I Really Don't Understand Why Players Want To Preserve The Current Star Chart...

[GreyEnneract]

Exactly 20 nodes isn't even confirmed.

DE was right when they said they knew that they would piss you guys off.

Glad they're still going along with it regardless.

[Stratego89]

Preventing us from having nodes like Draco will hurt players that have only a small portion of time to play the game. Instead of being able to get a new/forma'd weapon to 30 in 2-3 Draco runs it will instead take them 2-3 days.

 

Then there is the issue of farming itself. For example: most primes take ten Orokin Cells to make and players could either go throw themselves into two dozen missions to get their Cells (if they're lucky) or they can go run a few Draco's to get all that and then some.

 

DE can't eliminate farms. Even if we had a fully randomized starchart then players would identify what roll is best for farming what and then players would just flock to it like they do to Draco. The only difference being that players get left in a lull waiting for said roll and end up not playing untill then.

 

 

Also players that spam Draco are not harming you in any way shape or form. Any issue that players say stem from Draco farms are wrong; we've had the issues long before we started finding farms.

If it takes you 2-3 days to get a weapon or frame to 30 without using Draco, you are doing something SERIOUSLY wrong... A 25 wave T2D run (with booster) consistantly gets a set of weapons from 0>30 in one go. Spy missions are amazing for leveling everything relatively quickly, and has nice rewards on the side. Survival missions are great for leveling a frame, and get you lots of drops at the same time. Extermination is great for leveling melee if you stealth it.

 

Once again, if it takes you two dozen missions to get 10 orokin cells, something is wrong. Extermination and capture are horrid for getting drops, which is the only thing I can assume here that you were doing. ODA/Saturn/Ceres Bosses all have almost guranteed drops for at LEAST one cell. ODD/ODS are also pretty great, dark sectors on some planets work well due to their increased resource rates. Extractors are also quite nice, as you can get around 6 from a single extractor (when you get lucky), and you can have them on 2 planets that drop them at all times, getting other resources you might need even when you don't hit the jackpot (I am ALWAYS in need of spores and such personally, so this works great for me).

 

This part I admit is a viable argument for an issue with the "20 node starmap" that everyone is freaking out about (and isn't finalized for anyone who doesn't listen to the devs...). My assumption of how the star chart would be is that you can ALWAYS get any resource at any time, it's just you don't know what tileset, enemy, and gamemode you'll have to deal with to get it. If someone is too lazy to do a certain gamemode because it happens to have the rare resource they want atm, that is THEIR problem, and THEIR choice.

 

 

Yes. Yes they do. Once again I'll direct you to look at recruiting chat at ANY time of the day. It is flooded with people who only want to do one thing, and sit there holding one button to get rewards, that will not accept anyone except certain frames with certain builds, and people who have nothing better to do than sit there holding that one button. That (imo) is not PLAYING a game. That is sitting there staring at a screen bored because you don't know how to have fun. This isn't isn't specifically Draco, it's FARMS. As long as there are farms, this will happen. It was the same with Xini, with Viver, with every other farm. They need to go. They are creating a stagnation in the community.

[(XBOX)LordPuck]

If it takes you 2-3 days to get a weapon or frame to 30 without using Draco, you are doing something SERIOUSLY wrong... A 25 wave T2D run (with booster) consistantly gets a set of weapons from 0>30 in one go. Spy missions are amazing for leveling everything relatively quickly, and has nice rewards on the side. Survival missions are great for leveling a frame, and get you lots of drops at the same time. Extermination is great for leveling melee if you stealth it.

 

Once again, if it takes you two dozen missions to get 10 orokin cells, something is wrong. Extermination and capture are horrid for getting drops, which is the only thing I can assume here that you were doing. ODA/Saturn/Ceres Bosses all have almost guranteed drops for at LEAST one cell. ODD/ODS are also pretty great, dark sectors on some planets work well due to their increased resource rates. Extractors are also quite nice, as you can get around 6 from a single extractor (when you get lucky), and you can have them on 2 planets that drop them at all times, getting other resources you might need even when you don't hit the jackpot (I am ALWAYS in need of spores and such personally, so this works great for me).

