Frost Prime only has one buffed stat. Fix this DE

[RedSolstice]

Frost Prime really should have a second buffed stat over his non-primed. The only thing Frost Prime has is bonus shields and an extra polarity. He's, stats-wise, the saddest Prime frame to exist. Okay, Frost isn't an armor or health Warframe, so what should get buffed? Well in my opinion, his energy is well deserving of a buff. Frost Prime has the same pathetic 150 energy of Frost. .

Most 150 energy frames get an energy buff with their primed version. Excalibur, Volt, Nidus, Nekros, and Zephyr are all good examples. But why not Frost? Why is Frost the only frame with a single, buffed stat? Every other frame has, at the very least, 2-3 buffed stats. Frost Prime should get the same attention and have his max energy raised to 180-200 and sprint speed raised from 0.95 to 1. These are reasonable stat changes in-line with the kind of buffs DE would normally do.

I'm sure I am not the only Frost user who feels like they've been lied to. Frost Prime is just hardly a Prime frame.

[EDM774]

He was literally the first F2P prime in the game (first prime at all being the founder exclusive Excalibur Prime). So they hadn't established an MO when it comes to priming frames yet. I agree he's due for a re-visit. But you gotta see where the devs were at when he was first released to understand why.

Edited November 6, 2023 by EDM774
ate an S

[RedSolstice]

That is a fair point for the reason why. But, he's not just due, he's long overdue for a re-visit.

Edited November 6, 2023 by RedSolstice

[PollexMessier]

A lot of older frames are falling behind on energy reserves. It's kinda wierd tbh. But I don't really have energy issues with him that bad. I miiiight be running Prime Flow+Arcane Energize on him tho, which is basically the "delete energy economy issues from the game" setup. I don't know off the top of my head if I have that on him tho, I don't use it very often.
He's pretty poor on survivability (Even his overguard agument seems to be pretty unhelpful. My experience with player overguard on the whole so far has been enemies one-shot it right off no matter how high it is) And his armor value Buffs the health of globe. So I think armor is probably the best stat to buff on him in his current state. I wouldn't be opposed to an energy buff tho. Both would be grand.

[S2Weak]

Actually, DE should fix the problem that normal version have less stat than prime version.

It would be better if primes are just cosmetics(or something similar to incarnon genesis).

[SDGDen]

50 minutes ago, S2Weak said:

Actually, DE should fix the problem that normal version have less stat than prime version.

It would be better if primes are just cosmetics(or something similar to incarnon genesis).

they used to be just cosmetic, and people complained, which is why prime frames have *minor* buffs. 

 

1 hour ago, PollexMessier said:

A lot of older frames are falling behind on energy reserves. It's kinda wierd tbh. But I don't really have energy issues with him that bad. I miiiight be running Prime Flow+Arcane Energize on him tho, which is basically the "delete energy economy issues from the game" setup. I don't know off the top of my head if I have that on him tho, I don't use it very often.
He's pretty poor on survivability (Even his overguard agument seems to be pretty unhelpful. My experience with player overguard on the whole so far has been enemies one-shot it right off no matter how high it is) And his armor value Buffs the health of globe. So I think armor is probably the best stat to buff on him in his current state. I wouldn't be opposed to an energy buff tho. Both would be grand.

archon flow! it's basically budget exothermic but for frost. that + icy avelanche results in your 4 being able to full strip, crowd control, create energy and give overguard to your entire team. it's a really strong setup especially when combined with his 3 for even better self-protection. im personally running him with nourish subsumed over his 1 (although subsuming over his 2 may be preferable if you like popping your globes with 1)

i've recently been testing all of my builds on things like kill rate, scaling and survivability, and frost was.... surprisingly high on every test (like top 5). he's a bit of a one-trick pony (since almost all of his power is stacked into his 4) but that one trick is very good. 

[S2Weak]

7分鐘前 , SDGDen 說:

they used to be just cosmetic, and people complained

They were reskin frames and weapons that cost inventory slots, crafting time and ranking up time. Not cosmetics like deluxe skins, alt helmets, weapon skins.

Edited November 6, 2023 by S2Weak

[PollexMessier]

20 minutes ago, SDGDen said:

archon flow!

Ah yeah, that'll do it. I've probly got that on. Just didn't feel like opening the game to check lol

[BiancaRoughfin]

3 hours ago, RedSolstice said:

That is a fair point for the reason why. But, he's not just due, he's long overdue for a re-visit.

