[Console] Operation: Plague Star!

[SsvenN]

17 hours ago, Stoner74 said:

I fail to see how it can be unfair. If you have lower members than other clans, it's literally your problem, not the others. 

Most of the clans are made for the people who you know irl/ have fun to play just for the friendly meanings. Why they should bother on this one to be fairly active and invite people they don't like/not enjoying to play with, and all those, who just willing to copy bp's and didn't even tried to achieve by themself in any meanings?

22 hours ago, Stoner74 said:

Edit: I actually forgot how PD worked. Ignis Wraith was not locked behind 10% of the best clans. Only the BP was and it was an extra added reward. You obtained the weapon as is like any other events. 

It's not about the bp itself. It's about the exclusive rewards closed to it. I've tryharded there as much as i could get from the recruit squad to make it aviable for my clanmates copy the bp even if they're now had lost the interest in game atm. They will return in a while and will get this one as it means. But many and many of the others - don't. Like yeah, do it for the clans but only for a month, and later give the opportunity to each clan research it. Even if it will be some kind of Hema's requiered amount of resources ( not the best thing to place for but still it's fine for me). The main point - let it be aviable for everyone.

22 hours ago, --RV--Ne_NobodyDS said:

"the majority of the ones asking for a leaderboard" refers to....the majority of the ones asking for a leaderboard...right here... No one claimed that's the will of the majority of the whole WF playerbase... pretty unambiguous

Placing yourself agains't the overall opinion not a great deal here, mate. Like why your opinion should be valued more? I've also started this game at a times when it was just released and still don't count myself toward the veterans neither the greatest players, yet my opinion should count as one. One of many and valued just the same way. We've got here like 14 pages and 25 posts / excluding the good bunch of half posts just for the meaning of the same people answering twice/etc, so it's just 150 people here got their point, and the amount of people who's not - way and way much more. Let's say we're gathering the party, and only 150 of us knew about this one is came. And we were asked about * do you like it how it goes? r'u willing to leave things like this all the way ahead?* And what about other douzens and douzens of thousands people who's not invited? They're support this game as much as you and i do, and i'm sure even more. So how could you even say * majority here*. Like the others are not existing for you.

20 hours ago, --RV--Jax said:

An exclusive reward provided to top tier participants (does not have to be tied to an MR gain, and can definitely be cosmetic) would be a motivator for some people to push harder during events.

And will be a even greater downside for even much more people who left behind those rewards. Doing ecxlusive stuff will remove someone's else will to play just because they're yet not good enough but still willing to achieve all the achieveble stuff, and closing eyes on their will it's like, i don't know, sounds pretty bad for me. At least it would push me away for sure at some point like viewing over and over to get from those rewards out. ( plus someone down there was talking about exclusive mods, which sounds even weirder like giving someone much greater values on frames/stuff ( and even way much weirder idea to give the single and only one umbras)).

[--RV--Ne_NobodyDS]

6 minutes ago, SsvenN said:

Placing yourself agains't the overall opinion not a great deal here, mate. Like why your opinion should be valued more? I've also started this game at a times when it was just released and still don't count myself toward the veterans neither the greatest players, yet my opinion should count as one. One of many and valued just the same way. We've got here like 14 pages and 25 posts / excluding the good bunch of half posts just for the meaning of the same people answering twice/etc, so it's just 150 people here got their point, and the amount of people who's not - way and way much more. Let's say we're gathering the party, and only 150 of us knew about this one is came. And we were asked about * do you like it how it goes? r'u willing to leave things like this all the way ahead?* And what about other douzens and douzens of thousands people who's not invited? They're support this game as much as you and i do, and i'm sure even more. So how could you even say * majority here*. Like the others are not existing for you.

i already tried to clarify that i'm not talking about the majority of the whole WF playerbase, but just about the "Majority of players actually asking for a leaderboards right here", you even quoted me saying this exactly same thing...so not a single of your points here is valid, you're fighting against your own thought, not even replying to a single one of my arguments. I've never claimed to speak for the whole community, neither ever tried valuing my opinion more...i can read, and what i read from the 99% of the posts in favor of a leaderboard are saying the same thing over and over.

And again, seems like no one still got what's being said, even with multiples attempts to repeat the same line of text, so i'll try typing it again in a simple, short, sentence:

We DON'T want any single exclusive item, mod, weapon, frame, arcane or reward. END.

We're asking for a leaderboard, and this being said multiple times, isn't going to affect your gameplay at all, not in a single way or occurrence... who's opposing to this, is just trying to prive the ones who cares, of a content that we enjoy and have fun to play, for the sake of the competitivity itself

Tell me how, exaclty, having a leaderboard, can harm your gameplay, or anyone else gameplay... if you do not partecipate on it cause you're uninterested about the leaderboards, you will still be able to enjoy 100% of the operation contents, you won't lose or be deprived of anything at all. Do it, tell me this, and i'll stop asking for a leaderboard. So far, the only attempt to provide an answer about this was:

1:"Focusing on leaderboards is a waste, use the time to create more contents"

Leaderboards alredy exist, there's nothing new to create to make this happen

2"Leaderboards = Toxic" , and i won't even try to make any comment about something poorly argued like this

[SsvenN]

2 minutes ago, --RV--Ne_NobodyDS said:

i already tried to clarify that i'm not talking about the majority of the whole WF playerbase, but just about the "Majority of players actually asking for a leaderboards right here", you even quoted me saying this exactly same thing...so not a single of your points here is valid, you're fighting against your own thought, not even replying to a single one of my arguments. I've never claimed to speak for the whole community, neither ever tried valuing my opinion more...i can read, and what i read from the 99% of the posts in favor of a leaderboard are saying the same thing over and over.

