Ignis, Amprex and all the rest...

[2wentyThre3]

AoE sweeping weapons. No. Please stop.

I'm tired of it now. I'll open with observed circumstance I guess:
So I line up kills to enhance Warframe abilities or w/e else and someone with an Ignis jumps over my head and just nukes my targets, turns round and runs past me. I ask them not to - they continue to do it. Join another party and get hit with the same nonsense over and over and over again. It renders certain warframes useless or just frustrating to use in parties. It's the same with certain warframe abilities - people mod for max range and strength and then just spam. Ask them to stop, they don't even bother to answer you in some cases.

Is this just low level? Does this happen in sorties too? Yes - yes it does. And it's even more infuriating when it's an assassination mission like Tyl Regor and the one hit you get to land on mobs that spawn is one tick of electricity before they disappear only having to wait until they reappear, you ask the person to stop, you get no response and they just keep doing it... The mission then takes 3 to four times longer than needed.
I ended up soloing sortie Sargas Ruk last week because no one in the party had any idea what they were doing and were all packing AoE weapons - they just stood in front of him with the trigger held till they all died. And yes, I stood back and watched them, just out of sheer disbelief. AoE weapons are making an already simple game into something faceroll to the point where if people have done something before, or rather someone else has done it for them - Screw it bring AoE.

IMHO the Ignis, Amprex, Phantasm - weapons like these... they have no place in the game, that or they need a serious nerf. And I'm waiting for those to step forward to tell me it helps farm "X" because you can switch off to it. And my argument is to this that you are "Optimising" something that bores you in a manner that inadvertently takes the fun out of it for someone else. And if you're bored of playing the game or aspects of it, then why the hell are you playing it? I play the game because I enjoy the game. I especially enjoy it through the various dichotomies that arise from varied gear sets in parties. But when you join yet another Meso survival with people only ready to go for  5-10 minutes in full on spam mode it gets old really fast... I play the game because I want to play it. I play all of the content in the game I can because it all serves a purpose, be it gaining platinum or finding / farming mods I don't have yet or daily sorties for that added boost.

I hate the fact that a full party is also needed for maximising the efficiency of that person's farm. At that point they are literally using other people. They need more mobs for more loot and don't care how it happens. Party leaves, fine just get another party and do the same to them - rinse and repeat. This is not healthy for the game. I do put this on to you DE and feel that a reasonable option is allowing for a solo mode "Hell" option. One where you can enter and the game know it's one person but have the area set to maximum spawn rate on enemies from minute one.

Do I get to say what is considered "Fun" to those people? No. No I do not. Do I get to add grievance to an issue I feel is only getting worse as time goes on? Yes. Yes I do. The game is plenty of fun without being able to hold Left Click and running circles on your mouse mat. My speculation for a solution to all of this, is that the game loses absolutely nothing from toning back AoE based weaponry and abilities. So many times has it been said that the games fluid movement system and speed are it's biggest draws, I fail to see where giving people the option to stand still and spam one thing and profit helps or showcases that system. Also, I have tried to do this where I essentially look for a group, but having to do this for every group I want to join? Be reasonable?


This next part is pre-emptive because I'm old enough to know what some people think is an acceptable answer, and I'm sorry for how it may come across. But it needs to be blunt:
If you advise me to play solo because you do the above, maybe you are totally missing the point of playing an online party based game.

I appreciate any input or the sharing of opinions. I won't waste my time running in circles with people that try to be inflammatory [no pun intended Ignis...]. I just would like to know if it's just me that feels this way. Is AoE getting out of control? Is it becoming an issue where players are taking an easy option over ignoring core functions of the game? Please, give me your input.

Edited February 22, 2019 by Astronomicon.

[(XBOX)Skippy575]

It's probably getting a bit out of control, but to other's credit, AoE weapons can be effective at clearing hordes of mobs. Warframe is a grindy horde loot shooter after all.

