Dev Workshop: Warframes Revisited

[MrInubis]

4 minutes ago, Vance.Stubbs said:

So why do you cry about crying when it's double as unproductive and hypocritical?

Except i dont? I just stated the fact on how it is. 

[throwaway987654321]

5 minutes ago, Glavenusaur said:

Exactly this, crying over an ability that lets you basically sit AFK... It's like crying because the devs actually want you to play the game instead of just sit there like its a screen saver... oh the humanity... the horror... jesus christ...

The game requires thousands of hours to unlock a lot of content that's only worth a few hours each. No-one is keen on spending an entire year wearing the same rank-30 lens-installed frames and weapons just so they can mostly fill ONE focus tree. Don't complain about people trying to make things more fun and less tedious. There is no AFK, either; Banshee at its best (reactor + forma's) lasts about one minute, and non-reactor/forma Banshee struggles to go past 20 seconds with Resonating Quake (the required mod for using Banshee's 4, as it's utterly useless otherwise).

Just stop. Let people enjoy things. Suggest more interactive and FUN mechanics, instead of telling us to quiet down when DE says they're going to make the grind even worse for some of us.

[Zahnrad]

3 minutes ago, Almagnus1 said:

However, Nova's 3 is one of the best movement skills in the game, so Nova's not really a good example of a bad frame.  Plus you have to actively engage with the primed enemies in order to do damage to them.

I wasn't stating Nova is bad just that her abilities tend to rely on Molecular Prime. I wasn't counting Wormhole as it's more of a movement skill than an active combat skill.

[TyrianMollusk]

15 hours ago, [DE]Connor said:

EMBER

World On Fire - 5 seconds after casting, a percentage will begin counting up on the ability icon. As this percentage scales from 0% to 100% over 10 seconds, the ability’s energy cost and damage dealt both grow to double, while the ability radius shrinks to half.
 

I'm quite disappointed in the Ember change.  NOT because it nerfs WoF, but because WoF is still an incredibly lame ability.  I never use the old WoF, and the new WoF is no more appealing or fun.

Ember needs some new ideas to wholly replace this derivative "everything nearby explodes" mindset.  Let us be the fire mage, the master of burning, the *interesting* dealer of blazing rage, not just random automated explosions for anything close.  There should at the very least be something fun about enemies with burning status.  I mean, you have GOT to use the fire here.  It's FIRE.

For a quick boring example, suppose WoF had the same explosion effects and range but explosions only triggered on enemies with burning status, after burning damage was dealt, with a rapidly-increasing burn damage on a rapidly-decreasing status duration (ie, a "candle burning twice as bright" kind of thing).  Burn some armor away, while you're at it (or have armor/shields influence the explosion AoE). Then Ember still kills, but she has to start the fires.  Look!  She's an actual participant again!  Her squad might even be relevant if they have some fire!  Roll the +Fire augment for Fireball into the base ability but make it lower non-combining Fire damage with a separate burn status bonus (use their crit+status) -- now the squad is on board!  *Two* Embers have fun synergies!

Let us have fun with fire, DE.  Please.  Make burning matter.

Edited February 3, 2018 by TyrianMollusk

[GazAcantha]

As a long time Ember player (she was my first frame since I picked up the game Feb 2013), I was looking over the changes to WoF and it reminds me a bit of how the first version of it worked blinding red filter excluded. WoF used to be a large AoE that would deal more damage to enemies closer to you.

To compensate for this, she had an ability to mitigate damage and survive being so close to her enemies, plus giving the added bonus of more damage thrown on top. This ability was called Overheat. For those who haven't been around that long ago, Overheat covered Ember in...well embers, and she gained a percentage-based damage resist and a very small AoE around her (about arms length and it didn't scale with range) that both scaled with power strength.

This ability was most likely replaced due to it being similar to the reworked Rhino Iron Skin at the time, which damage resist instead of invulnerability. But we now have Nezha's Warding Halo which is almost identical to Iron Skin is now, so I don't see the issue with this ability making a return.

Don't get me wrong though, I like the skill that replaced it. Accelerant was a great addition to her kit, and it greatly complimented the changes that were made to WoF. Rather than remove Accelerant, I opt to remove the overly redundant ability in her kit, Fire Blast. Fire Blast hasn't been useful since the days of Xini defense farming; and as cool as the changes made to it seem, it and it's augment never see use (besides being spammed by ember players at the end of a mission).

Please tell me what you all think, I am very passionate about Ember, and I hope DE does something to counterbalance this hefty change to her already crippled kit.

[(PSN)TachibanaSan]

DE is serious?

Chroma should be a multiplicative.

Chroma needs Narrow Minded, so this fix is meaningless.

Nobody uses Chroma when it is modified.

[DroopingPuppy]

19 minutes ago, Orblit said:

They're halving the ability's radius while doubling the damage + energy cost after a set timer...where's the nerf?

Because if you can't hit anyone, the end result is no damage. Make some damage to no damage is obviously no more than nerf to the ground.