Well, you also missed my point here, and i've answered this one few pages ago:

23 hours ago, SsvenN said:

If there will be more things like PD event, it seem's like a reason for me. Like i've already told ya, people get kicked just for the #competitive_spirit. If the future rewards will be not locked by any means of the top leaderbords it will do fine for me, but if not - you know my point here.

Now more and more people are starting to ask exclusive rewards in this topic, which is a big issue for me, you can reread and see it by yourself. I just hope this will be fair enough for the general majority of people to enjoy this game and play the way they're like it, and not putting in some unfair conditions with clans.

[Stoner]

42 minutes ago, SsvenN said:

Most of the clans are made for the people who you know irl/ have fun to play just for the friendly meanings. Why they should bother on this one to be fairly active and invite people they don't like/not enjoying to play with, and all those, who just willing to copy bp's and didn't even tried to achieve by themself in any meanings?

Then reduce your clan tier.

 

43 minutes ago, SsvenN said:

The main point - let it be aviable for everyone.

It WAS available for everyone. If you missed the event, well its too bad for you. People should be happy at least there is a BP so there is always a way to acquire Ignis Wraith even after the event is over... And ask most people that were top 10% and they'll give you a BP for free. Supra Vandal was locked behind Ambulas Reborn and you simply can't get it anymore. Yet, I don't see you talk about it. 

 

46 minutes ago, SsvenN said:

And will be a even greater downside for even much more people who left behind those rewards. Doing ecxlusive stuff will remove someone's else will to play just because they're yet not good enough but still willing to achieve all the achieveble stuff, and closing eyes on their will it's like, i don't know, sounds pretty bad for me. At least it would push me away for sure at some point like viewing over and over to get from those rewards out. ( plus someone down there was talking about exclusive mods, which sounds even weirder like giving someone much greater values on frames/stuff ( and even way much weirder idea to give the single and only one umbras)).

"Ahhhhh! I need to work to get something. What am I gonna do?"

Seriously mate, saying a simple exclusive emblem for leaderboards will push you away from this game is... I mean come on. You can't be serious. I would understand if it was a mod like previously mentioned, THAT is a pretty terrible idea imo. But a cosmetic? lmao...

[SsvenN]

12 minutes ago, Stoner74 said:

"Ahhhhh! I need to work to get something. What am I gonna do?"

Saying stuff in this ways won't give you any credits. Being rude is your way to clear things out?

 If got anything valued to tell - let me know, if not - we're done here. But doing exclusive rewards will pull out many people out just as i've mentioned before. The entry threshold in warframe is kinda huge and newcomers will always leaved behind. That's said.

Edited November 12, 2017 by SsvenN
thought it was the other one

[f0ba]

Please do it as early as possible, thanks giving week can't play T_T

[Stoner]

22 minutes ago, SsvenN said:

Saying stuff in this ways won't give you any credits. Being rude is your way to clear things out?

 If got anything valued to tell - let me know, if not - we're done here. But doing exclusive rewards will pull out many people out just as i've mentioned before. The entry threshold in warframe is kinda huge and newcomers will always leaved behind. That's said.

Yea so, giving a reward like an emblem to those who competed on the LBs will pull out many people... Please explain how. It won't affect your gameplay. It will just show others you were there and you competed when it was time. Again, I fail to see how this can lead to people leaving the game.. ?

That might have been rude, my bad. The way you worded it just sounded like you dont like working for something you want. 

[--RV--Jax]

1 hour ago, SsvenN said:

And will be a even greater downside for even much more people who left behind those rewards. Doing ecxlusive stuff will remove someone's else will to play just because they're yet not good enough but still willing to achieve all the achieveble stuff, and closing eyes on their will it's like, i don't know, sounds pretty bad for me. At least it would push me away for sure at some point like viewing over and over to get from those rewards out. ( plus someone down there was talking about exclusive mods, which sounds even weirder like giving someone much greater values on frames/stuff ( and even way much weirder idea to give the single and only one umbras)).

Thank you SsvenN for your counter viewpoint. I can appreciate that for some having an item in game that they did not get, or can not get, is frustrating. Do you have Excalibur Prime, Lato Prime, Skana Prime, Braton Vandal, Primed Chamber, Supra Vandal, all of the Dex items, and Mara Detron? I do not have these items and some of them I will never be able to get because I did not know about this game until July 2017. It is not Digital Extreme's fault I do not have these items, it is not your fault, and it is not the fault of clans that find ways to maximize their rewards during events. If not having these rewards deters you from playing a very enjoyable game, then I have to assume you don't currently play the game or that you have all of the exclusive items in game and are hypocritical saying you don't think there should be those types of items in game when you have them. 

