For a more mechanically interesting Frost, inquire within

[Hrodgrim]

I love Frost. He's one of my favorite frames, but he's very stale to the point of becoming uninteresting. The recent rework to the Overguard mechanic was neat, but ultimately didn't change much about the way he plays. After having been gone for some months, I come back to find Hydroid is now incredibly fun, with no forced (or false) synergies within his power set. Frost's powers are largely outdated and seeing the Hydroid rework got my noggin joggin' about how a similar design inspiration would work with Frost. To that end, I have some ideas for you to peruse.

 

Frost

Frost does not have a real passive. It is about as useful as Hydroid's old passive or more aptly Chroma's old "passive". Frost is the master of zoning, keeping enemies at bay, so his passive (which requires being struck with an enemy's melee attack) never comes into play. To exacerbate the problem, the passive itself only has a CHANCE of occurring to begin with.. In order to fix this, I've come up with a more interesting and useful passive for Frost.

Frost's new passive introduces an all-new mechanic centered around ice structures. 

Ice structures: Ice structures come into play depending on a variety of Frost's powers. By themselves, the ice structures do nothing. When shattered, Frost can pick up the ice pieces for tiny amounts of healing per shard. Ice structures will last for a static 30 seconds before melting.

Passive: Every ice structure in Frost's affinity radius grants him a small measure of armor and a small increase to Cold damage. Enemies frozen by Cold status also count until they thaw.

This new passive will make Frost more interactive with his own powers which will be listed below. 

 

Frost's first power is among the least useful things in the entire game. The ONLY thing this power is really good for is shattering globes (which should be built into the globe power itself, more on that in a bit) and maybe freezing the odd enemy here and there only to kill them less than a fraction of a second later with your gun. This new version of Frost's first power will revamp how it functions in the face of the passive stated above.

Freeze: 

Tap: Tap the button to cast a wintry gale toward the reticle. This breeze fires off in a wide cylinder, slightly pushes back and afflicts enemies struck by it with Cold status. Deals minimal damage but can shatter ice structures that it hits. Structures shattered by Freeze will deal slashing and cold damage and spread cold procs to enemies nearby.

Hold: Hold the button to cast Ice Wave, dealing Cold and Slashing damage and carpeting the ground in a wide area with razor sharp ice for X seconds. Enemies walking over the ice carpet are slowed and take Cold and Slashing damage over time. The carpet itself counts as an ice structure.

The first power for many frames is designed to be reused on a whim and or to provide fast utility of some sort. This new first power serves to combine Frost's old first and second powers into one power with its own self synergy. It is made to slow enemies down and somewhat incorporates Ice Wave Impedance into the base power. This further opens up Frost's kit with room for an altogether new power. 

Cold Snap: Frost conjures a deep freeze around himself that drains energy over time to maintain. Enemies who enter this zone are slowed by X% while they are in the zone and X seconds after they leave. Enemies afflicted with Cold procs who are killed in this zone will freeze into ice structures. Ice structures in this zone do not melt.

New Augment: With the removal of Ice Wave, the Ice Wave Impedance augment is replaced with Deep Freeze. Deep Freeze causes all ice structures in the radius to generate their own small Cold Snap zone as long as Cold Snap is active. This effect can chain between ice structures.

This new second power takes inspiration from Sevagoth's Gloom power, doubling down on Frost's habit of slowing enemies down. In addition to slowing enemies down, any enemies who are affected with Cold are completely frozen when they are killed inside the power's radius, which activates Frost's new passive, granting him more survivability and power when surrounded by ice structures. Visually, I imagine this power to slightly darken the area around Frost and conjure up a snow storm to swirl around him.

Snow Globe is one of Frost's two good powers. Snow Globe is the king of point defense and doesn't really need much help.

Snow Globe: 

Tap: Tap the button to generate a Snow Globe. This functions exactly as it does now. Snow Globe is considered an ice structure, but can only be detonated by its own power (or by being broken).

Hold: Hold the button to detonate all active Snow Globes. Broken or detonated Snow Globes will also shatter ice structures within and around them. Ice structures shattered by Snow Globe will create a mist (like Freeze does currently) that slows enemies in their wake and gradually applies Cold status.

This new version of Snow Globe is aimed at making fun usage of Frost's new passive. Due to Frost's new passive, the Snow Globe can have access to stronger, albeit conditional, armor scores in order to have more up-front durability upon cast. Secondly, it offers a different effect for shattering ice structures than the first power, letting Frost adapt to the situation at hand if necessary. 

