Warframe Ability Changes

[Deidaku]

My only gripes with all this

 

> Nyx psychic bolts

> excal slash dash should add to meter.

 

 

All the other frames except Nova are pretty balanced

[Perserve]

Trinity changes sound horrible I wouldn't be able to heal a team like that effectively basing it purely on health isn't good due to variable amount of shields players have. plus at higher difficulties(survival after 30 minutes, endless defense around 35 waves)...how could I heal a dead player? most of the time you can't survive two hits. Players take way too much damage to heal re-actively.

[The_Sharp_Demonologist]

Finally another ult that actually requires skill. This will not just help Trinity Players to not feel cheap when using her ult and her energy Vampire will be a great tool to use whit those Ogris users blowing S#&$ up and we will still get all that Energy.

 

Also i would like to mention that this Change to Trinity could be considered a indirect Valkyr buff because if there is a Warframe that will make use of that 90% Resistance is Valkyr (She is a Health tank and health doesnt regenerate that easily so she spends most of her time low on those long shoot outs).

 

Thank you DE and im still wating for more info on that Valkyr visual rework, maybe whit an actual Beserker ult?

[Rainbee]

AFTER THIS CHANGE:

Pros:

- ¿¿??None. Even energy vampire is outclassed by nekros desecrate.

Cons:

- No wave clear.

- No scape method.

- No repositioning.

- Can't affect the battle field.

- Requires luck to be used sort of effectively.

- Outclassed by any other warframe offensively. Outclassed by oberon and nekros defensively

 

So you just flat out admit that you haven't played any other frame other than trinity, right?

[neKroMancer]

It takes a hell of a lot more than blessing to get 4 people to wave 80 or 80+ minutes!!

Trinity isn't essential of course but I enjoy playing her and IMO it does take skill to use her properly... The window you have to ensure your entire team stays alive is minute after 40 minutes of play...

Can you imagine the uproar (excuse the pun) if they made Iron Skin a duration ability? I'd say there are 10000x more players using Rhino regularly over Trinity! I never see another Trinity in daily play so people complaining about Blessing can't be in great numbers!!

 

Iron skin used to be duration ability with invulnerability similar to Blessing. It got changed for similar reason - player abused the mechanic to get to higher level and claim they got SKILL to do so.

 

Been there, done that. 

 

Trinity doesn't take skill to use 'properly' with only 2 second period that you cast blessing is the only time you can be killed. You either run behind some cover and cast it or cast it, got downed, and other players (who are now immune to all the thing) revive you.

[Rorgal_Sina]

How about make other ults useful instead?

[KeepOnFlowing]

Yes! I'm glad we can't cheat the game now too!

[RahuHordika]

-snip-

At last someone gets it. Ash's ult purpose may have been to kill everything in range at first, but it differentiated from other ults in the aspect that it could have some utility, now it's most certainly going to become another boring 'press 4 to kill everything instantly' nuke.

I understand the time it took was an issue but instead of doing.... ugh this thing, they could have gone for a better route and improve on the utility Bladestorm could provide. I've mentioned it once, you gave a toggle to the other ults, why not Ash's too?

[CrimsonPorpoise]

-snip-

 

Ehhh I once played a T3 survival with a corrupted trinity, using a unranked frame and a unranked dual skana. We stayed for an hour, and I was never downed the entire period. I would say the current blessing is quite broken indeed.

Edited May 13, 2014 by NIXYNIXYNIX

[Vladek515]

I don't really mind the whole removal of the invincibility to Blessing, I still like my Trinity it felt really cheap to me to use it and I used the skill for it's intended use, not to tank everything, I'll try it out for a spin and decide whether it's positive or negative. I just don't see how people are just yelling without having tried it. We'll just see how it'll go, I'll also love to try out the Ash and Banshee buffs seeing they really needed them. Keep up the good work folks.

[Coach-Aprax]

Good news.I love those changes to Ash!

[Garuda4711]

I think we can all understand the general idea behind nerfing Trinity. But this "re-design" makes her outright ridiculous! :-(

[Kuestenjung]

So about Blessing, afaik you cannot recast blessing while it´s active.

If the Trin in the team now ( after she was changed ofc ) is casting blessing with only 1 teammember not at full health and let´s say blessing has a duration of 20sec, can Trin recast it within the 20sec if 1 other teammember gets his health reduced?

[Starender]

DE, about Ash's Teleporte:

- can you double the speed animation of teleporte plz ? because i'm faster if i copter to the target, and this is really wrong.

