Is it just me or is there something wonky with Shield Gating at the moment?

[Perfectly_Framed_Waifu]

(Posting this here because I'm not sure if it's a bug or if I've missed some patch notes somewhere.)

So, I took Banshee to Steel Path, had a setup where my survivability involved a combination of Decaying Dragon Key, Brief Respite, and enough Efficiency to just about reset my shield gate when casting Molt. Something was off, though - while casting Molt did fully reset my shields, it often, if not always, gave me not a millisecond of invulnerability. Quite often, I didn't even get to see my shields fill up before they were gone again, and my health was taking damage. To test this further, I went to the Simulacrum and cooked up a Harrow build custom-made for testing this. This time, hitting just a single enemy with his 1 would fully fill up my shields, with neither Decaying DK nor Brief Respite equipped. Despite that, my shield gating was still behaving weirdly. The Heavy Gunner squad I was up against was still either

• able to instantly damage my freshly repaired shields the moment I gated and refilled, or
• able to damage my health immediately after my shield was depleted.

In short, shield gating has for me become completely unreliable as a tanking option, seemingly regardless of my setup. (Actual shield tanking with the likes of Harrow still works tho.) So yeah, is there some patch notes I've missed or is shield gating just bugged now?

[(NSW)Greybones]

Ooooh, sounds interesting. I’m not sure myself, but hmm, now I’m curious

[Perfectly_Framed_Waifu]

12 minutes ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

Ooooh, sounds interesting. I’m not sure myself, but hmm, now I’m curious

Please let me know what you find out if you test it yourself. While I don't like the "less shield is best" situation we have (had?) with the shield gating, the survivability of quite a few frames becomes quite a bit more iffy without any gating whatsoever.

[Tesseract7777]

Could be something they were testing to fix shield gating that wasn't supposed to get into the build yet. 

Or it could just be a bug and not indicate they are currently looking into it at all. I could be reading tea leaves in an empty cup, who knows. 

[(NSW)Greybones]

2 minutes ago, Perfectly_Framed_Waifu said:

Please let me know what you find out if you test it yourself. While I don't like the "less shield is best" situation we have (had?) with the shield gating, the survivability of quite a few frames becomes quite a bit more iffy without any gating whatsoever.

👍 I’ll keep an eye out during gameplay

[Berzerkules]

I've been testing an ember build in sp void survival the last hour or so and have not noticed anything off with shield gating. 

[Slayer-.]

I dare not take a low HP frame into Void storm missions, the double explosion one after another within a millisecond kill my warframes, first explosion takes out the shield then the one that follows it straight away kills the health I have boom I'm dead, it's sad I need to take a frame that has plenty of HP and armour just to allow for the constant no shield mode I encounter.

[Perfectly_Framed_Waifu]

5 minutes ago, Berzerkules said:

I've been testing an ember build in sp void survival the last hour or so and have not noticed anything off with shield gating. 

Might be harder to notice on a frame with damage reduction, which I assume you have on Ember. Like, my normal Harrow build with Adaptation, the 2's Lifesteal, and Arcane Guardian was doing well enough in Sedna SP, but just shield gating and nothing more shredded my Banshee, even with Molt's instant mid-action cast.

[Berzerkules]

Just now, Perfectly_Framed_Waifu said:

Might be harder to notice on a frame with damage reduction, which I assume you have on Ember. Like, my normal Harrow build with Adaptation, the 2's Lifesteal, and Arcane Guardian was doing well enough in Sedna SP, but just shield gating and nothing more shredded my Banshee, even with Molt's instant mid-action cast.

It was shield gating build with key, shields get one tapped dr is irrelevant . 

37 minutes ago, Perfectly_Framed_Waifu said:

So, I took Banshee to Steel Path, had a setup where my survivability involved a combination of Decaying Dragon Key, Brief Respite, and enough Efficiency to just about reset my shield gate when casting Molt. Something was off, though - while casting Molt did fully reset my shields, it often, if not always, gave me not a millisecond of

This is what confuses me. 

You say it was just about enough to reset gate but then the next sentence you it was enough. What was it? There is a big difference between full and partial shield gate.

[Perfectly_Framed_Waifu]

1 minute ago, Berzerkules said:

This is what confuses me. 

You say it was just about enough to reset gate but then the next sentence you it was enough. What was it? There is a big difference between full and partial shield gate.

