CrazyCatLad Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Easy fix: Just double stamina for everyone...or make blocking the only thing that requires stamina (Then balance stamina mods as necessary). Star Chart - hopefully will be awesome. It was fun clearing it originally back in Closed Beta but 85% of the nodes, including Draco, are pointless to the game. Just don't add layers of terrible RNG to it or you'll have a million unhappy Tenno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RainDH Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Stamina "It should be changed/modified in some way." Using melee or block drains stamina immediately, and "Second Wind" does not help at all. Star Chart "I’m not sure yet - need more information." When I started playing WarFrame, I was sure that at endgame all these nodes will receive a narrative, that they will become consequential: player unlocks one node after another moving through the story and so he completes the game. I'd suggest this way: player completes all nodes on the planet, finishes boss, and after that there're left only a few nodes, using, for example, this guy's idea: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/470639-june-5th-community-hot-topics/?p=5243039. Trials "Other" Oh. That's funny. If I'm not mistaken, "lack of instructions" wasn't exactly the one and only problem, that was discussed in the topic "Trial of trials". Trial have issues with playability among some players (me included). Right now trial is not much of a teamwork and thinking and taking quick decisions on a field, but mostly of a "executing a list of things and actions already written by someone else", or "playing a Required Frame Checklist" as said someone there. I'm sure there wouldn't be many problems with finding out what to do in a trial, if it wasn't an endless frustrating survival chaos, where the only actual solution is to create a team of immortals using a ready manual from forum or wiki. Many people like to solve puzzles or in-game situations where it's your brain working, not fingers on a keyboard - and I am one of these people. But it just doesn't work right now in raid, and this is a thing that should actually be resolved, not instructions. The ones who advice watching the trial solution on youtube: you're playing chess on youtube as well? WarFrame 30+ I think it depends on system, but I like ideas from topic. Wasn't Focus supposed to offer the same? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronyn Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Are you considering that blocking is directional, and the only gamemode in which you don't (potentially) have enemies spawning behind you is Exterminate? I am. What I am trying to guage is how an unlimited defense mechanic would effect the intended class roles/capabilities in the long run. I haven't quite come to a conclusion just yet. Or you can just say 'screw both' and equip Corrosive Projection. (ohai enemy scaling!) Yeah. I find it unsatisfying that in order to effectively fight at a certain level we are limited to that one aura. Anyhow, good set of posts. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DameDameNingen Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Stamina is currently not functional as it should; -can be over-drained at minimum charge, -confusing inconsistent drain rates in some situations, -does not affect gameplay in any good logical sense. Since we are ninjas, it might as well be removed. Starchart nodes currently serve as an unlockable progression for new players which is the aspect that should be improved on. -Resources/mods drop should be distributed among different nodes instead of the whole universe. -The redundancy of the same tilesets and same missions should be removed. -Completing a mission on some nodes may affect another, for examples; -completing an Extermination node reduces patrolling troops on a specific Assassination, allows easier stealth run for a special reward. (1 Extermination completion per 1 loss of patrols), -completing a Capture reveals security codes for instant hacking in specific Spy node, -completing a Sabotage turns a specific Extermination into Crossfire! -completing a Spy, to reinforce a Defense pod, along with a Survival to call Tenno operative to help on the Defense. Trial mission guidelines should all be written in the game somewhere not too obvious to remove the requirement of www search. Progress is (probably) addictive.... @___@ This is a really good idea. A major problem with current missions is that endless missions offer greater rewards, to the point that there's little point doing other types (except the specific rewards of spy and rescue). Short missions giving a boost to your next endless mission would really help break up the monotony. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-ornithorynk- Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 "What is your initial opinion of the proposed Solar Map changes? (see below for details)" MORE SHOTING LESS PUZZL that wold be nice :] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Telogor Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 (edited) Stamina needs to be removed except for blocking, because infinite blocks would be too OP, and stamina limits your options way too much. The old Star Chart was better, as you could clearly see what you needed to do to unlock a certain planet. I still haven't done a Trial, as the rewards aren't worth the amounts of cheese you have to go through. Enemies who can easily one-shot you, huge amounts of armor requiring 4x Corrosive Projection to even start to think about doing significant damage, the large amount of time you have to commit to it, and all the rest of the stuff make the pitiful arcane enhancements supremely unattractive. Progression higher than 30? I'm still just waiting for that Focus system you guys were talking about before U14. Edited June 8, 2015 by Telogor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl_Facehugger Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Saying “so long!” to Stamina The pros and cons of stamina have been in various hot topics for a long time. The source threads for this topic offer some opinions about the recently announced changes, and what they’ll mean for various aspects of Warframe. The following excerpt is from the Devstream 53 overview: During our revamp of Parkour 2.0 we've been keeping a close eye on how Stamina plays into player movement -- what works and what doesn't. To find what works, we’re currently experimenting with: not having Stamina in-game, fixed distance leaps, blocking, and many other mechanics. It's our ultimate goal to ensure Parkour 2.0 gives players the same empowered feeling our current movement 'features' allow for. That means everyone should expect a change to Stamina, as well. The change to Stamina is still a work in progress, but assuming it does get removed, what changes and/or mechanics would you like to see implemented instead? How would you change Mods and effects that currently rely on Stamina? Do you think Stamina has value? If you had the choice, would you modify it instead of removing it? What do you think the benefits to removing stamina are, if any? Please, post your thoughts/comments/ideas in this thread. Source threads: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/466800-please-dont-remove-stamina/ https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/467474-with-stamina-removal-what-happens-with-toxin-chroma/ Wish Upon a Star Chart The announced changes to the Solar Map have galvanized many Warframe players. I