 

This part I admit is a viable argument for an issue with the "20 node starmap" that everyone is freaking out about (and isn't finalized for anyone who doesn't listen to the devs...). My assumption of how the star chart would be is that you can ALWAYS get any resource at any time, it's just you don't know what tileset, enemy, and gamemode you'll have to deal with to get it. If someone is too lazy to do a certain gamemode because it happens to have the rare resource they want atm, that is THEIR problem, and THEIR choice.

 

 

Yes. Yes they do. Once again I'll direct you to look at recruiting chat at ANY time of the day. It is flooded with people who only want to do one thing, and sit there holding one button to get rewards, that will not accept anyone except certain frames with certain builds, and people who have nothing better to do than sit there holding that one button. That (imo) is not PLAYING a game. That is sitting there staring at a screen bored because you don't know how to have fun. This isn't isn't specifically Draco, it's FARMS. As long as there are farms, this will happen. It was the same with Xini, with Viver, with every other farm. They need to go. They are creating a stagnation in the community.

I have but dont like to powerlevel. I choose to do a few missions here and there. I choose to take my time so I can

1) enjoy the game my way.

2) have something to do later.

 

 

How is that SERIOUSLY Wrong???

 

Edit,

After spitting out the taste of salt,( lol) I reread the entire post. I do agree with the last paragraph.

Edited June 6, 2015 by (XB1)LordPuck

[Stratego89]

I have but dont like to powerlevel. I choose to do a few missions here and there. I choose to take my time so I can

1) enjoy the game my way.

2) have something to do later.

 

 

How is that SERIOUSLY Wrong???

 

Edit,

After spitting out the taste of salt,( lol) I reread the entire post. I do agree with the last paragraph.

1. That's great. 2. That's also great. The entire first section of your reply is what I do, and what I've been saying is GOOD. Draco isn't any of that. Draco is the OPPOSITE of that. It is NOT wrong. I think you should spit out more salt taste and reread all of my posts here...

[(XBOX)LordPuck]

1. That's great. 2. That's also great. The entire first section of your reply is what I do, and what I've been saying is GOOD. Draco isn't any of that. Draco is the OPPOSITE of that. It is NOT wrong. I think you should spit out more salt taste and reread all of my posts here...

Before I edited that post, it read

I normally find most of your posts interesting.......

 

I prolly should have left that part lol

 

I edited because I misread it based on the first 2 sentences. Thats why I admited to spitting out the salt.

Edited June 6, 2015 by (XB1)LordPuck

[aoguro]

 

i liked the former starchart, this one now doesnt fit warframe at all

 

im not shure about a 3-dimensional starchart, i would like to get a reworked 2-dimensional one and for the time left for the devs i would like to have a new planet/system with a brandnew enemy, if i think about the sentients and that they appear from nothigness im not really interested about

 

but it looks like we get some new maps with the arrival of the sentients, and i would be pleased for a system for them and more ... :P

Edited June 6, 2015 by Khampa

[CY13ERPUNK]

DE has always tested the community with sudden changes. I hope this time, they show us what they plan first and then ask us for our feedback. Before implementing such a change.

I think it'd be more civilized that way.

 

?

 

ahahahahahahaha

 

 

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA

[(PSN)WiiConquered]

I really agree with the OP. The feels I get from the game now is pretty much what the OP said. When I log in, the first thing I think of is

 

"What do I play now?" If there's no alerts, no weapons to level and try, I pretty much don't do anything and log off. That happened many times.

 

I play for the gameplay sometimes, and even that gets boring quickly. I run around shoot stuffs but the enemies are boring. Once, I even almost fell asleep shooting at the enemies mindlessly. Mind you, I'm already taking a break from the game. At least a few days to a week. Once I'm done with the Tactical Alert I probably will run out of things to do.

 

This is going to be a little off topic. There's Trial, aka raid, and when I'm in there, I need to do my part and it's crystal clear what the objective is. It really made the game feel different. That's one of the good things going with Warframe; the raid missions will provide somewhere in the game that I can use my 6 forma weapons, even though the point of the raids isn't about killing the enmies..

