Basic (Non Prime) Frames Should be Guaranteed

[BlackCoMerc]

Once upon a time, the obtaining of basic, Non-Prime frames probably needed an RNG element to keep players around.

Those times, have passed.

Warframe does not lack for things for which players can grind. What it DOES lack, are missions offering GUARANTEED rewards.

It's time each planet on the star map offered a guaranteed frame, ready to equip and use, with the defeat of the boss on that planet. Or at least, the BP and all the parts.

Why:

I won't kid. Four kids in my extended family started playing recently on PS4. Two quit in the first two weeks. They felt like they couldn't progress without throwing money at Potatoes and other necessary items for mid game and beyond, and, well, being kids, they don't have it to spend.

The other two kids are frustrated. They want Rhino, and have run the mission a dozen times without getting all four parts. They're bored and talking about moving to Destiny 2, since that's where their friends are, because it offers lots of loot without all the waiting.

Times change. People change.

I think it's time Warframe confronts the fact that not every item in the game needs to be hidden behind RNG grind walls.

[Kurokoz]

All four parts? BP is in the market, I hope they were not trying to farm the BP ._.
I also farmed like 5 frames with a friend the other day so he could finish having all of the Warframes. Took like maybe an hour for all 5.

[BlackCoMerc]

5 minutes ago, Kurokoz said:

All four parts? BP is in the market, I hope they were not trying to farm the BP ._.
I also farmed like 5 frames with a friend the other day so he could finish having all of the Warframes. Took like maybe an hour for all 5.

Twelve runs, can't get helmet (neuroptics). Got everything else. Though beating the boss and getting the parts, and still needing to BUY the BP felt so, so anti climatic it was infuriating to me. They feel the same.

Honestly I get that free to play games capitalize on frustration and paying to get around it. But they're kids; they don't have monthly disposable income.

They will quit, get Destiny 2 for the holidays and play it instead. As will, I suspect, a whole lot of other frustrated young players.

[Jicematoro]

You do realise Warframe is an M Rated game not meant to be played by children, right?

Edit: Let's also not forget, If you want something immediately, that's what Platinum's for, The minor nuisance of farming all parts is part of the price for getting the Frame.

Edited September 21, 2017 by Jicematoro

[Kurokoz]

They're just getting wrecked by RNGesus. Although, I would agree that kids would not have a good time accomplishing things in this game. The best way to get around the frustration is how easy it is to obtain things you can sell in trade chat. Not a lot of people are very good at trading though so understandably the platinum is hard to get..

[(PSN)Shaun-T-Wilson]

Play conclave theres pre built frames in conclave rep.

[NightBlitz]

so basically, because kids these days feel they need to get everything immediately, DE should make it so you only need one run to get all parts??  if they can't deal with farming for a basic frame that early, they wouldn't last long anyways

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

Just now, NightBlitz said:

so basically, because kids these days feel they need to get everything immediately, DE should make it so you only need one run to get all parts??  if they can't deal with farming for a basic frame that early, they wouldn't last long anyways

entitled mentalities as of late 

[Fiftycentis]

Fiftycentis thinks of how many time he rekted Tyl Regor for Equinox, then start thinking about Mesa farming.

Having problems on farming rhino makes me laugh honestly. If you get burned trying to farm rhino, well... warframe it's not the game for you

[Ultimate_Vault_Hunter]

3 minutes ago, Fiftycentis said:

Fiftycentis thinks of how many time he rekted Tyl Regor for Equinox, then start thinking about Mesa farming.

Having problems on farming rhino makes me laugh honestly. If you get burned trying to farm rhino, well... warframe it's not the game for you

When he came out, my little brother farmed him for over a month to get the helmet. I got him in five or six runs, haha.

[BlackCoMerc]

3 minutes ago, Fiftycentis said:

Fiftycentis thinks of how many time he rekted Tyl Regor for Equinox, then start thinking about Mesa farming.

Having problems on farming rhino makes me laugh honestly. If you get burned trying to farm rhino, well... warframe it's not the game for you

A Sentiment that, if everyone told this Actually adhered to, would by now have driven off more players than the game can afford to lose.

Sigh.

