A message to the discouraged veterans

[Currilicious]

Been a veteran in multiple MMOs over the years. Not sure if I can call myself that in Warframe but there is always one similarity.

A game starts small with a simple premise and builds around that. It attracts a small niche of players. This group will eventually be the veterans and ambassadors for said game.

Over time the game grows, so does the community and the demands on content. This is where the game has to diverge from its initial vision and cater to the masses.

It is inevitable. It is not tragic. When I was younger, I tend to agree with doom-mongers. But eventually getting involved in the industry as a software developer in my youth I am no longer that naive.

As gamers, we want better features, QOL, stability and also new content. All those cost man hours. If the game is only ever going to appeal to a small segment, how is it ever going to cope?

Do you get paid for your work? Well guess what, people in DE have families to feed too.

TL;DR: Games no matter how niche at inception will want to appeal to the masses eventually. This is inevitable in order to boost revenue and continue development.

 

Edited February 23, 2018 by Currilicious

[DxAdder]

People leave games for the same reason : Lack of Content.

DE has shaped there game to cater to the free to play model which means End Game content is there last consideration.

 

 

[Horaciozhao]

can´t say for everyone, but I´ve been in the game since it was out of closed beta. And I can say that for me, raid is one of the least thing I care about this game, just after PVP.

[TheErebus.]

I guess I'm a veteran then. 
See, as much as I hate seeing the direction WF is going and DE doing what they typically do, I can't ever really get away from WF. The forums, the game, the community was such a big part of a good 3 years of my life that I can't just go away. I've taken breaks sure, hell I even said once that I decided to quite the game but I came back for a little bit. 

5 hours ago, --Q--Nyu said:

If you're a veteran then you should know better than this. DE will always make these gross changes from time to time, but things can get better. Maybe. 

I'm not gonna speak for all the "veterans", but you see; it hasn't gotten better. For me at least, I see the same problems popping up time and time again. Whenever they take a step forward it's great, but I see more steps back with every update. 

[Fluff-E-Kitty]

Iv been here sints 2013

<-< I just get bored and do other stuff on occasion.

[GunRunnerX]

7 hours ago, --Q--Nyu said:

if you don't know what to do, you can make a build for everything in the game. Get rid of that Steel Charge on Ember, or Equinox. Make actual optimized builds. While it might not seem like it has a purpose now, because we have no where to really use them, always plan ahead. This doesn't mean that the future doesn't hold a challenge.

Your post is slated in very positive wording, which is nice because normally this topic is met with an angry mob.  Although I would still argue, there's no point to making optimized builds because you don't need them.  You can basically clear 99% of the content the game has to offer in sub-par equipment.  And if the counter argument is that it's still good for planning ahead, traditionally DE is great at changing mechanics so often that you can't actually plan.  And even if you could plan for future challenges, the trend over the last many years since Warframe was in beta is that there will be no future challenges.

My Rhino without any formas on the frame, and a 5 forma Opticor can basically cover any content and it took very little time investment to obtain the equipment.  I have plenty of other frames and weapons which can be fun to switch into and also can equally handle any content, but my point is I don't need any of it except for posterity.  I'm left with no actual tangible goals to work towards other than fashion frame.

[ikkabotz]

deleted

Edited February 24, 2018 by komoriblues

[Guest]

If anything, really, the only reason why I still stick to the game after two and a half years, other than of course the ridiculous amount of time invested for a game and money as well, is because of only one thing - the movement system.

I am so used to moving fast in Warframe that I simply find all other games like a snail's crawl. 

Admittedly, there is little to capture the attention of longer time players anymore, but that happens for pretty much any game. Warframe going Casual is in fact not entirely unwelcome, especially when time to play has always been getting very limited for me.

[-Shikari-]

I honestly have stopped playing even more than twice a week since the Plains update, because I thoroughly dislike the direction of this. 
But I can see the appeal, and will continue to support the game I used to love, but now play sometimes. 
I still haven't leveled the first amp, or maxed out rep in Cetus, which is a surprise because I used to love that grind. 

Edited February 24, 2018 by -Shikari-

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

13 hours ago, NullSaint said:

Honestly, if they are just going to run around cheesing the crap out of everything then coming to the forum to complain about how easy it all is, I'm good with them leaving. Grandpa is fun, but you can only invite him to play Gears of War with you so many times before you get sick of hearing, "You know, in my day we didn't have...."

THIS!   I don't WANT anyone to leave, and I don't have anything against "long-time players" (not usin' the damned "vet" term.  That should be a skill-based title, not length of playtime.)  but too many people PURPOSELY seek to break the game mechanics...and then complain about it not being fun.  