My point in making my original post was only to say that a reward system with challenges that aren't just handed out to everyone for showing up is not a bad thing, and is more realistic in gaming and in real life situations. Almost every game I have ever enjoyed has had a reward for top tier players. For some, the grind, effort, and skill required to get the reward is what drives them to play harder. For others it can be very frustrating when you feel you gave it  all you had and fell short, I understand that. Again, its not the developers fault or the fault of other players if you're unable to achieve a reward that required effort to get. For real, I do appreciate your viewpoint, and thank you for the thoughts you have put into this forum. We may not agree on things, but your opinion is just as valid as mine. Thank you.

[SsvenN]

1 minute ago, Stoner74 said:

The way you worded it just sounded like you dont like working for something you want. 

It's not, and bp for my clan is a proof of this one. And yeah, reducing the clan size is a rude thing to all the newcomers to be said. That's the reason people can't have just some fun without any need to do that much efforts and enjoy it with friends.

 

2 minutes ago, Stoner74 said:

Yea so, giving a reward like an emblem to those who competed on the LBs will pull out many people...

On those rewards i don't mind, but i do for exclusive right on other stuff. Still there's many who not give but sell the opportunity to achieve the ignis. Feel's bad for the ambulas, i was needed to work there for some extra currency which i value abit more, and sad tho it's not achieveble anymore, but it's not like with excal, and i appreciate DE for this one not going into the overall aviability, it's the way to being appreciated by the DE in it's own way for all the support they've recieved and all the believe in their child to be what's it exactly now. But things like ignis bp shouldn't exist in their way like they do. That's the thing i'm trying to say. Like what would change the opportunity to reveal the aviability to small calns recieve it's bp in research list after a one or even few months? it won't affect the overall meanings, but will help those small clans to be what they're now - fun and enjoyable place to stay in. There's many small players. They can't put many time but still having some fun, so why they should be left over the rewards?

[SsvenN]

4 minutes ago, --RV--Jax said:

Do you have Excalibur Prime, Lato Prime, Skana Prime, Braton Vandal, Primed Chamber, Supra Vandal, all of the Dex items, and Mara Detron? I do not have these items and some of them I will never be able to get because I did not know about this game until July 2017.

You can see my progress anytime ingame, just by doing /profile thing. I also don't have many of those things but i'm talking now on a different stuff, and exactly the ignis bp, which was just only for high tier clan to achieveble. Do the small stuff which will not affect gameplay as rewards in any meanings for clans - sure. About excal - even if i don't have one - i'm proud for de not giving this to overall handing. For the other stuff, as if you mentioned there - it's our problem for missing the events, but i'm willing to give the small/solo clans the opportunity to live, and not to being closed by the overall racing stuff. It was awfull to see the cleanings after the PD events. Even if i'm working i can't tell i'm not pressing my efforts in this game to achieve stuff, but newcomers just in some ways can't participate for the tier 10% rewards. Just hope this point could be get by the general population of this topic. ( they can't and i'm sure don't use the forums ( so was i to some point)). So they even can't stand for their small willings here. And yeah, each point should be valued on the same purposes as your or mine, and hope i don't be needed to arguing on those, it's silly and won't change anything at all. So also ty for the answer.

[Alcoholism]

1 hour ago, --RV--Ne_NobodyDS said:

Tell me how, exaclty, having a leaderboard, can harm your gameplay, or anyone else gameplay...

The leaderboards were constantly being exploited via the use of bugs/glitches which caused a lot of drama throughout the community during operations. Not only that, but the game's image was not looking too good as a competitive game where the top competitors were using those bugs/glitches to make short easy work of a supposedly tough event. As a matter of fact, I was in the alliance teamspeak for the last operation and I was getting wind of drama from plenty of clans (I'm from Orion, allied with V btw). There were quite a lot of clans who were having issues with certain members. For example, members not putting in enough effort, high ranking officers who did nothing, and also normal ranked members who are going above and beyond but not being rewarded for it. I won't explain why these situations occurred, just that I got wind it happened. On top of that you got drama and toxicity between clans on the forums, the reddit and where ever else it applies due to the aforementioned scenarios.

Long story short, it has a negative impact on the game's image. If the top clans from previous events told DE straight away about the bugs and glitches instead of using them, then this most likely would not have been the result. The moment I found out about the exploit last operation it was patched the next day. The two operations prior to that I only found those exploits towards the end of the event, where it was eventually patched; it was too late, the damage was done. Although last operation when the main exploit was patched, the points players received from it were also removed, there were still smaller exploits that could not be completely narrowed down until the very end.

Perhaps no one really remembers, but I remember the exploits of Rathuum, Pacifism Defect and Ambulas Reborn. Those past 3 operations really created rifts and divisions between players, clans and alliances. Perhaps those who weren't apart of these scenarios will not see it this way, that's fair enough. But from my experience, leaderboards caused quite a few problems. I'm sure once DE have found a better formula for the leaderboards they'll return, as I also do not want them to go. But for now, they need to be gone until these problems can be better avoided.

