Remove Sortie Spy Missions

[Sleepdebt]

5 hours ago, Broshambo said:

Defense Sorties were changed to 5 rounds from 10. That is because we realized 10 rounds is quite a long mission. 

when did this happen? i swear i did a defense sortie within the past few days and it was 10 waves and there's nothing about a reduction in latest patch notes

[DiabolusUrsus]

2 hours ago, Draugurr said:

The only benefit is if you won the lottery with people with two brain cells to rub together and finish it within minutes. Other than that there is absolutely no reason to run it Pub. 

Meaning you're probably better off just running it solo; you'll save more time in the long-run.

Not that Pubs failing Spy missions means they don't have two brain cells to rub together; anyone can screw up and the likelihood of doing so increases with latency. I have had runs where some of the Corpus Vault laser grids completely neglected to display, meaning I walked right into the first one when it was showing as "off."

[RedDirtTrooper]

1 hour ago, TheJagji said:

Pretty sure Alt-F$ing out of pub simply for being in pub counts as an RQ :P

I don't get angry about it, just frustrated with myself for not remembering to swap it over. Playing it would induce rage. I love spy missions, I get frustrated with other players even setting off alarms, much less failing to complete one of the vaults. So, why would I put myself through that? I only alt+f4 because it's faster to do that and relog than to sit through the loading screen, abort the mission, and sit through another loading screen to get back to my orbiter. It's about time efficiency, not because I'm upset.

[KochDerFrettchen]

I'd rather people who actually try to do the spy vaults, instead of farting around waiting for the dedicated-stealth-framer to do all three vaults for them.  Last spy sortie I did, I had to do all three vaults... as Mag, whilst the others did hot nothing.

Edited April 7, 2018 by KochDerFrettchen

[Draugurr]

10 hours ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Meaning you're probably better off just running it solo; you'll save more time in the long-run.

Not that Pubs failing Spy missions means they don't have two brain cells to rub together; anyone can screw up and the likelihood of doing so increases with latency. I have had runs where some of the Corpus Vault laser grids completely neglected to display, meaning I walked right into the first one when it was showing as "off."

It's when they run things like Ember and use her WOF or when someone says "if you don't know how to do it don't do it." They go and do it anyway and later say "I don't know how to do this" and trigger the alarm. It's those types of people i'm talking about. The people who seem to go out of their way to fail the mission.

[Ozamchist]

A hard no on that. Spy missions are probably the most fun out of the types of missions you can do in a sortie.

[AzureTerra]

If you don't want to risk a Spy then drop the group and do it on your own or only do it with people you know/trust to do well

[DatDarkOne]

20 hours ago, Broshambo said:

I fully understand the option to go solo(hence why i mentioned it) but we wouldn't be playing this game if we wanted to play by ourselves would we? 

I play this game specifically because I can go solo.  I never really understood the constant need some have for always playing with others.  It's cool at times, but not a necessity to have fun.  

That said, HELL NO to removing Spy Sorties.  

[MystMan]

 

15 minutes ago, (XB1)Cubic Clem said:

Spy wields no challenge whatsoever..

And yet threads like these exists. Clearly it is a challenge for those who keep failing at it. It's up to them to put up or shut up. 
If there truly was no challenge whatsoever, then we'd all be pubbing spy by now with no fear of failure. Those who keep failing spy are too stubborn to just look up guides on how to make spy runs really easy with any frame.
"I shouldn't have to look up guides"  <-- people who say that tend to suck at videogames in general, demanding constant handholding.

 

14 minutes ago, (XB1)Cubic Clem said:

Edit: NOT to mention when there's lag, where laser barriers completely bug out, which always means "ALARMS!" 

That's the host's problem, not the game.

 

10 minutes ago, (XB1)Cubic Clem said:

Edit No. 2: YES, remove spy from Sorties because it is not really affected by modifiers 

• Electromagnetic Anomalies  (those magnetic bubbles placed in the worst locations)
• Extreme Cold (sprinting is disabled, all our other movement actions are severely slowed down)
• Low Gravity (floaty effect like when using Zephyr, making our jumps difficult to control.)

These most definitely affect our behavior inside spy rooms.

