Should i wait, or refuse damage 3.0

[avengel]

If it exist. The serration mod get removed, and effected other mod as well.

But i like my serration mod.

[Airwolfen]

Probably not going to dissapear. 

But IF it does there are 2 important notes.

If it happens it wont be soon. Will take quite some time till 3.0 happens.

And when it goes you will get compensated. De has always made sure of that with mod system overhauls.

[Aeon94]

Serration will be removed and weapons will get damage bonuses as they level up. ( at least this was the idea )

They will give us the endo spent on them , like @Airwolfen said we always get compensated for these kind of changes.

And yea it will take really long time to implement damage 3.0

[phoenix1992]

Didn't DE drop the damage 3.0 removal of serration and multishot mod more than a year ago?

And we are getting damage 2.5 which is shuffling status and damage effects?

[---Merchant---]

30 minutes ago, Aeon94 said:

Serration will be removed and weapons will get damage bonuses as they level up. ( at least this was the idea )

They will give us the endo spent on them , like @Airwolfen said we always get compensated for these kind of changes.

And yea it will take really long time to implement damage 3.0

I play for 4 years and I would be careful with that "always" part.

I do not quite understand the ideology behind removing serration
If we would follow that pattern we could remove most mods
There is maybe 1 weapon that does not use multishot [because it does divide damage instead of buffing it for said weapon
There are 0 crit weapons that do not use %crit chance or crit %dmg boost
There are 0 status weapons that are not build to proc status
Hush mod should be build-in every weapon as it is must for every silent gun
Basically we could remove most mods,make weapons 100%proc status 500%multishot,200% crit chance with 1000basic damage
and build in aoe dot damage

The only thing we would pick is element [that would end up being magnetic vs viral debate,so we can as well build in both to all weapons ingame]


Basically why stop at serration? It is not any more must have than other mods that make guns generally better
I do not even use serration on every gun I have,some are more relliable with more attack speed to proc %status or crit

It is not like you need to put Hornet strike on Sonicor that we take pretty much just for CC ragdoll fun


I feel like dmg 3.0 will feel like nerf,especially for slash and from my experiences it does take too long time to re-buff nerfed stuff in this game.
So I'd rather pass on it

What about perfectly rolled %dmg %multishot %crit chance rivens? WIll they become only way to progress?
 

Edited December 5, 2017 by MidoriFuse

[Aeon94]

2 minutes ago, MidoriFuse said:

I play for 4 years and I would be careful with that "always" part.

I do not quite understand the ideology behind removing serration
If we would follow that pattern we could remove most mods
There is maybe 1 weapon that does not use multishot [because it does divide damage instead of buffing it for said weapon
There are 0 crit weapons that do not use %crit chance boost
There are 0 status weapons that are not build to proc status
Hush mod should be build-in every weapon as it is must for every silent gun
Basically we could remove most mods,make weapons 100%proc status 500%multishot,200% crit chance with 1000basic damage
and build in aoe dot damage

The only thing we would pick is element [that would end up being magnetic vs viral debate,so we can as well build in both to all weapons ingame]


Basically why stop at serration? It is not any more must have as critical chance or multistrike.
I do not even use serration on every gun I have,some are more relliable with more attack speed to proc %status or crit

It is not like you need to put Hornet strike on Sonicor that we take pretty much just for CC ragdoll fun


I feel like dmg 3.0 will feel like nerf,especially for slash and from my experiences it does take too long time to re-buff nerfed stuff in this game.
So I'd rather pass on it

Why would it be a nerf at all ? I mean Serration gets integrated into weapons' stats and you will get a free mod slot.

Maybe you are not using Serration or Hornet Strike on every weapon but they are mandatory if you want to deal more damage. 

They wanted to change how multishot works but ideas were not that good , not sure if they totally scrapped idea of changing multishot or not.

Also tell me when we didn't get compensated for a system change ?

[---Merchant---]

7 minutes ago, Aeon94 said:

system change ?

Maybe after you define what this "system change" is and is not because I feel like your whole argument is going to be word-play around it.

Nerf part talked clearly about slash,that was mentioned to be nerfed soon tm and other damage effects buffed

It is not impossible for them to do 100%more damage for akstiletto and 10% more for opticor I do not know if they gonna do global damage value buff,you do not know either
Might as well become nerf to all good weapons [just like rivens are] and buff to less used ones

[(PSN)BattleCry1791]

1 minute ago, Aeon94 said:

Why would it be a nerf at all ? I mean Serration gets integrated into weapons' stats and you will get a free mod slot.

