Ash rework needed on console badly

[(XBOX)Natfrog123]

Can we get an Ash rework PLEASE! He has been nothing but pure trash since the "rework". Blade Storm is 100% unusable now in multiplayer and is a JOKE on console. Blade Storm needs to go back to a one button activation or scrap the entire skill and make a new one.

[Valennyonnen]

Ash's skills are supposed to reflect ancient skills. On pc they're ok. But on my PS4 he's ridiculously hard to use. 

I have been praying for Ash to get a rework for all consoles because he lost most value after his Nerf, *hahem* 'rework.'

It seems not enough frames survive their prime releases.

[(XBOX)LoneRyder3926]

Nonsense 

[(XBOX)Natfrog123]

51 minutes ago, (Xbox One)BlackcoatOne said:

Nonsense 

Would you mind posting a blade storm multiplayer console video then? I mean since you think this is nonsense surely you wouldn't mind backing that up with proof right?

[(XBOX)Natfrog123]

1 hour ago, Valennyonnen said:

Ash's skills are supposed to reflect ancient skills. On pc they're ok. But on my PS4 he's ridiculously hard to use. 

I have been praying for Ash to get a rework for all consoles because he lost most value after his Nerf, *hahem* 'rework.'

It seems not enough frames survive their prime releases.

He has NO value now. Blade storm was the one thing that made him unique. Stealth is not unique and he isn't great at that. 1 skill is slightly modified Kestral/Glaive gameplay. Ash has NO value that other frames can't and don't FAR exceed.

[(XBOX)SweatyPick3L]

@Nazrethim and yet another that has seen the light. 

Welcome to the resistance!

Edited December 3, 2017 by (XB1)RDeschain82

[(PSN)robotwars7]

and go back to the days of spamming a single button and killing everything in the room? no thanks. he just needs a few QoL changes, manual targeting with Bladestorm is fine.

 

[-Trey-]

Why exactly is Bladestorm unusable on console ? I tried it on pad and it doesnt seem hard to use. You can use dpad to highlight skill and click r1/rb, highlight and click it again.

But I agree with Ash needing real rework.

[(XBOX)Natfrog123]

10 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

and go back to the days of spamming a single button and killing everything in the room? no thanks. he just needs a few QoL changes, manual targeting with Bladestorm is fine.

 

Like all the other frames that press one button and do the same? 

This game IS all about being godly at a very high speed.

 

 

[(XBOX)Natfrog123]

2 minutes ago, -Trey- said:

Why exactly is Bladestorm unusable on console ? I tried it on pad and it doesnt seem hard to use. You can use dpad to highlight skill and click r1/rb, highlight and click it again.

But I agree with Ash needing real rework.

In multiplayer? Everything is dead before you can get marks on anything. 

[(XBOX)Natfrog123]

5 minutes ago, -Trey- said:

Why exactly is Bladestorm unusable on console ? I tried it on pad and it doesnt seem hard to use. You can use dpad to highlight skill and click r1/rb, highlight and click it again.

But I agree with Ash needing real rework.

The ONLY place ash is usable is in single player and you better hope it's on a low level area. Ash is too squishy so that forces you into using smoke bomb. If I'm going stealth game play I'd rather use Loki or Octavia. Ash brings NOTHING to the table and CAN'T survive without massive duration in stealth which really takes the entire fun out of the frame.

[Cubewano]

20 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

and go back to the days of spamming a single button and killing everything in the room? no thanks. he just needs a few QoL changes, manual targeting with Bladestorm is fine.

 

oh boy he needs more than qol tweaks, he needs an entirely new ult, and definite buffs to the rest of his kit. this frame is pretty much meaningless without augments, and even with them he's niche at best. (we don't need to return him to the mess that was his old ult, but that doesn't mean we should want to stay with the mess that is his current ult instead, because they are as mentioned, both messes)

Edited December 3, 2017 by Cubewano

[(XBOX)Natfrog123]

15 minutes ago, Cubewano said:

oh boy he needs more than qol tweaks, he needs an entirely new ult, and definite buffs to the rest of his kit. this frame is pretty much meaningless without augments, and even with them he's niche at best. (we don't need to return him to the mess that was his old ult, but that doesn't mean we should want to stay with the mess that is his current ult instead, because they are as mentioned, both messes)

Other than the invulnerable/unkillable enemies by allies, what was wrong with Ash BS before. I loved the skill. Press one button at a certain energy cost and things died. LIKE ALMOST EVERY OTHER FRAME. Ember, Saryn, Mag, Oberon, Nova, Frost, Hydroid, Octavia, and so on. This would be just like the rest of the game. Explain to me other than the ONE flaw what was wrong with the skill.

[(XBOX)SweatyPick3L]

I have suggested this

 

[Marvelous_A]

1 hour ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

and go back to the days of spamming a single button and killing everything in the room? no thanks. he just needs a few QoL changes, manual targeting with Bladestorm is fine.

