January 30Th: Community Hot Topics!

[(PSN)SilverKarasu]

Raid Expections:

 

 - Definitely needs puzzles or moments of logic reasoning.

 - Multiple bosses with special mechanics should be an obvious necessity.

 - It should be restricted so that leechers looking for carries don't get in and that everyone that goes a least can pull their weight. A moderate conclave requirement say at 1200- should be good. Something higher would go into the realm of taking specific mod loadouts to boost conclave and no longer have the weapons be effective.

 - Raid exclusive gear is another obvious need or there would be no point to take the challenge. Raids are usually for the skilled or people that have done the work to get to that point. The rewards should be work it or make the game a bit easier to progress through. A hefty Fusion Core rewards would be nice as well as cosmetics. Weapons are ok but ONLY if those weapons are balanced to the rest of the weapons in the game like with usual weapons. If Raid weapons outclass the rest of the game then that basically breaks the rest of Warframe and we have an even worse case of "Necessary Endgame Weapons".

 - Timed Lockouts would not be a good idea. I like difficult content. And if you also have rewards such as the Large Fusion Core Pack discussed earlier, then this Raid could be a nice place for High level players to pit their best gear against good odds for nice progression rewards.

 - "Other": Went scaling the Raid's difficultly, keep in mind to make it so any fully maxed out weapon (barring MK-1's and beginner weapons) can pull their weight. We don't need recruiting messages asking for Specific Frames with Specific Weapon Loadouts like we already see for rep farming, and needlessly long survivals. I should be able to play my Zephyr with my Sybaris and bring my worth to the team.

 

Raid Boss Expectations:

 

 - Raid bosses should definitely require team coordination.

 - Top-tier gear is vague for this game. It should require well modded gear. Narrowing our weapons pool only makes us regret the work we put into other weapons.

 - No raid specific gear. Again, we focusing on modding and forma'ing weapons out of the huge pool we have because they're our favorite and want to use them &#! our signature. This would take that away.

 - Yes to mechanics. That's a Raid Boss staple.

 - A timed requirement is not good. The main thing that Warframe has going for it is it's large and, hopefully soon to be, immersive world. I don't want to rush through this Raid and want to be able to experience it fully. Maybe a final boss end phase can be timed for pressure but that's it. Or maybe certain mechanics can be timed.

- Bosses should have phases definitely. Each phase is like an accomplishment for a Raider.

 

Bows:

 

More Bows are ok. I think their in a nice place. Personally I'd like to stop with so many new weapons and start making more legitimate content. Raids, quests, Lore, etc.

[Bibliothekar]

A moderate conclave requirement say at 1200- should be good. Something higher would go into the realm of taking specific mod loadouts to boost conclave and no longer have the weapons be effective.

Are you nuts? 1200 already is highly specialized loadouts, since abilities don't contribute any more. I have loadouts <900 that can carry me through T4 without problem. Conclave rating as gate is drek anyway, as it was entirely made with Conclaves (viz. PvP, not PvE) in mind, thus mods that are strong against Tenno have a higher rating than those that are stronger against certain enemies. (Case in point: all Bane/Expel/... mods have a conclave rating of one.) You can put a minimum rating of 600 or something to keep people with 000 loadout away, but that's about it.

[(PSN)SilverKarasu]

Are you nuts? 1200 already is highly specialized loadouts, since abilities don't contribute any more. I have loadouts <900 that can carry me through T4 without problem. Conclave rating as gate is drek anyway, as minimum loadout like in t4entirely made with Conclaves (viz. PvP, not PvE) in mind, thus mods that are strong against Tenno have a higher rating than those that are stronger against certain enemies. (Case in point: all Bane/Expel/... mods have a conclave rating of one.) You can put a minimum rating of 600 or something to keep people with 000 loadout away, but that's about it.

1200 is pretty average for a full loadout.

With a final build primary, secondary, melee, frame and sentinel I sit at about that. Assuming I actually mod my sentinel weapon I'd sit at around 1300-1400.

800-900 is my loadout when I'm running around with only one good weapon and 1-2 newly forma'd weapons. T4 show not be a comparison for raid requirements. Hopefully they'll have mechanic that depend on a full loadout. You shouldn't be able to walk into the raid with just a minimum loadout like your t4 fit. If you can then the Raid difficulty is a joke.