 

 

[GinKenshin]

WoF didn't need fixing, it needs to be reworked and removed for another ability 

currently it's broken and unfun, after the 'fix' it'll be broken and unfun....at this point, no mater how much they change it it's not gonna be worth it 


also, they totally killed her firequack augment, which made her useful in higher lvl, but now due to increase cost and lower dmg it won't be 

ofc they can just make it like the current wof when you use the aug, but with it dealing no dmg, just knocking them off 

[Glavenusaur]

2 minutes ago, Dawson1917 said:

The game requires thousands of hours to unlock a lot of content that's only worth a few hours each. No-one is keen on spending an entire year wearing the same rank-30 lens-installed frames and weapons just so they can mostly fill ONE focus tree. Don't complain about people trying to make things more fun and less tedious. There is no AFK, either; Banshee at its best (reactor + forma's) lasts about one minute, and non-reactor/forma Banshee struggles to go past 20 seconds with Resonating Quake (the required mod for using Banshee's 4, as it's utterly useless otherwise).

Just stop. Let people enjoy things. Suggest more interactive and FUN mechanics, instead of telling us to quiet down when DE says they're going to make the grind even worse for some of us.

 

I'm sorry but if you don't like grinding in warframe, this game really isn't for you, as the whole point of the game is to grind for the gear you want, always has and always will be.

[DreamsmithJane]

10 minutes ago, DroopingPuppy said:

That's literally false. Ember usually has +45% range and WOF's range is basically 15m, so usually it have about 21m radius. Cut in half means it only has about 10m, and you better make the slide attack by the whips or you need to turn down and cast WOF all the times.

 

 

Ugh. Please read something before you say it's false.

1 hour ago, DreamsmithJane said:

Being able to kill enemies within 42 meters just by walking around is disruptive. And yes, that's with all available +range mods. That's the problem. Being able to mod for 280% range naturally means that 100% range is going to feel a bit lacking in the worst case scenario.

Besides, the entire point is that World on Fire doesn't need to be literally setting the entire world on fire the whole time. Honestly, 10.875 meters is fine for that level of constant damage output. And like I pointed out, DPS on each enemy is higher when the area of effect is smaller.

Edited February 3, 2018 by DreamsmithJane

[MrInubis]

4 minutes ago, Dawson1917 said:

Just stop. Let people enjoy things. Suggest more interactive and FUN mechanics, instead of telling us to quiet down when DE says they're going to make the grind even worse for some of us.

Isnt this exactly what they try to do with banshee? You wont be channeling anymore, you will deploy it like hollowed ground and be able to do other things.

[AcceptYourDeath]

vor 14 Stunden schrieb [DE]Connor:

As this percentage scales from 0% to 100% over 10 seconds, the ability’s energy cost and damage dealt both grow to double, while the ability radius shrinks to half.

Can the shrinking effect overcome base range of 15m? That would be 10m while using Stretch 7.5m without once the effect is fully applied. The wording on dev stream was "....once it reaches 100%.......max damage.... also at its min range window" 

 

[Glavenusaur]

Wow an excal prime owning master ranker who is only an initiate on the forums... now I've seen everything...

[Yachooo]

10 minutes ago, Lancars said:

I come up with an idea and no one bats and eye. Someone throws salt and the post gets posts in moment. Blah.

That is why i stopped posting mag fixes and suggestions. If i received any feedback it was negative, that im wrong and mag is ok.

Sometimes i think that people took mag meme serious :(

[DroopingPuppy]

1 minute ago, DreamsmithJane said:

Ugh. Please read something before you say it's false.

Besides, the entire point is that World on Fire doesn't need to be literally setting the entire world on fire the whole time. Honestly, 10.875 meters is fine for that level of constant damage output.

It is false because it doesn't insta-kill anything by just walking, nor it have so insane range. It only have about 21m range, and the fire bursts has limited numbers so it needs to hit the enemy.

 

Also it is false that 10.875m is fine either. It is so close enough to make the melee attack. You better use the slide attack with some long ranged melee weapon and have much better result, and you don't need for an Ember.

[Cryptix123]

Just now, Vance.Stubbs said:

Yeah, vanity items get updated pretty consistenly/

What about broken/useless/outdated mechanics that DE haven't bothered to touch for years? 

Boohoo! Spoiled community!

Nidus was released in December 2016 with Update 19.5

Gara was released in October 2017 with Update 22.0

In that time the following items were released:

- Shotgun and Secondary Rivens

- Infested Salvage

- Hema

- Hirudo

- The Helminth Cure

- Ohma

- Sovereign Outcast

- Astral Autopsy

- Ayatan Anasa Sculptures

- Quick Steel Conclave Mode

- Taxon

- Defection PVE Mode

- Ferrox

- Ignis Wraith

- Octavia

- Tenora

- Pandero

- Captura

- Helminth Charger

- Cycron

- Oberon Rework

- Ambulas Rework

- Endura

- Cyclone Kraken

- Harrow

- Scourge

- Knell

- Guandao

- Zakti

- Jat Kusar

- Lenz

- Hydroid Rework

- Hydroid Prime

- Ballistica Prime

- Nami Skyla Prime

- Arca Plasmor

- Arca Sciscor

- Arca Titron

- Plains of Eidolon!!

