A compromise for login rewards?

[Mk.1]

*note: I adapted this idea from BlodhgarmDethahal's idea on Reddit*

With the latest login reward being announced recently, this topic seems to have risen once again. So;

 

What if every for 100 days you logged in, you received a token that you could use to redeem one of the login milestone rewards?

As an example, I'm nearing the 600th day reward. With the system I'm suggesting, I would be able to use my token to purchase either the Sigma and Octantis or Primed Shred. A person reaching their 100th day reward would be able to pick any one of the "sundial weapons" or Primed mods that are available right now.

The interval rewards (50, 150, 250..) would remain as they are right now as to preserve the prestige of being a loyal player, since they're only visual in nature.

This would allow newer players to obtain the weapons or mods that they desire while allowing veterans to boast their complete arsenal, topped with their visual rewards.

I think that's all. Thoughts?

Edited October 31, 2017 by Mk_1
I should probably post these things a lot earlier than 2 AM..

[Shifted]

So kinda like guild wars 2 does it with achievement milestones?
(https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Achievement_rewards)

Sounds good to me.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Shifted

[KenthNisshoku]

or log in normally everyday...

hell if other people did it so can you

[DecadeX]

7 minutes ago, KenthNisshoku said:

or log in normally everyday...

hell if other people did it so can you

That works until you have to spend days at the hospital cause a family member is sick. Typically lives do not allow for you to do the same thing every day for nearly 2 years straight. The fact that there is nothing to account for that, but they continue to insist that days played is a measure of loyalty is actually disgusting.

[Jiminez_Burial]

1 minute ago, DecadeX said:

That works until you have to spend days at the hospital cause a family member is sick. Typically lives do not allow for you to do the same thing every day for nearly 2 years straight. The fact that there is nothing to account for that, but they continue to insist that days played is a measure of loyalty is actually disgusting.

Except launching the mobile app counts as a login, and most public places have free wifi locations (at least in NZ).

[Mepheri]

3 minutes ago, Starfreak911 said:

Except launching the mobile app counts as a login, and most public places have free wifi locations (at least in NZ).

does it? because las time i checked i didnt get the login rewards from it

[Tali]

32 minutes ago, Starfreak911 said:

Except launching the mobile app counts as a login, and most public places have free wifi locations (at least in NZ).

As far as i know, that does not count as login.

[KenthNisshoku]

54 minutes ago, DecadeX said:

That works until you have to spend days at the hospital cause a family member is sick. Typically lives do not allow for you to do the same thing every day for nearly 2 years straight. The fact that there is nothing to account for that, but they continue to insist that days played is a measure of loyalty is actually disgusting.

then you have more important things to worry about other than some unimportant digital game item for gamers

[Callback]

I'd put the tokens every 50 and make the sigil packs a purchase option with them as well, but you only get the next one in line and can only buy sigils up to your actual login count.

 

Players who are at full login would be the only ones with the final sigils (having their exclusive reward), while new/returning/more moderately paced players could eventually catch up on the weapons and mods.  It would still take a long time, but at least regarding the main gameplay rewards there would be a way for the completion gap to shrink instead of only widening.

 

Or they could add additional cosmetics with the sigils.  Profile icons, warframe cosmetics, or even weapon skins.  Again, these would represent the higher count logins so those players can have their unique reward, while the important things (actual weapons and mods) are free to be caught up on.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Callback

[Callback]

11 hours ago, KenthNisshoku said:

or log in normally everyday...

hell if other people did it so can you

I can still log in 2 years ago during my hiatus when the system was changed and I didn't know about it?  Tell me how and I'll do that tonight!  Hell, I'll spend the night logging all 700 days.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Callback

[JuicyPop]

10 hours ago, KenthNisshoku said:

then you have more important things to worry about other than some unimportant digital game item for gamers

Of course. It would certainly be nice though to be able to come back and make up for that time instead of it being a permanent loss. Is your point really that a login system should be designed to most thoroughly reward the luckiest and the dullest among us?

Edited October 31, 2017 by JuicyPop

[KenthNisshoku]

1 hour ago, JuicyPop said:

Of course. It would certainly be nice though to be able to come back and make up for that time instead of it being a permanent loss. Is your point really that a login system should be designed to most thoroughly reward the luckiest and the dullest among us?

this is a login reward system not a "oh I took hiatus and i should get this reward because i am special" system.

Edited October 31, 2017 by KenthNisshoku

[JuicyPop]

1 hour ago, KenthNisshoku said:

this is a login reward system not a "oh I took hiatus and i should get this reward because i am special" system.

