New hateframe?

[Imniscor]

MR = item leveler.
Some people don't like playing different weapons/frames just for the sake of leveling MR.
There are a lot of frames/weapons I will never have because I have 0 interest on them, thus limiting my MR level.

Besides, nobody needs MR higher than 15.
All weapons can be used with MR 13, and all the Rivens I saw so far can be used with MR 15.

[(PSN)Derio23]

Yea the MR hate is real. 

 

In regards to the Ash hate. Ash doesnt offer as much utility as other frames. The armor reduction can easily be done better by frost. As far as the plains go there are other warframes that have better group utility. However there are still other warframes out there that need to be fixed such as Atlas.

[nickelshark]

Just ignore the non-believers. Really though, I'm sure every frame has some number of people that hate them for their own weird reasons.

[Jeon-Rammbo]

Think I'm gonna go build an Ash.

[Jeon-Rammbo]

2 hours ago, Imniscor said:

MR = item leveler.
Some people don't like playing different weapons/frames just for the sake of leveling MR.
There are a lot of frames/weapons I will never have because I have 0 interest on them, thus limiting my MR level.

Besides, nobody needs MR higher than 15.
All weapons can be used with MR 13, and all the Rivens I saw so far can be used with MR 15.

Uh, I just looted an MR 16 Riven.I thought 16 was the magic number.  Amprex Visi-hexado

[Saetun]

3 hours ago, GnarlsDarkley said:

You are mistaken. If you play any fissure, the yellow ball spawns invulnerable enemies and corrupts them immediatly. No time to kill them (anymore) before

The normal enemies will also become corrupted if you allow them to live long enough.  I have had no small amount of unopened relics because a frame capable of wiping the map did so and caused not enough corrupted to spawn.

[(XBOX)weedyodaa]

Ash is fine. So many call him trash. He was my first prime, and I loved it. Don't know why people hate him. Personally, I think his gameplay is boring for high level mot survival runs. It's just spam first ability and blade storm. He's a good frame. His concept is cool, and he's fine to play for players, and his parts are a bit tough to get. 

[Cifrer]

3 hours ago, Jeon-Rammbo said:

Uh, I just looted an MR 16 Riven.I thought 16 was the magic number.  Amprex Visi-hexado

16 is the magic number.

[(PSN)TertulSee]

8 hours ago, elpapitoluizito said:

Ok,i can understand people h8 limbo,but why ash?

I’m an ash main 24/7 and recently (this never happened to me before) the h8 towards him is going up like a rocked,in fact a lot if people in the exact moment they see me playing ash they trashtalk

OMG ASH NOOB

GONNA LEAVE FKIN’ NOOB

and instantly leave mission,i mean ash can be an overkill with his bladestorm even at high lvls,and with my build that ads fatal teleport(that one shots lvl 200 corrupted bombards) or seeking shuriken that strips 100% of armour it can be a huge part of the team,still they refuse to play with me lately.

Is this only unlucky matchmaking or is this happening to more ash players?

Ash is still really strong after his nerf. He’s just not meta anymore. You came across a die hard meta enforcer I presume.

[(PSN)Oryx453]

I don't know man, people calling you a noob for using Ash? That's just stupid, Ash has always been one of my personal favorites and he's a good all-around frame. Maybe this is a new thing that's developing, people thinking of Ash prime as a noob frame because he's one of the easiest to craft? I don't know what their problem was, but don't listen to it bro. They're is always going to be some little jerk, and his entire life is sitting in front of a computer screen, and he thinks he's some kind of video game god. Ignore these idiots, play whatever frame you enjoy.

[Tatann]

Il y a 10 heures, Kyoresh a dit :

Why do people hate Limbo?

hes is one of the strongest Frames! I often solo Sorties with him... and he is so fun to use

Maybe for the Limbo player, but he ruins the fun for the other 3 players

[Kyoresh]

28 minutes ago, Tatann said:

Maybe for the Limbo player, but he ruins the fun for the other 3 players

Not if played correctly.

But if we talk about ruining fun, dont forget stuff like Ember. There is nothing more boring then an Ember in an Exterminate Mission

[FreeWilliam]

11 hours ago, elpapitoluizito said:

Ok,i can understand people h8 limbo,but why ash?

Who cares what they think?  Their opinions have no value, they're projecting asshattery on the world.