 

What I want in future is something that can make me actually use my brain in gameplay and not mindlessly shooting. That's oen of the reasons why I forma'd so many of my weapons running Spy 2.0 missions. It made me think a lot at first, and it still did every run because it is dynamic. But running that single mission type is still boring and I stopped that at some point.

 

Maybe the starchart change will bring what I'm looking for, since there are few mission types that I haven't played recently. The game is way too easy right now. The early game where I had nooby skana and braton made me feel very weak but it made me think while I play. With all the warframe abilities and farming techniques people spam, the feel is gone, and it's just about mindless spam of abilities and shootings.

 

That was my rant about how I feel about the game as of now. I actually didn't run a single Draco mission since I unlocked the node, but I still feel this way. Playing while mindlessly spamming abilities to rank/forma weapons for no real purpose is beyond me, and I want to see more dynamic environment too. Honestly I think anything can replace the current starchart. I trust the devs.

What you're looking for has no connection to a starchart change. It won't matter how the missions are separated if you don't enjoy them, and removing many won't improve this. The farming methods exist mainly because of bad mechanics, (mechanics that seem to be making the game too easy for you right now), and those are independent of nodes.

My concern, at least with the Devstream 52 suggestions, is not about rewards. It's that there will be fewer missions I enjoy that I can play at any one time. I try to get items by finding the most enjoyable mission I can play that offers them--not the most efficient, and I often play without hunting for any item. But this change aimed at making things more enjoyable for farmers, even though their enjoyment comes solely from the items and not from farming for them. They'll just continue to take the most efficient path, but what will happen to those looking for a fun one? What will happen to newbies looking for a sense of progression.

There were good things about the suggestion, but they all struck me as revamps of alerts or invasions. I don't think it's enough to build meaningful choice around.

[trst]

If it takes you 2-3 days to get a weapon or frame to 30 without using Draco, you are doing something SERIOUSLY wrong... A 25 wave T2D run (with booster) consistantly gets a set of weapons from 0>30 in one go. Spy missions are amazing for leveling everything relatively quickly, and has nice rewards on the side. Survival missions are great for leveling a frame, and get you lots of drops at the same time. Extermination is great for leveling melee if you stealth it.

 

Once again, if it takes you two dozen missions to get 10 orokin cells, something is wrong. Extermination and capture are horrid for getting drops, which is the only thing I can assume here that you were doing. ODA/Saturn/Ceres Bosses all have almost guranteed drops for at LEAST one cell. ODD/ODS are also pretty great, dark sectors on some planets work well due to their increased resource rates. Extractors are also quite nice, as you can get around 6 from a single extractor (when you get lucky), and you can have them on 2 planets that drop them at all times, getting other resources you might need even when you don't hit the jackpot (I am ALWAYS in need of spores and such personally, so this works great for me).

 

This part I admit is a viable argument for an issue with the "20 node starmap" that everyone is freaking out about (and isn't finalized for anyone who doesn't listen to the devs...). My assumption of how the star chart would be is that you can ALWAYS get any resource at any time, it's just you don't know what tileset, enemy, and gamemode you'll have to deal with to get it. If someone is too lazy to do a certain gamemode because it happens to have the rare resource they want atm, that is THEIR problem, and THEIR choice.

 

 

Yes. Yes they do. Once again I'll direct you to look at recruiting chat at ANY time of the day. It is flooded with people who only want to do one thing, and sit there holding one button to get rewards, that will not accept anyone except certain frames with certain builds, and people who have nothing better to do than sit there holding that one button. That (imo) is not PLAYING a game. That is sitting there staring at a screen bored because you don't know how to have fun. This isn't isn't specifically Draco, it's FARMS. As long as there are farms, this will happen. It was the same with Xini, with Viver, with every other farm. They need to go. They are creating a stagnation in the community.

My argument was for players with only a little time to play. Running a 25 wave anything is still longer than a Draco (unless you go in with a 'Draco' team but then you come back to the p42w issue). Spy missions with other people tends to be hit or miss and is still worse than Draco for affinity. Again the issue is for players who either don't have the time to spam missions for ranking and/or don't want to be stuck with underleveled things for days when trying to play with friends.