[elele]

Time lockouts or bust. 

 

Gotta make those raids feel special and high risk. Nothing beats a 24hr lockout, a.l.a. Mastery Rank Tests.  

[Vanadium]

Absolutely do NOT touch my Dread.

 

Also, ADS/Secondary Fire fix when?

Edited February 2, 2015 by Go4tfi5h

[HoloheX]

Bows.

 

Holy crappppppppp.

 

 

We need a better impact one, for sure. Cernos just doesn't cut it. I used bows since I first started to play but recently I've been using the Opticor. The same charge mechanic fits but I still love bows to death. If anything, please take a look at how they damage null shields. Other than that I love them to death.

 

 

(Although I have plenty of bow concepts if you guys wanna look at em! Even an Archwing bow with homing arrows. c:)

 

Link for whomever; https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/331838-clustrum-20-archwing-bow-and-arrow/

what if they busted a hole it the sheild?

[Zeus154]

In addition to supporting 8 players, what else do you expect/want from Warframe raids?

-Puzzles

-Special boss mechanics

-Multiple boss fights

-Raid-exclusive rewards

 

BREAKDOWN

Puzzles – I would like to see and integration of puzzles in the Warframe raids. Maybe you’ll have to solve a puzzle in order to fight the boss in the upcoming room, to build suspense, for example. They shouldn’t be impossibly hard, but they should require some thought to get that “aha!” moment started.

 

Special boss mechanics – Special boss mechanics should be truly unique. Something cool and possibly zany. Something different that invulnerability states and enemy waves. A perfect example of boss mechanics would be Shadow of the Colossus; that game has massive bosses, each with their own attacks, and methods of elimination.

 

Now, it would be awesome to see a Lephantis-sized Corpus mech, and the only way to destroy it was to climb and attack the weakspot, but I can only dream. Stuff like that would make boss fights more entertaining and engaging.

 

Multiple boss fights – Now this kind of depends. A coliseum with just a whole wave of bosses can get a bit messy or just annoying. Maybe something to prepare you, a little taste; a mini-boss! Like in Mega-man X, with a mini-boss before the actual boss. A sample of what is to come.

 

Or the Lech Kril and Vor boss battle, or even the Hyena Pack. Those were relatively fun bosses. Just make them interesting to fight, much like the mechanics above.

 

Raid-Exclusive rewards – This would be a good sentiment to leave off on. Made it through? You get some exotic weapon, like one of the weapons from the boss to use, or something very awesome aesthetically, like a syandana, or armor set.

 

What do you expect from a Warframe raid boss?

-Requires team coordination to defeat

-Requires mastering special mechanics to defeat

-Boss should “phases”

 

BREAKDOWN

Team coordination – In addition to the unique boss mechanics, team coordination should be a priority.  Going off the boss idea I had, the Corpus Mech… Let’s say this tall beast requires you to attack a weakspot at the top of the mech, and the only way to do so, is to distract, and weaken some components.

 

That team would have to split into smaller groups: one team to divert attention, one to weaken the mech. One player alone then could scale the beast, then attack it. Something around those lines would be awesome to see.

Mastering special mechanics – This seems rather self-explanatory. Mastering special mechanics is part of every game. I don’t have very much to say about that.

 

Boss “phases” – Another self-explanatory concept, but just adopt the thought that each phase has to be rather different. Maybe after the Corpus Mech is destroyed, the Boss happens to eject and fight you head on? That man knows no bounds!

 

Should some void rewards be moved to different mission types outside the void?

-Yes, spread out the rewards to make mission types more appealing.

 

BREAKDOWN

Spreading out the rewards will not only help with the “dilution” issues and make mission types more appealing, it would seem like it would help early-game progression! That is, if it is planned to include some parts onto early-game nodes like Mercury and Earth.

 

“What is Frost Prime? A new Warframe?! I want to find the rest of his parts!”

 

That was only an example. If integrated, this will increase progression and the drive for newer players to seek out that particular Warframe/weapon set.

 

Console players, do you feel prepared/ready for the Overtake tactical alert?

-Yes, my throwing arm is ready.

 

Yes, I am a PC Player posting this. I have migrated to the Xbox One version of Warframe, and I can say, that my throwing arm is ready.