[BombtailsTheFox]

I don't get. Why nerfing or removing weapons that does AoE damage, if their point is to be effective against hordes of mobs?

I get the point that it's out of control, but why punishing a category of weapons by nerfing or removing them?

[(XBOX)GameNerd300]

Yeah....this is an issue that I think not many know how to get around other than just leaving the mission. Very rarely though, that AoE weapon wielding player makes mob clearing a pinch. But yeah, nothing is more annoying than that moment where you're about to lay waste to a mob and you see them all go BOOM because another player jumped in with an Ignis and roasted and exploderized them seconds before you could.

[2wentyThre3]

il y a 7 minutes, BombtailsTheFox a dit :

I don't get. Why nerfing or removing weapons that does AoE damage, if their point is to be effective against hordes of mobs?

I get the point that it's out of control, but why punishing a category of weapons by nerfing or removing them?

Because, regrettably you can't rely on a community to fix the issue. So if something that is in the game itself is altered it forcibly fixes the issue. Removal is extreme - But Nerfing allows people to still have the weapon but it deters them from taking it into higher level content - content they should by that point have modded other weapons for.

I see this "hordes of mobs" argument has arisen in the last few comments. Correct me if I'm wrong but modifying automatic weapons for punch through both requires actual aim AND in the right hands does exactly the same thing? I mention this as raising the skill cap was also part of my argument.

[BombtailsTheFox]

7 minutes ago, Astronomicon. said:

Because, regrettably you can't rely on a community to fix the issue. So if something that is in the game itself is altered it forcibly fixes the issue. Removal is extreme - But Nerfing allows people to still have the weapon but it deters them from taking it into higher level content - content they should by that point have modded other weapons for.

I see this "hordes of mobs" argument has arisen in the last few comments. Correct me if I'm wrong but modifying automatic weapons for punch through both requires actual aim AND in the right hands does exactly the same thing? I mention this as raising the skill cap was also part of my argument.

Ok. Your response at least explains to me the reason why you said that, and it's also sensate. With that, i can agree.

[Kontrollo]

I remember a time when there were heated discussions about the 20% in damage the Soma Prime got over its vanilla counterpart. Amprex was already a thing. After that we got Simulor and Tonkor, Sonicor and Staticor, etc.

Feels a bit silly now. But hey, let's put some Rivens on top for good measure.

 

=> They're aware and they introduce new weapons like that anyway, because people like them. I don't think that's going to change anymore.

[2wentyThre3]

il y a 4 minutes, Kontrollo a dit :

=> They're aware and they introduce new weapons like that anyway, because people like them. I don't think that's going to change anymore.

You say like. But I'm not sure all of the people using these weapons do so because they like them. I'm almost certain it's at least a 50/fifty split. The other half are using the most optimized option because it's fast and it gets them "X" much faster. Now what "X" is, is down to the person but I'm almost certain those people don't care about anyone but themselves in what they are doing.

Why does this bother me? The same reason many things in multiplayer games bother me. Things like this are often done at the expense of others. When its myself I'm annoyed... When I watch people say something in chat, are ignored, leave AND then openly complain in chat about it - it absolutely insenses me.

The Tonkor, Sonicor and Staticor did all get nerf'd though right? The Tonkor so much that you didn't see it anymore and it got a Riven dispo boost from 1 to 2 if I'm not mistaken. 
The Ignis and the Amprex are by far the biggest culprits of the weapon side of the issue. They have a Dispo of 2. I'm unsure if it was ever 1. But when they perform this strongly on a Dispo of 2 then there is a clear and logical step forward.

We all know we have the best community around. But it will not stay that way if people don't try to maintain it. when you say "I don't think that's going to change anymore" it bothers me a little. I've seen this SO many times. Phantasy Star, World of Warcraft, Tera... they all started well and with great communities [World of Warcrafts was bad for more years than it was good...] but after popularity engulfed the games more and more, undesirables from other games crept in that exploited the game or the community making it worse off. I'm worried that's happening here. Popularity and hype is going up and so are the frequency of these sort of events. I genuinely care about this community, it's amazing. So the least we can all do is stay vocal right?

