If Anthem is WF’s future competition, then Vanquish is its past

[Lanadra]

39 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:

I would love to play Anthem as it looks interesting and the type of game that I would enjoy.  BUT (and it's a major one) the game is an EA game.  That alone means I won't ever be playing it.  I just can't support anything EA as the company has shown me time and time again over the last 20+ years that they are the bane of gamers.

And it's not just EA either. It's Bioware as well. Bioware has shown with ME:A that right now, they cannot be trusted. I used to consider any Bioware title an instant buy, because I knew it was going to be good. This was in the days of ME2. Even ME3, ending aside, was spectacular to me. But with DAI I already felt a bit iffy as I played it, I enjoyed the story, but the maps felt very MMO-ish. And not in a good way.

And then off course ME:A happened. And I don't think it needs to be explained how bad that one was. Not to mention 3 months into that dumpster fire you get a showcase of everything Bioware had been putting their actual effort into. The general consensus I felt and saw around me at the time was that everything they were showing off with Anthem, most notably animations, is quality and dedication that should have gone into ME:A.

I said it back then and I'll say it now here: Bioware sacrificed Mass Effect to make Anthem happen, and that is unforgivable to me. And why I won't ever consider getting it.

[DatDarkOne]

2 minutes ago, Lanadra said:

And it's not just EA either. It's Bioware as well

I can't in all honesty put all the blame on Bioware as they made high quality games before they got bought by EA.  Check the track record of what's happened to every studio that got bought by EA to see what I mean.  

Similar situation IMO with Bungie.  They were doing fantastic work when Microsoft (the supposedly evil company) allowed them complete freedom to do what ever.  Activision isn't quite giving Bungie that same freedom.  People often times forget that a great studio can have their ideas ruined by a publisher.  Just take what happened to DE with the original concept of Dark Sector. 

Sorry for the history lesson. I just wanted to point out that sometimes the Dev studio doesn't have a choice sometimes.  

[rune_me]

30 minutes ago, Lanadra said:

And it's not just EA either. It's Bioware as well. Bioware has shown with ME:A that right now, they cannot be trusted. I used to consider any Bioware title an instant buy, because I knew it was going to be good. This was in the days of ME2. Even ME3, ending aside, was spectacular to me. But with DAI I already felt a bit iffy as I played it, I enjoyed the story, but the maps felt very MMO-ish. And not in a good way.

For me Bioware died with ME2. I hated that game. I was raised on old school Bioware: Baldur's Gate 1 & 2 will always in my book be among the greatest games ever made. I loved ME1 as well, but with ME2 it was clear that Bioware was more interested in making shooters than RPG's. For that reason alone, I still consider to this day ME2 to be one of the biggest disappointments I have ever experienced in all my years of gaming. Also for that reason, I never player ME3 or Andromeda.

[Lanadra]

16 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:

I can't in all honesty put all the blame on Bioware as they made high quality games before they got bought by EA.  Check the track record of what's happened to every studio that got bought by EA to see what I mean.  

Similar situation IMO with Bungie.  They were doing fantastic work when Microsoft (the supposedly evil company) allowed them complete freedom to do what ever.  Activision isn't quite giving Bungie that same freedom.  People often times forget that a great studio can have their ideas ruined by a publisher.  Just take what happened to DE with the original concept of Dark Sector. 

Sorry for the history lesson. I just wanted to point out that sometimes the Dev studio doesn't have a choice sometimes.  

I know, I grew up on the C&C franchise and was a massive Westwood fan, it was quite sad to see what happened to them and C&C after EA bought them. At the same time, I am allergic to the concept of always blaming the overlord even when it isn't necessarily that overlord's fault.

You also give Bungie as example, I do not consider Destiny 2 an Activision #*!% up, I considered that a Bungie #*!% up, it was Bungie that said ''buuut new meaningful content is too hard, just let us do Eververse instead''. It was Bungie that throttled XP and was also responsible for most of the other controversies coming out almost like some sad sort of comedy routine at the time.