 

If you want to know why I switched, it is of general performance reasons, and better graphical capabilities than my PC. Simple.

 

Would you like to see more bows added to the Warframe arsenal?

-Yes, release a few more bows.

 

Currently, the bows are one of the coolest and interesting weapons in the game. There are only few worth mentioning like the Paris, its prime equivalent, and Dread. The MK-1, is well… the MK-1. Nothing here or there. The Cernos isn’t anything to scoff at, in terms of damage.

 

Adding new bows might add great variance to the scene. Want a collapsing Tenno bow that also has the function of Melee? Heck yeah, I’ll take that! An Infested bow that slings corrosive arrows? Why not? Stuff like that might make bows a bit more appealing and interesting.

 

These are my thoughts, on the issues at hand. Hope to see some substantial progress is made, with some suggestions are taken to account!

[GhostSwordsman]

I'll be honest, I didn't do the tactical alert, Overtake, and here's why:

 

You restricted it to one very specific category of weapons.

 

In my opinion, this is much much worse than conclave restrictions because with the cc restrictions, you at least have room for variety in how you take on the mission.

 

Personally, I don't like thrown melee weapons. I tried Glaive Prime, maxed it and sold it because I needed room for other weapons. I think limiting a tactical alert to a specific weapon category is very punishing to many players. I wasn't going to build a glaive or krestel because it would take too long to build it and get it leveled up to a point where I could take it into the mission without being carried, and the rewards just didn't justify that work. Though I'd like to have increased the count on my stratos badge.

[xlraistlx]

In the topic of probably introducing more bows to the game, please take into consideration The Larynx, infested bow concept it is awesome.

[Cyberspace100]

The harder and more complex raids are the better. The more new mechanics and features the introduce, the better they will be. 

[BenzinNinJa]

Tactical alert: Overtake

It wasn't harder than some of the other tactical alerts as such, but it was really badly designed.

I understand how taking on a nullifier or two with only a throwing weapon can be a challenge, because you have to either wear down their shield in the middle of combat, or just go head on and melee them to death.

Taking on a million nullifiers with throwing weapons however, is just plain old stupid. I say this because this not only pushes the boundaries of what practically possible with throwing weapons, it surpasses it. By miles.

 

What I saw was people using their Glaives untill they reached the rover. After that, a couple of Nyx players would sit on the rover using absorb. 

 

This meant that what probably should have been an interresting alert testing our skills with thrown melee weapons became a tactical alert of "did you bring team energy restores? I forgot mine".

 

Bows

 

The current arsenal of bows seems to consist of Dread and Paris Prime.

Every other bow seems irrelevant because they are (in my opinion) sup par, and of poor esthetic design.

I have seen one player use the Cernos, and since the new intro came along, a couple of MK1-paris. Other than that, it's all Paris P and Dread.
Personally I've only ever used any other bows than Dread for mastery fodder.

Edited February 2, 2015 by BenzinNinJa

[tmtke]

Should some void rewards be moved to different mission types outside the void?

 

Yes. But do it according to lore. For example, blueprints can be acquired through the void or derelict, prime parts are scattered around in vaults on every planet (as somebody already suggested here, there are already some tiles with actual orokin era buildings). This would make explorer type players like me happy, and could also reduce rushing. The grineer caches are already a nice addition, create more like that please :)

[-.E.-]

In addition to supporting 8 players, what else do you expect/want from Warframe raids?

Except those selectable examples, want…

 

1.Mastery rank limiting system. Which means, depends on difficulty of raid game, particular mastery rank will be need to join.  

 

2.Do not set exclusive rewards as void prime parts (parts of new weapon, warframe or rear mods might be ok)

 

3.New map modeling for raids (like underwater city :) )

 

What do you expect from a Warframe raid boss?

Except those selectable examples, want…

 

1.Please make boss’s health as multiple. If you don’t mind it, add some support for boss to make them powerful. (current  bosses are too weak or less weak, but never normal) Such as boss have nonsense skill which can make bleeding out 8 of all.

 

2.Put event that requires extremely high team cooperation. Such as, the boss’s skill or attack which can’t able to block or evade  alone if there is no team coordination

 

3.More hardly care the boss’s attack mechanism. At least, boss has to change it’s attack mechanism in every time when it      attacks over.

