Let's talk about set mods.

[(XBOX)dude1286]

The base stats should be around 70% of the base mod, while the set bonus should be better than the mod it replaces. I might try the Gladiator set with Inaros, but the others are entirely lack luster with the numbers in every way.

[yles9056]

I don't think set mods are entirely for new players. Some of them drop from level 30~50 bounties which are clearly not meant for new players.

I tried Vigilante mod sets. To be honest, the set bonus is not really useful. Crit upgrade sounds neat. But in reality, the chance is too low consider that you have to sacrifice many useful mods. I can barely find any primary that could utilize all Vigilante mods unless I have a god-teir riven, which is also not for new players.

Edited December 6, 2017 by yles9056

[(XBOX)MarblePine204]

Just found this. Sir Long, nicely put. Do believe if what you suggest be upscaled to second set of rare gold bonus sets would slide tight into game.

[(XBOX)dude1286]

I just took a closer look at some of the gladiator set, the one that does the same thing as Rage is better at %45 with Rage being %40.

[Educated_Beast]

I've found a few of the mods useful but would never use a whole set (agree would make frame weaker).  

 

But some of these can be used on certain builds without losing anything and gain a small bonus to be used with other mods (especially the crit mods since they stack).  

 

The duration mod on radiation disarm Loki is pure awesome (25 sec invisibility and small bonus), harrow can use it as well for longer crit duration.  Vigalante armaments works great on crit weapons throwing up red crits often on rapid fire weapons (use on a build with buzlok I have riven for).  The hunter mod that produces slash on crit weapons..  

 

 

There are good mods in there, but I agree the entire set bonus (on any set) not worth it.  Just use as a supplement and enjoy.  

[Fallen_Echo]

The only great combination i have seen so far is rage and the hunter mod what grants the rage effect zoo.

85% damage converted to energy works extremly nice.

[(PSN)Titchgamer]

Ive had a tinker with these mods and have a full Hunter and Gladiator set.

As a Kubrow and Melle player I was excited about the idea of these mod sets but after some testing I am using 1 of them (Hunter Adrenaline).

There stats are far to low to make them Viable for anything, if they were slightly lower as a trade off for the set bonus in comparison to their counterparts that would be ok.
But to drop for instance 260% Health and 65% armour for 30% crit chance (with combo multiplier) they are just not worth using.

A drop of say 80% and 20% I could live with but those drops are just to extreme for me to bother with.

 

[BtheLee]

I mean the Hunter Munitions mod is pretty beastly even without the whole set. And if you run companions just add in another Hunter mod on your kubrow and you're gonna wreck S#&$. You don't need a whole set, hell the Baza with Hunter Munitions just shreds enemies.

[Flames21891]

I wonder if maybe they should get their own slot, like Exilus mods did. But then, simply adding power to what's already there increases powercreep which is already a glaring issue.

I don't know, these are hard to balance. Either they completely replace the existing mods that they mimic, or they're practically worthless. Neither end of the spectrum is particularly great.

[(XBOX)THANOTOS OMEGA]

On 12/9/2017 at 7:58 AM, (PS4)Titchgamer said:

Ive had a tinker with these mods and have a full Hunter and Gladiator set.

As a Kubrow and Melle player I was excited about the idea of these mod sets but after some testing I am using 1 of them (Hunter Adrenaline).

There stats are far to low to make them Viable for anything, if they were slightly lower as a trade off for the set bonus in comparison to their counterparts that would be ok.
But to drop for instance 260% Health and 65% armour for 30% crit chance (with combo multiplier) they are just not worth using.

A drop of say 80% and 20% I could live with but those drops are just to extreme for me to bother with.

 

As i noted, these stack with the old mods, they don't magically make you throw out mods that offer bonuses to the same stats, so they have to account for that in balacing them because some people will break the meta and when they do they could discover insane new combos, so they have to balance set mods to avoid things like Valkyrs with nearly +200% armor buffs and stuff,

[.Re-light.]

On 10/21/2017 at 1:24 PM, Harulem said:

I agree those sets are lackluster.  No one in their right mind will use them as they are.

Maybe use one piece for a very specialized build ?

Boosting the set bonus is the way to go I think.  Having the bonus scale non linearly is a great idea.  But they will never, nor should they really, make the set mods base values as good as their standard counterparts.

Correct me if I am wrong but with the exception of primed mods, there is no mod in the game that does exactly the same as another mod but better or with an added effect.

I like this, having the set bonus when 2, 3, 4.. Increase exponentially. I found use for them by using 2 gladiator mods, 3 Hunter mods.. Replacing mods on frames and builds that can afford it.

   If the set bonus was really great then you could make some fun builds on certain frames with the full set equipped, but would still have a reason to use just 2 or 3 in some builds and not gimp yourself.

 

 I've upvoted OP, but after further thought, their base values of mods by them selves cannot be equal to normal or primed mods. That wouldn't bring build diversity, only new meta.

TL:dr 1) Exponential increase in value of bonus stat when multiple are equipped.

          2)Bonus effect being something useful and palpable that cannot be achieved by other means, at least not just by one frame. (I would say Gladiator set is the best example of good effect)

         3) As someone suggested maybe not more 50% (or different based on what that stat is) of stat values on them selves versus normal/prime mods otherwise.. the whole idea behind them that was build diversity (I guess?) goes out the window and  you just got new meta which everybody uses all the time.