Avalanche is easily Frost's greatest power. It can shred enemy armor, freeze them in place, deal respectable damage, and even has an incredible augment. 90% of Frost's viability is in this one power. To that end, it doesn't require a radical change.

Avalanche: Frost violently freezes, shatters, and re-freezes the area surrounding him. Enemies affected by Avalanche have their armor sundered and are frozen in place for X seconds. Enemies and ice structures shattered by Avalanche explode with effects similar to the first power but also shatter any other ice structures near themselves. Avalanche conjures up its own improved ice structures after it finishes. 

Greater Ice Structure: These ice structures are created specifically by Avalanche. They are used by the other powers in the same way as listed above, but have stronger effects. Frost's passive is more potent in the presence of these structures.

This new form of Avalanche seeks to capitalize on Frost's new ice structure mechanic, gaining terrifying power if used right. It will allow Frost to destroy all ice structures in play if they are close enough together, by virtue of chain destruction.

 

To recap, this new Frost gains more defensive might when he is surrounded by ice structures. He can also destroy the ice structures to heal himself, thanks to his new passive, and use them offensively in the form of damage or crowd control. Enemies who are frozen by Cold status also count toward Frost's passive as long as they are still frozen.

Frost's new first power is designed to give the player a small taste of the rest of Frost's kit all up front. It can generate AND shatter ice structures, and later on when Frost is able to create veritable jungles of ice, it will allow him to more surgically remove small areas of his ice structures.

Frost's new second power serves to create and propagate more and more ice structures to further fuel Frost's new passive. It also has the added bonus of slowing down enemies who are close to Frost, giving him another sort of soft form of crowd control. 

The changes to Snow Globe allow it to interact with Frost's new passive. It remains roughly the same, and its shatter effect is focused on crowd control.

Avalanche now gains calamitous power if used wisely with ice structures. It also generates its own type of improved ice structure to be used at Frost's discretion. 

 

This writeup is something of a wishlist inspired by the more interesting Warframe design that's been coming out here recently. All of the newer Warframes are pretty interesting to play, and are not as unga bunga as some of the older frames. Hydroid is a prime example of this; his original powers were not fun at all, his first rework made him a little better, but he was still sort of idle to play, and his new rework has made him simple but nuanced by hinging all of his powers on the Corrosive damage type. This design philosophy makes Warframe very fun again since it's no longer braindead "push to win" and requires you to think about your powers' own interactions. 

[Circle_of_Psi]

I really like this

[Asono]

I honestly really love this, I like the idea of Frost's theming being more of flash freezing the air around him rather than a traditional cryomancer. I would honestly prefer another frame take up the mantle of a more tradition cryomancer utilizing icicles. This would also keep him well in line with remaining as a defense frame more focused on cc. Which is what he was supposed to be based on his current kit. On top of that it would bring much needed synergy to his kit.

[gfb537]

These are fine suggestions, but any rework of Frost needs to alter his snow globe to allow allies to shoot through it similar to Gara's Mass Vitrify.  Frost can be not-fun to be in a squad with because snow globe can impede our ability to fight.  The trolling opportunities are endless, but it doesn't take a malicious Frost player to cause problems for the rest of his squad.

[AsffluffyZ]

7 hours ago, gfb537 said:

These are fine suggestions, but any rework of Frost needs to alter his snow globe to allow allies to shoot through it similar to Gara's Mass Vitrify.  Frost can be not-fun to be in a squad with because snow globe can impede our ability to fight.  The trolling opportunities are endless, but it doesn't take a malicious Frost player to cause problems for the rest of his squad.

The weird thing is you can only shoot through the globe from inside.

[Hrodgrim]

12 hours ago, gfb537 said:

These are fine suggestions, but any rework of Frost needs to alter his snow globe to allow allies to shoot through it similar to Gara's Mass Vitrify.  Frost can be not-fun to be in a squad with because snow globe can impede our ability to fight.  The trolling opportunities are endless, but it doesn't take a malicious Frost player to cause problems for the rest of his squad.

It's honestly a good idea. Allies shooting through Snow Globe is sorta long overdue.

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

So, the biggest problem with this is that you're probably going way too hard into the slowing aspect of Frosts abilities, which you don't really have to even include since Cold caps at a 90% slow. Snowglobe itself already has an inherent 67% slow on top of Cold Procs, so I'm not really understanding the fascination with just stacking it to kingdom come.

Passive: Sounds good so far.

Freeze: Should probably still have the full Frozen effect applied to it, but is otherwise fine. Might want to look into giving Ice Wave Damage Vulnerability to Cold damage, or something like increased Status Chance to help with the Cold and Slash Proc distribution from his Passive.