[Braken]

1 hour ago, --RV--Jax said:

Thank you SsvenN for your counter viewpoint. I can appreciate that for some having an item in game that they did not get, or can not get, is frustrating. Do you have Excalibur Prime, Lato Prime, Skana Prime, Braton Vandal, Primed Chamber, Supra Vandal, all of the Dex items, and Mara Detron? I do not have these items and some of them I will never be able to get because I did not know about this game until July 2017. It is not Digital Extreme's fault I do not have these items, it is not your fault, and it is not the fault of clans that find ways to maximize their rewards during events. If not having these rewards deters you from playing a very enjoyable game, then I have to assume you don't currently play the game or that you have all of the exclusive items in game and are hypocritical saying you don't think there should be those types of items in game when you have them. 

My point in making my original post was only to say that a reward system with challenges that aren't just handed out to everyone for showing up is not a bad thing, and is more realistic in gaming and in real life situations. Almost every game I have ever enjoyed has had a reward for top tier players. For some, the grind, effort, and skill required to get the reward is what drives them to play harder. For others it can be very frustrating when you feel you gave it  all you had and fell short, I understand that. Again, its not the developers fault or the fault of other players if you're unable to achieve a reward that required effort to get. For real, I do appreciate your viewpoint, and thank you for the thoughts you have put into this forum. We may not agree on things, but your opinion is just as valid as mine. Thank you.

The Dex items are re-released every anniversary, along with a new one. So bad example there. And the Braton Vandal is supposed to be available through the upcoming relay rebuilding event. The Mara Detron also has a chance to show up each time Baro comes around.

Also, none of those were tied in with event performance the first time they came around.

People aren't saying there should be no rewards for challenges, just that any leaderboard/clan performance-based rewards should be purely cosmetic.

 

P.S. Best not to mention the Founder's Primes, as discussions about those tend to get rather... heated. I will say I'm entirely for them becoming available to the public, though. But that's all I'll say about them.

Edited November 12, 2017 by Braken

[--RV--Jax]

19 minutes ago, Alcoholism said:

The leaderboards were constantly being exploited via the use of bugs/glitches which caused a lot of drama throughout the community during operations. Not only that, but the game's image was not looking too good as a competitive game where the top competitors were using those bugs/glitches to make short easy work of a supposedly tough event. As a matter of fact, I was in the alliance teamspeak for the last operation and I was getting wind of drama from plenty of clans (I'm from Orion, allied with V btw). There were quite a lot of clans who were having issues with certain members. For example, members not putting in enough effort, high ranking officers who did nothing, and also normal ranked members who are going above and beyond but not being rewarded for it. I won't explain why these situations occurred, just that I got wind it happened. On top of that you got drama and toxicity between clans on the forums, the reddit and where ever else it applies due to the aforementioned scenarios.

Long story short, it has a negative impact on the game's image. If the top clans from previous events told DE straight away about the bugs and glitches instead of using them, then this most likely would not have been the result. The moment I found out about the exploit last operation it was patched the next day. The two operations prior to that I only found those exploits towards the end of the event, where it was eventually patched; it was too late, the damage was done. Although last operation when the main exploit was patched, the points players received from it were also removed, there were still smaller exploits that could not be completely narrowed down until the very end.

Perhaps no one really remembers, but I remember the exploits of Rathuum, Pacifism Defect and Ambulas Reborn. Those past 3 operations really created rifts and divisions between players, clans and alliances. Perhaps those who weren't apart of these scenarios will not see it this way, that's fair enough. But from my experience, leaderboards caused quite a few problems. I'm sure once DE have found a better formula for the leaderboards they'll return, as I also do not want them to go. But for now, they need to be gone until these problems can be better avoided.

You're placing blame on the wrong thing. A leaderboard only shows the "ranking" in a numerical order. The problem isn't the leaderboard in the scenario you bring up, the problem is the dishonest play-style of players violating terms of service to exploit a reward not intended by the developers of the game. you're justifiably upset that other people found ways to get around intended gaming mechanics to score better during an event, but this isn't the leaderboards fault. the only thing the leaderboard did in this scenario was report the point totals gained, or show who was able to score more points than others. If anything the leaderboard helped the developers, who can track what should be possible and what can be acquired through following proper mechanics and compare those metrics to what is actually being recorded and find out who is exploiting an in-game bug. 

Unfortunately dishonest people exist in the world, I'm sorry to disappoint you with this information, but its true. Additionally, games are not often released with perfect coding. Bugs exist in games because of the complexity of the design. A feature may be added which ends up adversely effecting another. This is why software engineers are important in design studios. The developers have asked (required) that whenever bugs are found in the game they designed that they be reported as accurately as possible. That way they can review the coding associated, and fix it as fast as they are able so that fair game play continues to exist and the features they build work as intended. If as a player you notice an "unintended feature" and use this to exploit a reward, you are a cheater and part of the problem. The leaderboard's roll in this is only to show the rest of the player-base and developers that you have obtained a certain score. If you scored unnaturally high because of an exploit, the developers can punish you accordingly (if they choose to do so). Again, your concern is valid, but blame is misplaced. Please don't blame the tool that helps capture cheaters as the source of the problem when the problem is the player that cheats.