  

 

[(PSN)satsukixpenny]

I personally only use the Augur set mods but believe me are they cool. The duration and range ones are my favorite. I can finally hit that sweet 190 power range with the exilus and stretch. I honestly think the set mods are very nice, well the augur ones anyways, I haven’t gotten the chance to use any of the others but I don’t think I will since they don’t seem to have any advantages over the regular version. 

 

That being said, I wish the mods would drop more. I thought these mods were suppose to be more new players! But I’ve ran over 50 missions and have yet to got Augur Secrets in my claws. 20~ power strength doesn’t seem like a lot but it helps! 

[_Kireek_]

On 17/10/2017 at 10:48 AM, Sir_Long said:

Say you have 2 pieces of a set equipped, on top of getting additive value of the set bonus the mods making up the set will scale up as well, if the 2 mods are equipped, gladiator aegis and resolve, you'd get 55% armor from the aegis and 220% health from the resolve. Thus when you have the full set equipped you would receive the same amount of stats or more from the set mods compared to the mods you had to replace to accommodate the new set mods.

This is how set mods would logically work.

[BlackCoMerc]

Once again, the lack of balance and the necessity of mandatory mods rears it's ugly head.

Imagine a balanced game where Redirection, Steel Fiber, Vitality, Continuity, Intensify and Stretch were built into Frames. The versatility of such a system us mind boggling. It would be a game changer.

Instead, mods-as- progression kills the fun again.

[(XBOX)Onyx Schnee]

On 10/17/2017 at 12:55 AM, Xzorn said:

Well, as said the mods aren't nearly good enough and except for Gladiator the set bonuses aren't good enough either.

Vigilante's bonus in an absolute best case scenario for a 100% crit chance weapon is still less than a mod like Point Strike would give that weapon and you're sacrificing 6 mod slots for that....  On weapons under 100% crit chance the value is even lower by every % under 100 your weapon has.

Augur's bonus just isn't going to be good until shields are good. The numerical values are irrelevant for the most part. There's maybe 4 frames in the game where this would be anything more than pointless. A very niche situation for a set bonus designed to entice build diversity.

It looks like they were going for Melee, Gunplay and Caster but these mechanics just don't work. Vigilante should prolly be more like a 30% additive chance to crit on normal hits and increase a crit by one level. Being tied exclusively to crit weapons is very limiting. Auger, I just dunno. Shield are bad. They could do something like a stagger-less QT but I know they already added a mod like that.

then you have the fact that vigilante's bonus is at it's best when used on things like soma prime, baza or any other high rof, crit based primaries.

things like dread(other bows that can reach above 100% crit, riven or no) lenz, rakta cernos, daikyu, zenith(maybe it can?) sybaris prime etc.....they can't make use of it.

i mean, maybe lenz can? with hunter munitions and split chamber(with point strike of course) you get a whopping 6 total chances for munitions to trigger(as each stage of the bolt crits with point strike, the initial impact, the cold field and finally the explosion itself....this makes munitions at its absolute BEST on lenz.)

In theory, vigilant armaments should follow the same process. with 6 separate crit hits(split pluz arm is 150% multishot, so a 50% chance to add 3 more chances in the mix) so 9 total chances half the time.....with each being 5% chance to upgrade that crit....we're looking at a 30% chance to upgrade its base crits to orange(125% crit, remember?) and that same 30% to upgrade that 25% orange crit chance to red.

lenz may be the ONLY semi auto weapon that can make good use of the vigilante bonus.....

that's a problem.

[Leland_Gaunt]

Sets are not worth using as of now, you sacrifice too much for absolutely no gain.

And to be honest, I don't expect them to ever be worthwile. DE will probably have forgotten about them within the next 2 prime accesses.

It's not like we haven't seen good ideas with mediocre implementation and then complete abandomnent when the next hot-topic-whatever comes out only to go through the same loop like Archwing, Raids, Relays, Dark Sectors, Melee Channeling for example. All stuff that was advertised as the next big thing, yet all of them are marginal at best.

I'm sure sets will stay as they are and will never be brought up again after the next 1 or 2 sets, much less be revised. DE doesn't really care about going back to old mods (just look at the regular status mods, the holy troika of firearms or channel mods) they just release new bandaids.

 

I wonder how long landscapes are gonna be a thing and if we ever see another one besides PoE.

[(PSN)moonshinetemp098]

There's a fundamental issue with buffing them up to the baseline mods themselves, and that's the fact that you don't want to invalidate the other mods. The better option here, honestly, is just to add a couple extra slots specifically designated for these mods themselves, similar to how the exilus mods have their own slots on frames, or, adding something similar to the reactors and catalysts that adds mod slots to the weapons and frames. It becomes less a matter of "what do I take out to put this in" and more along the lines of "which set do I want to run?" At that point. 

OR, we change the function of the set mods entirely. Ideas like Hunter munitions could help advance the game as a whole, and would help in the same way Rivens were supposed to, in that it essentially adds an addition effect onto the weapon that makes it more viable (adding say... A corrosive proc on critical hit, or boosting critical chance against enemies who are already affected by status procs), condition effects that can be catered to for certain weapons. 

This all fails to consider the actual set bonus. In the current system, we'd need a very large incentive to run a full set mod, so unless they make the set bonuses worth applying, or they make the things that the current set bonuses do viable (using the hunter set as a glaring example here), we have absolutely no reason to run these mods at all. I get that there needs to be a balance, but making something entirely unusable isn't balancing it. 

[(PSN)Croewe]

Make a new thread instead of digging a long dead thread back up.