We need other ways to get Conclave rewards

[SirPaladin555]

2 minutes ago, SpicyDinosaur said:

yea and their ai is terrible, and that isn't really pvp, it's just more pve.

Yeah the spectors have the AI of a rock with googly eyes. So it could certainly use some improvements if implemented in conclave lol

[SpicyDinosaur]

1 hour ago, SirPaladin555 said:

Yeah the spectors have the AI of a rock with googly eyes. So it could certainly use some improvements if implemented in conclave lol

even if they were good, no one playing conclave is plaqying to go up against a mob. They are there to fight live people. There's a big difference in the approach for pvp and pve and I don't think it would benefit conclave to be more pve when that's not the point of it at all.

[SirPaladin555]

41 minutes ago, SpicyDinosaur said:

even if they were good, no one playing conclave is plaqying to go up against a mob. They are there to fight live people. There's a big difference in the approach for pvp and pve and I don't think it would benefit conclave to be more pve when that's not the point of it at all.

I get what you mean , the spectors would be more just to fill slots if nobody is playing or if you can't get a full team , multilayer games do this all the time.

[DeadVoid118]

12 hours ago, RobWasHere said:

Or we could rework Conclave again and make it enjoyable...

PvP in Warframe CAN work, Destiny is the example.

Some Conclave mods drop from Sentients.

Years and years of experience have shown that it may not be worth getting it to work.

(Direct) PvP is an entirely different mode that requires constant attention, care, and balance. Every new Warframe has to be tweaked to work in it, every new weapon has to be tweaked to work in it, so on and so forth. PvE scalings and effects simply aren't fun or fair when it's being used on you, like getting stunned for 10+ seconds is not fun, so obviously that needs to be changed. Warframe is a PvE game, nobody is looking to play PvP in Warframe. The cost/benefit simply isn't there, especially when other parts of the game are in dire need of support and people actually do participate in those aspects. Archwing and Railjack are both more important aspects of the game that are also in need of a lot of work, and Necramechs could do with some tweaking. Let's also remember even Warframes have vast amounts of issues for PvE, which should always be the focus.

I'm very much of the opinion that Conclave should be retired, for good. But then, I'm here for Warframe, the PvE game, not Conclave.

[SpicyDinosaur]

54 minutes ago, DeadVoid118 said:

Years and years of experience have shown that it may not be worth getting it to work.

(Direct) PvP is an entirely different mode that requires constant attention, care, and balance. Every new Warframe has to be tweaked to work in it, every new weapon has to be tweaked to work in it, so on and so forth. PvE scalings and effects simply aren't fun or fair when it's being used on you, like getting stunned for 10+ seconds is not fun, so obviously that needs to be changed. Warframe is a PvE game, nobody is looking to play PvP in Warframe. The cost/benefit simply isn't there, especially when other parts of the game are in dire need of support and people actually do participate in those aspects. Archwing and Railjack are both more important aspects of the game that are also in need of a lot of work, and Necramechs could do with some tweaking. Let's also remember even Warframes have vast amounts of issues for PvE, which should always be the focus.

I'm very much of the opinion that Conclave should be retired, for good. But then, I'm here for Warframe, the PvE game, not Conclave.

This is so wrong and a totally uninformed opinion. Plenty of people want to play pvp in warframe, the lack of challenge in the game and the devs catering to the players that don't want a challenge along with neglect of the mode has just whittled away at the fan base. However, pvp does not require constant attention because new things are generally not added to conclave anymore. Your statements are categorically false. PvP is stable for the most part, it just need the occasional glance over.

 

You talk about what is more important like you speak for everyone, and as if you speak from an educated position, but neither of those is true. It's obvious you've never properly experienced pvp in warframe or how it works, otherwise you would have known that constant balancing is not required. We got some quick fixes when Reb took over and things have improved drastically. The mode was just being ignored completely. PvE updates would sometimes break things like Lunaro, bu that's because PvE is the unstable factor in this system.