 

4.Please make raids in archwing either.

 

PC players, in your opinion, the Overtake Tactical Alert was…

First shot, it was deadly hard. But after set with particular warframes as a party, that going easy right away. I know in every events what you thought it might be harder than ever, user always makes a way to make it easy. Actually, this event was different that we have to take only throwing melee, and it was nice try. Want tactical alert harder that makes us concern to complete it.

 

More things

 

1.Bow usage is too limited for some mania. Still slow for slaying dozen enemies (useful in boss faction, though)

 

2.This game is still easy and no more things to do when becomes 18 rank (only leveling of few left) think it needs update faster. Moreover, please add some exclusive advantage or rewards for mastery rank. Over the rank 10, it really meaningless to raise. 

Edited February 2, 2015 by Ignitia

[tmtke]

1.Mastery rank limiting system. Which means, depends on difficulty of raid game, particular mastery rank will be need to join.  

 

Why? I for myself am nearly at 600 hours, but only on MR 10, playing Warframe for almost 2 years. I don't really care about levelling up all available items, therefore my experience and skill is not matching with my Mastery Rank.

 

Personally, I think all game modes should be available to every player, the difficulty (or, most preferably the enemy levels) should scale better. This is really a tough topic, but locking away gameplay and content is always a bad decision.

[Doomclaaw]

On the Overtake difficulty, I don't think it was too hard, the challenge was fun and I enjoyed something requiring more planning and skill instead of counting conclave numbers, but the execution could have been different. The spawn rate density was too high and it made it frustrating to use the throwing weapons, forcing us to result to finding creative ways to use our powers. Throwing weapons should be able to penetrate the nullifier bubbles. If that had been the case, this whole mission would have made much more sense and nothing else would have needed to be changed. The only other frustrating part of it was that even if we did excellent at clearing the enemies before they hit the crate, it would still degenerate health so if we had a stall for too long, it would die anyway. Overall though it was a fun experience. I completed it close to 10 times from having to go back and help out clan mates so by the end I was pretty comfortable with it

[NovusNova]

Instead of mastery locking the raids. Maybe make a different progression to it e.g. There are three different raids, an easy one, a mid difficultly one and a very hard one and to unlock the harder ones, you need to complete the easier ones first and then there could be another raid where you have to complete certain side objectives in each of the other three raids to unlock.

As to boss mechanics, you can still use invulnerability phases but make it part of the combat, like shooting 3 to 4 targets in a certain order to both end the invulnerability phase and deal some damage to the boss, but if you didn't shoot the targets in the right order, the invulnerability phase still ends but the boss doesn't take damage. Or there are four tiles on the outside of the boss arena and have to be pressed to end the invulnerability and then the four players have 30 seconds to a minute to get back to the boss arena which would be before the boss activates an ability that electrified the floor outside the boss arena and kills anyone outside of the boss arena but only after the four tiles have all been pressed.

[--Q--WaffleZ]

About Overtake tactical alert.

 

I was very tempting to choose "Just Right" choice.  But from my experience, the Over Take alert can be frustrating hard when playing with a full party or extremely easy when soloing and spamming consumables.

 

So, the difficulty is extreme at both ends.

Edited February 2, 2015 by --Q--WaffleZ

[Anestheas]

영어를 못해서 한글로 씁니다.

 

보이드의 전유물인 프라임 부품들이 일반 노드에서 나온다면 보이드가 지니는 상징성이나 의미가 없어진다고 생각합니다.

아예 스펙터처럼 특정 일반노드 미션에서만 얻을 수 있는 (같은 종류 미션이어도 보이드에서는 못 얻는) 좋은 보상이 있어야 한다고 생각합니다. 반달이나 레이스가 이벤트용이라면 아예 다른 범주로...

다만 프라임 부품이 욕나오게 얻기 힘들다는 점은 개선이 필요합니다. 저 투표 수가 증명하죠.

 

오버테이크에 대해서도, 오버테이크는 특정 워프레임에게는 쉽지만 다른 워프레임들에게는 지옥처럼 어렵기도 했죠. 단적으로 닉스와 트리니티가 있으면 정말 쉽게 깰 수 있어요. 대여섯 판 해봤는데 닉스가 차 위에서 업소브틀고 트리니티가 블레싱과 에뱀으로 보조하면 쉽게 깨죠. 네... 하지만 그 워프레임 없으면 어렵더라고요. 라프도 눕고, 애쉬도 눕고.