Right, and that's an argument for the current design or what? I'm not debating what it currently is and who it most rewards but why it's built as such in the first place and why the rewards are pieces of primary progression in a game without any actual end-game content beyond the collect-a-thon? 

It really doesn't bug me that I'm only just now hitting the Azima, but I'm smart enough to know that one day it will be seen as a poison that keeps new players away. 

Edited November 1, 2017 by JuicyPop

[KenthNisshoku]

1 hour ago, JuicyPop said:

Right, and that's an argument for the current design or what? I'm not debating what it currently is and who it most rewards but why it's built as such in the first place and why the rewards are pieces of primary progression in a game without any actual end-game content beyond the collect-a-thon? 

It really doesn't bug me that I'm only just now hitting the Azima, but I'm smart enough to know that one day it will be seen as a poison that keeps new players away. 

several MMOs have these login rewards system and no one is complaining

but in this game all hell breaks lose

plus you don't even need these login rewards to progress

who the hell even proclaimed that these are mandatory items 

these are just bonus items for people who logged in everyday as a thank you

plus if this is enough to push people away then you people don't really deserve these at all

you people are just feeling entitled to everything like spoiled brats

plus I doubt you people would even use these

I barely see anyone using any of the milestone weapons

 

Edited November 1, 2017 by KenthNisshoku
added more

[JuicyPop]

1 minute ago, KenthNisshoku said:

several MMOs have these login rewards system and no one is complaining

but in this game all hell breaks lose

plus you don't even needs these login rewards to progress

who the hell even proclaimed that these are mandatory items 

these are just bonus items for people who logged in everyday as a thank you

plus if this is enough to push people away then you people don't really deserve these at all

you people are just feeling entitled to everything like spoiled brats

 

Yeah, it's not a huge issue because the MMO market has receded massively in just the last 5 years. The people who are actually bothered by these things simply aren't playing the games. 

[...]

And you don't have much of a substantive argument in support so you're resorting to strawmen. 

 

[Madway7]

1 hour ago, JuicyPop said:

Right, and that's an argument for the current design or what? I'm not debating what it currently is and who it most rewards but why it's built as such in the first place and why the rewards are pieces of primary progression in a game without any actual end-game content beyond the collect-a-thon? 

It really doesn't bug me that I'm only just now hitting the Azima, but I'm smart enough to know that one day it will be seen as a poison that keeps new players away. 

As someone who is only 4 days behind on the highest possible log in teward days atm (which is 700) I feel that the system was intended to reward people who give the game the time of day to just log in over a long period of time and not just add more things that people would just spend a few hours or days to craft, level, maybe use a bit then forget about. Or just buy it and do those things.

Now in execution this resulted in a system that locks weapons and mods behind long wait times where missing time cannot be refunded or earned. Weapons and mods that at a single glance do not seem necessary in the grand scheme of things as the main point of the game revolves around just killing enemies and we have plenty of alternatives to do that.

Despite this, it comes off as dangling a shiny thing in front of people which constantly results in them being reminded them that they are locked behind arbitrary wait times.

Wait times that cause more shiny things to be dangled in front of them as they are trying to catch up to the last shiny thing or the shiny thing that caught their interest the most. (Typically the Zenistar)

Is it good as it is? I'm not sure. Should people get these weapons much faster just because they feel a great need to receive them in a timely manner? I'm not sure.

Discussions about the log in rewards started with the Azima, but people didn't get upset much because it was only 100 days and the weapon was mediocre when compared to some other secondaries. It's only gotten worse since then with good mods and a very good melee weapon getting locked behind it.

In the end I find myself in the middle of this. Being of the opinion that DE can't cater to everyones life situation that may cost you your progress on the log in rewards and knowing that the game heavily relies on player retention and this system in a way rewards those willing to give it at least some time investment.

At the same time it rubs me the wrong way that it's giving people direct access to a system telling them that they have to wait to unlock content and has no system in place in case a player loses the ability to catch up to the latest gear due to unforseen circumstances.

 

(Man this was long... thanks for taking your time to read it if you did)

Edited November 1, 2017 by Madway7

[KenthNisshoku]

13 minutes ago, JuicyPop said:

Yeah, it's not a huge issue because the MMO market has receded massively in just the last 5 years. The people who are actually bothered by these things simply aren't playing the games. 

[...]

And you don't have much of a substantive argument in support so you're resorting to strawmen. 