Ah, my bad. Non-native English speaker here, used the "just about" term slightly incorrectly, it seems. I meant "just about" as in "almost exactly", not exclusively "slightly less than exactly" with no possibility of it being a tad more than enough. To be precise, Molt costs 50 energy by default, which becomes 35 with Streamline, which turns into 52.5 shields with Brief Respite and no Augur mods. Banshee Prime has 100-300 shield, depending on rank, with mine sitting at 200 since she's recently Forma'd and only rank 16, meaning that she has 50 shield with Decaying Dragon Key. Thus, unless something is off, Molt should be able to reset my shield gate and leave me with 2-3 overshield. (Yes, this will be too little once I reach 300 shield, but for now it's enough.)

But, as is the reason for this post, something does seem to be off.

[Berzerkules]

1 minute ago, Perfectly_Framed_Waifu said:

Ah, my bad. Non-native English speaker here, used the "just about" term slightly incorrectly, it seems. I meant "just about" as in "almost exactly", not exclusively "slightly less than exactly" with no possibility of it being a tad more than enough. To be precise, Molt costs 50 energy by default, which becomes 35 with Streamline, which turns into 52.5 shields with Brief Respite and no Augur mods. Banshee Prime has 100-300 shield, depending on rank, with mine sitting at 200 since she's recently Forma'd and only rank 16, meaning that she has 50 shield with Decaying Dragon Key. Thus, unless something is off, Molt should be able to reset my shield gate and leave me with 2-3 overshield. (Yes, this will be too little once I reach 300 shield, but for now it's enough.)

But, as is the reason for this post, something does seem to be off.

If you are leveling up your frame that is the problem. Your max shields will increase as you gain levels, but the energy cost to cast will stay the same. You will reset shield gate at lower rank but once you reach a certain rank you will have too much efficiency. 

At max rank Banshee has 75 shields with a key, molt cost 50 energy to cast and Brief respite gives 150% shields so base efficiency at rank 30 a single cast of molt will fully reset your shield gate. Running any efficiency will require augur mods.

[Perfectly_Framed_Waifu]

4 minutes ago, Berzerkules said:

If you are leveling up your frame that is the problem. Your max shields will increase as you gain levels, but the energy cost to cast will stay the same. You will reset shield gate at lower rank but once you reach a certain rank you will have too much efficiency. 

At max rank Banshee has 75 shields with a key, molt cost 50 energy to cast and Brief respite gives 150% shields so base efficiency at rank 30 a single cast of molt will fully reset your shield gate. Running any efficiency will require augur mods.

Please read my replies a tad more carefully.

15 minutes ago, Perfectly_Framed_Waifu said:

Thus, unless something is off, Molt should be able to reset my shield gate and leave me with 2-3 overshield. (Yes, this will be too little once I reach 300 shield, but for now it's enough.)

But, as is the reason for this post, something does seem to be off.

[Lutesque]

11 hours ago, Perfectly_Framed_Waifu said:

So yeah, is there some patch notes I've missed or is shield gating just bugged now?

It's an unintended Exploit.... I'm not even remotely surprised it's not working Properly....

11 hours ago, Slayer-. said:

I dare not take a low HP frame into Void storm missions, the double explosion one after another within a millisecond kill my warframes, first explosion takes out the shield then the one that follows it straight away kills the health I have boom I'm dead, it's sad I need to take a frame that has plenty of HP and armour just to allow for the constant no shield mode I encounter.

And if you have a Pet they just Die Immediately.... All The Time....

Funny Enough my Team Mates die more than my Kat does... 😝

 

[Perfectly_Framed_Waifu]

On 2022-01-24 at 2:52 PM, Lutesque said:

It's an unintended Exploit.... I'm not even remotely surprised it's not working Properly....

Since it was wonky even without Brief Respite or Decaying Dragon Key, just Harrow doing Harrow things, do you mean to say that shield gating itself is an unintended exploit, or something else?

[Josh486]

This has not happened at all for me, can you give some video proof?

[Karsaros]

I hate to be that player but I have to ask:

Why do people use Dragon Keys outside of Vault runs/Riven Challenges?

To me this just feels like a bad time, they drastically reduce stats, (Shield, Health, Movement, Damage) maybe its just a lack of understanding on my part but Idk.

While I do get that reducing shields to a lower threshold will increase the odds of it fully reseting before the next hit I still cant imagine a scenario I would use a Dragon Key for such a purpose, more to the point I do vastly prefer Shieldless Frames Nidus/Inaros because they dont use Shieldgating for obvious reasons.

[Berzerkules]

20 minutes ago, Karsaros said:

I hate to be that player but I have to ask:

Why do people use Dragon Keys outside of Vault runs/Riven Challenges?