- the finisher on teleporte would be great if only it wasn't SO WEAK, seriously either buff finishers OR remove this.

 

ash would be perfect with those final changes

 

Volt: 

- plz remove the camera change on speed, it hurts

- if you make his speed toggle it would be even better

- either boost his armor/life OR his damage from ability's

 

Saryn:

- Venom would gladly use a buff

- Contagion is weak right now, it adds the equivalent of an elemental on your melee, seriously with this name you must add something truly nasty on those blades.

 

Excalibur:

HE IS SO WEAK ! besides dark sector's fans nobody plays him and they are right !

- replace "super jump" by "super charge", making him kinda like a little HULK:

        + melee damage /  jump / immunity to knockdown/ regen endurence / channeling damage...

 

- double the speed of slash dash

- give punch through to javelin

- and finaly BOOST HIS ARMOR, the original tenno was known to be able to support great harm, minimum 150 armor here 

[Agua]

Ehhh I once played a T3 survival with a corrupted trinity, using a unranked frame and a unranked dual skana. We stayed for an hour, and I was never downed the entire period. I would say the current blessing is quite broken indeed.

I've made similar things with a friend using nekros. Anyway blessing is op currently, but compensates for the rest of trinity powers.

I play warframe with about 9 friends. Im the only one that likes it, but after this change its a useless frame. The only real utility was to avoid bein oneshotted, now that is gone.

[lordblak360]

I can already tell, Trinity players will now be more selfish.

Pay attention ONLY to their health to get maximized effectiveness.

 

I'm saying it now, I prefer the current Blessing.

I know I will.  Wanna nerf a support specialist then I for one will only watch my own health and I will only cast when I need it now.

[JerZeyCJ]

just let go of trinity, or delete her since she's trash to only "you".

 

the only trinity i see in games are "invite only" or "private", "clan"

and those are to farm for mods.

 

 

no need to go to high defense/survival for fun-game for your endless.

just un equip all your mods you have on your WF,Guns,Melee n play.

So people should have to gimp themselves in order for the game to give them a challenge? Also, the poster said specifically "endless defense / survival is about all thats 'fun' to do that doesn't include gimping ourselves"

[Griefel]

Currently trinity's blessing is one of the only realistic ways to do some of the difficult content, like for example nightmare survivals vs ranged enemies. Instead of this total nerf of Blessing I propose some other ones: 

 

1) Half duration of Blessing: this will make it less spammable because it will require more energy to keep it up, giving newbie players a run for their money since they won't have the mods, the experience and the discipline to keep their team up forever while giving a challenge to the older more experienced players that like to do next to impossible content(like nightmare survivals).

2) Remove it's healing capabilities: add the healing to Well of life, increasing Well of life's range as well making it the effective healing mean it seems to have been created for. 

3) And if the 2 above don't do it then remove full immunity and add a 90% of 80% dmg reduction instead.

 

This way blessing will be for casual players the oh "s**t" button helping to save that person that is in trouble and will not make trinity not that useful compared to other frames.

The proposed changes make trinity very weak and it's the same debacle as with Frost tbh, from hero to zero. In most missions it will be preferable to get other forms of defense over trinity, for example nyx, vauban, nekros, hell even frost will be preferable or even another aoe dmg frame such as nova/ember/mag/etc, while for normal easy missions it will be a waste of slot since it's already a slow frame and it has no offensive abilities.

Then look at the lore part of this change, the warframes are supposed to be badass, some of them create singularity with a wave of their hand so using nano-bots to making armors give high dmg reduction would be a triviality at that level of technology right?

 

Thanks for reading.

Edited May 13, 2014 by Griefel

[Wurdyburd]

Looking through the thread, I'm glad to see people suggesting alternatives to Teleport's targeting system. It confuses me to see others who claim that when using Ash, they don't include Teleport in their arsenal, since despite it not having much use on a large-scale battlefield, it's useful for people who play melee-Ash, for a variety of reasons.
Long ago, in a discussion about Melee 2.0, DE suggested that being in melee-mode would grant you certain buffs or nerfs, depending what you were wielding. For example, a dagger, while not dealing much damage, would cause your run speed to increase, to greater close the distance between enemies so that melee could be viable. Since no system has been installed to actually help close distance, I thought for sure Ash's Teleport would get a look, as it's perfect for such purposes.