 

You need to learn to step outside of your own needs and experiences and appreciate that other people might see things differently or want/enjoy different things. And that's okay! The game can support multiple modes of play at once. It's been doing it for ages now.

[DeadVoid118]

13 minutes ago, SpicyDinosaur said:

This is so wrong and a totally uninformed opinion. Plenty of people want to play pvp in warframe, the lack of challenge in the game and the devs catering to the players that don't want a challenge along with neglect of the mode has just whittled away at the fan base. However, pvp does not require constant attention because new things are generally not added to conclave anymore. Your statements are categorically false. PvP is stable for the most part, it just need the occasional glance over.

 

You talk about what is more important like you speak for everyone, and as if you speak from an educated position, but neither of those is true. It's obvious you've never properly experienced pvp in warframe or how it works, otherwise you would have known that constant balancing is not required. We got some quick fixes when Reb took over and things have improved drastically. The mode was just being ignored completely. PvE updates would sometimes break things like Lunaro, bu that's because PvE is the unstable factor in this system.

 

You need to learn to step outside of your own needs and experiences and appreciate that other people might see things differently or want/enjoy different things. And that's okay! The game can support multiple modes of play at once. It's been doing it for ages now.

Citation needed.

[Tyreaus]

I'd say trading.

Big reason is that it protects playtime. You might not play Conclave, but somebody has to put in the time to get those items. That allows people who enjoy it to continue enjoying it, and even have a pretty good reason to keep at it, while those who don't can encourage and support that aforementioned group without putting themselves (and, by proxy, others in the matches) through unpleasantness.

[----Legacy----]

2 hours ago, DeadVoid118 said:

Citation needed.

As a player who started playing conclave a bit before the rework, has kept an eye in both, pvp and pve updates and knows several knowledgeable players who remain active in pvp i can confirm that SpicyDinosaur's statement is right.

Also:

3 hours ago, DeadVoid118 said:

I'm very much of the opinion that Conclave should be retired, for good. But then, I'm here for Warframe, the PvE game, not Conclave.

These lines say pretty much everything about your bias.

[gioMisterio]

17 hours ago, SirPaladin555 said:

Your making the assumption people have the friends to play conclave with in the first place.

Same situation, yet by simply checking once in a while all gamemodes from Orbiter I usually found people to play against for 3-4 matches, and by doing arguablly not hard daily quests you can get about 10k standing easily in half a hour (2k-6k by getting standing from matches itself and 3k-5k from daily quests). 

[(PSN)Pablogamer585]

hace 19 horas, SirPaladin555 dijo:

Your making the assumption people have the friends to play conclave with in the first place.

Correct, I shouldn't assume people have friends to begin with but it would have come as rude if I said it, hence why I skipped that bit.
You, on the other hand...

[DrivaMain]

It's just a piece of cloth that is dangling behind your frame, you can live without it. 

Spoiler

I am referring to that exclusive Syandana.

Until PvP has OFFICIAL dedicated servers, I wouldn't touch it with a 10 light year pole. It has potential, but the terrible ping experience is pushing me away,

[DeadVoid118]

On 2023-02-06 at 7:06 PM, ----Legacy---- said:

As a player who started playing conclave a bit before the rework, has kept an eye in both, pvp and pve updates and knows several knowledgeable players who remain active in pvp i can confirm that SpicyDinosaur's statement is right.

Also:

These lines say pretty much everything about your bias.

Yes, they do. I made sure to point out my bias with reason, because I don't play Conclave. I want to point out that, based on how long Conclave matchmaking can take, the vast majority of players also don't play Conclave. SpicyDinosaur points this out by saying the PvP fanbase has whittled away, which is correct. Pulling those players back to Warframe is not worthwhile in my opinion, Warframe should focus on what it is good at and not what it doesn't need to.

The reason I said 'Citation needed' is because I doubt that player (or anyone) has actual data on how many people care about Conclave, except maybe DE. I admit it was a bit crass of me to simply respond with that, and I apologize for it.