Maybe you are not using Serration or Hornet Strike on every weapon but they are mandatory if you want to deal more damage. 

They wanted to change how multishot works but ideas were not that good , not sure if they totally scrapped idea of changing multishot or not.

Also tell me when we didn't get compensated for a system change ?

Truth here...if everyone uses it, then why have it all?  Everyone uses two mod slots on every gun for Base damage increase and multi shot regardless of  build.  Why bother having them at all?  

[Aeon94]

11 minutes ago, MidoriFuse said:

Maybe after you define what this "system change" is and is not because I feel like your whole argument is going to be word-play around it.

Nerf part talked clearly about slash,that was mentioned to be nerfed soon tm and other damage effects buffed

It is not impossible for them to do 100%more damage for akstiletto and 10% more for opticor I do not know if they gonna do global damage value buff,you do not know either
Might as well become nerf to all good weapons [just like rivens are] and buff to less used ones

I meant it as overhaul , guess chose wrong words. 

Well we still don't know if changes to slash will end up as nerf or buff. We will see it soon. But that has nothing to do with the idea of Serration's removal and OP's concern.

( returning to original subject ) Like I said free-ing up a slot and integrating Serration into weapon stats don't count as nerf. We will get compensated IF it gets removed. 

Lets see Damage 2.5 ( IPS rework ) first then we can worry about Damage 3.0 and Serration's removal 

[Volinus7]

Inconsequential OP is inconsequential.

[Aeon94]

Just now, (PS4)BattleCry1791 said:

Truth here...if everyone uses it, then why have it all?  Everyone uses two mod slots on every gun for Base damage increase and multi shot regardless of  build.  Why bother having them at all?  

Exactly, it limits build variety by filling 2 mod slots with mandatory mods. Damage 3.0 's goal was getting rid of Serration by making it built-in addition to weapons and changing how multishot works.

[Aeon94]

Just now, (PS4)BattleCry1791 said:

Truth here...if everyone uses it, then why have it all?  Everyone uses two mod slots on every gun for Base damage increase and multi shot regardless of  build.  Why bother having them at all?  

Exactly, it limits build variety by filling 2 mod slots with mandatory mods. Damage 3.0 's goal was getting rid of Serration by making it built-in addition to weapons and changing how multishot works.

[AzureTerra]

When Kuporcine fly across a Sapphire Lua is when we are likley to see something given how much of a shakeup it will be so don't wait for it, accept it when it comes and ignore it till then

[Teloch]

6 hours ago, avengel said:

If it exist. The serration mod get removed, and effected other mod as well.

But i like my serration mod.

Wait or not, but damage 3.0 ain't gonna happen (not in the way it was advertised)

[TotallyLagging]

They've already scrapped the idea of removing damage mods in past Devstream months ago. I think it was on February/March. Basically they're looking to alter enemy resistance/behavior instead.

 

I blame Riven mods.

[Maercurial]

vor 7 Stunden schrieb avengel:

If it exist. The serration mod get removed, and effected other mod as well.

But i like my serration mod.

Don't worry, the idea of Damage 3.0 as some people advertise it was scrapped a long time ago, it's nothing more than a myth at this point, there's currently no reason to assume we're ever going to get it the way they've speculated back then. That was just some theorycrafting, and for what it's worth, they figured it's not actually worth it to invest further into that idea, and instead went with a completely different (and much better) approach, because the Modding System is a fundamental part of Warframe that simply works. You can build upon that instead of completely overthrowing it, that simply would've been a nonsensical decision to make. 

Several things to consider here...

1.) Removing Mandatory Mods is completely pointless, as that would simply create new Mods that would then be considered Mandatory.

2.) Mandatory Mods aren't a bad thing at all, in fact they're not only an important balancing factor, but also increase build diversity. As such, they're healthy for the game. Yes, you heard that right, contrary to what some people might tell you, limitation increases diversity, and removing them would reduce build diversity.

Simple example:

A Weapon with 10 Mod Slots, and you have 5 Mandatory Mods and 10 Variable Mods.

Obviously you're going to add the 5 Mandatory Mods, but then you have to decide which of those 10 others you want to use in your remaining 5 Slots. This means there's a choice you have to make, and different builds you can try out, or even run different builds and combinations for different purposes. That right there is a good thing and a core part of what makes Modding fun. In this scenario, there are many different builds you can create out of those 10 Variable Mods. 