[Vidopnir]

I hope we get the release in a timely manner, namely the 13th

Edited November 12, 2017 by Vidopnir

[--RV--Ne_NobodyDS]

1 minute ago, Vidopnir said:

Them cheaters didn't do anything wrong and bugs exist to be exploited, am I right my dude? Why have the power if you don't abuse it, right?

Seriously, you shilling for exploiters and the other RV guy saying theres no toxicity in the leaderboards really makes me think youve been dipping in some of these referenced pools.

You probably need to read again his post

 

18 minutes ago, --RV--Jax said:

the problem is the dishonest play-style of players violating terms of service to exploit a reward not intended by the developers of the game

with a long, calm, breath

[---RV---Maniac]

1 hour ago, Alcoholism said:

The leaderboards were constantly being exploited via the use of bugs/glitches which caused a lot of drama throughout the community during operations. Not only that, but the game's image was not looking too good as a competitive game where the top competitors were using those bugs/glitches to make short easy work of a supposedly tough event. As a matter of fact, I was in the alliance teamspeak for the last operation and I was getting wind of drama from plenty of clans (I'm from Orion, allied with V btw). There were quite a lot of clans who were having issues with certain members. For example, members not putting in enough effort, high ranking officers who did nothing, and also normal ranked members who are going above and beyond but not being rewarded for it. I won't explain why these situations occurred, just that I got wind it happened. On top of that you got drama and toxicity between clans on the forums, the reddit and where ever else it applies due to the aforementioned scenarios.

Long story short, it has a negative impact on the game's image. If the top clans from previous events told DE straight away about the bugs and glitches instead of using them, then this most likely would not have been the result. The moment I found out about the exploit last operation it was patched the next day. The two operations prior to that I only found those exploits towards the end of the event, where it was eventually patched; it was too late, the damage was done. Although last operation when the main exploit was patched, the points players received from it were also removed, there were still smaller exploits that could not be completely narrowed down until the very end.

Perhaps no one really remembers, but I remember the exploits of Rathuum, Pacifism Defect and Ambulas Reborn. Those past 3 operations really created rifts and divisions between players, clans and alliances. Perhaps those who weren't apart of these scenarios will not see it this way, that's fair enough. But from my experience, leaderboards caused quite a few problems. I'm sure once DE have found a better formula for the leaderboards they'll return, as I also do not want them to go. But for now, they need to be gone until these problems can be better avoided.

The glitched runs were rightfully removed from game. And had no effect on leaderboards.

We won that event as clan fairly, there's no dispute in that. People still acuse us over things other people did but that's just lies - and that's what causes the drama, pointless and fake acusations repeated over and over again. Along with the people saying we want special gear for geting in the leaderboards or somehow the way I run my clan affects everyone else.

Also competitive clans run things competitively, if you don't wana run it like that, then don't. We force participation on every member cuz that's how we run things. Why should people be upset over how we run things? 

If DE bans users that willingly glitch on events, it will help fixing the exploitation part and make people think twice about even trying it.

Removing the thing we have been expecting for several months, it's just not right.

Edited November 12, 2017 by ---RV---Maniac

[leadwolf1]

I think myself and probably DE is tire of the back and forth of this nonsense, Because I try to read and see everybody's point. SO if this whole thing is about a leaders board then great a leaders board does no wrong in the game to me, I have a very small clan 10 players to be exact. I do not see anything wrong with a trophy for the clan dojo. I once had said that I did not see anything wrong with a emblem or Sedona, however after reading and how petty the top so called competitive clans have been arguing , I think they feel like they have to have something special other then what I have mentioned to wear so they can say look at me and the clan I am in. OR to them it is not a competition. and not worth their time , so , I now for my last major post say to you the same thing that you have been saying. if you do not feel it is worth your time if you do not have a leader board and a great exclusive award other than my top mentioned then fine you do not have to participate, do not play that event, , this seems to be the same thing you want to tell everyone else. DE it is up to you, but apparently no matter what anyone else says they are ok with the so called competitive clans still want more. And if the clans do not want more//// then just as when you tell them they have to do so much per event then tell then enough is enough . SO DE GETS THE LAST SAY ANYWAY

[--RV--Jax]

3 minutes ago, leadwolf1 said:

SO if this whole thing is about a leaders board then great a leaders board does no wrong in the game to me, I have a very small clan 10 players to be exact. I do not see anything wrong with a trophy for the clan dojo.

I once had said that I did not see anything wrong with a emblem or Sedona, however after reading and how petty the top so called competitive clans have been arguing , I think they feel like they have to have something special other then what I have mentioned to wear so they can say look at me and the clan I am in. OR to them it is not a competition. 

I have taken the liberty to separate what I think are the 2 topics you're trying to contribute to. If I am wrong, I am sorry for misrepresenting your post.

The leaderboard discussion as a relevant part of this thread came about because [DE]Rebecca asked for it. Many people have weighed in on the topic, and from what I have read I think the majority of players that enjoy competition want to be able to track how they measure up against each other. a Dojo Trophy is nice for your clan to see which tier of reward you achieved, but it isn't the same as a ranking system that shows you exactly how you did in relation to other people.