 

솔직히 미션 컨셉은 재미있어요. 기발하고요, 지금껏 외면되어 왔던 무기 재조명의 효과도 있고... 하지만 왜 코퍼스 수송차량을 탈취하는데 투척무기만 필요한 것인지 개연성이 부족합니다. 좀 더 개연성 있는 설정이 붙여진다면 무기를 제한하는 페널티는 기쁘게 받아들일 수있다고 생각합니다. 다만 특정 워프레임에게만 유리한 환경은 아니었으면 하는 거죠.

Edited February 2, 2015 by Central_Dogma

[IronRoby]

I'm sorry DE, but the feedback you are getting on the Overtake alert is quite misleading, partly because of the inherently self-selecting nature of this poll, partly because you are not asking the right questions.

 

Was it easy or just right? Yes, if you played it as a Frost or Nyx alert.

 

Was it easy if you played it as a thrown weapon alert?

 

No.

 

Every successful playthrough of it that I participated in or heard off constituted of a Frost or Nyx permanently sitting on top of the vehicle and spamming their defensive abilities. With the rest just carried through (or at least a Trinity supporting them) and not even using their throwing weapons.

 

Thrown weapons were not the key to win that alert, they failed as a theme, they were merely a ticket to get in.

 

All those Nullifiers succeeded in stopping us from just slaughtering the enemies with offensive frame abilities, but it still left the issue of us needing to defend a far too fragile defensive objective from all those shooting enemies.

 

This is not the situation where players can have fun experimenting with unusual weapon restriction, it is a situation where they will spam defensive abilities of a few suitable frame. And thus set the difficulty level high enough with "it was easy" feedback that make it impossible for others to complete without using similar cheesing strategy.

 

Dear, DE, I'm all for weapon restriction missions to force us to use something else than a few top tier weapons all the time, but if you actually want us to have fun experimenting with weapons and strategies we would normally not use, then please select a mission type actually suitable for something like that.

 

If Overtake had not been a defensive mission, then, while many players would have still cheesed through it, you could also actually have seen parties actually playing the alert as intended, with actually making good use of their thrown weapons, actually having fun with the restrictions in the way it was intended.

Edited February 2, 2015 by IronRoby

[IronRoby]

"Mastery rank limiting system on raids"

 

There's a very good reason why this isn't an option.

 

Mastery Rank is collector completionist bragging points (at least after Mastery 8, which is needed to unlock everything), how much you are willing to buy plat to buy frame and weapon slots and the willingness to grind to level the weapons and frames that you don't even really like using as Mastery fodder. Not everybody should be forced to play with leveling your Mastery as the goal, just to get in on raids. It is not an indication of your skills, quality of your equipment or what else you can actually offer to the team.

 

Conclave points exist for a reason. Use them instead.

Edited February 2, 2015 by IronRoby

[Bibliothekar]

Why? I for myself am nearly at 600 hours, but only on MR 10, playing Warframe for almost 2 years.

Wasn't my suggestion, but: Since raids are going to be part of the "end game" (as I understand it), I'd see MR requirement as something to keep out "fresh" players who are still busy exploring the star chart, viz. MR0-3/4. Just like you have to be MR2 to trade or MR3 to join a Syndicate.

I don't see any point in making raids that demand MR15 or something.

Edited February 2, 2015 by Bibliothekar

[iamnuff1]

On the topic of Overtake, was it easy? debatable.

 

Was it easy (or even completeable) if you played it "as intended"? No.

 

I cheezed it with a mag and three frosts, I know a couple of guys who used Nyx and a ton of energy restores, ect.

 

Powers.

 

If you used powers to deal damage and protect the truck then it worked, and if you used enough powers then it was easy, but in that case you could have just made it a no-weapon mission.

 

the actual issue is that throwing weapons don't do jack to nullifiers. frankly, throwing weapons are kind of garbage-tier anyway, unless you stick half a dozen forma into it.

 

The base damage is just so low, and it takes so long to return, even with the no-bounce mods. 

 

It's either a ranged weapon with one bullet and slow reload, or a sub-par melee weapon, and frankly having that as your only way of dealing damage against a bunch of enemies who just ignore power-damage made the mission really hard, and above all else, not-fun.