Now instead scenario 2) Make those 5 Mandatory Mods innate to the weapon, now you got 10 Variable Mods and 10 Slots. Right, you just removed build diversity altogether, you simply put those 10 Variable Mods in the 10 Slots you have and you're done, no different builds, just this one is left, because you can fit everything in simultaneously. In a way, you've now turned all the Variable Mods into Mandatory ones, which is kinda ironic.

This is of course a simplified example, but it shows that with less Variable Slots, you get more different builds (=more build variety) out of the same number of Variable Mods. 

Long Story short, Making Mods innate does not increase build diversity, it actually decreases the amount of different build options, all it actually does is adding another slot for a variable Mod, and we certainly don't need that. That's nothing else than a forced powercreep accross all weapons. 

3) The whole premise is flawed to begin with and is the complete opposite of build diversity.

"Well, you'll always want Bonus Damage, let's make it innate to the weapon."

"Well, you'll always want Multishot, let's make it innate as well."

See the issue? Where do you actually stop here? Crit Damage is something you'd always want as well, should be innate too right? Crit Chance, why not, make it innate. Elemental damage? No reason to have it as a Mod, make it innate to the weapon too. You could carry on until there's no Mod left that couldn't be innate. Point is, they're not innate because you should always have a choice, but that choice should still be limited as in how much you can put into a weapon simultaneously (that's where Mandatory Mods come in to decrease the amount of Slots). That way you create build diversity, remove one core part of it and the whole thing breaks down like a cardhouse.

Edited December 5, 2017 by Maercurial

[Comrade]

13 minutes ago, Maercurial said:

Don't worry, the idea of Damage 3.0 as some people advertise it was scrapped a long time ago, it's nothing more than a myth at this point, there's currently no reason to assume we're ever going to get it the way they've speculated back then. That was just some theorycrafting, and for what it's worth, they figured it's not actually worth it to invest further into that idea, and instead went with a completely different (and much better) approach, because the Modding System is a fundamental part of Warframe that simply works. You can build upon that instead of completely overthrowing it, that simply would've been a nonsensical decision to make. 

Several things to consider here...

1.) Removing Mandatory Mods is completely pointless, as that would simply create new Mods that would then be considered Mandatory.

2.) Mandatory Mods aren't a bad thing at all, in fact they're not only an important balancing factor, but also increase build diversity. As such, they're healthy for the game. Yes, you heard that right, contrary to what some people might tell you, limitation increases diversity, and removing them would reduce build diversity.

Simple example:

A Weapon with 10 Mod Slots, and you have 5 Mandatory Mods and 10 Variable Mods.

Obviously you're going to add the 5 Mandatory Mods, but then you have to decide which of those 10 others you want to use in your remaining 5 Slots. This means there's a choice you have to make, and different builds you can try out, or even run different builds and combinations for different purposes. That right there is a good thing and a core part of what makes Modding fun. In this scenario, there are many different builds you can create out of those 10 Variable Mods. 

Now instead scenario 2) Make those 5 Mandatory Mods innate to the weapon, now you got 10 Variable Mods and 10 Slots. Right, you just removed build diversity altogether, you simply put those 10 Variable Mods in the 10 Slots you have and you're done, no different builds, just this one is left, because you can fit everything in simultaneously. In a way, you've now turned all the Variable Mods into Mandatory ones, which is kinda ironic.

This is of course a simplified example, but it shows that with less Variable Slots, you get more different builds (=more build variety) out of the same number of Variable Mods. 

Long Story short, Making Mods innate does not increase build diversity, it actually decreases the amount of different build options, all it actually does is adding another slot for a variable Mod, and we certainly don't need that. That's nothing else than a forced powercreep accross all weapons. 

3) The whole premise is flawed to begin with and is the complete opposite of build diversity.

"Well, you'll always want Bonus Damage, let's make it innate to the weapon."

"Well, you'll always want Multishot, let's make it innate as well."

See the issue? Where do you actually stop here? Crit Damage is something you'd always want as well, should be innate too right? Crit Chance, why not, make it innate. Elemental damage? No reason to have it as a Mod, make it innate to the weapon too. You could carry on until there's no Mod left that couldn't be innate. Point is, they're not innate because you should always have a choice, but that choice should still be limited as in how much you can put into a weapon simultaneously (that's where Mandatory Mods come in to decrease the amount of Slots). That way you create build diversity, remove one core part of it and the whole thing breaks down like a cardhouse.