 

there is no need for an argument because it is a LOGIN REWARD not sure why you people want to make changes on something like a LOGIN REWARD and these REWARDS will lose value/meaning because of impatient people like you with excuses

 

 

[JuicyPop]

10 minutes ago, KenthNisshoku said:

there is no need for an argument because it is a LOGIN REWARD not sure why you people want to make changes on something like a LOGIN REWARD and these REWARDS will lose value/meaning because of impatient people like you with excuses

 

 

Okay, let's pretend that all gear in the game is now solely released through a LOGIN REWARD. You'd be okay with that right? 

[Syni]

32 minutes ago, KenthNisshoku said:

there is no need for an argument because it is a LOGIN REWARD not sure why you people want to make changes on something like a LOGIN REWARD and these REWARDS will lose value/meaning because of impatient people like you with excuses

 

 

Hey, can you tell DE that lato vandal and braton vandal will lose their value when everyone  gets them. Thank you.

[Ruzu]

5 hours ago, JuicyPop said:

Okay, let's pretend that all gear in the game is now solely released through a LOGIN REWARD. You'd be okay with that right? 

Don't accuse someone of a straw man argument then use it yourself. 

There's no precedent that DE will release all gear through log-in rewards only and why would they? 

His argument is, if someone managed to log-in 1000 days total and he got a weapon for his effort, why should someone who just started be able to get what it took him 1000 days for 0 effort? You answered a completely different question.

[(PSN)NicolaiBM]

I think people need to stop crying about things to look for ways to add shortcuts.

[JuicyPop]

28 minutes ago, Ruzu said:

Don't accuse someone of a straw man argument then use it yourself. 

There's no precedent that DE will release all gear through log-in rewards only and why would they? 

His argument is, if someone managed to log-in 1000 days total and he got a weapon for his effort, why should someone who just started be able to get what it took him 1000 days for 0 effort? You answered a completely different question.

Well, first off, you should learn what a straw man is, because my comment is nothing close. 

I'm mocking the fact that his defense boils down to, "It's a login reward so therefore it can't be touched or tweaked because it's a login reward." It's quite asinine if you take the time to fully appreciate his comment. 

[...]

In regards to the bolded, the point has never been to take what is currently in the queue and give it to everyone – I would even be fine with making all that has been earned completely exclusive starting today – it's to stop this madness before it gets any further out of hand. 

Edited November 1, 2017 by JuicyPop

[Ruzu]

5 minutes ago, JuicyPop said:

Well, first off, you should learn what a straw man is, because my comment is nothing close. 

I'm mocking the fact that his defense boils down to, "It's a login reward so therefore it can't be touched or tweaked because it's a login reward." It's quite asinine if you take the time to fully appreciate his comment. 

[...]

In regards to the bolded, the point has never been to take what is currently in the queue and give it to everyone – I would even be fine with making all that has been earned completely exclusive starting today – it's to stop this madness before it gets any further out of hand. 

"will lose value/meaning"

He's saying, the effort of logging in a total amount of days, to get a weapon, is an effort that loses all value if someone is somehow able to acquire that same weapon on day 1.

"now solely released through log-in"

Assuming I didn't read the above, this is a response to someone explaining potentially why special log-in exclusive rewards becoming a regular weekly thing would strengthen the playing experience. Your argument would content is gated behind time, rather than skill or effort.

one way of looking at a straw man argument is one side attacking a position not held by the other side. aka he wasn't arguing that log-in exclusives are good, but they hold a certain value

Look at the above, your core argument is not what he argued.

That's just how I interpret it.

____

 

As for the rest of your argument, that's an alternative I suppose. Neither good nor bad.

[KX297]

Man, I really like the idea of a token system.

Mostly because the only item I want is the Sigma and Octanis. I dislike all the other weapons, and I don't particularly need or want the mods. The sigils are kind of cool I guess...

I've wanted another sword and board, and it really sucks that I can't get this one for about 500 more days. It really irritates me since I'm both what you would consider a veteran and loyal (1500 hours and I keep coming back...), but I just missed some login days and switched from one account to another. 

Oh well I guess, maybe they will eventually give us a way to obtain it outside the current method, which is down right bad. I mean, you aren't even really rewarded for playing or being loyal. 

Just log in, log out, and play something else. Wouldn't really say that's 'loyal'.

I want to be rewarded for actually playing...

Eh, whatever. Back to my oddball weapons. Sheeve for the win.

 

 

Edited November 1, 2017 by KX297

[peterc3]

How is this a compromise?