As for only needing the occasional glance over, that's not necessarily true. Technical debt is a thing, Warframe suffers from spaghetti code and every mode in the game adds to bloat and things that have to be checked and triple-checked. I'm a programmer myself, it's good practice to check as much of a program as is reasonably possible to make sure it's running correctly, even if you think you didn't modify something. Even if things aren't being visibly changed, maintaining what is currently there requires effort.

[SirPaladin555]

On 2023-02-06 at 1:53 PM, SpicyDinosaur said:

yea and their ai is terrible, and that isn't really pvp, it's just more pve.

 

If you haven't played in awhile, definitely give it a good shot now and then come back with the results. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Well i have tried conclave and it is indeed alot more active than it was before, 

 

In my opinion case closed , conclave rewards are fine where they are as of now 

[SpicyDinosaur]

1 hour ago, SirPaladin555 said:

Well i have tried conclave and it is indeed alot more active than it was before, 

 

In my opinion case closed , conclave rewards are fine where they are as of now 

Glad you actually gave it a shot! I do feel bad for console conclave players though, it is so much rougher with a controller. But crossplay plus the fixes they made like getting rid of the Telos Boltace have rejuvenated the mode imo.

[SpicyDinosaur]

9 hours ago, DeadVoid118 said:

Yes, they do. I made sure to point out my bias with reason, because I don't play Conclave. I want to point out that, based on how long Conclave matchmaking can take, the vast majority of players also don't play Conclave. SpicyDinosaur points this out by saying the PvP fanbase has whittled away, which is correct. Pulling those players back to Warframe is not worthwhile in my opinion, Warframe should focus on what it is good at and not what it doesn't need to.

The reason I said 'Citation needed' is because I doubt that player (or anyone) has actual data on how many people care about Conclave, except maybe DE. I admit it was a bit crass of me to simply respond with that, and I apologize for it.

As for only needing the occasional glance over, that's not necessarily true. Technical debt is a thing, Warframe suffers from spaghetti code and every mode in the game adds to bloat and things that have to be checked and triple-checked. I'm a programmer myself, it's good practice to check as much of a program as is reasonably possible to make sure it's running correctly, even if you think you didn't modify something. Even if things aren't being visibly changed, maintaining what is currently there requires effort.

As a fellow programmer, that's what AUT is for.

 

However, Conclave doesn't break every time something new is introduced to PvE, though it has certainly happened before. So that's speculation on my part, yes, but it's because things don't go wrong with every update, (like they did with Raids, F,) that I am making that speculation.

[DeadVoid118]

18 hours ago, SpicyDinosaur said:

As a fellow programmer, that's what AUT is for.

AUT is harder to do for videogames, though the main concern is when things break and now you have to fix things for a mode that's practically dead. In my opinion, the effort required to reinvigorate/redesign Conclave on the chance it will draw players in, at least ones not already playing for the PvE, is too much compared to the alternative of cutting out the bloat and putting those resources towards bettering PvE, which is 99% of the current game. Though, I am also of the opinion that portions of PvE need to be trimmed or slimmed as well, or otherwise made more conducive to the whole.

18 hours ago, SpicyDinosaur said:

However, Conclave doesn't break every time something new is introduced to PvE, though it has certainly happened before. So that's speculation on my part, yes, but it's because things don't go wrong with every update, (like they did with Raids, F,) that I am making that speculation.

It is indeed speculation as we have no knowledge of internal practices as far as I am aware. I would hope that Conclave is stable, but Warframe has shown worrying levels of technical debt at times in the form of bugs appearing in completely unrelated systems.

[SpicyDinosaur]

1 hour ago, DeadVoid118 said:

AUT is harder to do for videogames, though the main concern is when things break and now you have to fix things for a mode that's practically dead. In my opinion, the effort required to reinvigorate/redesign Conclave on the chance it will draw players in, at least ones not already playing for the PvE, is too much compared to the alternative of cutting out the bloat and putting those resources towards bettering PvE, which is 99% of the current game. Though, I am also of the opinion that portions of PvE need to be trimmed or slimmed as well, or otherwise made more conducive to the whole.