only included a couple hot topics in the source threads, but I know there are many more on the forums. If you’re unfamiliar with the proposed ideas, I’ve included the excerpt from the Devstream 53 overview below. We recognize that our current Star Chart needs a change, and we love to keep an open discussion on what kinds of changes we're looking to implement. That said, until the final version of our Solar Map is made live anything and everything discussed is to be considered a work in progress. We know there are lamentations of the old Star Chart, and we are looking at bringing back the Solar Map that many players enjoyed but didn't quite have the functionality we were aiming for. We want the new Star Chart to improve world building and include Mission modifiers while removing unnecessary redundancy -- it can't just feature planets with labels. Once we get closer to a final design we'll share with the community for feedback. The proposed Solar Map rework is a relatively blank slate, with the goal of streamlining and optimizing missions nodes. If you’re fearful of the proposed changes, what would you like to see change, if anything? Do you like having an abundance of nodes of each mission type? Do you think condensing nodes will create a more unified play experience? Do you think condensing nodes will make finding groups easier? If you were to create a more dynamic Solar Map with varying mission types and modifiers, how would you do it? What nodes or aspects of the Solar Map do you think are redundant, if any? Source threads: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/465123-u17-star-chart-change-speculation-what-do-you-want-to-see/ https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/454823-why-i-dont-play-starchart-missions-and-what-i-think-should-be-done-about-it/ Trials The Trials are finally on all platforms, so we’re able to discuss them now with the community at large. The source thread for this hot topic suggests that the Trials ought to have more instructions to help guide players. What do you think? Are the Trials too mysterious? Should they have more instructions? Do you think they are too easy to figure out? Should they be more vague/complex? Post your opinion in this thread. Source thread: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/468387-trial-of-trials/ Warframe after 30 Like Logan’s Run, a significant number of weapons and Warframes are at the end of their days once they hit 30. The hot topic for this thread suggests a few potential ways to extend the progression of your favourites, instead of being finished at 30. Would you prefer to continue leveling your favourite gear in lieu of leveling new stuff? If so, what kind of progression do you think makes sense beyond 30? How would you balance 30+ weapons and warframes? What other things need to be considered? Source Thread: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/469607-de-slow-down-making-new-warframes-and-let-us-go-farther-with-our-current-ones/ \ Stamina: It's a garbage mechanic that has no place in the game, IMO. It does nothing but slow characters down and make melee even more of a joke compared to guns than it already is. In a game as fast paced as warframe, stamina for movement has no place. However, it also has no place with melee because, right now, melee sucks. Guns are overwhelmingly more powerful, and much more convenient to use. Limiting melee based on stamina just means it's even harder to use melee in lieu of guns. Now, I know that there's a potential issue in that someone could make an infinite reflection build, but let's be honest - at high levels enemies have thousands or tens of thousands of EHP. Even with reflection, you're not going to be killing them faster with reflected bullets than guns or actual attacks, and on top of that, blocking only hits an arc in front of you. The only real legit issue I see is chroma needing his toxin ward to do something else useful - perhaps offer lifestrike or protection from poison or something. Star map: Condensing the star map is a great idea, but we should be able to play a specific tileset and mission type when we want. RNG based stuff is like what we have with syndicates: Where it's a crapshoot whether a mission comes up that I'd actually want to play. (Eg whenever hijack comes up, I roll my eyes and say "bleh" and skip it.) Trials: Honestly, the puzzles are bar none the reason I don't do trials. Not because the puzzles themselves are particularly hard, but because it feels like nobody knows how to actually do them. An uncoordinated pug team is just flat out painful to try and do trials with. Herding cats and being punished for something that's not a result of your own error (standing on platform, instadowned when some idiot flubs the puzzle or some unlucky tenno gets yoinked/blasted off the pad by scorpions/bombards) is garbage. I solo to get away from idiot pubs who don't know how to play. Indeed, it is because of how epically trials suck if you don't have a competent team (since you require a competent team - can't really carry in trials due to puzzles) that I'm extremely disappointed that the new J3 will be locked behind them. About Excalibur's Run: We need the focus system. Right now, I have literally everything maxed except the new scythe. All that XP I accumulate playing otherwise vanishes into the void, and it makes me not want to bother playing. Even if I didn't have maxed everything, I was still lamenting the loss of that XP. You guys really need to stop plundering focus for stuff like raid rewards and augments. Both of those systems would have been virtually perfect as a focus mechanic, but now because they're already implemented elsewhere there's no way to fit them in. As to what can be done: Make focus give weapons and frames passive level ups. Not damage necessarily, but things like ammo pickup count, magazine size, reload speed, recoil reduction, etc. Alternatively, give each weapon and frame conditional effects with focus - eg "get X headshots, next X shots does +200% damage" to encourage skillful play, with the required shots and % of damage going up as you level ("focus") your gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeuol Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 (edited) Saying "so long!" to Stamina The only time it's been important for me is when I'm traversing large distances. Even at full stamina, it's only possible to run part ways up a wall. Shouldn't stamina represent how far up the wall I can run? Same thing could be said for melee, stamina represents how long I can maintain my combo. Those mechanics are already built into the game since wall running and melee combos are finite. I'm not saying stamina should go away; I like the concept of having a finite resource to get from 'point a' to 'point b', but it's hard to say how stamina should change, when existing concepts like wall running just limit my usage of stamina anyway. "Vanilla" actions, like sprinting or rolling shouldn't use stamina, but Parkour 2.0 should definitely utilize a stamina resource to limit maneuvers. I want to be able to do something totally awesome, but I should only be able to maintain it for a limited amount of time. Wish Upon a Star Chart I don't think that reducing the number of nodes will solve the problem where a majority of nodes are ghost towns. Veteran players will farm the missions that give the best rewards. To get veteran players to run beginner missions, earlier missions have to up the rewards. I think it's definitely possible to accomplish that with the existing Star Chart and without spending the