Sometimes, yes, it's the publishers fault. EA's bullS#&$ is what lead to C&C 4: Tiberian Twilight, when that was originally meant to be a Chinese exclusive battle arena game rather then a proper entry into it's parent franchise. At the same time, a lot of people default to defending the developer while vilifying the publisher, same thing with DICE. BF V isn't a mess because of EA, that's all DICE. DICE also insisted on putting so much focus on the whole social justice narrative, even engaging in historical revisionism.

And sadly, Bioware has already given of ''woke'' signs in regards to the next Dragon Age as well.

[Kaotyke]

15 hours ago, Padre_Akais said:

...We'd better hope.

We all know how goofy EA gets when they have a bonafied hit.

I dont think you understood. Some of the games that were called pretty popular those last few months have been called failures by the publishers, as they didnt get to the $$$ they wanted.

Some exemples are Tomb Raider and CoDBlops4.

Just look for Jim Sterling, even if you dont like his style, look for the games he mentions, popular games with big fanbases... And they having articles that they havê "fallen Bellow Expectations".

[Ziltrex]

I personally think Anthem is if they made it right can be an alternative to warframe but the problem with the game is the EA the publisher so we can except a lot of microtransaction which is not different from warframe because you can spend here a lot of money too the only advanage of warframe the total free setting. Peoples does not like the microtransactions if that requires them before to pay a full game price but in warframe the peoples willing to pay mostly because of the slots others for the cosmetics. In my eyes warframe has more potential to earn more bucks while technically Anthem will be much better " larger team works on it with more budget " so that is not a surprise the surprise would be if they fail despite the budget.

Many peoples after seeing mass effect fail and down are considered to wish a big lose to Anthem and many will refuse to pay to them because of EA. EA turns a lot of good ideas and game concepts fast enough money wells and when the game dies they kill the franchise and close the studios too. That is a huge negative starting point and a lot of players will consider to skip EA products.

If we want to talk about similarities I could just say Vanquish aswell because the scifi set and similarities. There are other games also which close related to warframe but warframe found it's own kind of games and currently it's ruling it's created genre. There are other tps and shooter games but warframe always has a lot of potential and from the start the game evolved a lot and some stuff become better while others just worse but overal there are more positives on it.

Sure no devs can pleases it's all playerbases but they can try to please as many player as many they can and they are working on multiple projects so the game will remain fresh and up to date. Anthem on other hand only has chance to become similar like warframe if the devs there will cater the game and the game will generate enough money because EA decides on final what considered win to them. If they cannot sell 2-5 million in the first few months maybe they will just trash the project and close bioware too. 

On my side I will consider to buy th game because the armors and the atmoshphere looks good to me but I consider to buy when it will get discounts. I can afford the full price but I will just buy if the game get good critics and the price will goes down a bit. 

[rune_me]

47 minutes ago, Kaotyke said:

I dont think you understood. Some of the games that were called pretty popular those last few months have been called failures by the publishers, as they didnt get to the $$$ they wanted.

Some exemples are Tomb Raider and CoDBlops4.

Just look for Jim Sterling, even if you dont like his style, look for the games he mentions, popular games with big fanbases... And they having articles that they havê "fallen Bellow Expectations".

This is a corner AAA gaming has painted itself into. If budgets keeps increasing to (lets be honest) absurd amounts, and keeps increasing year after year, then obviously income also has to keep increasing to match the insane budgets. And income can't keep increasing forever. At some point you've reached your entire target audience and there's just no one left to buy another copy. The fact that Black Ops 4 could sell so extremely well, and still not "meet expectations" suggest we've reached that point. If you can make half a billion dollars on your release weekend (almost twice as much as Infinity War made on its opening weekend), break about a dozen sales record, have the most successful release of any game in 2018 (which includes some pretty strong titles like RDR2, Spider-man and God of War), and still consider it a failure, then something is very wrong in the industry. 

[Rakosta_Kai]

1 hour ago, Kaotyke said:

I dont think you understood. Some of the games that were called pretty popular those last few months have been called failures by the publishers, as they didnt get to the $$$ they wanted.