It's not dead, though. As you can see, the OP went back and tried Conclave again, and it is active once more, especially around the time turn over. With the precious few fixes they made plus cross play, it has had new life breathed into it. I suggest you try playing it yourself if you don't believe me.

 

1 hour ago, DeadVoid118 said:

It is indeed speculation as we have no knowledge of internal practices as far as I am aware. I would hope that Conclave is stable, but Warframe has shown worrying levels of technical debt at times in the form of bugs appearing in completely unrelated systems.

Except that PvP isn't showing those problems. We'd be experiencing them, and until recently we'd be dealing with them not being fixed. We would see the results, basically. So the speculation is still pretty highly likely. It's about as sure a statement as you can make outside of being on the dev team.

[Jackdarsan]

The conclave rewards are useless to the rest of the game apart from any skins/cosmetics which people running around in missions so fast I can hardly see anything anyway. 

Its DEs dark little mistake that they want all of us to forget and look past as they focus on on every other part of this game. 

As someone who loves to have it all, I would love to be able to get into conclave and collect everything it has to offer but it is soooo mind numbing boring and I just hate it, I had to leave it behind and not touch it. 

[Frendh]

On 2023-02-06 at 10:27 AM, Merrcenary said:

This is a problem that should be addressed, we need another source or two for getting conclave mods, armor, skins that DOESN'T involve playing dead mode.

 

I disagree.

[(PSN)jaggerwanderer]

How to improve Conclave? Put in 1v1 quick matches. With crossplay there's bound to be someone to queue with. 

[DeadVoid118]

On 2023-02-09 at 5:13 PM, SpicyDinosaur said:

It's not dead, though. As you can see, the OP went back and tried Conclave again, and it is active once more, especially around the time turn over. With the precious few fixes they made plus cross play, it has had new life breathed into it. I suggest you try playing it yourself if you don't believe me.

Huh? Where in this thread did OP go and try Conclave again? I suppose I can go and try it again.

On 2023-02-09 at 5:13 PM, SpicyDinosaur said:

Except that PvP isn't showing those problems. We'd be experiencing them, and until recently we'd be dealing with them not being fixed. We would see the results, basically. So the speculation is still pretty highly likely. It's about as sure a statement as you can make outside of being on the dev team.

Frankly, I highly doubt we see every bug introduced by updates, but only a tiny minority of them. We do not see the results of all the bugs that are fixed prior to an update that would've introduced them. The last update to the Conclave was in January (and was a fix after the tweaks, not the tweaks). Even assuming that the recent changes caused some issues, there has been regular fixes to the Conclave for a long, long time. It's quite easy to just look at the Patch History on the wiki and see how often updates to the Conclave occur. PvP clearly is showing problems at times, and even in Conclave's most dead state is DE forced to fix it.

[SpicyDinosaur]

4 hours ago, DeadVoid118 said:

Huh? Where in this thread did OP go and try Conclave again? I suppose I can go and try it again.

 

On 2023-02-08 at 9:23 PM, SirPaladin555 said:

Well i have tried conclave and it is indeed alot more active than it was before, 

 

In my opinion case closed , conclave rewards are fine where they are as of now 

 

[BroDutt]

On 2023-02-07 at 3:17 AM, SirPaladin555 said:

You missed the point , the mode Is dead making it nearly impossible to get the rewards without a dedicated group. 

Spoiler

Get a new account on another PC/Console a friend and use the Pacific server

Just don't abuse it.

On 2023-02-10 at 10:48 AM, (PSN)jaggerwanderer said:

How to improve Conclave? Put in 1v1 quick matches. With crossplay there's bound to be someone to queue with. 

You can do that with any Conclave Modes as long as you're playing in public. And invite your "friend" after entering the Mode not before it.

[DeadVoid118]

23 hours ago, SpicyDinosaur said:

Insert quoting of SirPaladin555 here

That's not the OP.

[SpicyDinosaur]

1 hour ago, DeadVoid118 said:

That's not the OP.

Ahh, that's what I get for thinking someone sounds like they know what they are doing. How can someone who is not the OP declare the thread closed? lol