 

Boss runs for rare resources are still subject to rng and Dark Sectors don't have the sheer ammount of spawns Draco does. Extractors are also bad for players with a little time on their hands as chances are they'll break after 2-3 gathers making them more resource sinks than useful. Again the issue is with time and having a way to speed through leveling and resource rng lets these players still get something out of the game with the time they do have.

 

What if the only nodes avalable for Cell drops was some simple exterminate? Yes it's still there but it is horribly inefficient. And yes I get the star chart isin't the whole '20 node' thing they said initialy but the point was that even with a system as bad as that we would still have farms.

 

Players will continue their whole "Mesa, Gmag,  Nekros ONLY." (or whatever) regardless of farms and the p42w mentallity has exsisted for far longer as well. Removing farms won't fix these issues. Also any players who take issue with the game not being fun because they spam these are only hurting themselves; spamming will also cause the same issue with anything. Spammers hurt themselves and players with only so much time on their hand have it as more or less their only option.

 

Also my point still stands that we will always have farms no matter what DE does to the star chart. Or at the very least nothing they can do without ruining game modes in other ways.

[Hypernaut1]

My argument was for players with only a little time to play. Running a 25 wave anything is still longer than a Draco (unless you go in with a 'Draco' team but then you come back to the p42w issue). Spy missions with other people tends to be hit or miss and is still worse than Draco for affinity. Again the issue is for players who either don't have the time to spam missions for ranking and/or don't want to be stuck with underleveled things for days when trying to play with friends.

 

Boss runs for rare resources are still subject to rng and Dark Sectors don't have the sheer ammount of spawns Draco does. Extractors are also bad for players with a little time on their hands as chances are they'll break after 2-3 gathers making them more resource sinks than useful. Again the issue is with time and having a way to speed through leveling and resource rng lets these players still get something out of the game with the time they do have.

 

What if the only nodes avalable for Cell drops was some simple exterminate? Yes it's still there but it is horribly inefficient. And yes I get the star chart isin't the whole '20 node' thing they said initialy but the point was that even with a system as bad as that we would still have farms.

 

Players will continue their whole "Mesa, Gmag,  Nekros ONLY." (or whatever) regardless of farms and the p42w mentallity has exsisted for far longer as well. Removing farms won't fix these issues. Also any players who take issue with the game not being fun because they spam these are only hurting themselves; spamming will also cause the same issue with anything. Spammers hurt themselves and players with only so much time on their hand have it as more or less their only option.

 

Also my point still stands that we will always have farms no matter what DE does to the star chart. Or at the very least nothing they can do without ruining game modes in other ways.

for me the issue isnt farming. I LIKE farming, but i dont like having to go to the same spot over and over. Hopefully the new star chart changes that.

I dont mind having to farm for neuro sensors, in fact i purposely didnt overdo it on dbl resource weekend so that i have something to farm for later. i DO mind having to do defense on jupiter or Alad V over and over again, since forever.

[wtrmlnjuc]

The issue was that what they proposed as a replacement was just oh so terribly bad.

Having missions with rotating factions, tilesets, and missions would fix the issue of having so many empty nodes. But then the game suddently loses a lot of players in total because just queuing up for what you want to run is the same as waiting for an alert.

The very least of what we need is one node per planet (or at least one node per tileset) and when you select that node you can pick a mission type. Heck we can even do away with the planet levels and simply make a level range filter based on MR rank.

They didn't propose anything. That's the community conjecturing from a few lines of casual conversation over the goals that they have for the new one. Nothing has been set in stone.

[Invalid_Infinity]

If the changes go through as they stand then I will no longer play this game. 

 

Enough is enough. If DE wants to punish their players then so be it. I however will have none of it. I have played this game for almost two years now. I thought DE knew better than this. I thought they listened to their players. Recently that has been called into doubt. 

[MagPrime]

If the changes go through as they stand then I will no longer play this game. 