Some interesting points, i'd like to offer some counters:

1. Of course there will always be "Mandatory mods", especially with the current dichotomy of crit and status weapons, but you're arguing on a slippery slope.

2. The example you provide, while it does prove your point, isn't the actual case for weapons and is a massive understatement. It seems nit-picky, but weapons only have 8 mod slots- this is important because there are more than 8 variable mods. there are easily dozens of variable and never-used mods that will never see the light of day outside of a niche build. Those who argue for the removal of serration, hornet strike, pressure point and multishot mods do so because they, by default, take up 1/4 of your entire build automatically- those two slots will never be available to use otherwise. instead of 5 slots and 10 variable mods, you have 5-6 slots and 20something mods; the problem only compounds itself with the addition of new mods. This forces people to just cram whatever mods are community recommended into those remaining slots and forget the rest.

3. again, slippery slope. flat damage and flat multishot are all people are asking to be removed, nothing more.

[Maercurial]

vor 38 Minuten schrieb Comrade:

1. Of course there will always be "Mandatory mods", especially with the current dichotomy of crit and status weapons, but you're arguing on a slippery slope.

I simply wanted to express that it's naive to think mandatory mods will be gone after that change, they'll be replaced, there's always going to be a meta / "best in spot". So if it's simply your goal to remove mandatory mods, you'll quickly find out you created new ones. The meta's shifting, but it won't ever disappear as long as the game exists. And I think that's a fair point to make considering how many people just seem to argue against mandatory mods for the sake of them being mandatory, without realising the purpose of these mods and why they (should) exist. This point is closely connected to the second one admittedly, and I considered putting them both together in one. 

vor 38 Minuten schrieb Comrade:

2. The example you provide, while it does prove your point, isn't the actual case for weapons and is a massive understatement. It seems nit-picky, but weapons only have 8 mod slots- this is important because there are more than 8 variable mods. there are easily dozens of variable and never-used mods that will never see the light of day outside of a niche build.

Of course, I said that it's a simplified example, I'm aware that there are more than 8 variable mods to fill the limited space, but that only further proves my point... the more (useful) mods, the more possible builds. There's nothing wrong with niche builds, in fact many niche builds can be quite fun once you get the idea. There's only a problem when mods are never used, but that's not because of mandatory mods, they're not the one to blame here, no, that's because the mods that are never used are, let's be honest here, just S#&$ty outdated mods that need an overhaul/buff to them to put them back into the pool of variable (useful) mods people would consider in a build. 

Again, removing the Mandatory Mods will flat out decrease the amount of different builds. It's a common argument for these speculated Damage 3.0 changes that removing them would increase build diversity. That however is simply not the case, it's false advertising, you're actually decreasing the amount of builds by increasing the slots, and therefore the amount of Mods you can have simultaneously on a weapon.

Basically, where now you have to chose between Gas and Viral Damage, you could then have both (just an example again) with no downsides. What previously where two builds is now one with the advantage of both. If that's not the very definition of powercreep then what is?

vor 38 Minuten schrieb Comrade:

Those who argue for the removal of serration, hornet strike, pressure point and multishot mods do so because they, by default, take up 1/4 of your entire build automatically- those two slots will never be available to use otherwise. instead of 5 slots and 10 variable mods, you have 5-6 slots and 20something mods; the problem only compounds itself with the addition of new mods. This forces people to just cram whatever mods are community recommended into those remaining slots and forget the rest.

I think I adressed this above, they're basically arguing against build diversity while claiming to be arguing for build diversity. "5-6 slots and 20 something mods" is more variety than 7-8 slots (after the suggested removal of Serration/Multishot) and 20 something mods to fit in. And variety when building weapons isn't bad, multiple options, choices, that's what many games are lacking nowadays, and I personally like Warframe because it doesn't shy away from complexity. 

And no, no one's forced to only put community recommended mods in, if that's the only thing people are doing, they're missing out a core part of Modding: Explore and discover new stuff, or at least discover certain things on your own. Of course you can forget the rest if you only want to be meta, but then that's your own fault, that's not a problem caused by mandatory mods. Which leads back to my point 1) the meta's gonna change, and the same people will - again - only put in the recommended mods and forget about the others. There'd just be less Mods they could potentially forget about then, because they could fit more Mods in. 

vor 38 Minuten schrieb Comrade:

3. again, slippery slope. flat damage and flat multishot are all people are asking to be removed, nothing more.