development time to change that UI aspect. The best idea I can think of is balancing missions via population. The more people running a node, the less of a reward that node gives. That way, the player base would be evenly spread across every node. Once you agree to a mission, your reward should be constant, regardless of how many other sessions are created after you have started. You could even go so far as to make an algorithm to calculate rewards based on how popular a mission is over time. Missions that are very popular for long periods of time will have poor rewards. Trials I haven't run a Trial yet, but I've seen videos. They definitely look sweet, but the objective of the mission should be pretty clear. That being said, a little trial and error should be expected. No team should expect to walk in on their first try, and clear it with absolutely no issues. Warframe after 30 This could be a lot of fun. I've never understood why there are multiple Mk1 weapons in the game. All of them will never see late game play, yet all of them are needed at some point for Mastery. It would be fun to offer a progression system that could (with TONS of work) turn a Mk1 weapon into a death machine. Obviously the big concern would be, if you could do it for weaker weapons, then it would just make good weapons even better, thus continuing the imbalance. Perhaps adding a way to modify two stats on a weapon. Once I complete some objective (kill 30000 corpus with this weapon), I could for example increase fire rate while decreasing magazine size (both stat changes are specified prior to agreeing to the objective). I would be able to customize the weapon exactly to the specifications that I wanted, but usually at some sort of sacrifice, that way powerful weapons just don't get infinitely more powerful. Same could happen for Warframes (increase Power Max, decrease Armor). My only concern is players maxing out preferred stats. Perhaps only certain stats can be modified, like armor, speed, and power max. Edited June 8, 2015 by Zeuol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigercloud Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Responding to the Warframe after 30 topic: This should be addressed by the Focus system. Here is the basic model. -Focus should be capped by Mastery. You cannot progress in Focus past your Mastery Rank. -Focus should be gained while leveling weapons or Warframes that have been Formaed, or by using weapons or Warframes that are level 30. -Each Focus level costs 3x the amount of experience necessary to reach level 30. -Focus levels are applied to the weapon or Warframe that gained them. Once a weapon or Warframe gains a Focus level, the player gets the option to add one of the following options: 5 Mod Points, a polarized Utility Mod slot, a polarized Augment Mod slot, or an unpolarized general Mod slot. You can only have one additional general Mod slot per weapon and Warframe. This is to prevent players from simply maxing out Mod Points and general Mod slots for maximum DPS. This would necessitate certain mods being made into Utility mods. Utility mods should have little to no direct effect on damage. -Focus levels would be capped at 10 Focus levels per weapon. The last 3 Focus levels would cost 4x, 5x, and 6x the amount of experience necessary to reach level 30. By tying the Focus system to Mastery Rank, it would make sure that players continued to diversify and level different weapons and Warframes in order to make their favorite weapons more powerful. If Focus was like this, it would also allow dedicated players to make any Focused weapon on par with unfocused "top tier" weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinjeto Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 (edited) Saying “so long!” to Stamina The pros and cons of stamina have been in various hot topics for a long time. The source threads for this topic offer some opinions about the recently announced changes, and what they’ll mean for various aspects of Warframe. The following excerpt is from the Devstream 53 overview: During our revamp of Parkour 2.0 we've been keeping a close eye on how Stamina plays into player movement -- what works and what doesn't. To find what works, we’re currently experimenting with: not having Stamina in-game, fixed distance leaps, blocking, and many other mechanics. It's our ultimate goal to ensure Parkour 2.0 gives players the same empowered feeling our current movement 'features' allow for. That means everyone should expect a change to Stamina, as well. The change to Stamina is still a work in progress, but assuming it does get removed, what changes and/or mechanics would you like to see implemented instead? How would you change Mods and effects that currently rely on Stamina? Do you think Stamina has value? If you had the choice, would you modify it instead of removing it? What do you think the benefits to removing stamina are, if any? Please, post your thoughts/comments/ideas in this thread. Source threads: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/466800-please-dont-remove-stamina/ https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/467474-with-stamina-removal-what-happens-with-toxin-chroma/ Warframe after 30Like Logan’s Run, a significant number of weapons and Warframes are at the end of their days once they hit 30. The hot topic for this thread suggests a few potential ways to extend the progression of your favourites, instead of being finished at 30. Would you prefer to continue leveling your favourite gear in lieu of leveling new stuff? If so, what kind of progression do you think makes sense beyond 30? How would you balance 30+ weapons and warframes? What other things need to be considered? Source Thread: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/469607-de-slow-down-making-new-warframes-and-let-us-go-farther-with-our-current-ones/ Remember these? http://i.imgur.com/0KncGH4.jpg -- Remember this? http://i.imgur.com/BuY66en.jpg -- Also remember this? A lot of us long time players remember all of the above and the post below. Now we're stuck with removing stamina?! You might remember this and I know it might take a lot of effort [sic], You can still do it: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/137875-a-complete-rework-of-the-foundation-of-warframe/ It's good melee discussion is back on the table. Maybe we can finally subdivide the systems using the Mastery Rank system or make an independent individual series of system(s) and have it so we can finally play the frame the way we (the players -- also don't forget consumers) want to?. You want a fast healer -- boom there it is. You want a tanky healer that can move slower but use guns. There it is again. I know it's archived. I know it's old but I think it clearly demonstrates some parts of the brick wall that you seem to be encountering. The real key comes from what is inside the branches of the tree. Because each tree is pulling from its own point pool, the player is awarded more freedom. Recently Ember's Overheat was nerfed (It has now been removed). The reason being, Scott told us she was not a tank. Choice was supposed to be a centric theme around the game (from my understanding). Choosing the Warframe you like best and building them the way you want. With my skill tree, I put that choice back in the hands of the player. By creating parameters around which the players can alter their powers to their liking, you can assure that no matter what, they will be effective in combat. It also creates real and purposeful choice. To be fair 2 years on, you're thinking of getting rid