DE as a company won't do anything until there is community felt disruption surrounding one subject - and that's how it should be. I shouldn't be able to complain as one person and have them listen straight away. So what can I do? What can we all do?

So this is what we have. We can do this. Every few weeks I'll re-post something like this until all the people that feel as I do start to snowball. I genuinely think there's a lot that do feel like this - enough so that I see it daily. So hopefully those people will make themselves heard too. If DE choose to fix this problem in its infancy, then nothing changes. The community is untouched. But, I worry before long it pits players against other players - not because they can't get along as people but because of something they can't change and feel powerless against. And yes, sometimes that's how it makes me feel about the game. It bothers me sometimes that I have to log on to hours of people doing the same thing that disrupts my down time. I shouldn't have to think "Oh here we go again" When I press ESC and see what people have equipped. I shouldn't have to consider thinking calm thoughts before the map even loads...

But. To those that DO like these weapons I apologise. But if you do like them, chances are you can probably see my complaint as part of the draw to them is their power or the way in which they are used? I don't know. I'd love to hear from you guys too.

[2wentyThre3]

Il y a 3 heures, BombtailsTheFox a dit :

Ok. Your response at least explains to me the reason why you said that, and it's also sensate. With that, i can agree.

Thanks mate, I'm glad that I got my feelings across clearly. I worry sometimes that I babble on a bit.

[Kontrollo]

Simulor, Ignis and Amprex got nerfed, too, if I'm not mistaken. A bit, at least. Arca Plasmor, too, from what I've read? I wasn't around for a while until summer last year.

Anyway, doesn't stop people from using them. And if they did lose more power, people would just switch over to Maiming Strike permanently.

 

Honestly, I'd already be happy if some of these weren't so visually obnoxious. As for the balance aspect -- I guess that went out of the window with Rivens anyway, so I'm not really bothering anymore. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[(XBOX)Zweimander]

In a horde shooter AoE weapons don't have a place in the game. Me thinks you need to just quit the game then if you believe that, Just saying. Because these weapons are balanced and single fire weapons can be just as good in certain situations. Either way you need to get over being kill stolen, these things happen in power fantasy games and you are rather ignorant.

[Kontrollo]

2 minutes ago, (XB1)Zweimander said:

Me thinks you need to just quit the game then if you believe that, Just saying. Because these weapons are balanced and single fire weapons can be just as good in certain situations

Good one, keep 'em coming. 😄

[(XBOX)Zweimander]

9 minutes ago, Kontrollo said:

Good one, keep 'em coming. 😄

Well I'm not wrong am I? Sure the Ignis and Amprex are strong weapons I wont deny that. But they lack the strong single fire hits to kill Noxes and other heavily armored units in one hit unlike say a Rubico Prime or any other hybrid weapon in any category. Every weapon type has it's use and in a horde shooter it only makes sense for AoE weapons to be so prevalent. If OP wanted a game without these things he could easily just quit Warframe and enjoy another more tactical game. No need to ruin it for the Majority of players who like these guns after all, Keep em as is I say!

[2wentyThre3]

il y a 5 minutes, (XB1)Zweimander a dit :

In a horde shooter AoE weapons don't have a place in the game. Me thinks you need to just quit the game then if you believe that, Just saying. Because these weapons are balanced and single fire weapons can be just as good in certain situations. Either way you need to get over being kill stolen, these things happen in power fantasy games and you are rather ignorant.

I'm gonna start light... So the first sentence is you surmising my post from my perspective in a mocking manner I take it? Unsure... but it's the only thing that kind of[?] makes sense[?] - I'm really sorry mate the post isn't the most coherent but I'll try work with you on it...

