Lets brainstorm some "exploration" mission ideas

[DreisterDino]

So i just filled out the survey by @Purzzle and it triggered some thoughts regarding exploration in missions.

 

While i am a fan of exploration in games and like the new Tileset on the Zariman, i dont really enjoy the way exploration has been implemented in this Update. Aside from exterminate, exploring the Map and looking for Voidplumes conflicts with the actual objective of the mission. For the most part, the objective of the mission requires us to stay at a certain location while there is a massive incentive to leave those locations to find (additional) standing.

 

A simple mission which allows exploration could be a normal Survival mission. You usually stay a bit longer, and since there is no location you have to stay at you are free to explore the Tileset. Oftentimes, people do that anyway already and look for Ayatan Sculptures etc. But why not take this a step further?

 

Lets create missions where exploration is the objective. That way, there is no conflict between the objective and exploration, and finding the Voidplumes comes naturally. You dont have to think about whether you can risk leaving the objective or if you want to pause the mission in order to find them. You explore and either find Voidplumes or progress with the objective.

 

My initial idea was this:

 

You have a Capture/Rescue/Spy Mission, but you dont know where the capture target/rescue target/spy vaults are. So you have to explore the Map by mission design. The most basic way would be that you just find your objective at some point, found Voidplumes along the way and you are done with it. A more advanced way could involve finding clues. The Zariman has a few things you can find and interact with already - and doing that could give you information about where your objective is located (so you start with a radial objective marker like in Bounties where you have to find caches, and the more hints you find the more precise this marker gets, maybe leading into a simple waypoint at some point).

 

 

 

Did you have the same feeling regarding the implementation of exploration?

And what are missions you could imagine that actively promote exploration?

[Tyreaus]

I think it would be nice to have designated "exploration" missions. I don't think it would be quite as fun to find specific tiles, though. Imagine having a mission where you go out to find voidplumes - that's your objective. There isn't some other, "main" objective to distract you from the collection process. The plumes you find are shared, so you aren't having to run across the map to pick up one someone else found. You might have to crawl your way into ducts or if you have a crate buster loadout and loot radar, you find out where one is, but have to figure out how to get there. Someone else might be able to come along and show you. Genuine co-op. (Better yet: you can rank players on a point system by how many plumes they find and their values. Not for any reward, just to show off and offer an option to compete.)

Compare that with finding tiles. You run around, find the vault, run it - tada. It loses the nuance, the sneaky corridors, the in-built hints you can uncover with certain builds that make it feel like a genuine exploration run. It's functional, but feels more like a Spy mission just with the markers turned off. Which is what it is. Sometimes, simpler is better.

I think that would be good as an option for Syndicate missions, plus the Zariman maps. Maybe Deimos open world, too? It might be a touch less fitting elsewhere, but sounds like a good idea for token collection.

EDIT: What am I thinking? That could work for any Syndicate. Just toss a bunch of debt tokens and toroids across the Valis, a bunch of sentient cores and...IDK, spare gems? across the Plains, tokens and Voidrig stuff across Deimos. Maybe a more open form of Sanctuary Onslaught, too, where you're hunting rogue data packets in the simulation and Simaris gives credit for that. Heck, give us pickups in Conclave and you literally fight each other over them. (Distribute standing rewards based on placement - wait a second that's actually doable lol)

[Pakaku]

I think it works fine the way it is for non-endless missions, because you're naturally walking through the map anyways. You can pick up voidplumes/medalions along the way, or hop through the portal and do a second run to pick up anything you might have missed.

The only caveat is... not everyone wants to do that, so instead of a dedicated mission, just give every mission optional extract like other landscapes. People who want to leave can do that, and people who want to stay and find the rest of the voidplumes can stay.

But I can see the value in having a "dedicated" mode for hunting voidplumes. Syndicate missions have their medallions, and I assume almost everyone joins those missions with the mindset of finding the medallions. So getting that mindset into the Zariman missions would be worth it

Some of the endless missions are just too hectic IMO for hunting voidplumes, or things are too scattered around the map to make voidplume hunting very efficient. If there aren't any breaks between rounds, there's no time to really hunt for the voidplumes unless you're running Golden Instinct or happen to summon one of those specter kids. In that case I've just accepted that it's not worth hunting for when the mission gives you no real time for that.

[AuroraSonicBoom]

1 hour ago, DreisterDino said:

You have a Capture/Rescue/Spy Mission, but you dont know where the capture target/rescue target/spy vaults are.

DE actually tried that years ago with the introduction of the "no minimap" mode for nightmare missions. People were so enraged about having to actually locate the mobile defense console visually(you know, like the Lotus keeps saying all the time) and couldn't just run to the point, wait and run to the end, that the removed the entire mode and recycled the mechanic into the grineer propaganda balloons messing up your minimap in a very small radius. 