Defend the grind, then. Sure. Why not. Makes you feel like you're accomplishing something, I guess.

But not everyone agrees. And that is costing Warframe potentially a lot of players.

[Fiftycentis]

1 minute ago, Ultimate_Vault_Hunter said:

When he came out, my little brother farmed him for over a month to get the helmet. I got him in five or six runs, haha.

people are bored for harrow systems farming, my friend got it at the second rotation C

[13QZXXTTX]

@BlackCoMerc Don't bring Children into WarFrame yet, not even, don't let them touch CoD, it would ruin their Potential.

Let them try to play, but teach them it not OK for some stuff. If they want to "Experience" the Pain, let them do so.

 

o.o There are many Funs Games out there engage the Minds of Children. And some day your Children might try WarFrame again like in the Year 2020+. 

I remember taking randoms Newbies farming Frosts, RNG won't change by tonight, that "New Player Learning Curve".

 

@BlackCoMerc

 If you want "Guaranteed", tell your Children to try out the Zelda's Series (Original). If you want to start Building Game, I think MineCraft (on Safe Mode) would be Good Start. o.o Honestly, you have to let them decide for themselves, if they even want to touch "Grown-Up" Game.

[NightmareT12]

Once upon a time Warframe parts were not even a guaranteed drop of a boss. Then they became guaranteed end of mission rewards.

Never forget that time I had to purchase Volt because the J-3 Golem was practically bullying me lol. Good times.

[BlackCoMerc]

20 minutes ago, Jicematoro said:

You do realise Warframe is an M Rated game not meant to be played by children, right?

Edit: Let's also not forget, If you want something immediately, that's what Platinum's for, The minor nuisance of farming all parts is part of the price for getting the Frame.

These children are 16+

15 minutes ago, (PS4)Shaun-T-Wilson said:

Play conclave theres pre built frames in conclave rep.

They don't enjoy Conclave, though they did try it.

[Fiftycentis]

2 minutes ago, BlackCoMerc said:

Defend the grind, then. Sure. Why not. Makes you feel like you're accomplishing something, I guess.

i'm not "defending the grind", because i agree that sometimes grind in warframe is too much, but that's not the case with rhino, nor with other boss dropped warframe. Try to farm for scimitar, broken-war parts, the old limbo quest; those can be considered bad grind example

[BlackCoMerc]

6 minutes ago, DesFrSpace said:

@BlackCoMerc Don't bring Children into WarFrame yet, not even, don't let them touch CoD, it would ruin their Potential.

Let them try to play, but teach them it not OK for some stuff. If they want to "Experience" the Pain, let them do so.

 

o.o There are many Funs Games out there engage the Minds of Children. And some day your Children might try WarFrame again like in the Year 2020+. 

I remember taking randoms Newbies farming Frosts, RNG won't change by tonight, that "New Player Learning Curve".

 

@BlackCoMerc

 If you want "Guaranteed", tell your Children to try out the Zelda's Series (Original). If you want to start Building Game, I think MineCraft (on Safe Mode) would be Good Start. o.o Honestly, you have to let them decide for themselves, if they even want to touch "Grown-Up" Game.

Well...they aren't my kids, but yeah, we atold them not all games are like this. That plenty of other games reward you for playing.

Honestly, their frustration with the game makes me uncomfortable playing it to some degree myself now.

They do love Minecraft. And, for some reason, Skyrim and Horizon: Zero Dawn.

They also want Destiny 2 for Christmas.

Edited September 21, 2017 by BlackCoMerc

[xXRampantXx]

6 minutes ago, NightBlitz said:

If they can't deal with farming for a basic frame that early, they wouldn't last long anyways

 

2 minutes ago, Fiftycentis said:

Having problems on farming rhino makes me laugh honestly. If you get burned trying to farm rhino, well... warframe it's not the game for you

As much as I hate to say it, these guys are right.  Warframe is all about grind, and if you don't like the grind, Warframe isn't the game for you.  If someone can't deal with farming Rhino they probably won't even make it halfway through the starmap unless they get help from some generous veteran player giving them stuff.  I won't deny that some aspects of the grind might need fine-tuning, but it won't (and shouldn't) go away.