Some exemples are Tomb Raider and CoDBlops4.

Just look for Jim Sterling, even if you dont like his style, look for the games he mentions, popular games with big fanbases... And they having articles that they havê "fallen Bellow Expectations".

I understood.

My point alluded to what happens when EA actually does get what constitutes a "hit" in their books...

Increased (and even more predatory) monetization efforts

Countless super small DLC's costing as much as full featured DLCs

Paywall

Paywall

Paywall

EA is to console games what NCsoft was to MMOs back in the day...Profit comes a distant second to Profit Margin.

The difference was that NCSoft typically had subs to lean on...Now everyone gets micro-transactioned to death (some with subs).

[Lanadra]

2 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

I dont think you understood. Some of the games that were called pretty popular those last few months have been called failures by the publishers, as they didnt get to the $$$ they wanted.

Some exemples are Tomb Raider and CoDBlops4.

Just look for Jim Sterling, even if you dont like his style, look for the games he mentions, popular games with big fanbases... And they having articles that they havê "fallen Bellow Expectations".

 

[Arniox]

On 2018-12-12 at 11:11 AM, SenariousNex said:

I've seen gameplay of this. Anthem may not be that good though, too early to tell. I will be getting it though.

I got into the closed alpha. 

Can't say much cause of agreement. But it's fun. 

[IIDMOII]

I don't think anyone that pays attention to industry news and trends can keep a straight face when saying Anthem will be good. 

The last game bioware made was rushed out the door by their B team and is still a meme to this day. Andromeda.

Prior to that they released one of the worst mmos I ever played that flopped and went free to play. Star wars.

And since then their overlords at Electronic Arts have been going out of their way to ruin all their IPs or be in the news for mouthing off customers or ripping them off with microtransactions and season passes and dlc.

Anthem can kinda suck it even if it does end up being good.

[rune_me]

5 minutes ago, IIDMOII said:

I don't think anyone that pays attention to industry news and trends can keep a straight face when saying Anthem will be good. 

The last game bioware made was rushed out the door by their B team and is still a meme to this day. Andromeda.

Prior to that they released one of the worst mmos I ever played that flopped and went free to play. Star wars.

And since then their overlords at Electronic Arts have been going out of their way to ruin all their IPs or be in the news for mouthing off customers or ripping them off with microtransactions and season passes and dlc.

Anthem can kinda suck it even if it does end up being good.

That's entirely a matter of personal opinion. I could say the same thing about Warframe. I hated Plains of Eidolon. So I looked at Fortuna, and I could certainly not with a straight face say it would be good. And in my opinion, I was right. It sucked.

But other people disagrees. Just as people would disagree with you about Anthem.

[IIDMOII]

4 minutes ago, rune_me said:

That's entirely a matter of personal opinion. I could say the same thing about Warframe. I hated Plains of Eidolon. So I looked at Fortuna, and I could certainly not with a straight face say it would be good. And in my opinion, I was right. It sucked.

But other people disagrees. Just as people would disagree with you about Anthem.

Oh for sure. I'm actually not a fan of DEs open world implementation either. Hate it.

Point I was trying to make though is EA does not deserve anyone's business regardless of how Anthem turns out. Let alone their straight faces. 

[Tsardova]

10 hours ago, rune_me said:

For what the devs themselves have said, this is the approach they will take. Anthem won't have lootboxes or any pay2win mechanics. Anything that gives you power will have to be farmed in game, while microtransactions are purely cosmetics. But you have to pay for the game and future expansions.

Which I'm actually fine with. Sinking 150+ bucks into a game over the course of several years is not a problem. I've sunk way more than that into Warframe.

What someone says doesn't translate to what someone does sadly.

 

Good for you if you're fine with such a predatory corporate gimmick of releasing games in incomplete chunks and demand more of your money for the complete game. But your mindset isn't universal there mate. WF's a f2p multiplayer game; there's no entry fee, compared to Destiny/ Anthem's 60 bucks entry fee and always online DRM and needing you to pay extra fees totaling more than double of said entry fee then that's just nonsense from a consumer standpoint....