That's what some people are currently asking for yes. But if that can be removed because it's mandatory, then everything can be considered to go down the same route once it becomes the new mandatory stuff. Once you start with this, people will want more eventually. As soon as they feel there aren't enough slots to fit everything in, they'd ask for something that they have always equipped to be innate to the weapon as well. "Because why not? They did the same to Damage and Multishot after all..."

Edited December 5, 2017 by Maercurial

[Comrade]

47 minutes ago, Maercurial said:

 

Of course, I said that it's a simplified example, I'm aware that there are more than 8 variable mods to fill the limited space, but that only further proves my point... the more (useful) mods, the more possible builds. There's nothing wrong with niche builds, in fact many niche builds can be quite fun once you get the idea. There's only a problem when mods are never used, but that's not because of mandatory mods, they're not the one to blame here, no, that's because the mods that are never used are, let's be honest here, just S#&$ty outdated mods that need an overhaul/buff to them to put them back into the pool of variable (useful) mods people would consider in a build. 

 

Could I offer that instead of just removing the necessary mods, DE also gives a balancing pass to old mods to make them as usable as your status/crit mods? I think the frustration of necessary mods doesn't stem singularly from the whole "build diversity" idea, but also consider: WHY does DE give us 8 slots and 60 mod points if you automatically have to use 14-22 of those immediately or your weapon won't match others in any capacity? I think players feel cheated of those two extra spaces- If your argument is that fewer spots= more diversity, why not remove two slots from our weapons & reduce overall mod points as well as take out the mods? It would save players forma and time spent having to put the mods on at a minimum cost, after all. It's because players would feel even worse about their choices in terms of building a weapon differently.

With powercreep, i agree. removing the mods and just giving those two slots would give weapons the potential to be considerably more powerful, and the thing is that's not a terrible thing. With Eidolons DE has made an enemy that the most powerful weapons can't oneshot without buffs, which has lead players to once again seek the great damage cap and powercreep more or less has naturally advanced. In the forseeable future DE will add new, stronger eidolons and other bosses and stronger enemies, so why not increaase a player's ability to match them? On a final note on powercreep, Warframe is above all a power trip game- it exists to empower the player and make them feel like they're doing a lot of cool &#! S#&$- pushing the boundaries of power like it was Dragon Ball Z is a quarter of DE's playbook.

[KiroTheTraveler]

They could have their own unique space like Exilus mods and do not take up any mod space

[Maercurial]

vor 11 Minuten schrieb Comrade:

Could I offer that instead of just removing the necessary mods, DE also gives a balancing pass to old mods to make them as usable as your status/crit mods?

Sure, I'm all for that, and that's what they've chosen to do instead of the vague ideas thrown around for Damage 3.0. One recent example: With the addition of Zaw Arcanes, Channeling your Melee Weapon is now much more viable, and I've made a really powerful Zaw using Channeling Mods and the Arcane that buffs Channeling damage that I would have never used otherwise because most Channeling Mods were useless and didn't even get a second thought because it was inferior to Status/Crit or using abilities in every way imaginable. Now, I've actually replaced Blood Rush with Finishing Touch on that Zaw Build, and it's powerfull as hell. 

Yes, Channeling still needs some work, but it's a first step that brought a bunch of obsolete outdated Mods back into the light. We need more of that, more options, not less. 

vor 17 Minuten schrieb Comrade:

WHY does DE give us 8 slots and 60 mod points if you automatically have to use 14-22 of those immediately or your weapon won't match others in any capacity? I think players feel cheated of those two extra spaces- If your argument is that fewer spots= more diversity, why not remove two slots from our weapons & reduce overall mod points as well as take out the mods? It would save players forma and time spent having to put the mods on at a minimum cost, after all. It's because players would feel even worse about their choices in terms of building a weapon differently.

You're basically answering the question yourself. DE wants players to use Forma and spend time in the game, removing Slots would be contrary to that, and these slots being there but usually occupied is still more of a choice than removing them completely. Even now there are niche builds that will sacrifice Serration for 100% Status Chance to create a Weapon that's solely there to strip armor in a support situation, not to deal damage.* These spots are usually taken up by the Mandatory Mods, and I've explained why I don't think that's bad, but there's still the option to leave them out to get to 100% Status for example, which can be beneficial on some support weapons that won't be there to do damage anyway.