In answer to your first almost point:
So when the stats we have on the weapons we have exist - no, we don't need weapons that can literally blot out entire corridors and rooms by just waving your mouse over them. Punch through and multi shot already do enough AND require some degree of skill as you need to aim the weapon. Obviously the fire spread of the weapon degrade it's power over all but more often than not other things like fall off on say shotguns will cover that too. The ignis has an extendable frontal cone of continuous hurt and the Amprex jumps from target to target in it's immediate area with no aim required.

As for kill stealing, or rather what you list as kill stealing:
So you acknowledge in the case of you, that you do these things intentionally as the word steal was used. So therefore you are exactly the kind of person I mean. You are intentionally griefing other players with an exploitable weapon. Thank you for giving us an example of the kind of person we are dealing with.

Where you assume my ignorance:
What's to assume here? I don't use these kinds of weapons because I've seen the discomfort it causes others. What I did do was ask for opinions surrounding these weapons - even if it was in defense of them. I'd made that abundantly clear. What you did in your infinite unquestionable intelligence was come here and "Unga bunga" at me. The weapons aren't well balanced. Kontrollo doesn't feel so either looking at their comment. Please explain to us how they are? I'd like to understand your perspective.

But if you are going to "herrr derrr" at me again, I'd recommend against the waste of the time it takes for you to drag your knuckles across your keyboard. Thanks.

[Kontrollo]

Just now, (XB1)Zweimander said:

Well I'm not wrong am I?

When was the last time you saw someone bring a DMR like from the Latron series, the Veldt or similar?

And if you did run into one of the rare people who use these just for the sake of it, did they perform even close to any of these AoE weapons?

 

It was so obvious you'd bring up the snipers instead. Those are overtuned because people asked for them to be useful for years. Now they at least have a spot in boss fights, and I guess if you're a fan of end of missions damage percentages. 😄

 

And your "he could easily just quit Warframe and enjoy another more tactical game" is the argument of those who have nothing better to say.

[2wentyThre3]

il y a 3 minutes, (XB1)Zweimander a dit :

Well I'm not wrong am I? Sure the Ignis and Amprex are strong weapons I wont deny that. But they lack the strong single fire hits to kill Noxes and other heavily armored units in one hit unlike say a Rubico Prime or any other hybrid weapon in any category. Every weapon type has it's use and in a horde shooter it only makes sense for AoE weapons to be so prevalent. If OP wanted a game without these things he could easily just quit Warframe and enjoy another more tactical game. No need to ruin it for the Majority of players who like these guns after all, Keep em as is I say!

So you acknowledge their strength. And no Nox's won't be one shot by them typically - but what's the close of for being able to stand in front of them spamming? I've seen it up to level 80 and seen as thats the start level of Arbitration I think it's already too much. Yes the Rubico WILL flatten something like a nox. But the Rubico Prime has a clip of 5 and belongs to what are considered to be on of the worst weapons in an enclosed space. Personally I think anything above 30 for a weapon  that churns damage in large areas is too much. What is it teaching people beyond that? It is a horde shooter of sorts but it's mobility and dexterity based - What's dextrous about being able to stand still and spin your mouse around like an etch-a-sketcher AND mess with someone else's game? The fact it does mess with other people or can be used in that manner should be enough.

[(XBOX)Zweimander]

2 minutes ago, Astronomicon. said:

I'm gonna start light... So the first sentence is you surmising my post from my perspective in a mocking manner I take it? Unsure... but it's the only thing that kind of[?] makes sense[?] - I'm really sorry mate the post isn't the most coherent but I'll try work with you on it...

In answer to your first almost point:
So when the stats we have on the weapons we have exist - no, we don't need weapons that can literally blot out entire corridors and rooms by just waving your mouse over them. Punch through and multi shot already do enough AND require some degree of skill as you need to aim the weapon. Obviously the fire spread of the weapon degrade it's power over all but more often than not other things like fall off on say shotguns will cover that too. The ignis has an extendable frontal cone of continuous hurt and the Amprex jumps from target to target in it's immediate area with no aim required.