It was heartbreaking for me personally, because I absolutely loved having to look around and not just RUNRUNRUN all the time. The cache finding bounties brought back some of that old feeling a little, but it's just not the same as not knowing at all where the vault/console/etc. is. I'm not a fan of separating every little gameplay mechanic into its own mission type as to not offend any given player not wanting to do X,Y or Z, so I'd welcome an exploration mechanic as random mission modifier that lasts for up to an hour on a node, preventing people from cancel/repeating the mission like they do during "change of plans" captures. 

Another idea I suggested a long time ago was a randomly generated scavenger hunt unique to each player. Simaris' scanning tasks took some of the mechanical basics, but it doesn't include having to find hints about where to go or what to do next. The idea itself was supposed to be set in a reworked solar system where different factions launching invasions could actually have medium term effects on the map, and each mission a player completes would grant not only them some chance of revealing new information about their hunt, but also progress the state of the game world as a whole. 

Spoiler

 

 

[(PSN)Unstar]

I think the issue with exploration-focused missions is that they would quickly become a lengthy chore.  Traversing the bulk of a map to find anything is a big ask, and while in regards to finding feathers it's fairly fresh now because the Zariman and it's secrets are still new, the shelf-life on that newness is limited.  Eventually you'll just know all the details of how to explore the limited possibilities the tileset offers, and then the mission type would become nothing more than a mindless chore.  And maybe some people are fine with that, maybe some people would like that.  But I think most players would get bored by playing solitaire rounds of hide-and-seek when you already know all of the hiding places.

With the current system, you can still play the hide-and-seek game, but it's this optional thing on the side that you can opt into while you're doing something else.  Given the way our community likes to optimize and achieve multiple goals at once, I think that's probably the better way to do it, even if some of the mission types (such as timed exterminate) don't pair as well with the treasure hunt mini-game.

[TARINunit9]

1 hour ago, AuroraSonicBoom said:

DE actually tried that years ago with the introduction of the "no minimap" mode for nightmare missions. People were so enraged about having to actually locate the mobile defense console visually(you know, like the Lotus keeps saying all the time) and couldn't just run to the point, wait and run to the end, that the removed the entire mode and recycled the mechanic into the grineer propaganda balloons messing up your minimap in a very small radius. 

That sounds like a 100% justified change for Mobile Defense, and a shame for every other mission type.

[DreisterDino]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb Tyreaus:

Just toss a bunch of debt tokens and toroids across the Valis

Thats already a thing btw, you can find Toroids on Orb Vallis.

The problem with that: It feels like there are only a handful of Toroids on a map thats a few squarekilometers big 🙄

 

But i agree, in theory the Open Worlds might be even better for explorational missions since the whole Map is revealed from the start, which means this concept of 1. find clues 2. get a radial zone marker 3. get a waypoint could work a lot better. But what DE did with that is kinda embarassing tbh - remember the "fishing for clues" stage in this one heist mission? yeah...

 

vor 2 Stunden schrieb AuroraSonicBoom:

DE actually tried that years ago with the introduction of the "no minimap" mode for nightmare missions. People were so enraged about having to actually locate the mobile defense console visually(you know, like the Lotus keeps saying all the time) and couldn't just run to the point, wait and run to the end, that the removed the entire mode and recycled the mechanic into the grineer propaganda balloons messing up your minimap in a very small radius. 

Ok, thats just sad, but i am not surprised. I dont know, maybe better rewards would have solved it and make up for the additional time it takes. Because if it only takes longer for the same rewards, i can atleast understand why people wouldnt like it, although i would still enjoy it personally.

 

Some time ago i played a Mob Def with a friend from my Clan with the whole HUD turned off. I can only recommend trying that out for everyone who just wants to enjoy the game once in a while. Its honestly amazing how different Warframe feels when the whole screen isnt cluttered with symbols. I would genuinely do that more often if there would be an option to at least keep the crosshair, because no matter how trivial the mission is, not knowing where and what everything is makes it interesting.

 

[Tyreaus]

5 minutes ago, DreisterDino said:

Thats already a thing btw, you can find Toroids on Orb Vallis.

The problem with that: It feels like there are only a handful of Toroids on a map thats a few squarekilometers big 🙄

Yeah, that's the thing: it's not dense enough. Even in the Zariman, I would envision it having double, maybe triple the total number of plumes for solo play, and scaling that number and the map size to squad size. The open worlds could do it a little more patchwork: have designated, highlighted "loot" areas (perhaps really big ones, albeit) to rummage through instead of the entire map as-is, lest it become a bit too much of a loot fest. And there's a handful of modifiers to tack onto it, too: hide medallions in crates, make some crates only able to be opened with direct weapons fire (so the AoE clear trick only works up to a point), throw a timer on there and get the player to speedrun as hard as possible.