 

No? What exactly the rework changes except making Ash useless? Animation is still there, invincibility is still there, everything is still there except now it takes a lot of time to even cast the ability. Is that what rework for? Making a frame useless without addressing any of its problems? Adding synergy that's hardy a synergy at all and it's generally an useless gimmick? If you think it's OP just scrap it and make another what's the point of keeping 99% of it and make it useless? Now that's what we call laziness. And Mesa? Is she going to get the marking mechanism too? Or not because she has to move her cursor?

Edited December 3, 2017 by Marvelous_A

[(XBOX)Natfrog123]

4 minutes ago, (Xbox One)RDeschain82 said:

I have suggested this

 

When i think of Ash I think purely of the "teleport" ability with a theme of assasin. That brings me to Nightcrawler from X-men. Rapidly teleporting sticking blades into vital areas. Ash had this. He was PERFECT to play as. Lets not get it twisted the animation was a bit much to look at but game play wise Ash's BS was perfect. As another player playing with Ash on the team I understand that it was a pain at times but this was not the fault of the skill but of the way it was programmed to "mark" targets so ONLY BS could hit them. What would have happened if the animations were fixed to not get people dizzy OR just make the entire skill employ clones to (X) other targets around a single target the player attacks. That simple fix would have solved EVERYTHING. Why did DE think the entire skill needed to be trashed the way it currently is?

[(XBOX)Natfrog123]

"manual targeting with Bladestorm is fine" 

Then add it to EVERY ability that hits more than one enemy.

It's only fair right? I mean you just said it's fine right?

[(XBOX)Angryspy101]

19 minutes ago, Marvelous_A said:

No? What exactly the rework changes except making Ash useless? Animation is still there, invincibility is still there, everything is still there except now it takes a lot of time to even cast the ability. Is that what rework for? Making a frame useless without addressing any of its problems? Adding synergy that's hardy a synergy at all and it's generally an useless gimmick? If you think it's OP just scrap it and make another what's the point of keeping 99% of it and make it useless? Now that's what we call laziness. And Mesa? Is she going to get the marking mechanism too? Or not because she has to move her cursor?

It's funny how making bladestorm take actual brain power to use make ash useless now. 

I don't understand why everyone thinks that reworks are always suppose to be buffs. Just look at saryn or mag, also we all know the real reason ash got changed was because bladestorm was just way to good to be an instant cast ability, current bladestorm can kill most lvl 100 enemies by just have a steel charge aura on ash, now if you use things like the combo counter and power strength, bladestorm can easily scale in the lvl 160s. So if you think that bladestorm should be an instant AOE nuke than don't bother trying to rework him.

I play on console and it takes me like 3 seconds to mark an entire room, hell if you hate marking so much just activate bladestorm and play ash normally, and when you need bladestorm it'll be ready to cast. sounds like you guys need better environmental awareness and creativity.

Hate to break it to you guys but you don't care about ash, you only care about his broken bladestorm, it's a common mistake most people have with ash.

[(XBOX)Angryspy101]

24 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Natfrog123 said:

"manual targeting with Bladestorm is fine" 

Then add it to EVERY ability that hits more than one enemy.

It's only fair right? I mean you just said it's fine right?

Because if you actually done your homework you would understand that bladestorm deals two of THE best damage types in the game, finisher and slash damage both of which bypasses the most annoying obstacle in the game, which is armor/shield scaling, it even bypasses some damage resistances. Plus that damage also scales with the combo counter, so if you add it all together, bladestorm can technically out scale most damage abilities in higher lvls.

So manual targeting is the line between Brokenness and balance.

[Marvelous_A]

8 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Angryspy101 said:

It's funny how making bladestorm take actual brain power to use make ash useless now. 

I don't understand why everyone thinks that reworks are always suppose to be buffs. Just look at saryn or mag, also we all know the real reason ash got changed was because bladestorm was just way to good to be an instant cast ability, current bladestorm can kill most lvl 100 enemies by just have a steel charge aura on ash, now if you use things like the combo counter and power strength, bladestorm can easily scale in the lvl 160s. So if you think that bladestorm should be an instant AOE nuke than don't bother trying to rework him.

I play on console and it takes me like 3 seconds to mark an entire room, hell if you hate marking so much just activate bladestorm and play ash normally, and when you need bladestorm it'll be ready to cast. sounds like you guys need better environmental awareness and creativity.

Hate to break it to you guys but you don't care about ash, you only care about his broken bladestorm, it's a common mistake most people have with ash.

Coz Mesa? Why one frame got to keep auto aim and got buff afterwards while another frame got nerfed and had the auto-aim taken away? And how would you think aiming BS is actual use brain power? You know what needs you to aim also? Guns. In what situation BS kills faster than your guns? Over lvl 150 perhaps? In what situation BS kills faster than your teammates? Almost none lol. It's just difficult to cast your BS before your teammates kill everything for you in a pub game.

And you didn't even answer my another question. How did this reworks make it a better ult? You think it's better coz you need to aim and then it makes you to watch animations? What? Do you really call this a actual use of brain?