Cold Snap: I would look into removing the additional Slow. If you want to keep it, just have Snowglobes inherent slow apply to the radius of Cold Snap once you enter and leave the globe, taking the effect with you. I would try boosting the Critical Damage you get from Cold Procs against enemies in the radius instead. Mostly something to help with his gunplay.

Avalanche: Looks good.

 

[Hrodgrim]

10 minutes ago, (XBOX)Graysmog said:

 

I forgot all about Cold status' critical damage boost. That's a good point.

[_GoodLuck_]

His passive should be Biting Frost

[Leqesai]

It is funny to see a rework proposed for one of the strongest frames...

[Hrodgrim]

19 minutes ago, Leqesai said:

It is funny to see a rework proposed for one of the strongest frames...

"Strong" doesn't necessarily equate to "good". His first two abilities are pretty much the same thing and they don't do much. His third ability actively impedes the team. The vast majority of his strength is in his last power. Spamming one power doesn't make for good design. 

Spoiler

I still like playing as Frost though.

 

[rawr1254]

Love all this but if all these "structures" from enemies and all dont essentially do this:

so they dont block my shots like globe does i dont want it. I dont wanna have to constantly figure out where to aim cause you got structures all over the place

[Hrodgrim]

27 minutes ago, rawr1254 said:

Love all this but if all these "structures" from enemies and all dont essentially do this:

so they dont block my shots like globe does i dont want it. I dont wanna have to constantly figure out where to aim cause you got structures all over the place

What if the structures faded out when you look at them like the new frame's little floaty things? It would be cool if ice structures impede enemy pathing but not player movement, sort of like that glass frame's barrier.

[rawr1254]

2 hours ago, Hrodgrim said:

What if the structures faded out when you look at them like the new frame's little floaty things? It would be cool if ice structures impede enemy pathing but not player movement, sort of like that glass frame's barrier.

i mean we could make them able to be shot through too but if we wanna make them stand upright then either make them clear see through like glass or have them topple over. itll be like trying to drive an 18 wheeler in rush hour traffic with all the structures i can imagine id see

[Leqesai]

7 hours ago, Hrodgrim said:

"Strong" doesn't necessarily equate to "good". His first two abilities are pretty much the same thing and they don't do much. His third ability actively impedes the team. The vast majority of his strength is in his last power. Spamming one power doesn't make for good design. 

  Reveal hidden contents

I still like playing as Frost though.

 

I disagree but you do you.

[Fred_Avant_2019]

Le 25/12/2023 à 23:37, _GoodLuck_ a dit :

His passive should be Biting Frost

Yes. But probably not that high in terms of multipliers.  Or have it scale with the number of cold procs present.

 

I find it funny that you took inspiration from Sevagoth's gloom to make his new 2, because that's actually what I run on my umbral frost, that I main. It supplements his defensive role perfectly (I mean gloom), as for your ability, I think it's a decent take on it.

 

Another idea I had about Frost was, well, frostburn, as in converting cold into a DoT specific to just Frost himself, but it might not fit, since we want Frost to be mostly defensive.

[Hrodgrim]

1 hour ago, Fred_Avant_2019 said:

I find it funny that you took inspiration from Sevagoth's gloom to make his new 2, because that's actually what I run on my umbral frost, that I main. It supplements his defensive role perfectly (I mean gloom), as for your ability, I think it's a decent take on it.

I like to use Zephyr's subsume ability in place of Frost's first ability. It lets me double down on putting the enemies where I want them and keeping them there. It's also handy for knocking tougher foes into death zones like endless pits and such.

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

3 hours ago, Fred_Avant_2019 said:

Yes. But probably not that high in terms of multipliers.  Or have it scale with the number of cold procs present.

 

I find it funny that you took inspiration from Sevagoth's gloom to make his new 2, because that's actually what I run on my umbral frost, that I main. It supplements his defensive role perfectly (I mean gloom), as for your ability, I think it's a decent take on it.

 

Another idea I had about Frost was, well, frostburn, as in converting cold into a DoT specific to just Frost himself, but it might not fit, since we want Frost to be mostly defensive.

Well here's the thing, Frost is mostly a defensive Warframe who uses his kit to boost his weapons. You can still give him a little bit of damage and fit that concept, you just don't want it to be the entire focus.

Ice Wave is supposed to be an offensive ability as an example, so you could always just give it damage and leave everything else. Avalanche is his other main one, so that can also be looked into. Giving him one ability that can kill things outside of the weird Snowglobe % damage isn't a crime.

As long as Frost is more like Harrow and doesn't just replicate Gara, he should be fine.

Edited December 27, 2023 by (XBOX)Graysmog