a complaint about the new zenurik energy regen vs the old. I don't think that "warframe is an easy casual game for unwinding" is a good justification for reverting to old energy overflow. By that logic, why have enemy levels past 20 at all? Why have mission fail states at all. Just say "I don't like how convoluted the new system is to gain energy".

It's my opinion that making an energy bubble is not all that demanding or challenging, and that you can still have a casual unwinding experience without it if it really is too hard:

• Hotkey energy pizzas; they're not exorbitantly costed and you can spam those for stress-free energy.
• Don't play higher level missions where you might actually need the constant flow of energy if you're looking for a no-challenge experience.
• Just use the other zenurik passive, which even by itself drastically improves energy economy through picking up orbs, which you can do stress free using a sentinel's vacuum.

[Awazx]

44 minutes ago, DrProfSirCarmen said:

Since its evidently here to stay, rather then bullheadedly continuing to oppose its existence you should think of ways to improve it(...)

The only way to improve operators:

1. Stay inside the Warframe and do not bother. I just want to see him sitting in the ship's chair.

2. Focus skills affect the Warframe only.

[-Temp0-]

Quote

They aren't being "shoved down our throats", and as far as endgame systems go it's very inoffensive how often you have to use operators, which is almost never

Exactly. Yet they have so much for them going on especially focus that you begin to ask yourself what game you're playing. New focus is dedicated entirely to them. Nothing in the new one is for warframes that is worth even having as in not worth spending an ungodly amount of focus into 1-2 passives if you have to farm it right now.

I thought it was warframe but apparently now it Sims.

Quote

 

The only way to improve operators:

1. Stay inside the Warframe and do not bother. I just want to see him sitting in the ship's chair.

2. Focus skills affect the Warframe only.

 

^

Do not freaking bother players with them. Have them to look pretty and make quests/lore - no one cares, you can make everything about them from stroy persepctive from that point. But that's about it.

Edited October 17, 2017 by -Temp0-

[BlackCoMerc]

Just now, -Temp0- said:

Exactly. Yet they have so much for them going on especially focus that you begin to ask yourself what game you're playing. New focus is dedicated entirely to them. Nothing in the new one is for warframes that is worth even having as in not worth spending an ungodly amount of focus into 1-2 passives if you have to farm it right now.

I thought it was warframe but apparently now it Sims.

Exactly. Months of work...maybe years...and nothing in the update us for WARFRAME. It's all for Crippled Emo Kid Sim.

Shame, really. The open world us cool. Maybe if they hadn't been so worried about the children, we might have gotten more than 4 repeating missions to do in it.

[OniDax]

18 hours ago, SordidDreams said:

I feel a lot of the changes in PoE are ultimately due to DE not understanding some key concepts about Warframe and its players. I'm going to try to explain them:

 

WE DON'T WANT TO PLAY OPERATORS. Simple as that. If anything, this update should have removed operators from the game, not shoved them down our throats even more. The Eidolon fight mechanics and the changes to Focus are very clearly designed to motivate players to use the operator, and by "motivate" I of course mean "force". Nobody plays operators because they enjoy it, they do it only for the shortest amount of time required. Why do you think the SD meta for the Eidolon fight spread so quickly? Because nobody wants to play operators. The fight is not fun, it's a tedious chore, an obstacle on the path to rewards. Is anybody going to continue playing it once they have all the rewards, just for the enjoyment of it? I seriously doubt it. Same thing with Focus. Need energy? Even die-hard defenders of the new system tell everyone to just press 5, ctrl+space, 5, i.e. spend as little time in operator mode as possible. Nobody wants to play operator. Nobody wants to play operator. Nobody. Wants. To. Play. Operator.

 

WARFRAME IS AN EASY CASUAL GAME FOR CASUALS. This is equally as important as the above, and it directly relates to the changes to Zenurik as well as the mechanics of the Eidolon fight. Previously I could have constant passive energy regen, which was great. I could run around spamming my abilities and slaughtering hordes of enemies with barely any effort. It was fantastic fun. Now I have to perform some convoluted button press combo every thirty seconds to maintain that energy regen. That is bad in and of itself, because it interrupts the flow of the game for no good reason, but it's especially bad in fights. When I'm fighting, I have other things to worry about than whether a little icon in the corner of my screen has disappeared. Killing grineers is fun, watching a little icon is not. Yet that's exactly what I'm now required to do if I want to continue killing, otherwise I find myself short on energy and forced to retreat to refill in safety. The game now requires more 'skill', if you want to call it that, but that's not a good thing. I play Warframe to unwind, not to get stressed out. If I wanted to spend my time on the edge of my seat watching cooldowns like a hawk, I'd play Dota 2.