Overdue both Stats Wise and model wise. A lot of the old Primes need an update.

[Tiltskillet]

It's fun to compare the prime upgrades of Frost and Atlas side by side.

[RedSolstice]

6 hours ago, Tiltskillet said:

It's fun to compare the prime upgrades of Frost and Atlas side by side.

Haha, yeah. It's crazy knowing Atlas Prime gets all his main 5 stats buffed.

Edited November 6, 2023 by RedSolstice

[(PSN)Boiled_Guts]

On 2023-11-06 at 2:47 AM, RedSolstice said:

I'm sure I am not the only Frost user who feels like they've been lied to. Frost Prime is just hardly a Prime frame.

Recently started getting frost relics until i realized this, ill just stick with my basic frost thanks

[(PSN)Redphienix]

Seconded, a good amount of the older prime stuff really needs revisited in terms of stats.

Some would argue some older prime stuff could use a visual touch up but honestly, it's fine, and we have deluxe skins and the like- it's stats that could use some adjustments to keep things 'fair'.

It isn't like Frost (or other older counterparts) need MAJOR SWEEPING CHANGE so much as they deserve to be brought in line with more modern prime adjustments.

It ain't like bumping up some of his core stats (or core stats for other old prime stuff) would suddenly break the bank and change like the Burston or the topic-specific Frost primes into the most meta defining and game breaking things out there- it'd just be nice, and grant more diversity in what people like bringing, kinda like how the new adapters have brought some garbage weapons into the spotlight but, y'know, more baseline with how such prime things should already be.

[AsffluffyZ]

Did you consider max rank stats or only rank 0 because that makes a difference as the scale differently between prime and base versions?

[Sam_Stenton]

On 2023-11-06 at 12:25 PM, SDGDen said:

archon flow! it's basically budget exothermic but for frost.

Tbh Archon flow has some really glaring issues, especially with frost, the key is in how the mod is worded, it basically requires the killing blow to basically be the damage tic that the ability creates, and since cold is a passive slow with no additional damage you really need to get the job done.

In most of the star chart it works great and icy avalanche gives a nice little bonus but the interaction with flow and the scaling of icy avalanche need attention for sure, just having the trigger being set off by killing an enemy who was frozen by his 4 would be fabulous and that's not even touching on the fact that freezing frost (augment for 1) doesn't apply the trigger for flow either.

In real life end game scenarios frost can be energy starved quite heavily even at 160% efficiency because if you mod for the 4 augment you are literally hinging your survival on your ability to supply energy as the over guard gains rarely make up for the energy cost involved at higher levels, this problem is much more pronounced if you remove companions from the equation in a main line content path like steel path circuit, no companions, enemies scale extremely fast and you're in a state of spamming just to survive clawing back only 200 overguard per enemy which frequently just gets deleted by the first few bullets that learn of your presence.

The constant 4 to survive loop can be mitigated slightly by adding chilling globe and lots of range into the mix at the extremes to increase crowd control with the freeze and obviously block bullets from distant enemies but then you've just forced yourself to exist within a small globe of your own design. 

I the immediate future frost is easily fixable with some now triggers being set for flow and a reasonable buff to overguard gain, that would really just help him exist at high level content and I say that as someone who has more frost cosmetics than I really should as I have many fond memories with him from years ago, at least he's nowhere near as pathetic as Oberon is currently, especially a kick in the teeth considering he is now crammed into the back of rail jack and significantly more difficult to get 😅

[AsffluffyZ]

On 2023-12-10 at 6:27 PM, Sam_Stenton said:

at least he's nowhere near as pathetic as Oberon is currently,

Oberon is fine minus some qol stuff.

Also the thread is about stats of the prme vs. base frame.

Edited December 12, 2023 by AsffluffyZ

[(XBOX)Big Roy 324]

I believe the average is two base stats.  So a bonus to energy max would be okay in my book. 

[Famecans]

Thoughts:

I have nothing to complain about Frost, I can say that Frost has the most functional kit in the game for loadout-related builds, there are numerous modifiers internally and externally related to Frost related to cold damage, the expansion of the energy pool is a reality today , there are skills, arcana, mods and kitguns to do various tricks.

Frost can be built for range without negatives and strength for instant remove 100% enemy armor as its survivability is maintained on spam of globe and ultimate skills, this generates shields and effective crowd control through cold damage which significantly affects all mission units including eximus.

I agree that the energy points seem low but it is currently the easiest defense frame to use in the game.