[rune_me]

3 minutes ago, Tsardova said:

What someone says doesn't translate to what someone does sadly.

 

Good for you if you're fine with such a predatory corporate gimmick of releasing games in incomplete chunks and demand more of your money for the complete game. But your mindset isn't universal there mate. WF's a f2p multiplayer game; there's no entry fee, compared to Destiny/ Anthem's 60 bucks entry fee and always online DRM and needing you to pay extra fees totaling more than double of said entry fee then that's just nonsense from a consumer standpoint....

Nah, you don't speak for the consumers. So you meant to say it's nonsense from your standpoint. Which isn't really relevant for me.

I don't preorder games, but Fortuna made it clear to me that I'm tired of Warframe. Not saying it's a bad game. I've sunk 1000+ hours into it, so I obviously like it. But I'm not having fun playing it anymore, so I'm looking for something new to waste my time on. And Anthem may well be it, but I'll wait until release to make that decision.

[Rakosta_Kai]

5 hours ago, Lanadra said:

BF V isn't a mess because of EA, that's all DICE. DICE also insisted on putting so much focus on the whole social justice narrative, even engaging in historical revisionism.

And sadly, Bioware has already given of ''woke'' signs in regards to the next Dragon Age as well.

While completely off-topic, these lines confused me greatly...I'm sure I missed something important and simply can't find it.

39 minutes ago, rune_me said:

so I'm looking for something new to waste my time on. And Anthem may well be it, but I'll wait until release to make that decision.

Much respect to the stance.

It sounds like you are making your potential buying decision hype-train free and that's the method that has the least amount of buyer's remorse.

I'll definitely be playing it too (unless others change their minds...Then it's just might) but my only expectation is that it only might be good.

Truth told...

 BW could do all the right things. 

EA could actually manage to leave things the heck alone.

 And the game could still easily wind up being crap because of the quality of the community that remained after the first six months.

...Ya just never know.

[EmberStar]

5 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

I dont think you understood. Some of the games that were called pretty popular those last few months have been called failures by the publishers, as they didnt get to the $$$ they wanted.

Some exemples are Tomb Raider and CoDBlops4.

Just look for Jim Sterling, even if you dont like his style, look for the games he mentions, popular games with big fanbases... And they having articles that they havê "fallen Bellow Expectations".

That's because publishers A) have to please shareholders.  Shareholders are only pleased if profits continue to increase.  And B)  Sniff glue.  How else do you explain them setting "sales expectation targets" of *ten million units* for a franchise that has historically sold half that or less for each new installment?  It's also why loot boxes continue to be a recurring problem.  Publishers don't expect to sell a good game and make some money.  They want to sell the cheapest game possible and make ALL the money.

[iuki.]

Anthem is run by EA so I will more than likely not be buying that game.

I am done with those big corps that think their players are ATM machines to be milked and treated like trash.

Releasing broken unfinished games for full price with predatory MTs stacked on top....

Heck with that.

Edited December 13, 2018 by iuki.

[xXx_mtv_xXx]

Anthem lmao no, it will surely flop on release just like Andromeda and Destiny 2, those greedy corporate studios and publishers can't get S#&$ right anymore, it's all up to the indie stars like DE.

[rune_me]

36 minutes ago, xXx_mtv_xXx said:

Anthem lmao no, it will surely flop on release just like Andromeda and Destiny 2, those greedy corporate studios and publishers can't get S#&$ right anymore, it's all up to the indie stars like DE.

DE is not indie developers. They have hundreds of people working for them, they make tens of millions of dollars a year, they are owned by a giant Chinese investor company. They're the furthest thing from indie developers.

Edited December 13, 2018 by rune_me

[Lanadra]

1 hour ago, Padre_Akais said:

While completely off-topic, these lines confused me greatly...I'm sure I missed something important and simply can't find it.

A lot of drama about Battlefield V regarding historical accuracy, pushing of social/political agenda's, EA's baffling way of treating customers who criticized the direction of Battlefield V's setting, and upon release, severe lack of content. To keep it short and on point.