- Gara

- Volnus

- Astilla

- Zaws

- Amps

- Augur, Vigilante, and Gladiator Mod Sets

- Volt Rework

- Mirage Prime

- Kogake Prime

- Akbolto Prime

- Quartakk

- Stubba 

- Gunsen

Which brings us to present day. Note that I did not include any bugfixes, warframe augments, events, and no doubt I missed some things as well.

 

 

[Nephalem]

Well boys a nother frame turned from usefull to garbage.I think DE made a trend of doing this sort of things.Instead of Buffing the garbage frames and for the time beeing let the others be.They try to shift the meta from good to worst.There are soo many core mechanics that are terrible and are in need of atention...and they do this?Just think of the players that never played with ember and they want to get it from the unvault and once they got it .....i just want to se the dissapointment on theyr faces. :X

Edited February 3, 2018 by NephalemUnlimited

[rune_me]

23 minutes ago, Vance.Stubbs said:

Yeah, vanity items get updated pretty consistenly/

What about broken/useless/outdated mechanics that DE haven't bothered to touch for years? 

Boohoo! Spoiled community!

I have always been a firm believer in quality over content. I have said many times that I would love if DE took 6 months off releasing anything new and just spend them fixing bugs and working on what is already in the game. 

But the community at large really don't want that. They want new content with every new release. We just had a pretty big QoL patch, and already you can see threads in the forum with titles such as "content drought" "where's Khora?" and "what happened to damage 2.5?" just because that patch didn't come with lots of new content. If you have to always introduce new weapons, new frames, new free roam areas for all the planets, there's not many resources left to fix broken mechanics.

[Glavenusaur]

@Cryptix123

Absolute legend... 

 

[(PSN)Tactless_Ninja]

8 minutes ago, Glavenusaur said:

Exactly this, crying over an ability that lets you basically sit AFK... It's like crying because the devs actually want you to play the game instead of just sit there like its a screen saver... oh the humanity... the horror... jesus christ...

I've been mulling it over, and the real issue might be the gameplay isn't engaging enough so the looting and leveling mechanics take priority turning the game for most people into a boring grind. I'd personally would like to see more done with how their procedurally created levels are put together. It's just a chore getting around when you seen the same map with the same path every single time despite being flipped and showing up out of order. That and gore 2.0.

15 minutes ago, Vance.Stubbs said:

What about broken/useless/outdated mechanics that DE haven't bothered to touch for years?

Ouch that's a truthbomb. Though they're pretty much playing Jenga at this point. They have their tower built, but want to change out some pieces but can't let the tower fall down.

[Lancars]

1 minute ago, Yachooo said:

That is why i stopped posting mag fixes and suggestions. If i received any feedback it was negative, that im wrong and mag is ok.

Sometimes i think that people took mag meme serious :(

*sighs* yea. Mag was my first Warframe so i care a lot. But unless you're a Reddit post with high point, Friend with a Dev or A Warframe Partner streamer your words don't go anywhere. It wasn't like this a bit back but now the see of angst washes away everything.

[Dreadwire]

Back then they said overheat is op

Now wof is op

But to me she a good frame. To have fun with. Just gave her a decent skill. If wof is nerf again. Might as well just remove it from her and replaced it with something useful that are not op and cant be use to mass murder. 

 

Like gara.... sighh

[GinKenshin]

4 minutes ago, Glavenusaur said:

Wow an excal prime owning master ranker who is only an initiate on the forums... now I've seen everything...

1- it has nothing to do with the topic

2- so he’s not on the forums much, why is that a problem? 

 

3- you do know your rank on the forums and ingame rank are different right? 

 

As for the OP, no she doesn’t need overheat, the devs need to scrap wof and give us something new. What’s wrong with wof is it’s concept 

[NoelleAllogene]

25 minutes ago, HolySeraphin said:

I hate RQ banshee and WoF ember because I CAN´T DO anything else. I play the game to move my god damn character. If I want to watch someone play I watch a video.

in case you never played anything harder than Neptune, nobody use ember in Sortie for damage. They maximize on range for WoF Augment, which dropped enemies like blast proc for the CC,

here's a tip for you: CC beats damage everytime. especially in level 50+. So, congratulations, you whining babies who armed with Gorgons are basically nagging DE to make a mediocre frame to become trash. clap clap.

Edited February 3, 2018 by dataman88

[Glavenusaur]

1 minute ago, GinKenshin said:

1- it has nothing to do with the topic

2- so he’s not on the forums much, why is that a problem? 

 

3- you do know your rank on the forums and ingame rank are different right? 

 

As for the OP, no she doesn’t need overheat, the devs need to scrap wof and give us something new. What’s wrong with wof is it’s concept 

Huh? what are you getting at, never said it was a problem did i? it just took me by surprise is all, though yes it does have nothing to do with the topic true, my bad.