Official Necro Ability Discussion

[__Kanade__]

I sort of have to disagree with changing his 3rd ability to life drain to give himself more shields and hp, that's Trinities department. 

 

Necro makes for a good support frame like Banshee, plus his 4 seems like it will provide aggro to the undead as well as dealing damage to the enemies. This would greatly help squishier frames like Nova and Loki when you get to later waves in defense t increase their survivability.

 

I think Nyx and Necro teaming up would make for an interesting defense mission ( at later waves ).

 

The only thing I would say is to change his 1 alittle bit, maybe some sort of dash like ability where any enemy he touches will start losing their health ( but not give them to you or your party ). Or maybe just have him shoot a beam with a minor aoe and anyone who gets close to the beam or it's small aoe will suck the life out of them, so kinda like a poison dot ability.

 

But other than that, he makes for a good support frame, we need more of those since it's just Vauban and Banshee. He'll be good for players not looking to the alternative of "press 4 to kill everything". His 4 doesn't do direct damage and his 2 also sounds like it's a very good CC ability. His 3 will be good for potentially increasing the rarity of mods and cores and resources, I also hope it increases the chances of enemies dropping health orbs since we only get them from opening up canisters and lockers which means lower hp frames can stay in the fight longer without resorting to a panic 4 before dying.

Edited September 4, 2013 by __Kanade__

[Beasy63]

Maybe have clone the dead replace another move and have a move that ages enemies in the radius to death and damage or have a smog that does a lot of damage over time to all enemies in the area or have necros tentacles somehow multiply and strangle the enemies while holding them in place

[Subkillin]

I have a question, does his Ult only clone the dead that he has killed, or his entire team?

If it's the former,his 3 should be some sort of AOE that can actually kill.

If it's the latter, then his 3 should have some more utility other than just looting dead bodies like a hobo, maybe revive teammates from a range;AOE HP drain for Necro only; be immune to CC?

Either way I do not like his 3.

I like the idea of reviving teammates.  I say have the second power cause fear while providing extra loot in that area as the foes flee in terror as the ghost like helpers raid the dead.  Have the third power be able to revive teammates at the expense of the foes own life force to do that.  Soul Survivor should be the name.  To make it a bit more useful have it do something like a debuff or a buff just in general, like accuracy or foes have a hard time trying to see you for few seconds.

[MXultra]

Will Clone the Dead work on Stalker?

 

I think you should get rid of Totem or Search the Dead or fuse them together. Whatever the case, give him another attack.

[Draketh]

I sort of have to disagree with changing his 3rd ability to life drain to give himself more shields and hp, that's Trinities department. 

 

Necro makes for a good support frame like Banshee, plus his 4 seems like it will provide aggro to the undead as well as dealing damage to the enemies. This would greatly help squishier frames like Nova and Loki when you get to later waves in defense.

 

I think Nyx and Necro teaming up would make for an interesting defense mission ( at later waves ).

 

The only thing I would say is to change his 1 alittle bit, maybe some sort of dash like ability where any enemy he touches will start losing their health ( but not give them to you or your party ). Or maybe just have him shoot a beam with a minor aoe and anyone who gets close to the beam or it's small aoe will suck the life out of them, so kinda like a poison dot ability.

 

But other than that, he makes for a good support frame, we need more of those since it's just Vauban and Banshee. He'll be good for players not looking to the alternative of "press 4 to kill everything". His 4 doesn't do direct damage and his 2 also sounds like it's a very good CC ability. His 3 will be good for potentially increasing the rarity of mods and cores and resources, I also hope it increases the chances of enemies dropping health orbs since we only get them from opening up canisters and lockers.

 Ya Trinity is a healer .. but the only one who can heal. The are more than a few frames with mass murdering ability's, not just 1 so I see no problem having another frame that can heal some. Loot is never much of a problem really, and the 3rd ability being a loot finder would just make this frame a loot monger, no thanks on that one. 