of Stamina. What if you took a radical turn. Changed it so the Stamina was it's own system You could have melee build frames, You could have gun frames. You could have column A and column B. But let's just explore this for a minute before you go putting this post in the feedback section... impact to have an impact or effect on; influence; alter: The decision may impact your whole career. The auto industry will be impacted by the new labor agreements.substance: the actual matter of a thing, as opposed to the appearance or shadow; reality.Maybe it's time to work inside the confines of each Warframe allowing people to play: - That spell caster that runs slow. - That melee only wielding tanky spell caster. - Gun wielding light assault frame. There's already constraints with efficeincy and a max of 175% so if that can be done there. Why can't incomparables be done with other parts of the frame BUT allowing people to play a frame flexability the way the player wants to.REALLY GETTING IN THERE.. Letting the player finetune the way the player wants their frame to behave, but just, oh ok 30% stamina boost that's it. Like which parts. It also makes the job of the developer a lot easier because they only need to raise the level cap for more point attributes to be added to the skill tree. Then players get to play their favourite frame anyway they want to, with in the confines of that frame. What is stopping you from coding the long way around and re-implementing in: http://i.imgur.com/1ECYsQF.jpg With a few limitations. Edited June 9, 2015 by Kinjeto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legonist Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 You can draw in as many people as you want but you also need to keep them. If someone finds a warframe they love and a good set of weapons they like to use and max those items out but still want to use them, what progression do they have? I know many many many people who played warframe, maxed out a warframe or 2 and half a dozen weapons and then stopped playing, yes they do come back after every update or 2 for a day to see if anything "super cool or fun" came out but they always say that there is no endgame progression besides forma, which at a certain point for most good weapons is not needed. I mean new stuff is nice and all but most people do burn out on grinding new stuff they most likely aren't going to use, and when they do burn out and there is little endgame progression to satisfy them, they will leave. Everyone knows plenty of people who this has happened to and it is noticeable just by looking at your clan or chat and seeing the drop in people that slowly happens after every update. On the star chart: What scares me about it is that from what I understand the choice of tile-set, enemy type, level and mode may decrease and especially the ability to find the right combination of all 4, personally I am in favor of there being a default "suggested" star chart of a few dozen missions and there being a button on the bottom (like switching from warframe to archwing in the arsenal) to switch to the current or old star chart (with a little trimming, as I agree there are way to many missions, there should be no repeats of a mission type for each planet). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FierceRadiance Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Star Charts My concern is that I don't see a huge difference between a player choosing to only play a handful of (current) nodes because of Reason A, and Steve (et al) choosing which handful of (new) nodes a player will have to play because of Reason B. If the player choosing to only play a few nodes is a bad thing because -insert reason here-, how is Steve and Scott making that decision for players (i.e., limiting players' choices to 20 nodes or less) because -insert same or different reason here- also not a bad thing? Unfortunately, without solid information -which may not even exist, to be shared or not, at this point- all I can do is worry and speculate wildly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nedow40 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Well, I'm playing Warframe for some time (when I say "some time" it is 2 years) and I finally can have some opinions without being dumb about it. Stamina: You know where Stamina would be good? Charge Attacks. And no Stamina for any type of movement, only for attacks and blocks. Most warframes have 100 Stamina. This is a small number compared to 10 that we use for every single jump. "A basic function that costs 10 stamina" (Warframe Wikia). And I'm not done yet! "More advanced moves drains Stamina." How can be a jump a "more advanced move"? Conclusion: Stamina on movement? Nope! Nope! Nope! So much nope! And let's one more 0 to Stamina. 1000 would solve most of the limits we have. Star Chart: More information would be good. I only have some fear in losing the freedom that I have when I want to do a mission. Going to navigation and seeing all that planets asking myself, "What should I do today?". Been able to help someone with a mission in Europa to unlock the Boss. Things like that. Trials: The Rai... I mean. The Trials was a good challenge, but some kind of what-to-do can come in handy. On my first time at a Trial I was shooting the Injector to destroy it. Maybe if the injector have a bubble like Frost's Globe we would see it as a shield. That bright aura that was not enough to understand that it was a shield. Many things in Warframe have that type of glowing aura. Beyond lvl 30: Wasn't forma built for this? You reset the weapon and have a Polarity slot to have a better mod efficiency. You can Forma it many times you want. If it isn't enough, why not just change the way forma is used? You have your lvl 30 weapon and you put a forma on it. Now it have more 30 lvls to go. Each forma will reset only this last 30 points and give us that sweet polarity. P.S.: Sorry for the misspells, it's hard to learn a new language all alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themartinc123 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Star chart I hope to have more players to join mission while retaining the existing star chart. No dough that the current star chart is unfriendly to new players, but I like the design of it and being able to choose my mission. Suggestion: Make chapters instead of star chart for new players, once they have finished all the chapters, they unlocked the detailed star chart(current star chart). When players selected a mission, for instance, salad v assassination, they joined new players in the salad v assassination section of the Jupiter chapter. When the go to extraction, the old player extracts,while the new player have a cut screen for his,next mission. I hope this helps:p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z_Cubed Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 STAMINA We are ninjas and I don't think stamina is needed; however, perhaps the armor rating of a frame can tie into it's natural block rate and that can appease some of the people worried about infinite blocking. basically your armor rating would become like your stamina bar only in the instance of blocking. Jumps, attacking, running, arch-winging - none of it will suffer from the loss of stamina in my opinion, and will only be improved. STAR CHART this is going to be based entirely on whether or not you decide to lower the amount of nodes on the design side. I don't think this one looks bad but it is a bit lacking in functionality. Being able to pick your mission type is a very nice feature to me and