Nekros Soul Punch Rework

[(XBOX)DarkDominator14]

I just thought I would make a post about how there are a few reworks in process and thought it would be a good time to mention how bad Nekros’s Soul Punch is. If anyone has any ideas for this leave them below because he is probably my favorite warframe to use so I just want him to see him for more than a farming source. I don’t care if the ability is completely changed or just have changed stats but as of now it’s just bad. 

 

If if anyone is seeing it for a second time I accidentally put it in off topic

[GinKenshin]

it's a 1st for an 'amazing' set of abilities, what did you expect?

it's usable and doesn't have to reworked, plus there're more important frames to look at 

[(XBOX)DarkDominator14]

Yeah I guess but if you look at other first abilities like volts it’s just the worst I’ve tried a build for a damaging Soul Punch and it did almost nothing but rag dolled the enemy

[DarkSkysz]

Just now, (Xbox One)DarkDominator14 said:

Yeah I guess but if you look at other first abilities like volts it’s just the worst I’ve tried a build for a damaging Soul Punch and it did almost nothing but rag dolled the enemy

That is the skil main function...ragdoll things.

[NinjasPlay4Fun]

Well I had some ideas while reading.
the first of them is that soul punch could be like Virulence of Nidus.
Each dead enemy with soul punch would count 1 stack of souls, only without a stacks limit ... and every 100 or 150 souls collected nekros would gain buffs like power strength, passive efficiency / strength, range ... etc

Well this is my idea, I hope you like it!

[(XBOX)DarkDominator14]

5 minutes ago, GinKenshin said:

it's a 1st for an 'amazing' set of abilities, what did you expect?

it's usable and doesn't have to reworked, plus there're more important frames to look at 

If you do have a build involving a damage Soul Punch let me know because I want to use it but nothing really works with it

[(XBOX)DarkDominator14]

Just now, NinjasPlay4Fun said:

Well I had some ideas while reading.
the first of them is that soul punch could be like Virulence of Nidus.
Each dead enemy with soul punch would count 1 stack of souls, only without a stacks limit ... and every 100 or 150 souls collected nekros would gain buffs like power strength, passive efficiency / strength, range ... etc

Well this is my idea, I hope you like it!

Yeah an idea like that would be really cool to work with

[(XBOX)DarkDominator14]

NinjasPlay4Fun said this if you can’t read it

 

Well I had some ideas while reading.
the first of them is that soul punch could be like Virulence of Nidus.
Each dead enemy with soul punch would count 1 stack of souls, only without a stacks limit ... and every 100 or 150 souls collected nekros would gain buffs like power strength, passive efficiency / strength, range ... etc

Well this is my idea, I hope you like it

[(PSN)MrNishi]

A simple tweak of allowing Projectile damage scale off a percentage of Enemy Target Armor/Health like Oberon Smite would definitely give the base damage some more going distance.

 

Also I would very much prefer that Soul Punch gets the ability to dispel a targeted Shadow Clone to either deal AoE damage and/or AoE heal (Dispersing the Shadows health to those around it hurting foes and healing allies)

Values of damage/heal would be based off remaining health of Targets Shadow Minion*

(Basically allowing Freeze->Snowglobe like Synergy but also allowing Nekros to have better control over which Shadow Minions are spawned.)

 

TL;DR - Change Soul Punch Projectile damage to be Fixed % of Targeted Enemy Health+Armor

& Allow Soul Punch synergy cast on Shadow Clone to dispel that Clone/Minion for AoE damage and heal based on remaining health value.

[GinKenshin]

1 hour ago, (Xbox One)DarkDominator14 said:

If you do have a build involving a damage Soul Punch let me know because I want to use it but nothing really works with it

It’s not suppose to do dmg, it’s for CC....

 

Last time I checked, nekros was a support frame, not dps 

 

  You’re basically saying that you want trinity’s Blessing to do dmg. It’s not meant to do that, neither does soul punch

[o.0-]

All I'd want is for Soul Punch to do something with Shadows.

Maybe Soul Punch could make them explode to cycle through the Shadows in the list. The exploding Shadow could either send a heal pulse for the other Shadows as new one is brought up or deals damage, I like the heal pulse idea better.