 

Enough is enough. If DE wants to punish their players then so be it. I however will have none of it. I have played this game for almost two years now. I thought DE knew better than this. I thought they listened to their players. Recently that has been called into doubt. 

What changes?

 

DE hasn't even said what will be changed, they were giving an example of what it could be.  Nothing has been set in stone - nothing has been sneak peeked - nothing has been leaked.

[Invalid_Infinity]

What changes?

 

DE hasn't even said what will be changed, they were giving an example of what it could be.  Nothing has been set in stone - nothing has been sneak peeked - nothing has been leaked.

What it could be is a goddamn disaster thats what. 

[MagPrime]

What it could be is a goddamn disaster thats what. 

Could be.

 

COULD BE.

 

could be

 

Declaring that you'll be leaving if they "do this" when you don't even know what they're doing seems silly (not aimed directly at you, just a general, cone AoE)

 

Y'all are getting worked up like this over a game.   It's an awesome game, I agree.  I wouldn't have spent $300.00 USD if it sucked but really?  Fewer doom and gloom threads in GD and more "Here's my suggested changes" over in fan concepts or feedback.

[vaugahn]

If the changes go through as they stand then I will no longer play this game. 

 

Enough is enough. If DE wants to punish their players then so be it. I however will have none of it. I have played this game for almost two years now. I thought DE knew better than this. I thought they listened to their players. Recently that has been called into doubt.

Nothing stands as anything yet. Players are treating a half-heard quote as word of god, despite DE's insistence that there will be no RNG and nothing is concrete.

I used to wonder why they didn't share more of the development process with us. I think I know now.

[Invalid_Infinity]

Nothing stands as anything yet. Players are treating a half-heard quote as word of god, despite DE's insistence that there will be no RNG and nothing is concrete.

I used to wonder why they didn't share more of the development process with us. I think I know now.

What DE says and what DE does are two very different things. All we can do is wait and hope they don't screw it up horribly.

 

If they do screw up it will be the last straw for me on this game and I will be gone. Assuming they don't immediately fix their error.

[Chub_N_Tuck]

What you're looking for has no connection to a starchart change. It won't matter how the missions are separated if you don't enjoy them, and removing many won't improve this. The farming methods exist mainly because of bad mechanics, (mechanics that seem to be making the game too easy for you right now), and those are independent of nodes.

 

I don't doubt that what I've written was a bit off topic, but there still is connection. I see starchart change as changing the direct window of options that I can choose with different atmosphere and choices. Where I go and what I'm looking for will change with this starchart change, so I can say that my objective change and the amount of mission types I play will also increase. The game can feel a lot different by changing the choices and what's given afterwards.

 

I'm really tired of void missions ... Maybe I can add more context to my opinion with that. The recent tilesets are pretty much wasted because of the rewards and how much I can level things. General rewards in those nodes are crap. It would feel like a totally different game if I can adjust the difficulty level, as the devs already mentioned, in Earth nodes, Europa nodes or Eris nodes. I would actually play in those tilesets if they reward me like void missions.

 

I picture a far less nodes, full of players and rewards scattered among them. I know it's getting old, but I really can't stress enough about the dead nodes that are pointless. The fact that they are there has no meaning, and I am on the side for removing them because it creates this feeling of emptiness in the starchart as a whole. I know where the players are and those are the places 99% of the times I'm going to.

 

I agree with the bad mechanics though. And yes, that's a whole another discussion.

Edited June 6, 2015 by Chuck_NoMiss

[Ashnal]

*snip*

I agree with you completely that the majority of the playerbase tends to do the same missions over and over and over again.

 

The players do that becasue it is always the fasterst way to get what they desire, the carrot on the end of the stick. Whenever you make that stick longer, and make that carrot take more time and effort to reach people get upset.

 

People who oppose the proposed starchart changes are those that fear their favorite spots to farm <insert thing here> will not exist in the reworked chart, or exist but in a much less lucrative form.

 

Those of us in favor of the proposed changes are players who don't mind being inefficient, as long we have fun while we plod along towards our goals. A random variety of missions that allow us to work towards a single goal are what we desire, kind of like how syndicate missions have a large variety, but are all good sources of reputation, even if not every mission gives us 8 5000 rep medallions.