There are two main defining features to a necromancer in my eyes .. the ability to raise the dead, and the ability to steal health to keep himself and possibly his allies alive.

Edited September 4, 2013 by Draketh

[Dracosaber]

I agree with most people here. 

 

Search the Dead is underwhelming and not worthy of being a warframe ability. It's cool in concept, yes, but not really viable for anything but farming, if mats and mods are part of it.

 

Even then, however, I'd rather have something like Life Drain to heal myself and my teammates while hurting my enemies.They probably removed Life Drain because of Trinity, but I think they can make it unique and fit Necro better. Or perhaps an ability that gives Necro and teammates the ability to drain life for a given amount of time depending on damage dealt while debuffing those that are hit by the ability.

 

Something like that, perhaps, but not "Search the Dead". Shields are seen as more important anyways, and energy abounds mostly. I'd rather be able to cause some damage and gain some health. 

 

I do like Clone the Dead, it is unique among the Ultimates, and though it isn't "Press 4: Nuke", it has it's place, which in my opinion will be fun. Of course, a lot of it depends on what exactly can get cloned, and how many are cloned, and the AI/aggro of the clones. It will also mean that the Neco player will have to be at a slight disadvantage when playing with nukers, since needing to get kills for this to work will be interesting/frustrating at times. 

 

Also, the name for Necro. I myself am fine with Necro, but if some ideas are considered I would like to say either Osiris or Azrael. Cool names dealing with death. Lol

[CrossNgen1570]

Search the Dead sounds like a very underwhelming ability for a warframe to have, I would rather them go back to the life drain ability.

[TheImmortalHotDog]

 I'm sorry Loki, but I need an extra slot... I'M SORREH

[_Rue_]

Sounds nice.

Some naming suggestions:

1) "Soul Punch"

to

"Soul Blast"

or even

"Sunder Soul"

2) "search the dead"

to

"Spoils of Battle/War"

or even just

"Desecrate"

given what your power probably did to get those things out.

3) "Clone the Dead"

to

"Invoke Revenants"

or

"No Rest for the Wicked" *MTG reference

or

"Wrench from Death"

[Draketh]

IMO it should be more like this ...

 

SOUL DRAIN: Direct X% damage to self and gaining x% energy.

 

TERROR TOTEM: Necro deploys a totem of terror, causing X number of enemies within radius to
freeze in fear; the rest will flee.

 

LIFE DRAIN: Steal health from nearby enemy's to Heal yourself and allies. (perhaps a weaker heal than trinity's with a max amount of enemies it can effect so it cant be an uber heal but enough to really help and at least offset the health lost from ability 1.)

 

CLONE THE DEAD: Necro creates friendly nano bot clones of the last X enemies he has killed.

 

With this power set it can be combo'ed, he is more useful for groups, and never looses the feel of a necromancer.

 

The Search The dead ability is a waste and will make him un-viable for endgame furthmore everyone will treat this frame as a payday and only want you in a party to spam 3 for loot when they happen to be on a loot run. Furthermore how exactly does searching corpses fit into the theme of a necromancer? A scavenger searches pockets, a necromancer rips the life from enemy's to fuel himself, raises the dead to fight for him, and casts fear and disease/decay on his enemy's to kill them. Everything that Search the Dead does .. a mod in the game already does. Ammo Mutation, Rifle Scavenger etc., Equilibrium, Energy Siphon, etc etc etc.

Edited September 4, 2013 by Draketh

[MrCranky_BR]

Will Clone the Dead work on Stalker?

 

I think you should get rid of Totem or Search the Dead or fuse them together. Whatever the case, give him another attack.

 

Doubtfull... the Stalker never truly dies... he just vanishes once defeated. Wich is why our dumb Sentinels keep shooting him when he's leaving. XD

 

Search the Dead (ugh!) should be replaced by a buff or a movement skill. Unless DE makes this surprisingly good somehow...but I admit I cannot imagine how. General loot is not scarce in this game, and I BET this skill will not affect rare materials drop rate.