Edited December 3, 2017 by Marvelous_A

[Cubewano]

59 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Natfrog123 said:

Other than the invulnerable/unkillable enemies by allies, what was wrong with Ash BS before. I loved the skill. Press one button at a certain energy cost and things died. LIKE ALMOST EVERY OTHER FRAME. Ember, Saryn, Mag, Oberon, Nova, Frost, Hydroid, Octavia, and so on. This would be just like the rest of the game. Explain to me other than the ONE flaw what was wrong with the skill.

The endless finisher cameos. Beyond it being a nuisance to your team mates, and beyond it allowing you high tier damage at zero risk, it was also an incredibly un-interactive skill that removed you from play. And before you say that is just my opinion, DE themselves acknowledged this issue as one of the biggest concerns the community expressed when the rework was being handled. At no point was Ash's ult in a good position, neither in how it handled enemies, or how it was as an experience for the player. Yes I will say the previous version had more value, since it at least gave Ash a role worth filling, but it was still a poor excuse of a skill, just as the current state of his ult is a poor excuse of a skill. 

[(XBOX)Oussii]

3 hours ago, (Xbox One)Natfrog123 said:

Can we get an Ash rework PLEASE! He has been nothing but pure trash since the "rework". Blade Storm is 100% unusable now in multiplayer and is a JOKE on console. Blade Storm needs to go back to a one button activation or scrap the entire skill and make a new one.

Ash is great as it is.

[(XBOX)Angryspy101]

Just now, Marvelous_A said:

Coz Mesa? Why one frame got to keep auto aim and got buff afterwards while another frame got nerfed and had the auto-aim taken away? And how would you think aiming BS is actual use brain power? You know what needs you to aim also? Guns. In what situation BS kills faster than your guns? Over lvl 150 perhaps? In what situation BS kills faster than your teammates? Almost none lol. It's just difficult to cast your BS before your teammates kill everything for you in a pub game.

Lol, exactly you only care about bladestorm.

Bladestorm should NEVER be your main source of damage, you should only use it when you have too, if your teammates are killing enemies before to can bladestorm then why the flipping flapping are you wasting your time using it?  you think bladestorm should be used every time you see an enemy? Bladestorm is an backup ability, your weapons and first three abilities should always be the primary source of damage.

Also, Mesa still has to technically aim and you have to remember that you have to run an optimal secondary build and the ability deals physical damage which is affected by damage resistances, ash on the other hand only really needs a steel charge, combo mod, and an attack speed mod, and the ability deals finisher damage which ignores damage resistances and unlike Mesa ash can also go Invisible which is the next best thing to immortality, because why have a damage reduction when you can just avoid damage altogether.

[Cubewano]

23 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Angryspy101 said:

It's funny how making bladestorm take actual brain power to use make ash useless now. 

I don't understand why everyone thinks that reworks are always suppose to be buffs. Just look at saryn or mag, also we all know the real reason ash got changed was because bladestorm was just way to good to be an instant cast ability, current bladestorm can kill most lvl 100 enemies by just have a steel charge aura on ash, now if you use things like the combo counter and power strength, bladestorm can easily scale in the lvl 160s. So if you think that bladestorm should be an instant AOE nuke than don't bother trying to rework him.

I play on console and it takes me like 3 seconds to mark an entire room, hell if you hate marking so much just activate bladestorm and play ash normally, and when you need bladestorm it'll be ready to cast. sounds like you guys need better environmental awareness and creativity.

Hate to break it to you guys but you don't care about ash, you only care about his broken bladestorm, it's a common mistake most people have with ash.

sweeping your reticle wildly across the screen is hardly using brain power. it's just another clunky and inconvenient pre-requisite added to limit the potential of a skill, with no consideration with how it impacts the gameplay portion of it. 

reworks don't always have to be buffs no, but they should provide better balance, the rework to ash was not aimed at balancing him nor did it achieve such a goal, he ultimately came out with less of a role than he did due to it and with a clunkier but still ultimately disliked ult. the problem isn't him not being a one shot wonder, the problem is he isn't anything anymore, he exists as a niche and nothing more. 

ash deserved far more than he was given with his rework, when people heard he was getting it at the least they expected a new ult because the entire performance style of his old one was subpar, alongside some qol if not buffs to the rest of his kit. instead we got what was more of less just a petty nerf with some last minute qol changes tacked on to try and gloss over how weak it all was. 

Edited December 3, 2017 by Cubewano

[(XBOX)Natfrog123]

14 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Angryspy101 said:

Because if you actually done your homework you would understand that bladestorm deals two of THE best damage types in the game, finisher and slash damage both of which bypasses the most annoying obstacle in the game, which is armor/shield scaling, it even bypasses some damage resistances. Plus that damage also scales with the combo counter, so if you add it all together, bladestorm can technically out scale most damage abilities in higher lvls.

So manual targeting is the line between Brokenness and balance.

No that just makes the skill unusable. Mark anything and by the time you click again the things you targeted are already dead. PERIOD. As I stated before I'd love for you or ANY ONE for that matter to post a video of you using Ash end game as anything other than a single player defense and not spamming 1.