[Spoiler] Vor Was Right!?

[SilentMobius]

I remember using Vor's info on what Warframes were a while ago and people saying that he didnt know what he was talking about. That he was just some crazy old dude talking in metaphors, and verbs, and adjectives (mad izm).

And now it turns out he was 100% correct!

Sheesh you have real issues with understanding English don't you.

The bulk of the debate wasn't about Vor being correct or not, it was between "energy" being a metaphor for the source of the warframe's power or a literal statement that the Tenno were physically energy beings.

And now we know he answer is that it was a metaphor and Tenno are not energy beings, we are simply the mind and source of power for the Warframe. Yay, closure.

(In related news Shakespeare did not write a play about the tragic love of Romeo and a ball of stellar fusing plansma)

[Hypernaut1]

"We've been wrong all this time. Tenno do not control the Warframe's divine energy. The Tenno ARE that energy. Each Warframe you control is merely a glass shaping your furious light."

 

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Captain_Vor_(Corrupted)/Quotes

 

From the Vor's Prize quest.

He is exactly right. I dont know why people doubted it. It wad clear that he knew what he was talking about. Only people in denial came up with the ridiculous "he's just using metaphor" excuse.

[Enno69]

He is exactly right. I dont know why people doubted it. It wad clear that he knew what he was talking about. Only people in denial came up with the ridiculous "he's just using metaphor" excuse.

Well, we do actually have a body, don't we ?

[Aimop95]

Vor can't be a tenno. He wasn't on the Ten-zero ship.

[Ionus]

He is exactly right. I dont know why people doubted it. It wad clear that he knew what he was talking about. Only people in denial came up with the ridiculous "he's just using metaphor" excuse.

Except....it was a metaphor. People who thought otherwise subscribed to the "tenno are void ghosts" theory, which isn't true in light of recent developments.

[SeaUrchins]

Vor is a true void explorer, Tenno are just Sentient's lap dogs.

[Kaotyke]

We have to put a full power Madurai beam against Vor and test to see how that goes.

Vor is a true void explorer, Tenno are just Sentient's lap dogs.

I have to do this every time I see you:

[angias]

I remember using Vor's info on what Warframes were a while ago and people saying that he didnt know what he was talking about. That he was just some crazy old dude talking in metaphors, and verbs, and adjectives (mad izm).

And now it turns out he was 100% correct!

The tenno has the power, the Warframe is just a lens, and the best part is that HE became a Tenno.

Not only that but he seems to be using the focus system first!

He was throwing them hadoukens tenno throw and teleporting away to.... i dunno where when he was done.

Now we need a shirt in Grineer text saying Vor was right on the right with his face laughing on the left.

Preferably this face.

So now that the Grineer have Tenno-tech..... what does that mean?

Vor was one of the rare grineer attracted to other technology.

And since grineer ecepted vor are higly tennophobe i think we are safe...for now.

[Omnimorph]

It's really a neat way of synthesizing "Iron Man" with "energy being".  The things that supported "energy being" was the 1 to many correspondence, the lack of any hint that we were a physical being who got out of a warframe to get into another one, Vor's speech. The things that supported the "Iron Man" approach was that warframes or whatever was "in" them, bleed, need oxygen, etc.

 

So there was support for both theories.

 

And both theories still have a sense in which they're true: you're "in" the warframe in a sense, but you're also something that's etherial and free-floating in a sense too (the "transferred" consciousness that's "in" the warframe).

 

So in a sense Vor got it right, in a sense not (he really was being a proponent of the "energy being" theory himself, but he was just that bit off, in the same way the "energy being" theory always was.

 

You are a physical being that's able to project your consciousness into an object that serves as a focus for your superpowers, to look at the world through that object's eyes, and to act through it: that's the synthesis of the two antitheses were were apparently presented with.

Edited December 9, 2015 by Omnimorph

[Mak_Gohae]

Not really... Tenno were only CHANGED by Void Energy, and we were given the frames as a means to contain our minds and focus our new void powers into them. Our physical bodies are still unchanged, though possibly ageless since we're still children even after the fall of the Orokin.

 

Vor BECAME void energy, as he so likes to brag every time I cram my Mara Detron down his trachea and microwave his last meal. He's something entirely different.

 

All the things Vor does are the same things done in the focus system. Teleporting, hadouken, it's just that he doesnt have a frame.