 

C'mon DE, make this guy fly or hover or glide with nanite wings or whatever... Or become somehow ethereal and float. Or just buff him overheat-style. Just anything, please.

 

A looting skill.... sigh. What the friggin hell...If it's anything like the crappy looting the dead guys on fire levels, this will suck incredibly.

[Masquerade_]

i was thinking that the name i have here could work for them all https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/95600-crypt-the-wicked-warframe/page-3#entry1139272 but that third ability is just awful trash please. life drains ok but the loot thing is stupid.

and i would like to see soul punch called Harvester anyone else........

Edited September 4, 2013 by Masqurade_Blademan

[GottFaust]

1, 2, and 4 sound amazing and thematic.

3 sounds like a BAD idea. Having a frame power dedicated to giving additional loot will do two things:

First it will cause this frame to be a *MUST* have for every single run. If the entire point of U10 is to promote build diversity, this goes counter-intuitive to that goal. It also relegates less popular frames, though still useful in their own way, to "completely unused" status by basically converting every party into Rhino, Nova (or Saryn), (support frame), Necro. In all likelyhood pick-up-groups will probably be 4x Necro. Not because they like the frame or enjoy the theme, but because they want the maximum amount of loot.

Second it will relegate what could be an awesome support caster to the role of "That loot frame." People will only run him for the loot power and not for the reason that they like the theme, or the other three skills which show a lot of promise. This means that we'll see a whole lot of Necros, but no one will do anything but spam his #3.

I recommend something like an AoE corpse explosion skill. This would basically cause every dead body within a decent range to explode dealing some damage to everything around it in a small AoE. This skill would fill a similar slot to Nova's Molecular Prime, but would be more of a finisher due to it requiring significantly more setup.

Edited September 4, 2013 by GottFaust

[helosie]

1, 2, and 4 sound amazing and thematic.

3 sounds like a BAD idea. Having a frame power dedicated to giving additional loot will do two things:

First it will cause this frame to be a *MUST* have for every single run. If the entire point of U10 is to promote build diversity, this goes counter-intuitive to that goal. It also relegates less popular frames, though still useful in their own way, to "completely unused" status by basically converting every party into Rhino, Nova (or Saryn), (support frame), Necro. In all likelyhood pick-up-groups will probably be 4x Necro. Not because they like the frame or enjoy the theme, but because they want the maximum amount of loot.

Second it will relegate what could be an awesome support caster to the role of "That loot frame." People will only run him for the loot power and not for the reason that they like the theme, or the other three skills which show a lot of promise. This means that we'll see a whole lot of Necros, but no one will do anything but spam his #3.

I recommend something like an AoE corpse explosion skill. This would basically cause every dead body within a decent range to explode dealing some damage to everything around it in a small AoE. This skill would fill a similar slot to Nova's Molecular Prime, but would be more of a finisher due to it requiring significantly more setup.

Upvoted this shiznit.

The #3 power, should be a mod, not a warframe power.

Edited September 4, 2013 by helosie

[Delsaber]

(Long Post Warning)

After reading the powers I can defiantly see why this thread was created. Before touching on any of the powers I'd like to ask if we could get a little more detail on the current proposed powers? I know they're purposely vague because it's still all up in the air, but stuff like "generates more loot from corpses" is way to vague to discuss. I ask this cause it seems like what we read on this thread and what we heard from the live stream are quite different Soul Punch from this thread seems like a simple targeted skill, but from the live stream it sounds more like a projectile.

The "Necroframe" will be the 15th Warframe and after so many Warframes I hoped that the design process behind what works and what doesn't would have been established. What I mean by that is with Warframe #15 I really didn't want to see anymore "this power is 100% useless" we already have way to many of those (I'm looking at you Fireball, Freeze, Ice wave, Bounce, ect). That being said, lets look at what we got...