[Ultimate_Vault_Hunter]

Just now, BlackCoMerc said:

Well...they aren't my kids, but yeah, we atold them not all games are like this. That plenty of other games reward you for playing.

Honestly, their frustration with the game makes me uncomfortable playing it to some degree myself now.

Just don't focus on the grind

[MagPrime]

It would be nice if there was a mechanic that guaranteed to give you the part you're missing after your 12th run or something.

I mean, on one hand we can't cut out the grind entirely, it's a faucet if all games these days and even in the older games (it was just hidden better), but at the same time, we don't need to rely on horrible RNG for player rentiontion anymore.

It would be nice to find a balance.

 

[Latiac]

That's RNG for you - You ARE guaranteed a part as an end of mission reward every time you fight the boss.

If they want to move to Destiny 2, that's their choice to make - if they are considering quitting the game because they can't farm Rhino then they probably aren't fully invested in it? (Maybe they are who knows, but Rhino REALLY isn't that hard to farm, the mission is Trivial at best and there are always people running a node that early in the starchart for team play - the parts are on a 1/3 drop chance) it just seems like a case of bad luck, we all get it in games, I spent 7 missions getting Ivara, but others done upwards of 30.

 

I get what you mean, but that would essentially make the game incredibly Trivial, Guarantee a frame at the end of every boss fight? DE looses a large amount of money, players don't really feel like they've achieved something either. it's a loss/loss scenario.

Edited September 21, 2017 by Latiac

[BlackCoMerc]

Just now, xXRampantXx said:

 

As much as I hate to say it, these guys are right.  Warframe is all about grind, and if you don't like the grind, Warframe isn't the game for you.  If someone can't deal with farming Rhino they probably won't even make it halfway through the starmap unless they get help from some generous veteran player giving them stuff.  I won't deny that some aspects of the grind might need fine-tuning, but it won't (and shouldn't) go away.

I don't actually disagree. And I've warned them, too: it only get worse. The cousins who quit two weeks in said the same: if it's this bad now, I'm never going to enjoy it.

That said, I think DE should consider a look at just how much RNG grind they NEED, versus how much they could, conceivably, get away with. There's room now to dial it back a bit.

[BlackCoMerc]

1 minute ago, MagPrime said:

It would be nice if there was a mechanic that guaranteed to give you the part you're missing after your 12th run or something.

I mean, on one hand we can't cut out the grind entirely, it's a faucet if all games these days and even in the older games (it was just hidden better), but at the same time, we don't need to rely on horrible RNG for player rentiontion anymore.

It would be nice to find a balance.

 

Exactly. And that's what I am advocating here: Balance.

Grind will need to stay. I get that. But does it need to be so prevalent that even basic frames are ALL hidden it?

[Jicematoro]

8 minutes ago, BlackCoMerc said:

These children are 16+

And they cannot stand the grind? Let them go mate, they do not have what it takes to play Warframe, this game is GRIND PERSONIFIED.

Also, yes, we defend the grind, because that's what this game is. The point of Platinum is to skip the grind and get what you want.

If these kids can't stand the Grind or buy platinum, they're not potential players, heck, they're no better than bot accounts.

Edited September 21, 2017 by Jicematoro

[Latiac]

Just now, Jicematoro said:

And they cannot stand the grind? Let them go mate, they do not have what it takes to play Warframe, this game is GRIND PERSONIFIED.

Also, yes, we defend the grind, because that's what this game is. The point of Platinum is to get stop fast, jump through then hoops and get what you want.

If these kids can't stand the Grind or buy platinum, they're not potential players, heck, they're no better than bot accounts.

 

The grind is what the game is, we enjoy it and the game caters to that audience, the same way Borderlands caters to the audience with it's grindy loot system.

In all fairness you can even 'grind' platinum with relative ease.

But I agree, it's alright for people to dip in to play the game, but if they start to think the grind is tough before aquiring the first warframe then they probably wouldn't enjoy the rest of the game.

I know some games do like to hand things to you on a silver plate, and that's alright to do occasionally, (Junctions somewhat do this to help newer players?) but to give away frames like that? that somewhat defeats the whole purpose.