 

I feel that every single terrible design decision made in PoE boils down to DE's failure to understand the two above points. Thank you for reading.

I want to play as Operator, but as a sorta Jedi-like Operator based on the Focus school descriptions, which suggest a different type of gameplay than the current Operator system, namely a melee-focused gameplay with different types of weapons/attacks. Unairu is defensive, Zenurik is like heavy weapons and overwhelming force, Madurai is like fast, savage, unrelenting attacks (so, daggers, dual daggers, glaives, etc), Naramon is like patient, stealthy attacks with weapons that can target enemy weak points and maybe with the use of poisons and elements to degrade the enemy (tacticians "knowing the enemy"), and Vazarin is the balanced one that can block and parry and counter the enemy. If they'd make the Operator system fundamentally better, and not based on the current mechanics (so, tear down the Operator system like they did Focus), then I'd be very much interested in the Operator system.

[KennBone]

18 hours ago, Mewvg2 said:

I'd rephrase the second point as Warframe is a power fantasy game, not exactly a challenging hardcore experience. If you want the challenge turned up to eleven, you can easily remove power from your character (ie uninstalling mods, using basic weapons).

i read every day ppl saying same but hey i see   MR 24 with end game geared die in sorties, POE, survivals , defense normal misions. so..

[DrProfSirCarmen]

10 minutes ago, Awazx said:

The only way to improve operators:

1. Stay inside the Warframe and do not bother. I just want to see him sitting in the ship's chair.

2. Focus skills affect the Warframe only.

Nice to see the point went over your head and across the sky. If you're going to be this stubborn about it then its your own problem and while I respect that it's your opinion, I don't think its a very useful one. Just try and think of a way that you could actually enjoy the operators as a separate entity from the waframe but if you want to stay in the past then don't be surprised when you get left behind.

[-Temp0-]

46 minutes ago, davej83 said:

i read every day ppl saying same but hey i see   MR 24 with end game geared die in sorties, POE, survivals , defense normal misions. so..

Dying doesn't equal something being hard. You can die just because you fired Lenz up close or was one shotted by a Bombard because you though that Loki "iz fine" in toxin enchantment survival of lv 100.

And mrs 20+ doesn't equal being good either or always bringing top gear on a mission too.

And while some die in those places others do survivals/defense with enemies of lv 1000+. While in other games majority of people can't handle even 10-20 waves in endless modes on the easiest difficulty.

Quote

Just try and think of a way that you could actually enjoy the operators 

There's none.

I fail to see how some people just refuse to understand. Talk about being stubborn.

Liking operators equals operators not being operators - funny thing actually that reminded me, in a second day of update I saw someone in Cetus in the new operator suit and Excalibur mask on.  You know what? The first time I thought "it doesn't look as bad for once nad I kinda even like it". That says a ton doesn't it.

And you fail to realize that operators are just here as an attempt to keep players in check as something that meant to be squishy no matter how often tehy say otherwise they do not feel like "void demons" and useless in comparison to warframes to gate some content behind them. If they will improve operators you will get warframes 2.0. That is not what those updates aimed for. And that's why many people hate them, because no  matter how many times you will say what you think tehy will be DE will NOT do it. They're too mundane and they ruin everything. Operators should be like warframes to being likeable it's not a rocket science.

Edited October 17, 2017 by -Temp0-

[Stinker]

19 hours ago, SordidDreams said:

Previously I could have constant passive energy regen, which was great. I could run around spamming my abilities and slaughtering hordes of enemies with barely any effort. It was fantastic fun. Now I have to perform some convoluted button press combo every thirty seconds to maintain that energy regen.

Replying to say I for one whole heartedly disagree with this here statement.

On one hand, sure, passive energy was cool.
BUT It came at the cost of not being there for the first couple minutes.