As for kill stealing, or rather what you list as kill stealing:
So you acknowledge in the case of you, that you do these things intentionally as the word steal was used. So therefore you are exactly the kind of person I mean. You are intentionally griefing other players with an exploitable weapon. Thank you for giving us an example of the kind of person we are dealing with.

Where you assume my ignorance:
What's to assume here? I don't use these kinds of weapons because I've seen the discomfort it causes others. What I did do was ask for opinions surrounding these weapons - even if it was in defense of them. I'd made that abundantly clear. What you did in your infinite unquestionable intelligence was come here and "Unga bunga" at me. The weapons aren't well balanced. Kontrollo doesn't feel so either looking at their comment. Please explain to us how they are? I'd like to understand your perspective.

But if you are going to "herrr derrr" at me again, I'd recommend against the waste of the time it takes for you to drag your knuckles across your keyboard. Thanks.

First of all I do not grief on Purpose I just maximize the grind by using the likes of Sayrn's spores, Volts Discharge and the likes to make things to faster. Sure some people may quit if they have your attitude of "They are taking all the kills" but should that stop me from enjoying the game how the majority of the players do? As for the weapons yes the weapon types all have purposes be it spike damage with Crit's, Removing armor very quickly at the cost of some damage via high rate of fire weapons in general, and High risk high reward weapons like the Zarr offering the best of both worlds.

Sure your entitled to your opinion HOWEVER one should look at the bigger picture and see that without these things the game would be a boring slog and make some game modes impossible. Such as sanctuary onslaught with kills per second being the biggest factor. If you remove all the nukes you would be hard pressed to make it far in it at all. In conclusion we are just two sides of the same coin and your side just so happens to want everyone else nerfed so you can "Enjoy the game your way" which in that case use recruiting chat or play Solo. If DE listened to all the whiners such as yourself the game would be no fun at all and die off so it's better to keep us powerful and the likes.

[2wentyThre3]

à l’instant, (XB1)Zweimander a dit :

First of all I do not grief on Purpose I just maximize the grind by using the likes of Sayrn's spores, Volts Discharge and the likes to make things to faster. Sure some people may quit if they have your attitude of "They are taking all the kills" but should that stop me from enjoying the game how the majority of the players do? As for the weapons yes the weapon types all have purposes be it spike damage with Crit's, Removing armor very quickly at the cost of some damage via high rate of fire weapons in general, and High risk high reward weapons like the Zarr offering the best of both worlds.

Sure your entitled to your opinion HOWEVER one should look at the bigger picture and see that without these things the game would be a boring slog and make some game modes impossible. Such as sanctuary onslaught with kills per second being the biggest factor. If you remove all the nukes you would be hard pressed to make it far in it at all. In conclusion we are just two sides of the same coin and your side just so happens to want everyone else nerfed so you can "Enjoy the game your way" which in that case use recruiting chat or play Solo. If DE listened to all the whiners such as yourself the game would be no fun at all and die off so it's better to keep us powerful and the likes.

Did you actually even read the original post? Go back and read it, don't - I actually don't care. I left you a note at the bottom of it if you do.

Anyone else reading this, please acknowledge the ignorance of the individuals that do as I described in my OP. I said this would happen four hours ago. It did, even when this person was presented with the option to read... I only wish I could predict the numbers for the lottery like this.

And Zweimander, just so you know, I've screen capped this for my own amusement and for any attempts of you deleting posts and not bearing reference to it in the future of this thread. I saw you coming before you even decided you were coming here...

For the record DE have listened to reasonable people in the past and even debated things with them, I'd love to understand their reasoning for things being the way they are. IDK, maybe guns like this are kept in to keep people like you logging in because clearly you'd be massively hurt if they even altered them judging by your response? IDK.
Me personally when they make changes I'm not fond of I try see the reasons. I offered a few of those towards the sort of changes I'd like... you appear to have just bounced your head off of your keyboard a few times. Just saying.