DE is trying so hard to make the game enjoyable for EVERYONE.  You can't hate on them for not being able to please the game-breakers.  Nor should they.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

13 hours ago, Flareux said:

From someone (me) who's not happy about the changes:

I'm just a tiny little mad person that's sad i spend 1,5k plat on arcane enrgize back then, for the price to only get obliterated into the ground with people now being able to go uncordinated, (if really into it) 6 times a day and get 3 arcanes in a go. If you're fast you can even do harry, terry and larry 2 times a night.

It's just pure old frustration, but i'll get over it. Not something that's gonna make me leave at all. Just so frustrating with the time and effort spend into it.

 

What you're frustrated with is Capitalism and a Free Market, not DE or Warframe.

People could invest in Uber today....and tomorrow, flying automatic self-driving cars are a thing, and Uber's business model falls, along with their shares/stocks.

That's how a Free Economy works.  And it's honestly better that way, because it is ALSO the same way in reverse, allowing someone with nothing to make a TON of small investments of time or resources.

Remember, DE doesnt set prices.  Players ask for prices, and you either choose to pay it or you keep looking/farming.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

11 hours ago, Currilicious said:

Been a veteran in multiple MMOs over the years. Not sure if I can call myself that in Warframe but there is always one similarity.

A game starts small with a simple premise and builds around that. It attracts a small niche of players. This group will eventually be the veterans and ambassadors for said game.

Over time the game grows, so does the community and the demands on content. This is where the game has to diverge from its initial vision and cater to the masses.

It is inevitable. It is not tragic. When I was younger, I tend to agree with doom-mongers. But eventually getting involved in the industry as a software developer in my youth I am no longer that naive.

As gamers, we want better features, QOL, stability and also new content. All those cost man hours. If the game is only ever going to appeal to a small segment, how is it ever going to cope?

Do you get paid for your work? Well guess what, people in DE have families to feed too.

TL;DR: Games no matter how niche at inception will want to appeal to the masses eventually. This is inevitable in order to boost revenue and continue development.

 

THANK YOU for "getting it"!  I've been trying to say this across several threads for a bit now...people seem to just think that because people are playing, companies "make money".  During a brief stint as a full time Twitch streamer, people thought "Well, you have hundreds of followers so you can afford x, y, z giveaways!"  

I was like...nope.  Window Shoppers =/= transactions.

Same thing here. It's wonderful that DE has made a TRUE f2p game....but understand all of you who "I refuse to spend on plat!" ....It is not YOU who supports Warframe. It is the new player who wants the new shiny frames -now- and can't wait...who buys the new Prime Packs, etc.  Not to say others don't, but the numbers much favor the new players here.

So, yeah....new blood beats "fans and vets" any day from a business standpoint.  It's why, even though I'm content where I'm at, I'll still spend a few bucks here and there where I can afford it to support the devs.  It isn't much, but...they've given me much more than I've given them, for sure.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

Also, a further note on changes, rebalancing, etc...and "disrupting the market", so on...  

Warframe isn't much different in this respect than the TCG, Magic: The Gathering (or other TCGs, really).  People spend tons of hours and money trading, buying, selling cards, all in an effort to assemble "the perfect meta deck".  They amass a valuable collection.

Then they have this "Perfect Deck" and win all the time because, congrats, they found the broken mechanics.  "This game is boring!!"
So the TCG comes out with a new set, releasing more balanced cards, or changing the rules and making certain decks/cards illegal for Standard play.  

"WAAAAH!! They ruined it!  How can they take x Card out of the game?!  I spent so much time!  Now my Card Shop on Ebay is WORTHLESS!!" 

and yet...the TCG continues on.  The meta shifts, people adapt, and we keep having fun. 

It isn't an attempt to alienate anyone.  It is an attempt to keep the game from stagnating.

This is something Warframe IS doing, whether or not players want to acknowledge this on the forums, or elsewhere. 

[(PSN)johnsoigne]

It’s just people with no experience in mmo rpg genre prior to Warframe. It’s ridiculous how they call themselves “veterans” lol. New players will have to catch up to a point where developers can develop new contents. New players will get gears easier because there is whole new things coming to grind the S#&amp;&#036; out of their ass. It happens with all the other mmo games. Older contents will become easier as time passes it’s just inevitable. It’s basic predicament when you set your foot in a mmo game. Warframe doesn’t even remotley slap “veterans” in the face like other games do. Look how much time new players will have to grind if they start this game right now to get to the point where old players are standing. Hell no, this game didn’t reduce any grind at all. We still need 24 hours to craft a forma. And you cry about things like arcane.. come on. Warframe is not even remotely being hostile to “veteran” players. If you’re crying about these stuff then you’re obviously a noob to gaming. 

Your power level stops getting higher pretty quickly in this game. It was just your choice to keep playing to collect everything. You didn’t get any more powerful than years ago. There is no such thing as veteran in this game. You don’t need any skill. Point and click is all. You just put more time and know where things are so you don’t have to look up wikipedia all the time that’s it.