The Dragon Age comment is about people behind Dragon Age already giving off signs of similar political agenda pushing.

Beyond I'd prefer not to go into it further, I recently found I don't really enjoy talking about politics on this forum.

Edited December 13, 2018 by Lanadra

[EmberStar]

1 hour ago, Lanadra said:

A lot of drama about Battlefield V regarding historical accuracy, pushing of social/political agenda's, EA's baffling way of treating customers who criticized the direction of Battlefield V's setting, and upon release, severe lack of content. To keep it short and on point.

The Dragon Age comment is about people behind Dragon Age already giving off signs of similar political agenda pushing.

Beyond I'd prefer not to go into it further, I recently found I don't really enjoy talking about politics on this forum.

And by baffling treatment of customers, an example:

They released the first trailer, featuring a female British soldier with an artificial arm and a nail studded cricket bat, fighting alongside "some bloke" wearing a *katana.*  A handful of trolls complained about "dah womanz," but most were more upset by the... rather strange interpretation of a "realistic" World War 2 setting.  (Many said outright that it wasn't the woman somehow on the front lines that bothered them as much as *everything else.*)  There were also problems in the beta with the chat filters blocking really strange things.  Such as blocking "white men," but not "black men."  Or blocking the word Nazi, in a WW2 setting.  (Pretty much the one context where it's mostly acceptable to talk about them.)  I believe it also blocked "DLC," but not "Free DLC."

EA's response was to more or less call anyone who disliked it ignorant, with a strong shading of implying they were misogynistic as well.  And wrapped up with "If you don't like it, don't buy it."  Gamers:  "Okay."  And then they didn't buy it.

[EmberStar]

2 hours ago, rune_me said:

DE is not indie developers. They have hundreds of people working for them, they make tens of millions of dollars a year, they are owned by a giant Chinese investor company. They're the furthest thing from indie developers.

Source, please?  I don't have a citation either, but I had the impression that the Warframe team (meaning everyone working on this game) was less than a hundred people.  Considering that Assassin's Creed has (I think) more like a *thousand* or so, Warframe has a relatively small team compared to most Triple A titles.

[Paracosmer]

Just now, EmberStar said:

Source, please?  I don't have a citation either, but I had the impression that the Warframe team (meaning everyone working on this game) was less than a hundred people.  Considering that Assassin's Creed has (I think) more like a *thousand* or so, Warframe has a relatively small team compared to most Triple A titles.

they're indeed no indie developers , digital extreme is actually owned by a chinese company and here is your source

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2014-10-16-digital-extremes-sells-61-per-cent-of-shares-for-usd73-million 

[Rakosta_Kai]

12 minutes ago, EmberStar said:

And by baffling treatment of customers, an example:

They released the first trailer, featuring a female British soldier with an artificial arm and a nail studded cricket bat, fighting alongside "some bloke" wearing a *katana.*  A handful of trolls complained about "dah womanz," but most were more upset by the... rather strange interpretation of a "realistic" World War 2 setting.  (Many said outright that it wasn't the woman somehow on the front lines that bothered them as much as *everything else.*)  There were also problems in the beta with the chat filters blocking really strange things.  Such as blocking "white men," but not "black men."  Or blocking the word Nazi, in a WW2 setting.  (Pretty much the one context where it's mostly acceptable to talk about them.)  I believe it also blocked "DLC," but not "Free DLC."

EA's response was to more or less call anyone who disliked it ignorant, with a strong shading of implying they were misogynistic as well.  And wrapped up with "If you don't like it, don't buy it."  Gamers:  "Okay."  And then they didn't buy it.

Gotcha.

2 minutes ago, Paracosmer said:

they're indeed no indie developers , digital extreme is actually owned by a chinese company and here is your source

I think most of us know that as we've been playing WF since before it actually was sold ( @EmberStar) definitely has.

The question moreso regarded DE's current employee count currently if I understood it correctly.

I might be mistaken, in which case I should nose out  😃