As for the emblem or syandana portion of your comments, I have not seen a post stating that without an exclusive reward tied to the event that the event is a failure or that it is not a competition. Please feel free to link where someone has said that, if you feel the need to do so. What I have seen is mixed reviews on leaderboards, comments for and against items being tied to events, and an overall sense of disappointment from players that wanted competition and feel there isn't a way to track it.

[SsvenN]

40 minutes ago, leadwolf1 said:

I think myself and probably DE is tire of the back and forth of this nonsense, Because I try to read and see everybody's point. SO if this whole thing is about a leaders board then great a leaders board does no wrong in the game to me, I have a very small clan 10 players to be exact. I do not see anything wrong with a trophy for the clan dojo. I once had said that I did not see anything wrong with a emblem or Sedona, however after reading and how petty the top so called competitive clans have been arguing , I think they feel like they have to have something special other then what I have mentioned to wear so they can say look at me and the clan I am in. OR to them it is not a competition. and not worth their time , so , I now for my last major post say to you the same thing that you have been saying. if you do not feel it is worth your time if you do not have a leader board and a great exclusive award other than my top mentioned then fine you do not have to participate, do not play that event, , this seems to be the same thing you want to tell everyone else. DE it is up to you, but apparently no matter what anyone else says they are ok with the so called competitive clans still want more. And if the clans do not want more//// then just as when you tell them they have to do so much per event then tell then enough is enough . SO DE GETS THE LAST SAY ANYWAY

Well, the last posts was arguing just about fair/unfair gamestyles during the events ( using small glitches etc). But in general competitions between the clans is fine, just there shouldn't be something special like the ignis bp ( that's mine point). Willing to put your time and efforts to join the global event leaderboards races and take the lead positions - it's up to you, but don't forget about the other people who still want the last tier (10%) award, but can't get for the other meanings like job/study/ or just being a newcomer who ain't got the starter mods to join the race toward those great rewards/not reached the requiered mr to join those clans ( or spend 5-13 hours for one run). People will be more or less toxic, it's the thing tht will exist, like it or not. ( and we're not talking about the trophies for dojo also), those are cosmetics, as mentioned previously). At some point entry threshold for warframe is huge gap between the newcomers ( i mean if you weren't brought here and given all the mods, bunchload of plat and runs with high ranked players). I've spent pretty much huge bunch of time to recieve things i've own and to be on a decent game level for the undarstanding how things going on here. So at least just i'm hope DE will be kind to all those who's willing and trying to achieve the rewards. Each and every should have the equal rights to achieve the rewards and things like clans shouldn't be the case for closing the reward lists.

Edited November 12, 2017 by SsvenN

[leadwolf1]

1 hour ago, SsvenN said:

Well, the last posts was arguing just about fair/unfair gamestyles during the events ( using small glitches etc). But in general competitions between the clans is fine, just there shouldn't be something special like the ignis bp ( that's mine point). Willing to put your time and efforts to join the global event leaderboards races and take the lead positions - it's up to you, but don't forget about the other people who still want the last tier (10%) award, but can't get for the other meanings like job/study/ or just being a newcomer who ain't got the starter mods to join the race toward those great rewards/not reached the requiered mr to join those clans ( or spend 5-13 hours for one run). People will be more or less toxic, it's the thing tht will exist, like it or not. ( and we're not talking about the trophies for dojo also), those are cosmetics, as mentioned previously). At some point entry threshold for warframe is huge gap between the newcomers ( i mean if you weren't brought here and given all the mods, bunchload of plat and runs with high ranked players). I've spent pretty much huge bunch of time to recieve things i've own and to be on a decent game level for the undarstanding how things going on here. So at least just i'm hope DE will be kind to all those who's willing and trying to achieve the rewards. Each and every should have the equal rights to achieve the rewards and things like clans shouldn't be the case for closing the reward lists.

well then it should totally be based on individual performance only for player that by themselves can grind I a public forum and just keep switching  for the time they have should have just as much right from that clan that can make a squad and do it. that would be real tracking and then the actual player that did put all the time and effort is not penalized , because of the clan size or other clan members. this is why player are against the major reward. so if a player does the insomnia act and plays for 3 days straight and every one in the competitive clan run for a total of 2days each then the player running for3 days  and put in all that effort wins for that player beat everyone in the clan as an individual and the deserves the said prize / award above you and the rest of said clan , this would be fair to all players. I do not think there should be something that exclusive for only a minority in the game. Again a trophy and your name on a leaderboard

Edited November 13, 2017 by leadwolf1

[leadwolf1]

1 hour ago, --RV--Jax said:

I have taken the liberty to separate what I think are the 2 topics you're trying to contribute to. If I am wrong, I am sorry for misrepresenting your post.

The leaderboard discussion as a relevant part of this thread came about because [DE]Rebecca asked for it. Many people have weighed in on the topic, and from what I have read I think the majority of players that enjoy competition want to be able to track how they measure up against each other. a Dojo Trophy is nice for your clan to see which tier of reward you achieved, but it isn't the same as a ranking system that shows you exactly how you did in relation to other people.