[(PSN)El_Senior_Fats]

2 minutes ago, MystMan said:

 

And yet threads like these exists. Clearly it is a challenge for those who keep failing at it. It's up to them to put up or shut up. 
If there truly was no challenge whatsoever, then we'd all be pubbing spy by now with no fear of failure. Those who keep failing spy are too stubborn to just look up guides on how to make spy runs really easy with any frame.
"I shouldn't have to look up guides"  <-- people who say that tend to suck at videogames in general, demanding constant handholding.

 

That's the host's problem, not the game.

 

• Electromagnetic Anomalies  (those magnetic bubbles placed in the worst locations)
• Extreme Cold (sprinting is disabled, all our other movement actions are severely slowed down)
• Low Gravity (floaty effect like when using Zephyr, making our jumps difficult to control.)

These most definitely affect our behavior inside spy rooms.

I would add radiation hazard as well as it can trigger alarms during the mission.

 

The only problem with Spy missions is that if one person fails its over. So if you are playing with randoms this is a risk you must be willing to take, but there is no way around it, besides playing solo which is what I always do. I know a lot of people do them in pubs so they can get carried because they are either to lazy or too unfamiliar with the mechanics which is also another reason to run them solo.

I am new at the game but I cannot wait to see Lua's Spy sortie missions back again and check peoples reaction, I bet we will see many more posts like this then.

 

I mean, lets face it, sorties are not hard at all, they are not for me so I cannot imagine how easy this must be for those players who have been playing this game for years. Once you are properly equipped/geared they are easy to do or even solo. 

[DatDarkOne]

16 minutes ago, MystMan said:

And yet threads like these exists. Clearly it is a challenge for those who keep failing at it. It's up to them to put up or shut up. 
If there truly was no challenge whatsoever, then we'd all be pubbing spy by now with no fear of failure.

Exactly.  I also agree with the other parts of your post too.  

edit:  More people for more enemies doesn't quite make sense for spies as that mission type you don't have to kill any enemies.  

Edited April 7, 2018 by DatDarkOne

[Ham_Grenabe]

21 hours ago, Buff00n said:

I always pub spy sorties.  I run straight to A, and then go help out with B and C if needed.  Someone messes it up at most 1 in every 5 times.  More often that not, when that happens I'll offer to carry and we do it again with no issues.  Spy is fast.  I don't mind doing it twice, and I can't remember the last time I had to do it more than twice.

Maybe you're just picking a bad time of day?  I'm usually doing mine an hour or two after the daily reset at midnight UTC (not the sortie reset at noon EST).  

Here too -- it's extremely rare in my experience for a sortie spy failure (they're among the easiest sortie missions, IMO, because you don't have to kill anything, so your gear doesn't even have to be tuned up). 

I can remember 3 failed missions -- two on Uranus, and one on some corpus ice planet that was just a bad-luck death in the vault (rad hazard, I think). I assume there have been more that I'm not remembering, but it's really not that common. 

HOWEVER, I will not dispute that when one of your teammates blows a spy vault, you might feel somewhat irritated. That's natural; I have a feeling they're also feeling a little irritated, and probably embarrassed. 

Edited April 7, 2018 by Ham_Grenabe

[xxfiurionxx]

So... you want to take down my favourite secret simaris farm spot...

...Prepare to die...

Now seriously... Go solo lol

[Guest]

The only problem with Sortie spy is when there's:

1. Electromagnetic Anomaly - can mess your parkour real bad.

2. Extreme Cold - another thing that can mess up pakour

3. Radiation Hazard - probably the worst if the rad cloud happens to just be at the console. That is plain horrible. Triggering the alarm is a minor issue compared to that. I've even modded shields on my Loki just to hack in peace.

4. Infested Eximus Stronghold - toxin eximus can be as bad as the rad cloud, but at least is easily killable.

There's loads more missions worse than Sortie Spy for Sortie.

Edited April 7, 2018 by Guest

[KitMellow]

People do need to learn how to do Spy missions. So it's really not a big ask... it's literally part of the game.

If it takes them multiple failures to get things right during sorties, then so be it.

If you want something done properly, go do it yourself, Solo. Otherwise, lower your expectations and prepare to teach or work with others.

The real problem are trolls—when you have totally uncooperative people who are trying to make your life worse during Radiation sorties by killing other players on purpose, and destroying objectives... That's what should really be looked at by DE.

Edited April 7, 2018 by KitMellow

[DatDarkOne]

13 minutes ago, Datam4ss said:

Electromagnetic Anomaly - can mess your parkour real bad.