I would really hate to see that go even if the amount of missions available each day was 20. Maybe a design contest once you finalize the amount of nodes and the system you will be using for missions could give you guys some new ideas. The chapter thing above isn't bad for the sequence of missions up to a boss battle, that is sort of how the storyline missions feel to me anyways. As for general gameplay though for people who are looking to farm resources or go to void should have a map with all of the nodes shown. One way to solve a lot of your issues with this is to do like you said, and lower the total amount of playable nodes in the solar map, but keep the same progression system in place. only make it so that the nodes appear randomly for each player. Meaning - if I am on Venus before I finish a mission in the current "second ring" of nodes, on the left and right of it will be no visible nodes. But after I finish, it will randomly generate a new mission, or possibly 2 or 3 depending on how difficult the mission I just finished was. Anyways just random ideas. LEVELING GEAR PAST 30 I think that there are a ton of ways to go about this but only a few that make sense. I do like what a lot of people have been saying about the Focus system and thought that maybe once a weapon or frame maxes out, you will have access to a bp to create a new weapon or frame from that one but with new stats, sort of like prime keeps the base stats and adds to them, but the stats do not necessarily have to be much higher in number from this process. This way technically everything still has a max level of 30 but you can re-forge it or something. Perhaps to spice it up even more you could add that some weapons, once re-forged, can gain even more bonuses when used with a particular Prime frame or Sentinel or Melee. I do also like the idea of having a new augment mod slot appear on any frame that hits 30, and perhaps prime frames have polarized augment slots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celestics Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 I have differing opinions based on what I think would be better for the game as a whole and what I personally would like... Stamina For the game: I'm going with removing it. Although it is meant to be a limited resource, stamina limits too much in terms of gameplay style, and it just ends up making movement through large tilesets daunting and unnecessary. Losing all stamina during a run ends up in a simple "Sprint-Crouch-Sprint" mentality for most people as the fastest way to traverse a map - and this doesn't give a natural flow to the mission. IMO, stamina isn't the sole issue - the way it interacts with gameplay needs to be considered. It's a combination of factors - coptering, sliding, tile design, mission length, etc. - and to put it short... If the objective is far away from me and the journey there isn't interesting enough to keep me back, what's stopping me from just blazing through everything? WARNING: Whoever is reading this from DE probably knows this doesn't equate to "make more blocking doors/events". I'd rather have more freedom to showcase individual talent and choice in movement. As a Speedrunner: I do not want to remove it. My personal playstyle favors challenge, and I like the idea of stamina as a resource only. The way it was implemented could be tweaked. As an aside: I don't mind nerfing coptering, but I really would like to see the ability to stop on a dime or have player velocities resolved in a better manner. Suggestions: + Do not have stamina be required for actions. Have stamina determine the strength of actions (e.g. faster sprinting/coptering, stronger attacks, etc.). + Remove stamina altogether, make repeated action use become less effective over time (promotes movement diversity). + Stamina reduction is to be tied with weapon strength during use. This gives rise to more mod possibilities (stamina efficiency in use, stamina efficiency in power, etc.). In any case, please do not overly nerf the speeds we can attain currently! Going fast or slow is a player choice, and I feel that keeping options wide open is a good thing. StarChart 3.0 For the Game: Current "idea" of 20-node system w/ randomizations is bad. In a nutshell, it trivializes the Alert System and makes players lose interest in the game if their item choices are impossible to obtain in the current rotation. I'm not quite sure how this would work well with DE either. From a gameplay perspective, being at the mercy of time can be easily worse than being at the mercy of RNG if the time interval is too long. From a business standpoint (eh, just a thought), active users may drop down if players don't even want to run missions for specific rewards in the current rotation... I don't mind reducing the number of nodes, but there needs to be a unique method of progression. For now, the StarChart merely encourages moving from node to node - the only reason to unlock planets and missions are for the tilesets, bosses, and alerts (which most of the time aren't desirable, speaking from a player who has almost unlocked everything). Progression may be great at the beginning, but the saturation of missions over multiple nodes is not a good idea. It makes going through the nodes more of a chore. Hence, either the tilesets need unique events and mechanics or the missions themselves need more diversity (and the StarChart better interaction). IIRC, Scott explained that the StarChart should be calling me to action and I should be able to influence it directly. As a Speedrunner: As long as you don't make bosses randomized on tilesets or occurrence, I'm happy. I'd love to still run All Bosses as a category you know D: Trials I like mysteries and challenge. My first attempt at the first raid was a disaster though. I don't mind having little-to-no-information, but I want raids to have elements of surprise in it... Moreover, I'd like to see raids be more connected to each other. Raids really just don't stand out vs. regular missions as opposed to the difficulty posed in it and the 8-man possibility. More importantly, raid phases just feel too modularized. To me, this doesn't set it apart as a special mode - it just makes it another mission to finish. As a Speedrunner: Keep options open, but I'd like to avoid having RNG drastically change raid events and phases. No major problems here. LV. 30+ I'll just bullet-point this... + Focus System! :D + Someone once proposed a hexagonal modding system. Maybe this can be somehow adapted into the current system to allow for small increases to stats? + There's no reason to create duplicates of weapons unless we need different builds. This delves into the mod power issue, and I won't go crazy into it here. However, I'd question what to do with the 10+ Gorgon BP's I have from login rewards. Selling them is besides the point - maybe I can do something with 2 of these weapons at full rank? + We can always prestige weapons to add in a slot for aesthetic changes. Make it so we get more customization options that don't directly impact stats as we rank to 30 as an alternative to simply using a Forma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew1280 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 (edited) Saying “so long!” to Stamina The pros and cons of stamina have been in various hot topics for a long time. The source threads for this topic offer some opinions about the recently announced changes, and what they’ll mean for various aspects of Warframe. The following excerpt is from the Devstream 53 overview: During our revamp of Parkour 2.0 we've been