Please read before you reply to things in future. It may stop one of us looking the fool.


... Insert the classic Jojo " Next you'll say you only pretending to be an idiot " response...

[(XBOX)Zweimander]

7 minutes ago, Astronomicon. said:

So you acknowledge their strength. And no Nox's won't be one shot by them typically - but what's the close of for being able to stand in front of them spamming? I've seen it up to level 80 and seen as thats the start level of Arbitration I think it's already too much. Yes the Rubico WILL flatten something like a nox. But the Rubico Prime has a clip of 5 and belongs to what are considered to be on of the worst weapons in an enclosed space. Personally I think anything above 30 for a weapon  that churns damage in large areas is too much. What is it teaching people beyond that? It is a horde shooter of sorts but it's mobility and dexterity based - What's dextrous about being able to stand still and spin your mouse around like an etch-a-sketcher AND mess with someone else's game? The fact it does mess with other people or can be used in that manner should be enough.

It comes down to the types of players you end up with but typically in a structured group you will have maybe 1-2 DPs frames and the other frames supports with weapons to match the roles. One can never assume what one may run into doing a public mission but that's the chance you take when you go through that instead of making a group with recruiting chat or friends who play as well. More often then not you will get what the OP has suggested because it makes things go smoothly, or you could get a group that is so slow to get through waves or kill the mission ends up failing miserably. This is dictated by the build and weapon people choose on the frame of their choosing and just because one side is upset that thing are going to fast or to slow based off of these choices is not reason to change it drastically to fit either ends views perfectly.

Sure some people may view AoE frames and weapons as abuse of power and ruining the fun for them and I can somewhat understand that. But to change the whole Idea of being an Overpowered space ninja just because some people get annoyed when they cant kill stuff from time to time is rather silly in my opinion. As I stated before recruiting chat is a thing people can use to tailor there group and have fun while still grinding well enough to make good progress. Overall though I find myself being someone who makes myself as strong and efficient as possible so we could never truly see eye to eye on this matter but what can you do?

[(XBOX)Zweimander]

8 minutes ago, Astronomicon. said:

Did you actually even read the original post? Go back and read it, don't - I actually don't care. I left you a note at the bottom of it if you do.

Anyone else reading this, please acknowledge the ignorance of the individuals that do as I described in my OP. I said this would happen four hours ago. It did, even when this person was presented with the option to read... I only wish I could predict the numbers for the lottery like this.

And Zweimander, just so you know, I've screen capped this for my own amusement and for any attempts of you deleting posts and not bearing reference to it in the future of this thread. I saw you coming before you even decided you were coming here...

For the record DE have listened to reasonable people in the past and even debated things with them, I'd love to understand their reasoning for things being the way they are. IDK, maybe guns like this are kept in to keep people like you logging in because clearly you'd be massively hurt if they even altered them judging by your response? IDK.
Me personally when they make changes I'm not fond of I try see the reasons. I offered a few of those towards the sort of changes I'd like... you appear to have just bounced your head off of your keyboard a few times. Just saying.

Please read before you reply to things in future. It may stop one of us looking the fool.


... Insert the classic Jojo " Next you'll say you only pretending to be an idiot " response...

To be honest I am just a player who likes to push the Boundaries and do as much damage as possible to as many enemies as possible to speed things along, I have played this game for many years and what I find fun after all this time is feeling like a god among Tenno with all my acquired power. I'm sorry if you don't feel the same truly but many players have equivalent or even greater damage then I do and should we lose that just because new players get annoyed about getting no kill from time to time? I don't think that would be fair to the existing player base as a whole and would just make the dedicated fans rather upset.