 

Make throwing weapons better. if it's not killing the guy you threw it at in one hit, then you might as well just use a gun, and frankly, even with a maxed damage mod and with spoiled strike, the glaive just wasn't cutting it against those nullifiers before they got up to the truck.

[iamnuff1]

There is only one thing that I would like to comment on: raids and bosses.

 

Many people voted for special mechanics and phases for bosses an I'm really concerned about this. I'm fine with bosse having different attack patters or using different tactics/weapons or changing forms but I'd hate to see one thing: invulnerability phases.

 

This is the most boring part of any boss fight. Having to wait for the enemy to expose their one weak spot for a brief amount of time is boring and it breaks the pace of the fight.

 

 

Oh yes.

 

All invulnerability phases need removing from all bosses.

 

it's lazy boss design.

 

make him regen hp or have an overshield or block bullets with a physical shield or something. 

 

Don't just make him completely ignore players actions. It's incredibly frustrating.

 

You just sit around and let him whale on you while you wait for him to decide that he doesn't want to be completely invincible anymore.

[Tyrian3k]

Oh yes.

 

All invulnerability phases need removing from all bosses.

 

it's lazy boss design.

 

make him regen hp or have an overshield or block bullets with a physical shield or something. 

 

Don't just make him completely ignore players actions. It's incredibly frustrating.

 

You just sit around and let him whale on you while you wait for him to decide that he doesn't want to be completely invincible anymore.

I will add to this that the Jackal does this in a better way. Give us the option to reveal weak spots by using something in the environment, shooting a specific part of the enemy or maybe reach them with parkour or straightforward teamwork.

[Innocent_Flower]

영어를 못해서 한글로 씁니다.

 

보이드의 전유물인 프라임 부품들이 일반 노드에서 나온다면 보이드가 지니는 상징성이나 의미가 없어진다고 생각합니다.

아예 스펙터처럼 특정 일반노드 미션에서만 얻을 수 있는 (같은 종류 미션이어도 보이드에서는 못 얻는) 좋은 보상이 있어야 한다고 생각합니다. 반달이나 레이스가 이벤트용이라면 아예 다른 범주로...

다만 프라임 부품이 욕나오게 얻기 힘들다는 점은 개선이 필요합니다. 저 투표 수가 증명하죠.

 

오버테이크에 대해서도, 오버테이크는 특정 워프레임에게는 쉽지만 다른 워프레임들에게는 지옥처럼 어렵기도 했죠. 단적으로 닉스와 트리니티가 있으면 정말 쉽게 깰 수 있어요. 대여섯 판 해봤는데 닉스가 차 위에서 업소브틀고 트리니티가 블레싱과 에뱀으로 보조하면 쉽게 깨죠. 네... 하지만 그 워프레임 없으면 어렵더라고요. 라프도 눕고, 애쉬도 눕고.

 

솔직히 미션 컨셉은 재미있어요. 기발하고요, 지금껏 외면되어 왔던 무기 재조명의 효과도 있고... 하지만 왜 코퍼스 수송차량을 탈취하는데 투척무기만 필요한 것인지 개연성이 부족합니다. 좀 더 개연성 있는 설정이 붙여진다면 무기를 제한하는 페널티는 기쁘게 받아들일 수있다고 생각합니다. 다만 특정 워프레임에게만 유리한 환경은 아니었으면 하는 거죠.

You seem like you've got some really interesting ideas.  It's genuinely upsetting me that I can only understand some of what you're saying. Sadly, If DE has nobody korean, They wont be able to translate this . 

 

What I got from it: 

 

- Prime parts are symbolically tied of the void (I assume orokin levels, not the void itself) However, Getting primed items need to be improved, as the poll results suggest. (So, I would assume, He wants more Orokin areas to get prime parts from) 

 

- Stresses that the player is too reliant on some frames for the alert. (I really struggled with this one) 

 

-The mission was fun. The mission was also eccentric, and The combination of throwing weapons with hijack was a strange one. If there was a more probable weapon restriction (because not everyone has a good melee throwing weapon, and throwing weapons are rather novel) this korean would find it more easy to embrace the weapon restriction. Also: fun was tied heavily to what frames players used.