keeping a close eye on how Stamina plays into player movement -- what works and what doesn't. To find what works, we’re currently experimenting with: not having Stamina in-game, fixed distance leaps, blocking, and many other mechanics. It's our ultimate goal to ensure Parkour 2.0 gives players the same empowered feeling our current movement 'features' allow for. That means everyone should expect a change to Stamina, as well. The change to Stamina is still a work in progress, but assuming it does get removed, what changes and/or mechanics would you like to see implemented instead? How would you change Mods and effects that currently rely on Stamina? Do you think Stamina has value? If you had the choice, would you modify it instead of removing it? What do you think the benefits to removing stamina are, if any? Please, post your thoughts/comments/ideas in this thread. Source threads: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/466800-please-dont-remove-stamina/ https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/467474-with-stamina-removal-what-happens-with-toxin-chroma/ Wish Upon a Star Chart The announced changes to the Solar Map have galvanized many Warframe players. I only included a couple hot topics in the source threads, but I know there are many more on the forums. If you’re unfamiliar with the proposed ideas, I’ve included the excerpt from the Devstream 53 overview below. We recognize that our current Star Chart needs a change, and we love to keep an open discussion on what kinds of changes we're looking to implement. That said, until the final version of our Solar Map is made live anything and everything discussed is to be considered a work in progress. We know there are lamentations of the old Star Chart, and we are looking at bringing back the Solar Map that many players enjoyed but didn't quite have the functionality we were aiming for. We want the new Star Chart to improve world building and include Mission modifiers while removing unnecessary redundancy -- it can't just feature planets with labels. Once we get closer to a final design we'll share with the community for feedback. The proposed Solar Map rework is a relatively blank slate, with the goal of streamlining and optimizing missions nodes. If you’re fearful of the proposed changes, what would you like to see change, if anything? Do you like having an abundance of nodes of each mission type? Do you think condensing nodes will create a more unified play experience? Do you think condensing nodes will make finding groups easier? If you were to create a more dynamic Solar Map with varying mission types and modifiers, how would you do it? What nodes or aspects of the Solar Map do you think are redundant, if any? Source threads: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/465123-u17-star-chart-change-speculation-what-do-you-want-to-see/ https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/454823-why-i-dont-play-starchart-missions-and-what-i-think-should-be-done-about-it/ Trials The Trials are finally on all platforms, so we’re able to discuss them now with the community at large. The source thread for this hot topic suggests that the Trials ought to have more instructions to help guide players. What do you think? Are the Trials too mysterious? Should they have more instructions? Do you think they are too easy to figure out? Should they be more vague/complex? Post your opinion in this thread. Source thread: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/468387-trial-of-trials/ Warframe after 30 Like Logan’s Run, a significant number of weapons and Warframes are at the end of their days once they hit 30. The hot topic for this thread suggests a few potential ways to extend the progression of your favourites, instead of being finished at 30. Would you prefer to continue leveling your favourite gear in lieu of leveling new stuff? If so, what kind of progression do you think makes sense beyond 30? How would you balance 30+ weapons and warframes? What other things need to be considered? Source Thread: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/469607-de-slow-down-making-new-warframes-and-let-us-go-farther-with-our-current-ones/ The new update is going to stink up warframe just imagine being a space ninja with no stamina wont be a space ninja no longer but a bunch of week warframe hobbits with guns since melee uses stamina guns do not , Dev please do not take out stamina if you have not noticed after the last few nerfs warframe lost millions of tennos to that cause that was a everyday gamers ,whats up with the nerfing warframe instead of making the game more pleasurable. if stamina is removed some mods maps will be impossible or take forever to walk threw since running take stamina . Edited June 9, 2015 by matthew1280 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew1280 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 (edited) I have differing opinions based on what I think would be better for the game as a whole and what I personally would like... Stamina For the game: I'm going with removing it. Although it is meant to be a limited resource, stamina limits too much in terms of gameplay style, and it just ends up making movement through large tilesets daunting and unnecessary. Losing all stamina during a run ends up in a simple "Sprint-Crouch-Sprint" mentality for most people as the fastest way to traverse a map - and this doesn't give a natural flow to the mission. IMO, stamina isn't the sole issue - the way it interacts with gameplay needs to be considered. It's a combination of factors - coptering, sliding, tile design, mission length, etc. - and to put it short... If the objective is far away from me and the journey there isn't interesting enough to keep me back, what's stopping me from just blazing through everything? WARNING: Whoever is reading this from DE probably knows this doesn't equate to "make more blocking doors/events". I'd rather have more freedom to showcase individual talent and choice in movement. As a Speedrunner: I do not want to remove it. My personal playstyle favors challenge, and I like the idea of stamina as a resource only. The way it was implemented could be tweaked. As an aside: I don't mind nerfing coptering, but I really would like to see the ability to stop on a dime or have player velocities resolved in a better manner. Suggestions: + Do not have stamina be required for actions. Have stamina determine the strength of actions (e.g. faster sprinting/coptering, stronger attacks, etc.). + Remove stamina altogether, make repeated action use become less effective over time (promotes movement diversity). + Stamina reduction is to be tied with weapon strength during use. This gives rise to more mod possibilities (stamina efficiency in use, stamina efficiency in power, etc.). In any case, please do not overly nerf the speeds we can attain currently! Going fast or slow is a player choice, and I feel that keeping options wide open is a good thing. StarChart 3.0 For the Game: Current "idea" of 20-node system w/ randomizations is bad. In a nutshell, it trivializes the Alert System and makes players lose interest in the game if their item choices are impossible to obtain in the current rotation. I'm not quite sure how this would work well with DE either. From a gameplay perspective, being at the mercy of time can be easily worse than being at the mercy of RNG if the time interval is too long. From a business standpoint (eh, just a thought), active users may drop down if players don't even want to run missions for specific rewards in the current rotation... I don't