I've got no interest in playing with them and consider them a toxin...but not the good kind that kills Bombards, the bad kind that ruins Tenno (and human) days.

[FreeWilliam]

55 minutes ago, Tatann said:

Maybe for the Limbo player, but he ruins the fun for the other 3 players

How is it that you're solely incapable of having fun with a Limbo around?  Does your frame only have one weapon and no powers?  Are they unable to move?  

Have you never seen an Equinox or a Banshee?

[phoenix1992]

There was, is and forever will be a frame that will be hated, with reasons that can more or less be defined as "har har, this takes no skills, Loki Master Race".

Remember when Rhino /Rhino Prime was the "omg noob" frame? 

[(PSN)Dark-TailedFox]

I haven't had much of an issue with Ash ever since his rework. Hardly run into Limbo but the few I have are pretty cool.

Volt on the other hand with their attachment to "i need speed, do you want speed too? Don't care, take it. *10s later* need some more speed? I know you backflipped out of the first one but I got another here for ya buddy!" is frankly getting quite irritating.

[Saturmorn_Carvilli]

15 minutes ago, FreeWilliam said:

How is it that you're solely incapable of having fun with a Limbo around?  Does your frame only have one weapon and no powers?  Are they unable to move?  

Have you never seen an Equinox or a Banshee?

Yes, actually I spend a good amount of time only playing either Loki or Nezha armed only with a melee weapon to Focus farm.  Because of how long it takes to come anywhere close to hitting the cap outside of a few methods I find undesirable, it is pretty much the only way I play Warframe anymore.  The big difference with Equinox and Banshee is they are helping me farm Focus where Limbo is actually slowing me down.

Limbo is a 10%/90% frame to me.  Ten percent of the time Limbo isn't an issue.  They have Narrow Minded and surgically place their powers where I am not very likely to interact with them.  The other 90% of the time, it is either Limbo that doesn't know what they are doing or one that does that thinks they are the only keeping the squad from failing the mission objective and keeping the squad alive when they are actually just slowing everything down.  I have not seen any other frame breed such arrogance in the players that use them.

[FreeWilliam]

1 minute ago, Saturmorn_Carvilli said:

They have Narrow Minded and surgically place their powers where I am not very likely to interact with them.  The other 90% of the time, it is either Limbo that doesn't know what they are doing or one that does that thinks they are the only keeping the squad from failing the mission objective and keeping the squad alive when they are actually just slowing everything down.  I have not seen any other frame breed such arrogance in the players that use them.

Given how much projecting of intent is happening here, I'm pretty sure the Limbo players aren't the problem.

[goatwin]

17 hours ago, elpapitoluizito said:

Ok,i can understand people h8 limbo,but why ash?

I’m an ash main 24/7 and recently (this never happened to me before) the h8 towards him is going up like a rocked,in fact a lot if people in the exact moment they see me playing ash they trashtalk

OMG ASH NOOB

GONNA LEAVE FKIN’ NOOB

and instantly leave mission,i mean ash can be an overkill with his bladestorm even at high lvls,and with my build that ads fatal teleport(that one shots lvl 200 corrupted bombards) or seeking shuriken that strips 100% of armour it can be a huge part of the team,still they refuse to play with me lately.

Is this only unlucky matchmaking or is this happening to more ash players?

Maybe they were new players that accidently stumbled on pre-rework Ash discussions, (back when he can be annoying) and assumes that everyone in the game hates Ash.

[(PSN)Unstar]

If a teammate lacks skill with Excalibur, the worst thing that will happen is that I have to revive them — which is a normal part of the game that players are used to.

If a teammate lacks skill with Limbo, I can't kill enemies because they're in another frickin' plane, or I have to wait 30 seconds for my bullets to start moving, or I have to roll because I'm in another plane.

Limbo has the potential to significantly disrupt the way other players want to play the game.  That's why some people hate him.

[Kjahla81]

Ash is way more tame thanks to his rework. Too many nightmares from the Rad sorties.

Now only issue I have from time to time are nuke frames during low level fissure mission. Let players get reactant then turn it on. 

[FreeWilliam]

8 hours ago, (PS4)Unstar said:

 

If a teammate lacks skill with Limbo, I can't kill enemies because they're in another frickin' plane, or I have to wait 30 seconds for my bullets to start moving, or I have to roll because I'm in another plane.