I will test the new Teleport before praising it or hating it, but an issue still remains.
For long distance teleportation, it's ESSENTIAL to look down your scope to aim at your target. Otherwise, you'd be there all day making tiny adjustments to icon position. Even then, good luck trying to catch a moving target before it moves out of sight or out of range.
However, in melee-mode, you don't get a scope. You have no way of zooming in, because why would you need one, right? Swords can't span rooms after all.
This combination of flaws makes it so that while playing Ash, attempting to melee-only, Teleport is more useless than it already was. Your accuracy for Teleport might be 20m, at best.

As an alternative, I suggest a multi-target averaging system. Perhaps when you activate Teleport, you gain the ability to mark up to three targets, and then be transported to an averaged-center of the group? If stun applied to all three, rather than the single target that Teleport currently uses, then it would make Teleport much more useful, and give it additional utility.
While we're at it, why not grant the ability to Teleport through walls? While this will surely cause a massive array of bugs to be fixed, it will further Teleport's utility even further. We can already see blue outlines of team members through solid surfaces, so why can't we teleport to them? Could this not be combined with the codex scanner in some way, allowing us to Teleport to enemies behind walls, rather than come out of cover to try and gain line of sight, on a system that currently demands that we spend multiple seconds attempting to catch enemies in our reticle in the first place?

I appreciate the changes that have been suggested here. But giving Ash's Teleport melee-finisher utility, without addressing the issues that cause Teleport to be useless in the first place, is rather disappointing.

[outbox]

I'm hopeful the upcoming changes will be positive ones, but this is quite depressing for me personally. Nova & Trinity are my mains, and have been since the beginning. I've put a lot of effort in to obtaining ~26sec blessing duration. I'll admit to even having two Nova frames. One specifically forma'd for max power strength and the other for efficiency. Please don't kill this game for me DE.  

[(PSN)yeater42]

Great job DE! This is what I like to see!

[(PSN)yeater42]

I'm hopeful the upcoming changes will be positive ones, but this is quite depressing for me personally. Nova & Trinity are my mains, and have been since the beginning. I've put a lot of effort in to obtaining ~26sec blessing duration. I'll admit to even having two Nova frames. One specifically forma'd for max power strength and the other for efficiency. Please don't kill this game for me DE.

I can understand the disappointment certainly, that said, Nove has crutch powers which detract from the game as does trinity. Hopefully these changes will add a sliver of skill into their kits. Waiting for Rhino next! Edited May 13, 2014 by (PS4)yeater42

[(PSN)PhantomZod]

Iron skin used to be duration ability with invulnerability similar to Blessing. It got changed for similar reason - player abused the mechanic to get to higher level and claim they got SKILL to do so.

 

Been there, done that. 

 

Trinity doesn't take skill to use 'properly' with only 2 second period that you cast blessing is the only time you can be killed. You either run behind some cover and cast it or cast it, got downed, and other players (who are now immune to all the thing) revive you.

Well yes if all you do is hide in a corner and spam blessing, that doesn't take skill...

Playing the game the same as all other players *and* keeping an eye on everything does take a lot of concentration....

We'll see.... In the meantime I'll ready my NYX for ODD and Tower Defence...

[Soulrift]

I'm not sure if this has already been said as I haven't read all 20 pages, but:

 

If Trinity's Blessing is going to protect players depending on how much it heals them, it must be able to be cast again before the duration timer expires, without eliminating the protection granted by the previous use.

 

EG:

 

Player 1 is at full health, Player 2 is at 50%. Blessing is cast. Player 1 gains no benefit and Player 2 is protected at 50% for the duration.

Halfway through the duration, Player 1 takes damage and is now at 25% health. Player 2 is still at full health and still enjoying 50% protection. At this point, Blessing must be able to be used to heal Player 1 and grant them 75% protection WITHOUT removing Player 2's 50% protection.

 

Obviously, when Blessing granted everyone immunity for its entire duration, it didn't need to be re-cast during the duration, and locking out a re-cast forced a slight window of opportunity for damage between uses, making re-cast locking desirable. However, with the change, players at full health are locked out of any benefit, necessitating the change and removing the lock-out.

 

---

 

"Ash will also re-attack targets if they survive the initial attack."

 

Will this mean that Bladestorm can be used to repeatedly attack a single target, such as a boss? Is this desirable?

 

---

 

How will the energy drain + toggle of Sound Quake and Absorb interact with +duration mods? Will they increase the time between energy drain ticks, reducing the cost? Will +duration mess with the timing of toggling off?

Edited May 13, 2014 by Soulrift

[lordblak360]

**Note to self:  Do not forma anymore frames.