I used to be a new player and looked up to the ones who nuked maps wanting to be like them as I grow stronger with each new mod. I'm not sure were that mentality disappeared off to these past years but more should aspire to gain power rather then take it away from those who have it. If I wanted a fair and balanced experience I would play games like Anthem which is coming out soon or even Destiny but those games bore me with how weak you feel compared to Warframe. And I share this sentiment with many others like myself so in my personal opinion you should have the option to be as powerful as you want if you put in the time to do so.

[2wentyThre3]

il y a 28 minutes, (XB1)Zweimander a dit :

It comes down to the types of players you end up with but typically in a structured group you will have maybe 1-2 DPs frames and the other frames supports with weapons to match the roles. One can never assume what one may run into doing a public mission but that's the chance you take when you go through that instead of making a group with recruiting chat or friends who play as well. More often then not you will get what the OP has suggested because it makes things go smoothly, or you could get a group that is so slow to get through waves or kill the mission ends up failing miserably. This is dictated by the build and weapon people choose on the frame of their choosing and just because one side is upset that thing are going to fast or to slow based off of these choices is not reason to change it drastically to fit either ends views perfectly.

Sure some people may view AoE frames and weapons as abuse of power and ruining the fun for them and I can somewhat understand that. But to change the whole Idea of being an Overpowered space ninja just because some people get annoyed when they cant kill stuff from time to time is rather silly in my opinion. As I stated before recruiting chat is a thing people can use to tailor there group and have fun while still grinding well enough to make good progress. Overall though I find myself being someone who makes myself as strong and efficient as possible so we could never truly see eye to eye on this matter but what can you do?

There you go again:

You are literally describing things that are core parts of the game as negatives - weapon builds and warframe choices - yet the thing you want to do which is problematic as you only want to do the same thing, and you even state that it is -  but it's still the thing you would rather do than actually have to use mechanics intended for use. "I'm having fun, shame you're not" is the general summary of what you just said, and thank you for only reinforcing my points - Now I don't expect or want you to change, but if you go back and read the OP I actually gave an option for that kind of play. Go read it.

The fantasy of being an overpowered space ninja in the way that the present the game is cool. But the game is not a game if it has no challenge. People that get annoyed from dying to mechanics or specific enemies have the most options of any player. People being subjected to other selfish players have far less options, and given that the games community is what has carried it - they aren't really options worth considering.

The game was made for everyone not just selfish people - Especially not selfish people. No Multiplayer game is ever designed with being selfish in mind. What if I said to you that you should have to go through a menu to use the Ignis that only paired you with other AoE build users and you had to find them through chat? It would sound ludicrous wouldn't it. Why would you think it's an option to everyone else? AoE should be weaker. AoE DPS' job has always been to provide damage on a steady constant bases over an area - When that area is nukesville as soon as enemies step into it, it's doing a Primary DPS players job. End of story - It shouldn't be able to do both.

Edited February 22, 2019 by Astronomicon.

[2wentyThre3]

Il y a 20 heures, (XB1)Zweimander a dit :

To be honest I am just a player who likes to push the Boundaries and do as much damage as possible to as many enemies as possible to speed things along, I have played this game for many years and what I find fun after all this time is feeling like a god among Tenno with all my acquired power. I'm sorry if you don't feel the same truly but many players have equivalent or even greater damage then I do and should we lose that just because new players get annoyed about getting no kill from time to time? I don't think that would be fair to the existing player base as a whole and would just make the dedicated fans rather upset.

I used to be a new player and looked up to the ones who nuked maps wanting to be like them as I grow stronger with each new mod. I'm not sure were that mentality disappeared off to these past years but more should aspire to gain power rather then take it away from those who have it. If I wanted a fair and balanced experience I would play games like Anthem which is coming out soon or even Destiny but those games bore me with how weak you feel compared to Warframe. And I share this sentiment with many others like myself so in my personal opinion you should have the option to be as powerful as you want if you put in the time to do so.

First paragraph:

Read as "I will do what I can get away with. And why shouldn't I be able to push one button to feel like I'm better than everyone else for doing it." - There was also allusion to "You don't like what I'm doing, you must be new"...