SOUL PUNCH: Deals X% damage and knocks the soul out of the target, debuffing their armor by 5%.

I'm guessing the knocked out soul is that projectile mentioned in the live stream? First off I do not like the idea of having to cast a 25 energy skill multiple times on the same target to achieve maximum effect, why not give the original target a large armor debuff and the enemies hit by the dislodged "soul" a smaller armor debuff? Also why give the first armor debuff mechanic to a soul dislodge power and not Ember or Frost...I mean super heating enemy armor or freezing it to make it brittle makes much more sense.

SOUL PUNCH ALTERNATIVE: Necrosis

As a first power I'd much rather the necroframe target a single enemy with a powerful, non stacking, DoT (nanites swarm them or something). The DoT would deal high damage per tick as well as slowing the targets movement speed. If they died while still under its effects the nanites would temporarily reanimate the corpse for a few seconds to fight for you.

TERROR TOTEM: Deploy a "Terror Totem" in target area freezing X targets in fear, remaining targets run in terror.

While I don't like the idea of a warframe conjuring a giant totem...the ability itself seems ok. The amount of targets that flee should probably be capped though.

TERROR TOTEM ALTERNATIVE: Wave of Terror

Keeping with the fear theme a 2nd power would be for the necroframe to create a shock wave of horrifying energy that travels in one direction (passing through cover that enemies are hiding behind). Enemies that are hit by the wave are slowed and forced to turn and flee for a short time. This fear would give something unique to the necroframe, but also not stomp on other frames that specialize in area of denial (Vauban) and the slow would also make it not so annoying to gun down the fleeing targets.

SEARCH THE DEAD/LOOT THE DEAD/POWER 3: Generates loot from corpses (health, energy, ammo, ect).

So there was some sort of Lifedrain ability here, but now we get this. I don't need to go over all the problems with having a power tied to something that dissipates rather quickly...so I wont. Best case senario is that when activated this skill will target all corpses near you and force them to empty their pockets of energy, health ,ammo, and maybe mods/resources. This skill is incredibly toxic from the ground up...it will be either 100% useless or 100% necessary if it generates resources or mods. Get rid of it...now.

POWER 3 ALTERNATIVE: Harvest

While I was unable to see the original idea of Lifedrain the concept of the necroframe draining/weakening/crippling his foes is great. The Necroframe would channel for a few seconds (2 seconds top don't want to take away player control for to long...looking at you Blade Storm & Sound Quake) and siphon the life from nearby enemies. The siphoned health would flow back to the necroframe, healing him for some of the damage down. If the necroframe is at full HP the excess health would flow to nearby allies.

CLONE THE DEAD: The necroframe creates friendly nano bot clones of the last X enemies he killed.

Lots of questions on this one. First off, a clarification, do we activate this skill and summon the last X people we killed? Cause if this is true...then that's bad, it forces the player to keep track of who they killed to make it the most effective. I hope while you were killing ancients to unleash with your ultimate that you didn't accidentally kill a few crawlers...cause those guys are really helpful when reanimated. How strong are these clones and how aggressive are they? If they're as useful/aggressive as Mind Control...then we have some issues. What ranges of numbers are we looking at for X...5/10/15 and do they have a timer or last until killed?

CLONE THE DEAD ALTERNATIVE: Reaper's Fervor

The necroframe swarms himself with nanites, increasing his defensive stats, for X seconds. These nanites will also swarm and reanimate the bodies of enemies killed near the necroframe (bestowing some additional defensive stats to them as well). These reanimated corpses will be highly volatile, exploding upon their death. The necroframe can only have X reanimated corpses at one time.