mind reducing the number of nodes, but there needs to be a unique method of progression. For now, the StarChart merely encourages moving from node to node - the only reason to unlock planets and missions are for the tilesets, bosses, and alerts (which most of the time aren't desirable, speaking from a player who has almost unlocked everything). Progression may be great at the beginning, but the saturation of missions over multiple nodes is not a good idea. It makes going through the nodes more of a chore. Hence, either the tilesets need unique events and mechanics or the missions themselves need more diversity (and the StarChart better interaction). IIRC, Scott explained that the StarChart should be calling me to action and I should be able to influence it directly. As a Speedrunner: As long as you don't make bosses randomized on tilesets or occurrence, I'm happy. I'd love to still run All Bosses as a category you know D: Trials I like mysteries and challenge. My first attempt at the first raid was a disaster though. I don't mind having little-to-no-information, but I want raids to have elements of surprise in it... Moreover, I'd like to see raids be more connected to each other. Raids really just don't stand out vs. regular missions as opposed to the difficulty posed in it and the 8-man possibility. More importantly, raid phases just feel too modularized. To me, this doesn't set it apart as a special mode - it just makes it another mission to finish. As a Speedrunner: Keep options open, but I'd like to avoid having RNG drastically change raid events and phases. No major problems here. LV. 30+ I'll just bullet-point this... + Focus System! :D + Someone once proposed a hexagonal modding system. Maybe this can be somehow adapted into the current system to allow for small increases to stats? + There's no reason to create duplicates of weapons unless we need different builds. This delves into the mod power issue, and I won't go crazy into it here. However, I'd question what to do with the 10+ Gorgon BP's I have from login rewards. Selling them is besides the point - maybe I can do something with 2 of these weapons at full rank? + We can always prestige weapons to add in a slot for aesthetic changes. Make it so we get more customization options that don't directly impact stats as we rank to 30 as an alternative to simply using a Forma. I agree please do not remove stamina and turn warframe into a slow pace none skilled hobbit like game ,i have been down with warframe since beta and we have already lost enough tennos to the cause of nerfing out warframe. i spend over $500 a month on warframe and losing stamina to a bunch of none skilled whiners that cant keep up , that is what the solo option is for . Stop the nerfing start making the game more exciting and more pleasurable , look at how many have voted for stamina to be removed completely and most of them dont even have a clue of what stamina is or does with out stamina we are no longer ninjas but hobbits . Unless stamina is removed from screen and it would be like we always have full stamina in run and melee actions but i doubt it would be like that would be to easy to fix but even easier to just nerf nerf nerf like always . I hope the stamina mods like Acrobat Maraton Quick Rest Shield Flux etc turn into somthing usefule afterwords. Edited June 9, 2015 by matthew1280 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew1280 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 (edited) I cant imagin polorizing a weapon or warframe thats rank 50 to have to rank it back up to 50 wow that would hurt ,ouch my onions XD Edited June 9, 2015 by matthew1280 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RainDH Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 You might remember this and I know it might take a lot of effort [sic], You can still do it: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/137875-a-complete-rework-of-the-foundation-of-warframe/ Wow. These are some great ideas and concepts. So much win. As much as I understood, only stances were included in a way changed form? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FierceRadiance Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 (edited) Leveling Weapons Past 30 I've beat this drum in a few locations over the past few weeks...but I'll beat it here as well. I have a tangential take on this idea. Folk routinely shout that Power Creep is always a bad thing. ("PC BAD THING!! ALWAYS!!") I don't agree. IMHO, many of the weapons made available to us -maybe even most- are very similar in most respects. I mean, DE's only got a half-dozen variables or so to play with, and each one generally (but not always) has a fairly narrow range in which to vary. So in recent weeks, I've been sorely tempted to just ignore some of the new weapons, especially if I have to cannibalize an older weapon in order to make a different-looking but otherwise-similar gun. I hear new weps often called 'Mastery-fodder', and this points out a second important issue: what good is a Mastery rank higher than 8 right now? That's been debated by others wiser than I, and there's no need to re-hash it here. So... Why not institute a system where higher-Mastery players have access to more powerful weapons? I have to admit, I get a kick out of laying waste to vast swathes of enemies, striding amongst my foes like a BLOOD-SOAKED JUGGERNAUT.... . . . *ahem*...where was I? Oh yeah, higher-level players getting more powerful weapons. [Full-Disclosure: I would benefit from the system I'm advocating.] My personal preferences notwithstanding, it may not be the best idea for players to be able to take heavy weaponry into starter-level missions. I can understand that (while not necessarily agreeing with it). But I still think it would be a good thing for the game if level 13 or 16 or 18 players had access to some more-major firepower. Forma does take a few steps in this direction, but -again, IMHO- it can't go far enough, because of the basic restrictions of the weapons themselves. I'm a level 18, and there's nothing I can wield that a level 8 with a few Forma, some plat and a little drop-luck can't build and take into battle just like me. I've got nothing against him or her, more power to them. I'd just like to be able to work towards something better as I rise through the ranks. Edited June 9, 2015 by PanUmbrian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostvalor Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Opinions on: Stamina I think it should be kept as a feature for the next parkour remake. However, modifications should be done to answer future problems and create new opportunities for players and Warframes. For example, stamina should help limit the distance/amount of parkour a player can do - this will help players think of strategies for efficient movement around the map and simply not just hold spacebar and go everywhere they want. It will highlight skilled parkour players (obviously skilled parkour players reap more benefits, but that is the advantage of mastering parkour compared to those who don't even bother to practice wall running). Base stamina on Warframes should also be readjusted to give Warframes more personality. Warframes which require a lot of stamina - whether for movement, attacking, blocking, etc. Examples of such warframes include, but are not limited to Volt and Valkyr. Mainly, while writing this paragraph, I simply thought of the future of Warframe and opporunities that come with stamina. Imagine a raid/mission wherein 1 or 2 players need to be fast and good in parkour in order