Operator Void Beam works wonders on those. 

[SenorClipClop]

22 hours ago, Broshambo said:

Players are forced to repeat public missions over and over again until they rage quit and are forced to do solo. 

Remove the pain of Sortie Spy missions. Pretty please.

Matchmake. Look for others who are Sortie 3. Or go solo and ensure all Vaults will be the responsibility of a player at whatever your skill level is. Sorties have Spy missions in order to test Tenno in the upper intensities of what missions this game offers. If you have a problem with doing this mission type in Public, don't do it in Public. There are other options.

Every time I see a thread like this (talking about how Public Spy Sortie is awful and should be removed and defending against playing Solo with "but it's a co-op game"), I can't help but wondering if the Tenno is just complaining because they hope to be carried by others, but sometimes aren't.

[Guest]

Just now, DatDarkOne said:

Operator Void Beam works wonders on those. 

Was simply exploring the problems with them. Not saying they are hard ;)

I've seen worse things in Sortie.

[SenorClipClop]

3 minutes ago, (XB1)Cubic Clem said:

And I can't hear the sentence "oh then play solo" anymore, so dito. 

Then matchmake. Get on the chat in Recruiting or your Clan, find other Tenno who know what they're doing. It takes a couple minutes but it's better than random players potentially screwing up your mission.

[Cosmic_Elf]

I prefer running sortie spies solo, since you have to successfully unlock/hack all 3 vaults. And if I mess up , i am the only one to blame ... well i do blame my Kubrow sometimes for failing to turn invisible on certain occasions. Lua is one the hardest spy missions in the game, because of that one room... the one where there is no floor but patrolling drones in one dimension, and wall clinging in the other dimension. That room is the hardest, I have a 50% success chance , so I usually run that one first , so when I fail I don't waste successful hacks, especially in the long room.. that has obstacle courses, which can take time to do, and sometimes the auto-mission-fail alert kicks in just near the end... I have sometimes ran public spy sorties when I felt like it, they usually end up where someone triggered the alarms... and it fails.

 

Practice regular solo spy runs so you get the feel and all the features of the spy vault rooms, it is amazing what secrets you find... like certain enemy blind spots(where you can have a breather) and crevices to slide and slip through, that can act as little shortcuts to get to the hack console.

Edited April 7, 2018 by Cosmic_Elf

[Forcereborn]

As far as I can tell, those who have problems with Spy being a sortie option actually have problems with how Spy works, so why are you asking to remove it from sorties? Wouldn't it be better to propose ideas about how to make Spy missions more cooperative and less punishing when played non-solo?

Personally, I'm always happy when I find Spy on sorties because I can solo them easy and fast, and I never want to spend too much time on sorties (if I have more spare time I want to spend on Warframe I can always do something else later). I'd vouch for adding Capture on sorties as well: after all, it's not that much faster than Sabotage 1.0 (which can already be an option) so I can't see why not.

[(PSN)HAVOCS-Regret]

Solo

[(PSN)HAVOCS-Regret]

Don’t remove 

[Broshambo]

Im not going to reply to someone because it has been mentioned too many times lol. You guys are missing the point though. You have to alter your gameplay to complete a mission to avoid dealing with shenanigans. Its avoiding the problem, sweeping it under the rug. Solo is the obvious option, I just feel like you shouldn't be forced to do that. 

If you are familiar with Kentucky Windage dealing with firearms, then that is the best analogy of going solo I can think of. Is utilizing Kentucky Windage a quick fix for your messed up sights? Yeah. But I would rather just zero my weapon, aka fix the problem. 

[DatDarkOne]

2 hours ago, Broshambo said:

You guys are missing the point though. You have to alter your gameplay to complete a mission to avoid dealing with shenanigans. Its avoiding the problem, sweeping it under the rug. Solo is the obvious option, I just feel like you shouldn't be forced to do that. 

Now this is an interesting statement you've made here.  I say this because solo players could say the same thing about some other mission types in the game.  Should we be forced to group?

Think about that for a moment.  I mean really think about it.  Everything you said that I quoted above can just as easily be applied from the opposite perspective also.  

The difference between your topic and me is that I'm not saying to have something removed.  I personally don't like Defection missions.  That doesn't mean that I want to deny that mission type from sorties for those that do.  I'm just not that selfish.  

Edited April 8, 2018 by DatDarkOne
grammar