The list of 'things that look like bad guys that I can't kill' is extensive and I frequently take swings at specters, Nekros pets, and whatever the new flavor of the week is.  I don't flip out about it, I just move on to things that I can kill. 

With Limbo, if they're in the rift, they're dead.  I know sometimes I want to kill THOSE bad guys, but a good Tenno looks for solutions, and doesn't create problems. If you're still waiting for your bullets to move and haven't moved out of the very obvious bubble or switched to melee, then how in the world are you going to handle bosses?  

(I assume the answer is you handle them fine and are just grumpin')

If people weren't pressuring Limbo players into playing their frames completely differently in groups this would be less of an issue.  Cataclysm is VERY obvious and there are many obvious bubbles that have effects you have to pay attention to... Frost's Slow Globes spring to mind immediately.

This is about 90% 'it's fun to hate on frames for some people' and 10% reality here.

[(PSN)Unstar]

3 hours ago, FreeWilliam said:

The list of 'things that look like bad guys that I can't kill' is extensive and I frequently take swings at specters, Nekros pets, and whatever the new flavor of the week is.

None of the things you mentioned can be killed or need to be killed in any circumstances.  These things will never pop out of the rift and attack you, nor will they prevent the mission from progressing.  It's not the same thing.

2 hours ago, FreeWilliam said:

With Limbo, if they're in the rift, they're dead.

It seems like we have very different experiences with Limbo players.  I am very, very accustomed to being in an Exterminate mission with a Limbo that puts enemies in the Rift and then runs ahead.  Maybe it's a difference in the population on various platforms?  Maybe it's luck?

2 hours ago, FreeWilliam said:

If you're still waiting for your bullets to move and haven't moved out of the very obvious bubble or switched to melee, then how in the world are you going to handle bosses?

Please try to see where I'm coming from.  It's not like the bubble was always there and I carelessly wandered into it.  Someone put me in a bubble.  Before the other player took an action, the problem did not exist.  Now it does, and I have them to thank for it.

And it's also seldom as simple as "just do X".  As an example, here's one common situation: I'm in a good position to shoot at enemies in a narrow hallway (Warframe is a game made of narrow hallways).  And I'm shooting them, and it's fun.  Suddenly, myself and the entire width of the hallway is occupied by a time bubble.  Now I literally can't do what I want to do, which is shoot the enemies from my good position that I was already in.

Maybe the enemies are in the bubble, which means I have to switch to melee if I want to attack them.  Maybe the enemies are outside the bubble, which means I have to move closer to attack them (often not the best strategy with ranged weapons) or move backwards and try to shoot them through with a swirling bubble obstructing my view.  These are all certainly possible solutions to this problem.

But again, the only reason the problem needs to be solved is Limbo.  Other frames just don't limit my choices with the magnitude and the frequency of a Limbo player.  Now, if they did, it would mean that Limbo wouldn't stand out so much.  Then, Limbo would just be another frame, instead of the exception to the rule that he is.

But they don't.  With pretty much any other frame as a teammate, I can just play the game.  More often than not, I find the things my teammates are doing to be helpful.  And they almost never get in my way.

Sure, there are exceptions.  Maybe a Nidus or a Nyx has made a single enemy unkillable with mind control or an umbilical cord.  But this is just one enemy, and I can count the time's it's been an issue on one hand.  Frost certainly can make a Snow Globe in such a way that it blocks my fire, but it generally just doesn't happen, likely because you can actually shoot out of a Snow Globe.

Now again, this is my experience.  You have your own experiences, and you can certainly feel however you want about this.  If you don't mind moving out of Cataclysm 40 times per mission, I'm not going to tell you that's invalid.  I just hope you can respect that some of us don't want to do that.

P.S. - So far, I actually don't mind playing with Limbo players in the Plains of Eidolon; the wide open spaces seem to encourage teams to spread out a bit more, and makes it much less likely that a Limbo will create a Cataclysm on you.

[FreeWilliam]

12 minutes ago, (PS4)Unstar said:

None of the things you mentioned can be killed or need to be killed in any circumstances.  These things will never pop out of the rift and attack you, nor will they prevent the mission from progressing.  It's not the same thing.

I was more thinking 'wasted swings', not the same thing, correct! :)

12 minutes ago, (PS4)Unstar said:

It seems like we have very different experiences with Limbo players.  I am very, very accustomed to being in an Exterminate mission with a Limbo that puts enemies in the Rift and then runs ahead.  Maybe it's a difference in the population on various platforms?  Maybe it's luck?