to reach a console that needs to be pressed in order to save fellow squad members from dying. Or a Warframe that needs to block certain amount of damage for the team in order to progress through the mission. This strengthens the role of a Warframe in a squad and gives more variety to what Warframes are needed. Hopefully, it will address the issue of some frames being unused/unwanted endgame. Hopefully, these will also positively affect Conclave players - both skilled and new players. Star Chart My main concern for the star chart is the appearance. I propose that the star chart and planet nodes be transformed into what looks like a line graph (or for a more visual description: what you see when hacking consoles on corpus maps). The nodes should be round/circles simply connected by lines to determine the progressive path (like connect the dots). For added visual understanding, the planet nodes' (being now circles on a line graph) border color should be changed or sigils/marking should be placed around the circumference of the circle to denote the mission type - alert, syndicate, etc. About functionality and mission select: Missions type SHOULD be selected by the players according to what they want to do/what to accomplish but there should be unlocking progression (following the line graph appearance I stated above - this is somewhat still similar to the current star chart system only a change in appearance). Personally, I would not play a game if I found out that the certain mission/resource I want to farm will not be available to me at certain schedules. So far I think all mission types are healthy and reward players well based on the amount of effort they put into them but if you take away the choice of a player: lets say playerA wants to farm Orokin Cells, in order to build a weapon/quest/mission, but playerA's desired mission node that gives Orokin Cells, is not available/selectable on that day (given the player has already unlocked the node). What will that player do? Either he does something else, or quit the game and come back when the mission he wants is available again. I know that beginners should be slowly be taught about mission types in-game so I don't mind if early mission mission nodes are compulsory for new players. But after unlocking them, they should be able to replay them whenever they want. Skip this paragraph unless the mission reward system will be changed alongside the new star chart. This is based on the current mission reward/market system: This is only my opinion and I am not sure of this but: I think what helps keep this game alive is the balance of trade between non-platinum buying grinders who have time to play and those who have no time to play but buy stuff/mods/resources with platinum from players that grind for them. If you take away the choice of mission type, mods/resources will become almost unavailable and unless they put up specific mods in the Market, even avid platinum buyers will have no choice but to farm for themselves and no longer buy platinum to trade for the mod/resource instead, but unfortunately not all of them have enough time to farm for it. And considering that grinders are no longer able to farm the mission type they want, they would no longer be able to provide to those who simply want to buy from them. Regarding archwing/ the underwater archwing mission types (which I think is cool but rarely played): They should make a planet/nodes simply dedicated to the use of archwing frames. This will give rise to interest in leveling archwing frames instead of the Odonata collecting dust in the arsenal. They could revise Neptune to be an all underwater node or make an Asteroid Field planet/node simply dedicated to archwing type missions. Do I even need to mention Conclave possibilities? :) Warframe after 30 Maybe you could test this slowly by implementing it first on Warframes only - not weapons. It will be difficult to implement this for weapons because players will have to repurchase or craft them and it takes time to gauge if the new system is viable. Personally, I like the variety of weapons and leveling them for Mastery forces us players to learn about what kind of weapon we want/should use. Raising the level cap of weapons forces the player to stay with that weapon longer (unless affinity rewards are changed) and will therefore take longer for the player to try new varieties. However, leveling a weapon/frame after 30 does not even have to be for mastery points. Tweak it by: instead of earning mastery points, when a weapon reaches for example level 40, a Mod Slot is unlocked (not capacity, but a new slot - even just one will do) This could provide more end game possibilities and customization. Or if not a mod slot, maybe unlock innate abilities or "Skill Points" to be distributed to the frame/weapon. This will help players get stronger in order to face possible Stronger enemies on newly implemented maps/missions. I got goosebumps simply writing down my opinion on Warframe after 30. But it makes you think of the possibilities - they are endless. It will help make the game survive. Think with all these changes along with this idea: Its not about WARFRAME after 30 levels. Its about WARFRAME's existence over 30 years. Again, these are only my opinions and I know some of them you may not entirely agree with but thank you for reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
climatiseur Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 30+ level Given the current unbalance system, what would do good to have a progress more than level 30? To make the already messy and inconsistent system into a bigger chaos? Work on the current modding and enemies level system first, and after that we might want to see how would it be to have a progress over 30. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudpaws Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 wht in the grate void do you keep makeing the bad guys stronger and all the frames and weapons weaker ,, shakes head makes for less $$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aciaj613 Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 (edited) Currently the way I see it is this: Star chart: The proposed change to the star chart does not sound like it would be the best of options. With the way the current star chart is, it gives us choices which is a great thing to keep in a game. Rather than condensing all the nodes into 20 RNG nodes I propose the idea of just simply removing the repetitive nodes on each planet. That way each planet has 1 node of each game-type and the boss node (If there is one). Of course invasions may need a slight change in spawn rates due to this. Let's not forget mastery rank! What would happen to the Mastery XP if RNG nodes were to exist? No one would be able to complete all of the missions they need to do in order to rank up higher. If you end up condensing the nodes anyhow I suggest a rework on the mastery XP you gain from missions anyhow. Level 30+ Topic: I honestly thought the Focus system was supposed to be part of the end-game concept here. The focus system back when it was still being mentioned was supposed to be "Warframe past 30" and allow us to upgrade our warframes for more tough levels. Personally I don't think we should think too deep on other solutions for warframe currently has many things on its plate. I suggest maybe taking a look back at the Focus system and using that for the "Warframe past 30" concept. Edited June 10, 2015 by Aciaj613 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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