[(XBOX)DarkDominator14]

GinKenshin I’m just trying to relay some ideas with other people who have better ideas for Soul Punch like MrNishi(which I saw your post and I think that that would be cool as well) and NinjasPlay4Fun and SPARTAN-187.Thanatos

I don’t care if it doesn’t do damage but I just want it to do something useful because it’s just bad regardless of how anyone puts it 

Edited January 23, 2018 by (XB1)DarkDominator14

[(XBOX)DarkDominator14]

3 minutes ago, SPARTAN-187.Thanatos said:

All I'd want is for Soul Punch to do something with Shadows.

Maybe Soul Punch could make them explode to cycle through the Shadows in the list. The exploding Shadow could either send a heal pulse for the other Shadows as new one is brought up or deals damage, I like the heal pulse idea better.

Nice idea I like the idea about having a link between Soul Punch and Shadows

[(PSN)MrNishi]

34 minutes ago, GinKenshin said:

It’s not suppose to do dmg, it’s for CC....

 

Last time I checked, nekros was a support frame, not dps 

 

  You’re basically saying that you want trinity’s Blessing to do dmg. It’s not meant to do that, neither does soul punch

That is a bit of an extreme comment to make isn't it.

Is Ember's Fireball only for CC and not Damage?

Ember Fireball is 400 damage and Soul Punch is 500 damage...

Difference lies in that Fireball AoE damage is 150 and scales with Powerstrength mods

Vs

Soul Punch Projectile is 50 direct and 100 AoE but not affected by Powerstrength

So with no mods the claimed CC only ability is more damaging than DPS ability...are we playing the same game.

Some players do mod Nekros with Powerstrength for Shield of Shadows Damage Mitigation, Health, Armor, and Minion Damage; Creeping Terrify enemy slow plus the number of affected enemies scales with Powerstrength; and some rarely might decide they want Soul Survivor to actually give rezzed allies with more than 50% health. (By Ordis is this Mod Bad, aside from all but emergency VIP ranged pickup) (Literally Soul Survivor can be the most expensive ability in the game...)

• I swear Soul Survivor should use Powerstrength additively like Creeping Terrify or Molecular Prime. Then 170% Powerstrength would resurrect target at 100% health.

Back to Soul Punch Damage...I do agree that it scales poorly for Damage and thus it serves as a Utility ability in later usage.

However players don't seem to be modding Nekros in higher levels with minis Powerstrength as it lowers the CC of Terrify (Creeping Terrify) and lowers effectiveness of Shadows of the Dead(Shield of Shadows).

Players that are picking up Nekros for the 1st time might assume that Shadows of the Dead and Soul Punch are Nekros' DPS Abilities and by their descriptions that would be correct.

 

Just as Trinity can contribute to Damage with Link and Energy Vampire.

• there was a ton me when Ogris + Link Trinity was a common DPS build, that still provided Energy and made the team immortal

 

[Rhekemi]

2 hours ago, (PS4)MrNishi said:

TL;DR - Change Soul Punch Projectile damage to be Fixed % of Targeted Enemy Health+Armor

& Allow Soul Punch synergy cast on Shadow Clone to dispel that Clone/Minion for AoE damage and heal based on remaining health value.

 

I like these suggestions the most. Don't have any of my own to add at this time.

For the OP, copy paste from the other thread:

I've never tried to max his power strength (to see how hard it could hit at high levels), but then I don't use him like a mage. I use Soul Punch to knockdown targets between reloads, mostly. Bombard still has a bit of health and he's about to fire a rocket at my face? Soul Punch, reload, now he's dead/Soul Punch, melee, my face is safe.

It's the guaranteed knockdown and ragdoll that I like. I still kill with my guns and melee weapon. 

But overall, and without knowing if it can be modded to one-shot, I'd agree; Soul Punch doesn't hit hard at high levels. (Again, unsure.)

__

While he was never intended to be a DPS mage, Nekros isn't just a farmer, though. Try building him for survivability and look into his powerful augments.