What veteran players actually need right now at this point is legendary items to show off such as Excalibur prime or some ridiculously op weapons that everyone looks up to. Used to be like 1-5 items exist in the entire game in old mmo games. This can be done with dark sectors.

Edited February 24, 2018 by (PS4)johnsoigne

[Misgenesis]

16 hours ago, --Q--Nyu said:

explain why X weapon is not as OP as most of the comments on the forum suggest.

tsk tsk, how cheeky

Anyway, a 'us' and a 'veteran' here to drop by and say that i just enjoy playing whatever the game has to give and unless they turn this into a MOBA im not quitting anytime soon, thanks.

[Xico.xide]

I'm a "veteran" (joined in 2013 when Nova came out) I guess, I never really got into raids and im not that sad to see them go, however I do wish to see 8 player mode to come to SOMETHING. I also sympathize with those who are distraught seeing their 1000p basically going down the drain with the arcanes being moved to the eidolons.

 

sorry for not having any "strong opinions" i guess, I've always just enjoyed what came to warframe and got added, the only thing that even has me mildly upset is 8 player going bye bye

Edited February 27, 2018 by Xico.xide

[Kimimoto]

I'm a "vet" and I don't think this is purely about raids, I think raids are definitely apart of it though. I'm more annoyed about the immense amount of systems on top of systems meant to give us power, but there's less and less "challenging" content everyday. I'm really hoping the Kuva in the fortress in Devstream107 is Endless and scaling, so I want to get Riven/Arcanes/MaxMyBuilds.

So much power with zip to use it on. 

[Kn0xxPT]

After playing WF for about 3 years with some come-and-go's ... I did take a long break now...
I really hated when they changed Valkyr stats ...(well it was needed) and the Relics/Void ( almost a removal), it seemed to me that, all time invested in fine-tuning, adapting to playstyle for various mechanics in the game, can mean nothing after 1 week. constants changes in the game, some good, some made me loose interess, I lost the need to reach super high-end tier with better mods and rivens. In the end WF is casual. I do have some rare items and builds, ( including Arcane Helmets, farmed in old Alerts )...

I now went to a big MMO where I can see where to go, and identify the path to reach there, and is up to me to reach there.
WF can be just a "path shifter" with no real sense of being Veteran / High End Content player, perfect skilled warframe combos. In some way I would like to say when I play the game, " Here, I no longer play in that Level zone, my gear score allows me to play in that zone level ( aka Void T4 long-runs )" ...

damm.... I really miss Void T4 runs ....

They just could add T5 runs... that sir ..

[Shockness]

We leave and we we come back, that's how it goes

[puppycorpse]

Alot of players just take a break. I'm a vet and took a few months away from the game. I mean people have lives lol. I wouldn't say vets are really leaving though. It is annoying to see the noob entitlement posts though 😋

[SeaUrchins]

I was expecting "don't let the door hit you" lol

[(PSN)dA_BLoK_iS_hOt]

On 2/23/2018 at 9:00 AM, kswong98 said:

To be honest I don't really think vets will care for those you stated :/
Only the newer players (>2015)  will probably :v

Yea I stopped reading after the first paragraph.

[(PSN)dA_BLoK_iS_hOt]

On 2/23/2018 at 9:50 AM, FashionFrame said:

well, the "You know, in my day we didn't have...." doesn't really work in terms of cheese, since it has always been a thing for this game. There's just always new forms of it as new stuff keeps coming out.

And I wouldn't say it's just veterans, that can be said for any player. I see people using memeing strike and spin to win tactics because they saw it was the "best thing ever" on youtube somewhere. Doesn't mean they're a veteran.

To be honest, I don't know what makes someone a veteran. Only people I see to be true vets are the founders, but that's just my opinion. I can't really say I'm a veteran despite the years I've played this game.

You've been playing for 4 years and you can't say if you're a Veteran or not? lol Funny. Don't let the community keep you from admitting you're a Vet.

Veteran: A person who has had a long experience in a particular field.

[FashionFrame]

1 minute ago, (PS4)dA_BLoK_iS_hOt said:

You've been playing for 4 years and you can't say if you're a Veteran or not? lol Funny. Don't let the community keep you from admitting you're a Vet.

Veteran: A person who has had a long experience in a particular field.

maybe read again what I, myself, me, defines as a veteran: "Only people I see to be true vets are the founders, but that's just my opinion. I can't really say I'm a veteran despite the years I've played this game."

But that's just me. My opinion

[(PSN)dA_BLoK_iS_hOt]

11 minutes ago, FashionFrame said:

maybe read again what I, myself, me, defines as a veteran: "Only people I see to be true vets are the founders, but that's just my opinion. I can't really say I'm a veteran despite the years I've played this game."

But that's just me. My opinion

Lol seemed to get a little upset. I will say it for you. You're a VETERAN.