The energy in the middle is probably how he is connecting to his prosthetic legs. We dont know how much of Vor was left and how much was robotic.

 

Pretty sure people were saying that he was using a metaphor and didn't mean we were literal energy ghosts. A lot of people don't seem capable of understanding or recognizing when a metaphor is being used.

 

Vor saying we are the energy source of the Warframes is correct(We've always known this). Vor implying that we are energy ghosts is wrong.

 

The discussion with vor was not about energy being but from where the power of the frame comes from.

For a time there were people saying that the powers come from the frame and i was using Vor's word to show there is info that says otherwise.

[AM-Bunny]

The discussion with vor was not about energy being but from where the power of the frame comes from.

For a time there were people saying that the powers come from the frame and i was using Vor's word to show there is info that says otherwise.

 

I don't think anybody's said that ever.

 

The Sergeant sells Warframes left and right. Alad V got his hands on an entire stock of Warframes. If the suits had all the power, everyone in the universe would be as strong as us.

 

That much has always been obvious. 

[Mak_Gohae]

Vor may be ablle to control Warframes with no soma link with Tenno

 

but that dont change the fact that Tenno are flesh and bone creating Void energy on theire own

 

While Vor is pure energy draining hiis life directly in the void thx for his Janus key 'making it so he have have allmost infinite energy suply"

 

Down side : Vor may not be able to leave the void

 

While we Tenno can actually

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

edit: Vor did not quit grineers Queens, he just look stuck in the void

 

Do we know Vor is void energy? We know he is keeping himself together with energy. He was cut in two.

[(PSN)FlyaThanAkitE]

Do we know Vor is void energy? We know he is keeping himself together with energy. He was cut in two.

How was he cut in half?

[Hypernaut1]

Well, we do actually have a body, don't we ?

where does he say tenno dont have a body?

Except....it was a metaphor. People who thought otherwise subscribed to the "tenno are void ghosts" theory, which isn't true in light of recent developments.

Its NOT. Metaphor. The Tenno are the energy that powers the WF. Its exactly what he says.

[SilentMobius]

Its NOT. Metaphor. The Tenno are the energy that powers the WF. Its exactly what he says.

 

Not quite. the omission of 'the source of' does shift the statement somewhat into metaphor. If Vor had said:

 

"Tenno do not control the Warframe's divine energy. The Tenno ARE the source of that energy. "

 

That would be a literally true statement. But the common linguistic affectation of referring to being something en-total when in fact they are just the source is certainly a common metaphorical construct "You are that love", "You are my motivation", etc. The point is that a literal reading implies that Tenno are en-total only energy, but the later reference to the Warframes being "A Glass" illustrated that the whole piece of exposition is poetically and metaphorically constructed.

Edited December 10, 2015 by SilentMobius

[Terrahero]

He is exactly right. I dont know why people doubted it. It wad clear that he knew what he was talking about. Only people in denial came up with the ridiculous "he's just using metaphor" excuse.

 

That the Tenno were the source of the power, and not the suits was as far as i could tell commonly believed. We weren't helpless regular Joe's putting on an Ironman suit, we had the power and it interacted with the suit.

 

What was hotly contested was, WHAT are the Tenno? And of course, WHERE are the Tenno. Vor did not reveal anything about either of these two questions. He did not answer if we are inside the Warframe, or not, just that the power comes from the Tenno and not the suit. Also he did not mention what the Tenno are, pure void energy, infested, normal humans, something else. Now we know, but Vor certainly didn't tell us.

Edited December 10, 2015 by Terrahero

[Mak_Gohae]

He got his bling from the Janus key, and inherently is Void energy itself. Immortal, constantly reforming from the atoms, the undying, the my dialogue extends too far beyond my spawn span.

 

While the Tenno were soaked naked in Void sauce, and still retaining physical traits.

 

He may be using the Key to focus his power like tenno use frames.

 

But, we are not actually "energy". We are beings, shaped in human form, children - although what exactly lies within us had not yet been fully explained.

So, we should not take his words in the litteral sense, unless we want to admit a lore disruption.

Also, how would he know precisely what we really are ? Not even the Stalker did - he thought our frames were mere chunks of metal.

 

I dont think he ever said tenno are energy.