In an exterminate?  Somebody...didn't murder things?  

That's just...WRONG!  Are we sure they're Tenno? ;)

I actually think I might have seen that once or twice, or at least the aftereffects.  I'm not sure, it definitely hasn't been a common experience for me.

I Limbo occasionally and I'm also trying to figure out why somebody wouldn't cataclysm those puppies...or maybe they're rift surge stragglers or something?  

20 minutes ago, (PS4)Unstar said:

Sure, there are exceptions.  Maybe a Nidus or a Nyx has made a single enemy unkillable with mind control or an umbilical cord.  But this is just one enemy, and I can count the time's it's been an issue on one hand.  Frost certainly can make a Snow Globe in such a way that it blocks my fire, but it generally just doesn't happen, likely because you can actually shoot out of a Snow Globe.

I alt-fire a Ferrox a lot so those slow globes are pesky!  but you nailed it when you hit on the different experiences.

I also JUST realized something...you can't type on console!!!!

I wonder if this is a big reason why we've got a divergence?  It's really easy on the PC side to just PM some body and say 'hey, let's move that bubble a bit to the left', you don't really have that option on consoles, do you?  

So, slight apologies for being a bit snarky...it's partly because I'm a bit old school (been gaming since I got my Adventure Construction Set on my C-64!) and we had to evolve into social gaming.  It's most definitely different for people born into it.  I DO notice a bit of an attitude difference with a lot of people with backgrounds more like mine where we expect everyone else to be a nervous, uncomfortable human who may have had an awful day at work.  It seems like when I run into people who are gentle with lowbies or extremely generous they're in the same age range and have some similar stories.  The funny thing is when we chat (regardless of age, just people with the same attitude) I often also hear something about avoiding raiding in MMOs because it's 'like work'

I wonder if there's a big 'how you approach gaming' thing going on here too?  It sure does look like people are being crazy competitive over silly things sometimes.

27 minutes ago, (PS4)Unstar said:

Now again, this is my experience.  You have your own experiences, and you can certainly feel however you want about this.  If you don't mind moving out of Cataclysm 40 times per mission, I'm not going to tell you that's invalid.  I just hope you can respect that some of us don't want to do that.

P.S. - So far, I actually don't mind playing with Limbo players in the Plains of Eidolon; the wide open spaces seem to encourage teams to spread out a bit more, and makes it much less likely that a Limbo will create a Cataclysm on you.

Encourage or force? ;)

It IS funny that nobody's complaining about Zephyr's tornadoes out there!

I think we're converging on something we can agree on.  There are a couple of things that DE could tweak with Limbo (and a few other frame abilities)...but there's definitely also an 'approach to the game' thing where some people are more likely to find things stressful.  

The only real thing I bristle at is when I see people hating on MR 2-6 types who are OBVIOUSLY new to the game, probably have been soloing for a while, and are still getting a feel for how they're using their frames.  I think we should expect PUGs to be full of randos...because they will be full of randos.  You can get people who are more skilled and expect to work together in recruitment chat, a clan, or Warframe LFG on Discord.

So that's the only bit that really throws me... why be hatey in PUGs?  I go in them EXPECTING to find some complete nutbunnies, and it's sometimes rewarding to mentor them.  

Does that make sense as a boundary of reason?  The difference in expectations between planned groups and PUGs?  Where are the randos supposed to go if not PUGs?

[Foefaller]

Ash hate is probably a mix of residual hate from before they nerfed Bladstorm, to the fact that now with that Bladestorm nerf, most who lived by spamming 4 all day no longer know how to play him and contribute very little to the group.

Limbo I don't have much problems with. Vast majority of Limbo players I run into nowadays know what they are doing, and when they don't... Well, I play Mesa a lot, and Peacemaker can cross the Rift and IIRC aren't affected by stasis, so I'm good :P (I sometimes even ask to be banished so I can use all my energy on Peacemaker and not have to worry about keeping Shatter Shield up)

Banshee's who spam Resonating Quake are the only thing I actually groan at seeing. Especially if it's a Defense Sortie and the Banshee's too dumb to realize that they're just drawing the mission out and not at all making it easier.

Edited December 1, 2017 by Foefaller