*And most builds won't even require you to remove Serration to get there, so I don't think we're at a point where we have so many -good- mods that the two slots for Serration/Multishot are a reason to feel cheated. Them being there is justified in terms of balance and variety. Actually, I think 2-3 out of 8 Slots being Mandatory might be just about the right ratio, the problem would start once we have more than half of our Slots filled with absolutely mandatory choices. Yes fewer spots, more diversity, but there's also a point where that eventually shifts and we'd simply have not enough slots to create basic builds because they'd need more space than available by any means. Limitation is good and adds to the variety as long as it does not strangle builds.

But then, once we get much more variable Mods, they might add another slot eventually, maybe something like Exilus for Weapons, but that's still a few dozens of really useful/powerful Mods in the future and also assumes that these new Mods do not replace current ones as a more popular choice (like Body Count => Drifting Contact), but need to be alongside of them.

vor einer Stunde schrieb Comrade:

With powercreep, i agree. removing the mods and just giving those two slots would give weapons the potential to be considerably more powerful, and the thing is that's not a terrible thing. With Eidolons DE has made an enemy that the most powerful weapons can't oneshot without buffs, which has lead players to once again seek the great damage cap and powercreep more or less has naturally advanced. In the forseeable future DE will add new, stronger eidolons and other bosses and stronger enemies, so why not increaase a player's ability to match them? On a final note on powercreep, Warframe is above all a power trip game- it exists to empower the player and make them feel like they're doing a lot of cool &#! S#&$- pushing the boundaries of power like it was Dragon Ball Z is a quarter of DE's playbook.

I agree 100% with the idea that Warframes are supposed to be over the top powerwise, it's the powerfantasy it delivers and the freedom that comes with such a design choice that makes it unique, and that's definitely a considerable part of the games success. But there's still some sort of balance to keep, although way less restrictive than most other games define "balance", while powercreep is going to happen and is already happening, it should always happen within reasonable boundaries. You don't want to overshoot here, and adding two slots without any need for them would be way too much, that'd just be mindless powercreep for no good reason. The Eidolons can still be easily dealt with, with existing builds using the amount of slots we have available efficiently. 

[LameLaYou]

The idea with crit chance is that there is a spectrum going on - weapons that perform best when built for crit and hence benefit most from crit mods, weapons that can be built for crit, but can also be built for other things like status, and weapons that don’t benefit from crit mods at all. The spectrum here is what makes crit mods not “mandatory” so to speak, and the same goes for other mechanics such as the other prominent case of status chance, or others such as punch through and fire rate.

With serration and it’s equivalents however, it’s a bit iffy because there only exists a small selection of weapons that actually do well without having them on. As an earlier poster mentioned, there are builds centered around status for stuff like fast armor removal, but that’s about it. Meaning there’s hardly any reason to ditch the mod in favor of something else. Besides, more damage kills stuff faster and that’s ultimately what you want to do to everything you see so it complements every build that exists. 

So unless there comes a mechanic that helps us achieve our goal of killing without the use of direct damage mods, serration and its likes will pretty much feel mandatory on all weapons.

[(PSN)Stealth_Cobra]

I don't really get the point of damage 3.0 myself. I get what they are trying to accomplish, but I have a feeling it will litterally have no impact whatsoever.

People look for the most min-maxed builds. If you remove a couple near mandatory damage mods from the equation, new mods will take their place. People will do their testing on the remaining mods and will figure out the best-in-slot replacement to the old mods and in a couple of months it'll be exactly the same situation, but with a few different mods.

In the meanwhile, this would create extreme frustrations in the community for the following reasons :

1 - People have sunk numerous formas over the years to build their weapons to peak performance. Let's say for example they remove serration and barrel diffision... That's two V polarities that are no longer needed. Let's say the replacement people find are two - 90% Elemental Mods... That forces everyone to reforma most of their gear.

2 - Likewise, in a split second, this would litterally invalidate 4 years of build videos for most warframe streamers.

[rushari]

Removing base damage mods would be too problematic. Especially after introducing rivens. But imho a special flat damage mod slot could work better. They can gather damage, multishot, crit, crit chance mods in the same pool so player can chose the one that suits the build. Rivens also have to be revamped especially with several direct damage mods on them.