Just that they provide the energy. Which is why im saying he is right, cause that's what it turned out to be.

[Culaio]

I think that answer to what tenno are is pretty complicated, and it depends on what how you look at tenno, for example one of quotes of ordis say's this: "You are Tenno. You are the Operator. Ordis is the Cephalon. Ordis is the ship.", if you think about it  Cephalon(AI) isnt same thing as ship(its like difference between softwere and hardwere), tenno also isnt same thing as operator but operator is one half of tenno(he provides mind and energy), other half being frame(which is body)

 

so Tenno on the battlefield is combination of operator's energy/mind and warframe's body, but the way they show transference process hints that operator's mind and energy are interconnected since they say that transference project's operator's mind on to surrogate body but we see that operator's send in their energy into frame to operate it as we see in quest(and since they dont use frame's power's during that time means, that process was just to control the frame)

 

We must also remember that Operator can project himself on battlefield directly, which is very important since during that time he flies, is invincible(like some kind of energy entity) shots beam of energy, and other stuff. also important is the fact that during that time frame looks exactly as empty as it looks when operator disconnected from it which could mean that operator isnt in the "chair" or WHOLE energy/mind of operator is used to control projected operator.

[Omnimorph]

 

 

We must also remember that Operator can project himself on battlefield directly, which is very important since during that time he flies, is invincible(like some kind of energy entity) shots beam of energy, and other stuff. also important is the fact that during that time frame looks exactly as empty as it looks when operator disconnected from it which could mean that operator isnt in the "chair" or WHOLE energy/mind of operator is used to control projected operator.

 

 

Is he really projecting himself onto the battlefield though?  Or is that just a visual representation of the subjective impression of the Tenno that,for that moment, they no longer feel like they're in the warframe, but feel "Focussed", feel like (what they now know to be) themselves, on the battlefield?

 

In which case if others can see your "Tenno form", then that could be a bit of a slip on DE's part.

 

OTOH, Void is "magic" and we can create forms like stone men, etc., etc., so maybe it is some kind of actual projection - if the energy can be projected into the frame (and manifest as fire, ice, etc.) as well as the Tenno's consciousness being transferred, then an "energy form" can emanate from the warframe, or heck, even the whole warframe can suddenly be warped into that energy being.

Edited December 12, 2015 by Omnimorph

[Culaio]

Is he really projecting himself onto the battlefield though?  Or is that just a visual representation of the subjective impression of the Tenno that,for that moment, they no longer feel like they're in the warframe, but feel "Focussed", feel like (what they now know to be) themselves, on the battlefield?

 

In which case if others can see your "Tenno form", then that could be a bit of a slip on DE's part.

 

OTOH, Void is "magic" and we can create forms like stone men, etc., etc., so maybe it is some kind of actual projection - if the energy can be projected into the frame (and manifest as fire, ice, etc.) as well as the Tenno's consciousness being transferred, then an "energy form" can emanate from the warframe, or heck, even the whole warframe can suddenly be warped into that energy being.

 

That is indeed a possibility but I think that there are few things that kinda hint against it:

1)Why our frame falls down when we control "operator", if your theory was correct it would make more sense if frame turned into shape of operator. Of course it could be explained as some kind of visual representation of us becoming something more then just tenno controling frame.

2)why the way we move as operator is different then when we move as frame, operator slowly floating is different then frames VERY agile movement. This also could be explained as visual represenation of becoming more then oprerator controlling frame but that would be kinda stupid since it would mean that what player see's in game is VERY different then what is really happening and would break immersion very much.

3)This one is most important reason why I think your theory is incorrect, why frames abilties change when we control operator ? its important because as vor said in one of his lines("Each Warframe you control is merely a glass shaping your furious light."), frames work like prism, filtering pure Void energy of operator's into the various powers. Gameplay itself confirms it as we see with the fact that each frame is limited to powers related to its theme(fire, ice, earth and so on) Because of that it shouldnt be possible for frames to use pure void energy as operator's can which means that its impossible for it to be visual representation .

[5H4DE]

Keep in mind our Warframes also limit our power . Without it we're way too powerful to control ourselves and this is why we need the Warframes to control it . Vor is nothing compared to a Tenno's true power . Even with our focus we are still being limited by the warframes as we dont go there ourselves but we merely project our image on the battlefield .