Second paragraph:

Your edging toward me being a new player again. Perhaps read my profile first. I'm not. Anthem is a solid game, so much so it has taken the crown of other BR games in a short period. And it isn't out soon as you stated. It's already out and as I just said, and doing BIG things. You seem to draw parallels between "Feeling weak" and a designed scaling mechanic that is built to test you at end game levels. You shouldn't be allowed to be as powerful as you want, in fact DE have placed many precautions in to stop exactly that. Melee 3.0 is aimed to be exactly that. Riven disposition was designed for just this. Stat alterations occur for exactly this reason. This entire thread is me asking them to enact upon those systems in play further for a specific area of play.

EDIT: He said Anthem... I thought of Apex legends. Anthem is a bad game, but for many reasons - I'll yield to getting this part wrong. Either way my point about what IS weak and feeling weak still stands. As do my comments surrounding whether or not you should ever be allowed to be as strong as you want.

I genuinely have no further responses for you. I feel we are starting to turn circles in the sand... Thank you for your input and the reinforcement of idea's I have already shared. Intentionally or unintentionally, you now stand as a shining example to both DE and anyone else reading this post of exactly the kind of person I meet in game every day.

Edited February 23, 2019 by Astronomicon.

[2wentyThre3]

il y a une heure, (XB1)Zweimander a dit :

First of all I do not grief on Purpose I just maximize the grind by using the likes of Sayrn's spores, Volts Discharge and the likes to make things to faster. Sure some people may quit if they have your attitude of "They are taking all the kills" but should that stop me from enjoying the game how the majority of the players do?

I just really wanted to highlight this sense of community spirit for all to see if it was missed.

I have no attitude in all of this. There is something I do dislike, could easily attain and become the person that does these things, but I choose not to. I choose not to because doing what other people do only adds to the problem. People that see this at low level then go through the game thinking it is normal and is the sort of behaviour that should be aspired to.

It bothers me because when I first started things were within reason. Things are getting out of hand and the comment kicks it all off is solid ground for my reasoning alone:

"I do not grief on Purpose" :  The person does however recognise what they may be doing as griefing and continues do so purely because they can. This is why AoE needs to be nerf'd.

Edited February 22, 2019 by Astronomicon.

[Xzorn]

Hey, I was perfectly happy with my Ignis at x4 the Volume but scaling like trash later in levels.

DE went and reduced it's volume by a massive amount and made it do damage. I'll take either.

Beam weapons in general are where single target DPS should be.

Both in their performance and their Ammo Economy. Assault Rifles are easily the worst gun type in the game and beam weapons are a good example of why. Their status triggers suck and when they don't their Ammo Economy does or they simply do poor DPS. Until the Beam weapon and Sniper changes Shotguns, Pistols and Launchers ruled this game and still do outside those specific weapon types. Pistols have been the single target DPS of Warframe for a long time running and Beam / Snipers are the only comparison.

[xveganrox]

The classic “nerf the way other people play so the way I play feels stronger.” Man, I remember when Nova first came out, people complaining about “kill-stealing” made up every other thread.

Amprex is fun. It’s MR/Clan gated, it’s single target damage is low, it has limited range, it does solid AoE CC and damage within that range. Without a Riven in Sortie 2/3 it’s probably going to be outperformed by a ton of weapons damage-wise, in PoE/fort it can be outperformed by almost anything, it’s not an anti-sentient weapon, it’s not a boss killer. If other people killing enemies bothers you, nerfing Amprex/Ignis doesn’t get rid of Maim or WoF or Exalted Blade or Dex Pixia or any of the hundred other things that people are going to use to kill enemies... which isn’t griefing, it’s playing the game. You can play solo and get all the kills if that’s what you want, or you can play in premade groups and call all your kills in advance or whatever, but if you’re just running PUGs and your main complaint is that they’re playing the game properly it sounds like that might not be for you.