To me this just feels like a bad time, they drastically reduce stats, (Shield, Health, Movement, Damage) maybe its just a lack of understanding on my part but Idk.

While I do get that reducing shields to a lower threshold will increase the odds of it fully reseting before the next hit I still cant imagine a scenario I would use a Dragon Key for such a purpose, more to the point I do vastly prefer Shieldless Frames Nidus/Inaros because they dont use Shieldgating for obvious reasons.

I find it a more active playstyle for squishy caster frames. The more you can use your abilities the tankier you are.

I've always played glass cannons though. I like the risk/reward, Keeps it exciting when I can destroy everything but if I get hit once i'm fn ded. I find tanks boring, I always have. I just feel lazy playing tanks in any game, like stand there and just keep killing to maintain survival. 

That's why this game is cool though, there are multiple valid playstyles. Tank if you want or go full glass cannon with brief moments of invulnerability if you time it right.

[Slayer-.]

On 2022-01-25 at 12:52 AM, Lutesque said:

It's an unintended Exploit.... I'm not even remotely surprised it's not working Properly....

And if you have a Pet they just Die Immediately.... All The Time....

Funny Enough my Team Mates die more than my Kat does... 😝

 

Haha don't get me started on Pets and Sentinels.  If I really need to keep a Sentinel alive I'll take Zephyr with Turbulence, so they don't get hit and learn to dodge all the hand grenades hurled at me. 🤣

[(NSW)Greybones]

1 hour ago, Karsaros said:

I hate to be that player but I have to ask:

Why do people use Dragon Keys outside of Vault runs/Riven Challenges?

To me this just feels like a bad time, they drastically reduce stats, (Shield, Health, Movement, Damage) maybe its just a lack of understanding on my part but Idk.

While I do get that reducing shields to a lower threshold will increase the odds of it fully reseting before the next hit I still cant imagine a scenario I would use a Dragon Key for such a purpose, more to the point I do vastly prefer Shieldless Frames Nidus/Inaros because they dont use Shieldgating for obvious reasons.

Personally I mainly only use Dragon Keys if I’m looking to do content that’s better suited to a Warframe that’s still ranking up from the lower ranks; rank 30 Warframes have intrinsic stats that make most anything below level 20-or-so a trivial fight (enemies don’t hit hard enough), so I don’t mind shaving off some of that excess survivability if it means I can’t just facetank. Had a pretty good fight through a level 12 Syndicate mission using Dragon Keys because I didn’t have any Warframes to rank or re-rank

Outside of that I’m not a user of shieldgating builds; if I’m relying on shieldgating, I feel like I’m either doing something wrong or my build has simply hit its upper limit

edit: 🤔 Though technically if I was using shieldgating builds, then that upper limit would be defined by my use of shieldgating. I just don’t use them

double edit: I do also use Dragon Keys if I’m looking to do some lower-level content and I’m currently geared for higher-level, and I’m too lazy to do basic swapping out of mods or whatever

triple edit: I don’t use Hobbled much if at all; mostly I revolve around the stat changers (shield, health, damage)

[Berzerkules]

On 2022-01-24 at 4:52 AM, Lutesque said:

And if you have a Pet they just Die Immediately.... All The Time....

Funny Enough my Team Mates die more than my Kat does... 😝

This has always annoyed me to no end. You have to stat stick your frame for companion survivability. 

Like playing a glass cannon, sucks for you, better mod for enemy radar and forget about fetch/vacuum. There are some cool companions that are just worthless to me because they are dead a few minutes into a mission. 

If DE just made companions scale with enemy lvl like specters it would be a huge step in the right direction.

[Lutesque]

1 hour ago, Berzerkules said:

If DE just made companions scale with enemy lvl like specters it would be a huge step in the right direction.

That's actually a great idea.... Why didn't I think of that... 🤔 !!!

 

[AngryAv0cad0]

I believe I am experiencing a similar issue of late.  I take advantage of shield-gating on Mirage with a shield value of 60 (decaying dragon key equipped).   I am using Brief respite along with a few auger mods.  My energy efficiency is at 50%.  Recasting eclipse for example, usually restores my shields to 100% plus over-shields.

What I have noticed, however, is that after my shields are depleted and an ability is immediately cast, nothing happens - no shields are restored and I have to recast once or twice again to see shields restored.  Most of the time the method works as intended, but it does seem a bit off of late. 

I'm not sure if it's because I'm casting within the 1.3 second invulnerability window?