Gunsen quick melee (fanning animation)

[Staggeringking]

Enjoying this weapon so far, looking forward to seeing how this weapon category expands in future.

However, I (personally) have one huge issue with it so far:

The "fanning" animation at the end of the quick melee combo. I don't mind it on some of the stance combos as much but, as fancy as it looks, it really affects the actual combat use of this weapon. Every second you stand there fanning yourself, basically animation locked (as far as I've noticed), this opens you up to all sources of damage with no way to avoid it. 

To be fair, the multiple attacks performed from the 3rd part of the quick melee combo are extremely fast and include a knockdown, which is fantastic, but this knockdown only affects a small area if not only a single target, so in practise it usually knocks down one enemy, and while you fan yourself, every other enemy can attack you freely (bare in mind you are in melee ranges).

If I had to make a suggestion, I think removing the fanning animation from the quick melee (at least) would make this much less punishing to use. Alternatively, make the fanning animation INTERRUPTIBLE (e.g. casting abilities will override the fanning animation, maybe even rolling) this suggestion is my preferred as I understand the point of the fanning animation existing is because....they are fans, but after a while of use, it's hard to ignore how punishing this can be. (Corrupted crewmen are the worst offenders, especially on Mot)

NOTES:

• I DON'T think this NEEDS to be changed, but it would help it perform in higher level content better (in my opinion) where quicker response times are very important.
• Cleaving Whirlwind "spin to win" combo (forgot actual name) has a punishing aspect to it as well, if you spin too much, you get staggered, but this is EASILY avoidable.
• There is no justification for this fanning animation in terms of "the warframe feels too hot"
• Don't get me wrong, I really like this weapon type, I'd just like to see it perform even better.

If anyone has any tips to work around this fanning animation lock, please share. (Not "use Iron Skin/Inaros so it doesn't matter if you get hit.")

Other than that, sorry if this is the wrong place to post this, thanks for all the awesome content DE, and happy holidays :)

 

[MJ12]

Another way to make the fanning animation interesting and/or not punishing would be to give damage/CC resistance in the taunt.

[Sapphic-Sandra]

I'm like 99% sure this weapon is going to get a hotfix. The awkward fanning animation and the listing of 'magazine size' make me wonder if that's when its supposed to be thrown. Idk, needs work either way I agree.

[FluffyArsonist]

the whole stance in general looks and feel pretty terrible, to me. i was expecting something elegant, and smooth. what i got was short ranged slapping and immobile seizures.

[Fallen_Echo]

16 hours ago, Staggeringking2 said:

Cleaving Whirlwind "spin to win" combo (forgot actual name) has a punishing aspect to it as well, if you spin too much, you get staggered, but this is EASILY avoidable.

Cleaving whirlwind? This weapon accepts heavy blade mods?

[VoxGray]

3 hours ago, Fallen_Echo said:

Cleaving whirlwind? This weapon accepts heavy blade mods?

It's a cross-reference to another, similarly egregious animation. Using the Broken Bull combo of Cleaving Whirlwind can also lock you in an animation, as the quick melee for the Gunsen does. Difference is, Broken Bull has to be deliberately activated and extended to get to that point, and so is easily avoidable. With the Gunsen, on the other hand, the animation lock is part of the basic combo, and happens after only a couple of inputs. It's needlessly punishing for such a basic interaction.

 

(It'd be friggin awesome if you could use Cleaving Whirlwind on the Gunsen tho. Cleave all the things!)

Edited December 23, 2017 by EmissaryOfInfinity

[Fallen_Echo]

37 minutes ago, EmissaryOfInfinity said:

It's a cross-reference to another, similarly egregious animation. Using the Broken Bull combo of Cleaving Whirlwind can also lock you in an animation, as the quick melee for the Gunsen does. Difference is, Broken Bull has to be deliberately activated and extended to get to that point, and so is easily avoidable. With the Gunsen, on the other hand, the animation lock is part of the basic combo, and happens after only a couple of inputs. It's needlessly punishing for such a basic interaction.

 

(It'd be friggin awesome if you could use Cleaving Whirlwind on the Gunsen tho. Cleave all the things!)

To be fair when i read it the first thing that came to my mind is using the tempo royale spinning quick melee to cover large area with it.

[notHunky]

The fanning animations absolutely need to go. Having an animation lock which does nothing is bad enough by itself, but putting an extremely long one into the basic button mash combo just makes it far worse since it's fairly easy to have a bad input during the pause combo and end up being punished with the basic attack. This will get you killed on higher level difficulties.

At least the animation lock on the Broken Bull combo with Cleaving Whirlwind is preceded by several really powerful attacks which make the stagger justified after spinning like 7 times, and it can easily be avoided.

If the fanning animation has to stay, at least give it a risk/reward aspect by following up with an attack which opens up enemies to finishers or inflicts them with a guaranteed slash proc or something.

 

Other than that, I like the weapon so far.

[Chipputer]

Gunsen are 99% style, 1% substance. They have amazing stats and they're held back by them trying too hard to make their combat use seem flashy and elegant. Superfluous animations need to go and should only be present in wind ups (a little style doesn't hurt, after all) or idle animations.

Cleaving Whirlwind's dizzy animation, as stated, is justified, deliberately activated after the first few accidental times, and is a drawback to one of, if not the, most powerful melee combos in the game. Nothing the Gunsen does justifies any amount of animation lock or stutter.

[DreamsmithJane]

I think the fan stance needs to have automatic blocking during its combos. War fans were meant to be used for deflecting projectiles anyway. Also, the stance is weirdly immobile for such a lightweight and low range weapon.

[Wharrgarble]

Automatic Parry & Riposte, maybe?

[ShiraHagane]

for now just do a slide attack to bypass it

[Staggeringking]

13 minutes ago, ShiraHagane said:

for now just do a slide attack to bypass it

Yeah, I've been doing this but the fan slide attack propels you so far forward that it isn't always worth doing when you're swarmed with enemies right in front of you, plus the slide attack animation still has a pause before any damage is dealt. Also the 3rd attack with the fanning animation does a lot of damage, so I still prefer to use that.

But sliding between enemies is great for cancelling the combo, when they die from the first two attacks.

[ZinGrin]

The fanning would be fine if there was something else happening while I'm cooling off.

Any way to add a fan throw, kick, or a stab/slice with the other fan during the animation?

[LSG501]

On 23/12/2017 at 7:25 AM, FluffyArsonist said:

the whole stance in general looks and feel pretty terrible, to me. i was expecting something elegant, and smooth. what i got was short ranged slapping and immobile seizures.

I'm in the dislike camp too, while the weapons themself seem to do a fair bit of damage the stance really doesn't feel like it's got any 'flow' to it due to the way it 'stops' you moving forward to do moves etc, even if you're running forwards.

[White_Matter]

All we need is attack/animation cancelling. I've died so many times because of not being able to cancel animations. Especially  if it is a slow melee. You spam buttons, characters starts to execute a combo, then you see a threat and want to jump away or use an ability but no, your character goes through the whole animation before he can do anything else and you die.

Just implement animation cancelling which should be triggered by jumping/rolling/casting.