On the other hand, I now have even HIGHER energy per second, AND my buddies benefit. AND I actually like the active nature to it. My chief complaint is that none of it bleeds through the 'constant' abilities. So frames like ember don't mix very well with zenurik.
If anything, I vote Zenurik bubbles should dump DOUBLE the energy until they dissipate leaving you with the buff. Risk of standing in a bubble for the reward of a bit more energy.

Also noticed the zenurik bubbles don't stack, making duplicate zenurik users questionable.

19 hours ago, SordidDreams said:

WE DON'T WANT TO PLAY OPERATORS. Simple as that. If anything, this update should have removed operators from the game

I want to play with the operator. I like the concept of having a slower more methodical way to play. It's just a shame the AI isn't tuned to playing operators in any situation. (Even just make them far less noticeable to the enemy or something.)

[BlackCoMerc]

4 minutes ago, Stinker said:

Replying to say I for one whole heartedly disagree with this here statement.

On one hand, sure, passive energy was cool.
BUT It came at the cost of not being there for the first couple minutes.

On the other hand, I now have even HIGHER energy per second, AND my buddies benefit. AND I actually like the active nature to it. My chief complaint is that none of it bleeds through the 'constant' abilities. So frames like ember don't mix very well with zenurik.
If anything, I vote Zenurik bubbles should dump DOUBLE the energy until they dissipate leaving you with the buff. Risk of standing in a bubble for the reward of a bit more energy.

Also noticed the zenurik bubbles don't stack, making duplicate zenurik users questionable.

I want to play with the operator. I like the concept of having a slower more methodical way to play. It's just a shame the AI isn't tuned to playing operators in any situation. (Even just make them far less noticeable to the enemy or something.)

Lots of games offer slow, methodical play. Almost all of them, in fact.

I...didn't come to Warframe for slow and methodical.

[Kothophed]

1 hour ago, Prophet_007 said:

That's the fun bit. With the arrival of PoE the system specs needed to play the plains have been changed somehow and the game crashes everytime I try to access the plains. Apparently PoE cant be run on low end PC and when i say low end....reallllyyyyy low end(geforce210 2gb gpu and a pentium processor)...Guess what that means for me..no operator, no new abilities or even gara. LMAO!!...I thought i was the only person  with the same issue but there were others too (dedicated to play the game even at low end pc's) that faced this rather traumatic experience. Now what happened is im playing warframe as it was before second dream which is a major setback for me.

Two solutions:

1.either buy a new pc or upgrade the existing one(which id do if i could afford to)

2.some magic happens and DE would be kind enough to optimise it by taking into consideration all those potato pc's out there

Thus the reason for me saying the powers atleast should have been available as earlier.

The second has been shown by warframe history.  I am currently playing on a second-hand lenovo from Hek-knows-when, and understand your pain.  However, with these kind of massive updates, DE needs some time to optimize.  I remember the Tubemen Update and Second Dream were unplayable for me until a few hotfixes later.   (although I haven't minded the lack of operator powers as I was unairu before this)

[-Temp0-]

Quote

On the other hand, I now have even HIGHER energy per second, AND my buddies benefit.

If you grinded out Zenurik.

If you didn't well. Enjoy grinding another million or so standing and if you invested in other schools? Yeah *** you then. Now I'm sitting at vazarin and madurai being 3 millions with nothing worth having there for me and fuinny part, 3 millions in new system is nothing - madurai's 3 millions was wasted on just 2 ways being lv 3 and 4. Instead of just dumping all the focus points into one pool upon updating you're stack with schools that for the most parts are now useless.

Yeah no it's not "better". I do not care that ways got removed and from what schools. I *** hate that once again, all my progress was wiped clean + new focus costs so much that I literally can not bring myself to grind it often because it means more than an hour per days just squatting on bere if you wnat something done i.e to being able to reach about 100-150k focus a day when you need millions.

[SubsituteGamer]

your not really forced to use the operator, killing eidolons is just to get better operator gear which you will not need if you use it for energy regen or revives its really more of a way to get people who like operators more chances to actually use them for something better than pushing high lvl infested off of akkad and if your a competitionist every game has something you have to do that you don't like.(to be fair they probably would have fixed anything that made fighting eidolons easier)