As for the emblem or syandana portion of your comments, I have not seen a post stating that without an exclusive reward tied to the event that the event is a failure or that it is not a competition. Please feel free to link where someone has said that, if you feel the need to do so. What I have seen is mixed reviews on leaderboards, comments for and against items being tied to events, and an overall sense of disappointment from players that wanted competition and feel there isn't a way to track it.

and to your response , I know that DE Rebecca had asked of this,and if you read from page 1 you will find some players stating it is not worth if there is no leader board and it should not even be considered an event,.

[leadwolf1]

After going back to page 1 and re reading I lost focus of what this page is suppose to be so , here is a back on track question and maybe some suggestions on the leaderboards and who gets what. Every clan has their players list , and yes the ambulis was probably not bad for most  of the competitive clans, how ever my clan only had me and 1 other person that came on for a short while getting 1 or 200 of the ambulas drop points , I had to get the rest for my clan size to get the weapons and such, but with all that work I did as an individual to get it,  I did not get the wraith ignus. I reduced my clan down twice since then to the lowest and got rid of all the players that really do not play. So in reality I did more than a lot of the other clans that give the requirements to there players in the competitive clans, so is there a way of locking out any players in the clans that have been absent and not counting them as a number  and then going by a percentage total from the active side to be on the leader boards, and to get the rewards in that fashion. then no one can really complain, I mean I know some will. you will always have that , but would this not be the most fair in the leaderboard clan logging. I had to collect for all the clan members that were not playing that were listed and during the event you would not allow me to decrease to be in the running in the right category of clan. so could you the DE personal do it in this manner, then for players in the clan that do go above and beyond they would get the reward and it would go to the right clans in this fashion. ALL CLANS HAVE PLAYERS THAT CAN PLAY A LITTLE AND PLAY ALOT DEPENDING ON THERE WORK AND SCHOOL AND EVEN LIFE SCHEDULE. SO I DO NOT BELIEVE THIS IS A VALID ARGUMENT FOR MY PROPOSAL, IT WOULD STILL GO BY CLAN BUT ONLY THE ACTIVE SIDE AND TOTAL PERCENTAGE.  Thoughts  from the DE side, is this doable.

Edited November 13, 2017 by leadwolf1
miss spelled word

[-Exenon-]

57 minutes ago, leadwolf1 said:

After going back to page 1 and re reading I lost focus of what this page is suppose to be so , here is a back on track question and maybe some suggestions on the leaderboards and who gets what. Every clan has their players list , and yes the ambulis was probably not bad for most  of the competitive clans, how ever my clan only had me and 1 other person that came on for a short while getting 1 or 200 of the ambulas drop points , I had to get the rest for my clan size to get the weapons and such, but with all that work I did as an individual to get it,  I did not get the wraith ignus. I reduced my clan down twice since then to the lowest and got rid of all the players that really do not play. So in reality I did more than a lot of the other clans that give the requirements to there players in the competitive clans, so is there a way of locking out any players in the clans that have been absent and not counting them as a number  and then going by a percentage total from the active side to be on the leader boards, and to get the rewards in that fashion. then no one can really complain, I mean I know some will. you will always have that , but would this not be the most fair in the leaderboard clan logging. I had to collect for all the clan members that were not playing that were listed and during the event you would not allow me to decrease to be in the running in the right category of clan. so could you the DE personal do it in this manner, then for players in the clan that do go above and beyond they would get the reward and it would go to the right clans in this fashion. ALL CLANS HAVE PLAYERS THAT CAN PLAY A LITTLE AND PLAY ALOT DEPENDING ON THERE WORK AND SCHOOL AND EVEN LIFE SCHEDULE. SO I DO NOT BELIEVE THIS IS A VALID ARGUMENT FOR MY PROPOSAL, IT WOULD STILL GO BY CLAN BUT ONLY THE ACTIVE SIDE AND TOTAL PERCENTAGE.  Thoughts  from the DE said, is this doable.

First off, just because you had only 2 players active during the Pacifism Defect Operation, you expect to get the Ignis Wraith?

A lot of players got over 200 points in the event. (You didn't do a lot than most players in competitive clans). Also you have 75 score in the Ambulas Reborn Operation.

Also leaderboards don't count by active players, it counts from points gained by a player. (What you said makes no sense)

I think you are either really misguided or confused as to what this discussion is about.

 

 

 

 

Edited November 13, 2017 by DARK_EXENON

[leadwolf1]

1 hour ago, DARK_EXENON said:

First off, just because you had only 2 players active during the Pacifism Defect Operation, you expect to get the Ignis Wraith?

A lot of players got over 200 points in the event. (You didn't do a lot than most players in competitive clans). Also you have 75 score in the Ambulas Reborn Operation.

Also leaderboards don't count by active players, it counts from points gained by a player. (What you said makes no sense)

I think you are either really misguided or confused as to what this discussion is about.