Giving his ultimate some defensive stats will encourage the necroframe to be in the middle of the fight with his power to reanimate as much as possible and not having to wait for someone like nova to do all the killing for him. The cap on the number of res'ed minions is important as we don't want to swarm the map and ruin the fun for other players. Allowing the minions to deal damage when they die will allow even weaker minions to have a place. Giving some of the additional defensive stats that the necroframe gets will help them be useful in the later levels.

TLDR: Took awhile to type out so...no. I will say there is a reason why this thread was created and we, as the community, should take full use of it and give our 2 cents. Lets make sure Warframe #15, Necroframe, is one not to be forgotten.

EDIT: Sorry I suck at forum posting

Edited September 4, 2013 by Delsaber

[GottFaust]

- Snip -

You may want to work on the formatting there.

[Coca-Cola_Addict]

I like it... His #4 will be great in well coordinated teams that let him finish off the heavies, assuming it works on heavies. And #1 will be awesome against bosses.

[Delsaber]

You may want to work on the formatting there.

The breaks never work when I first type it out :( always have to edit it. Should be fixed now...

[Lordician]

1, 2, and 4 sound amazing and thematic.

3 sounds like a BAD idea. Having a frame power dedicated to giving additional loot will do two things:

First it will cause this frame to be a *MUST* have for every single run. If the entire point of U10 is to promote build diversity, this goes counter-intuitive to that goal. It also relegates less popular frames, though still useful in their own way, to "completely unused" status by basically converting every party into Rhino, Nova (or Saryn), (support frame), Necro. In all likelyhood pick-up-groups will probably be 4x Necro. Not because they like the frame or enjoy the theme, but because they want the maximum amount of loot.

Second it will relegate what could be an awesome support caster to the role of "That loot frame." People will only run him for the loot power and not for the reason that they like the theme, or the other three skills which show a lot of promise. This means that we'll see a whole lot of Necros, but no one will do anything but spam his #3.

I recommend something like an AoE corpse explosion skill. This would basically cause every dead body within a decent range to explode dealing some damage to everything around it in a small AoE. This skill would fill a similar slot to Nova's Molecular Prime, but would be more of a finisher due to it requiring significantly more setup.

Corpse explosion does sound pretty cool.

 

EDIT:

 

-long post-

 

Your third and fourth power replacement sound pretty good to me.

I do agree with "Search the Dead" being either completely useless or just a farmer's basic need skill and that they got to change that.

Corpse Explosion might not be the best replacement actually, as that would feel more like a 4th ability.

However, your "Reaper's Fervor" suggestion sounds good.

Maybe they can leave the exploding on death thing out, because that might be a bit much, but otherwise that seems like a good one.

Edited September 4, 2013 by Lordician

[Philosopher]

How will "Search the Dead" work? I mean, it searches corpses so it wouldn't seem that effective if there is a Nova, Saryn, etc, spamming 4 since the corpses would be vaporized. Other than that Necro sounds F#*#)*@ AWSOME.

 

And what's wrong with Soul Punch?

Edited September 4, 2013 by Philosopher

[Tortured_Reaver]

Search the Dead, completely useless. 
Come on DE, make it a life drain/hp regen skill. 

[Takai]

SEARCH THE DEAD: Generates loot from corpses (health, energy, ammo, etc).

 

Not too keen on this skill while the others sounds very desirable, it seem overly utility based, this would be good for soloing non the less...

I could see it being very useful if its a AOE with fixed range, but if its a single target move, It would be a bit too time consuming to utilize.

 

The Totem sounds like the most useful along with the Necromancer skill

[CrimsonCricket]

I just hope his character is very well balanced, and also with the raise the dead ability will there be a cap at how many enemies and how long will they be zombies for?

[StuffedTurkey007]

CLONE THE DEAD: Necro creates friendly nano bot clones of the last X enemies he has killed.

 

I think it would be even cooler and fit the theme very well if the nano bots entered and reanimated the corpses of the last X enemies he has killed.

[BUTSHI309-EGT-]

pls change the 3rd skill search the dead to something else it dont fit into his skillset