[frostyhobo]

it should have some sort of healing factor maybe restore shields if you kill them heal yourself if you don't

[(PSN)TertulSee]

5 hours ago, (Xbox One)DarkDominator14 said:

I just thought I would make a post about how there are a few reworks in process and thought it would be a good time to mention how bad Nekros’s Soul Punch is. If anyone has any ideas for this leave them below because he is probably my favorite warframe to use so I just want him to see him for more than a farming source. I don’t care if the ability is completely changed or just have changed stats but as of now it’s just bad. 

 

If if anyone is seeing it for a second time I accidentally put it in off topic

Make Soul Punch guaranteed a slash  proc. That way, it will synergise with Desecrate and split enemies in half.

Edited January 23, 2018 by (PS4)godlysparta

[Dornam]

I've posted this before in my own thread, but giving it the ability to be hold-casted on shadows to unsummon them so that you can summon more powerful shadows without having to wait for all of your shadows to die.

[Andele3025]

Among all of the 1 slot abilities, Soul Punch (or to be precise soul slap) is among the best (probably only outdone by Saryns Spores and Ivara Sleep). The whole "enemies hit by soul get tickled" is a pointless gimmick, but the core function of the ability itself (to deal ok damage/hits basic goons in sorties for at least a quarter of their hp and launch a non-heavy enemy via Tenno Space Program across half the map).

IF advocating for a buff on it, it would be a) Making its cc work in full effect on all enemies that are not giant bosses b) giving it a proper augment (e.g. tagged enemy gets added to shadow pool once).

As for it being used to be able to destroy shadows, id rather see a "Technoctyle control" item added (possibly as a quest from Simaris) that one would farm along with lephantis when getting necros which lets people choose the preferences on what enemy gets put into the shadow pool (e.g. you dont want want Commanders and Hellions, but Scorch and Scorpion units summoned among grineer or Tech and Sniper crewmen over MOA units among corpus) once you scanned the enemies so that you wouldnt get into a situation where you would want to destroy your shadows at all in the first place.

[o.0-]

4 minutes ago, Andele3025 said:

As for it being used to be able to destroy shadows, id rather see a "Technoctyle control" item added (possibly as a quest from Simaris) that one would farm along with lephantis when getting necros which lets people choose the preferences on what enemy gets put into the shadow pool (e.g. you dont want want Commanders and Hellions, but Scorch and Scorpion units summoned among grineer or Tech and Sniper crewmen over MOA units among corpus) once you scanned the enemies so that you wouldnt get into a situation where you would want to destroy your shadows at all in the first place.

From a conceptual basis, I like this idea, I've thought about this along similar lines in the past, I wonder then if this would be seen like in the Codex listings or maybe a new, yet similar menu? Just wonder how the nuts and bolts for this would be setup.

[Andele3025]

12 minutes ago, SPARTAN-187.Thanatos said:

From a conceptual basis, I like this idea, I've thought about this along similar lines in the past, I wonder then if this would be seen like in the Codex listings or maybe a new, yet similar menu? Just wonder how the nuts and bolts for this would be setup.

Simpler version of mandachord Tavi gets (as in sub-option in appearance menu), if you mean from the coding side, the game already has a priority list and a kill memory cap of 20 so its unlikely that it doesnt have its own table or index file. Hell, it might even be the basis for DE to sell different texture packs for the shadows... but lets not give them any naughty ideas.

[o.0-]

1 minute ago, Andele3025 said:

Simpler version of mandachord Tavi gets (as in sub-option in appearance menu), if you mean from the coding side, the game already has a priority list and a kill memory cap of 20 so its unlikely that it doesnt have its own table or index file. Hell, it might even be the basis for DE to sell different texture packs for the shadows... but lets not give them any naughty ideas.

Hmm, just unclear on Tavi, I could see a sort of toggle on a List of enemies inside a menu.

Because yeah, there is supposed to be a list and cap, the question is what tools could access that data from the player's side to add such customization, most likely from the Orbiter.

[DarkSkysz]

Soul punch could pull the soul out of the body of the enemy (more or less like the Ballistica Prime) and leaving the enemy souless(stunned). That would create a second body to desecrate, when its killed.