 

 

 

 

first off I had a clan that had a 1000 capacity and had well over 100 non playing clan members , I did thousands, so please do not speak until you get all the info that you need to . and no I am not mis guided there was a quota to receive all the rewards and it was based on clan size. This is about moving forward with leaderboards and how to approach them. that is what DE Rebecca asked , I gave my idea. So unless you have a fair way to do the leader boards as well as the rewards stay off trolling mode to get plarers to argue off topic. it was my experience and what I would like to see moving forward.

This is added= so if you think= if I do the math  about 7800 lets say for me to get all the weapons and I divide it by the 2 players active it would give me an average of 3500 per player now if you had a clan and had 100 active to be even with the same dedication and hard work as this CLAN  THE 1OO ACTIVE PLAYERS WOULD HAVE TO HAVE A SCORE HIGHER THAN 350,000 ANYTHING LESS AND THEY DID NOT WORK AS HARD AND AS LONG AS THE OTHER CLAN. THIS IS FAIR COMPITITION. CASE AND POINT .  MORE PLAYERS CAN PUT UP MORE NUMBERS IT IS A FACT SO THERE IS NO COMPITITION IN THAT  AND IF THIS IS THE POINT YOU ARE ARGUEING  , YOU WANT UNFAIR ADVANTAGES ONLY IN YOUR FAVOR. THERE IS NO SPORTSMANSHIP IN THIS AND THERE IS NO COMPITITION IN THIS. ITHE ANSWER IS NOT TO GO OUT AND GET THE PLAYERS AND RAISE A CLAN HIGH ENOUGH JUST TO COMPETE WITH YOU AND YOUR CALN IT NEEDS TO BE FAIR ACROSS THE BOARD. AND IF A GROUP OF PLAYERS SMALLER THAN YOUR CLAN DO MORE YOU DO NOT THINK THEY SHOULD GET THE REWARD, FOR WHAT// MORE PLAYERS PLAYED IN YOUR CLAN, LOGGED IN RAN A COUPLE , GOT CLAN QUOTA AND WENT ABOUT THE REST OF THEIR DAY. THERE NEEDS TO BE A FAIR SYSTEM TO RANK AND MEASURE WHO REALLY IS DOING THE MOST AND LET THEM RECIEVE THE REWARD, SO IF YOU WERE BEATEN BY A CLAN THAT HAD LESS NUMBERS, THEN YOUR CLAN WOULD HAVE TO TRY HARDER THE NEXT TIME WOULDN'T THEY.  Again come up with a fair leaderboard and reward system to post and let DE decide how to combine ideas or go with one of them or maybe it triggers a way that the posts have not thought of but DE Rebecca and Megan and Steve does come up with along with their team at HQ .

 

.

Edited November 13, 2017 by leadwolf1
too add

[JayJayTheScrub]

2 hours ago, leadwolf1 said:

I reduced my clan down twice since then to the lowest and got rid of all the players that really do not play. So in reality I did more than a lot of the other clans that give the requirements to there players in the competitive clans

hate to break it to you but this is actually the easier way to be competitive, it's the reason Q and Dicht stay at the tiers they do (well... that and resource costs for clan tech (but that's a different topic)).

 

2 hours ago, leadwolf1 said:

so is there a way of locking out any players in the clans that have been absent and not counting them as a number  and then going by a percentage total from the active side to be on the leader boards, and to get the rewards in that fashion. then no one can really complain, I mean I know some will. you will always have that , but would this not be the most fair in the leaderboard clan logging.

I disagree with this being fair, it is subject to abuse, suppose someone makes a clan moon size and happens to be the only player in that clan to participate in an event, their score would be the clan's score, this score would then go on to beat that of all other moon clans who had a higher number of people participate but on average get less than that score. It makes the efforts of legitimately leading a clan of such a size meaningless. Part of what is involved in being competitive in these events is keeping your clan active, whether its through in-clan events (such as the ones mentioned by voltage in an earlier post) or through kicking those who seem to have abandoned or forgotten about warframe via offline limits. 

 

2 hours ago, leadwolf1 said:

ALL CLANS HAVE PLAYERS THAT CAN PLAY A LITTLE AND PLAY ALOT DEPENDING ON THERE WORK AND SCHOOL AND EVEN LIFE SCHEDULE.

Yes this is of course true, however if one wishes to be competitive they must arrange their schedule in such a way that permits that. This is true in many other games as well. It's part of why pro-esports players make playing their full time jobs. Remember, being competitive is more of an added bonus to these events, no one is demanding that you must be competitive to receive the rewards (although some are in favor of there being rewards, they are satisfied without them).

 

I genuinely do not see an issue with a simple list ranking the accumulated scores of each member in the clan (or their personal best score as has been the case in the past events). It shows approximately how active and how dedicated to the game (or at least scoring high) they are relative to other clans in their tier. Sure there will be the inevitable exploits due to the developers being human, but they have dealt with those players in an effective manner thus far. Additionally there will be accusations of using such exploits by those who perhaps cannot fathom the level of skill, commitment, or otherwise displayed by the top rankers. This, in my opinion, should be brushed aside as it generally is in other competitive scenes. The developers have displayed they are able to find those who truly do exploit through their removal of scores as recently seen in the ambulas event and of course no one should encourage the use of such exploits. 

Edited November 13, 2017 by ---RV---JayJay
changes some punctuation