 

The ideal solution is to make sure the most efficient ways of obtaining rewards have variety within them, so both camps can be satisfied.

[Invalid_Infinity]

I agree with you completely that the majority of the playerbase tends to do the same missions over and over and over again.

 

The players do that becasue it is always the fasterst way to get what they desire, the carrot on the end of the stick. Whenever you make that stick longer, and make that carrot take more time and effort to reach people get upset.

 

People who oppose the proposed starchart changes are those that fear their favorite spots to farm <insert thing here> will not exist in the reworked chart, or exist but in a much less lucrative form.

 

Those of us in favor of the proposed changes are players who don't mind being inefficient, as long we have fun while we plod along towards our goals. A random variety of missions that allow us to work towards a single goal are what we desire, kind of like how syndicate missions have a large variety, but are all good sources of reputation, even if not every mission gives us 8 5000 rep medallions.

 

The ideal solution is to make sure the most efficient ways of obtaining rewards have variety within them, so both camps can be satisfied.

Actually I just dislike DE taking away choices from the players. I have nothing that I need to farm. Don't generalize people please. 

I am also concerned that it will force solo players to play public.

[vaugahn]

Actually I just dislike DE taking away choices from the players. I have nothing that I need to farm. Don't generalize people please. 

I am also concerned that it will force solo players to play public.

See the quote I posted earlier in the thread. All content/rewards/gear will be accessible at all times, that's a central consideration for any star chart proposal.

There are some choices that need to be taken away. For example, the five different hive missions on Eris.

[x_Soulframe_x]

Because some people don't want to watch their life waste away before their eyes doing clone missions and not getting rewards for. Those people would much rather grind on one node if the rewards are actually worth something. 300 to 20 nodes is no small change. 300 to 100 I would have been fine with.

[Hypernaut1]

Because some people don't want to watch their life waste away before their eyes doing clone missions and not getting rewards for. Those people would much rather grind on one node if the rewards are actually worth something. 300 to 20 nodes is no small change. 300 to 100 I would have been fine with.

i think its because you have this silly idea that they are taking the exact star chart we have now, and just removing 200+ nodes. They are most likely going to overhaul what a NODE means. it wont be just 1 mission on a planet.

 

I took it to mean that when you look at the star chart, you will see at least 20 options of where to go and farm for what you need. The current star chart doesnt really provide 20 options. Not for a vet. You open the star chart and there's Draco, a few resource spots, and maybe a few spy missions.

 

Our star chart is practically already down to "20 nodes", except that they NEVER change and remain static,

Edited June 6, 2015 by Hypernaut1

[Cerebrum123]

 

And all the missions are cookie-cut-outs of eachother, just different planets and factions.

 

I think multi-objective missions would help more than anything else.  Go in for a Capture, find out there's a VIP there that needs rescuing as well.  Go in for an Exterminate, turns out it's a trap and now we have a Survival, etc.

 

 

 

And it was easier to figure out where you needed to go to open up another planet/node.  

 

They had something like this a while back, I miss it. It should be brought back and updated.

[Ashnal]

Actually I just dislike DE taking away choices from the players. I have nothing that I need to farm. Don't generalize people please. 

I am also concerned that it will force solo players to play public.

Well from what we've heard of the system, you'll still have meaningful choice. Currently there are a lot of meaningless choices for nodes on the starchart. I don't feel like searching the chart right now to find a specific example, but I'm sure there's a number of duplicate nodes (ones that are the same faction, tileset, level, and type) that could be trimmed and nobody would miss them.

 

I'd still say you belong to the first camp I mentioned. Those afraid the exact node they want may not be on the new chart. Your reasons are more vague than the ones I described at first though.

 

Why would you be concerned about solo play? I honestly can't see how a reorganization of mission nodes is going to affect whether you can solo them or not. They're still going to be the same mission types we know and love, and I highly doubt they're going to remove the solo option. How is solo play even related to the organization of the mission structure at all?

 

Perhaps you could give an example of where the new star chart might wrong you.