So sick of trading chat, why can't we get an auction house?

[Kaminariss]

33 minutes ago, PatternistSlave said:

Yes even their SUBSCRIPTION game has had and continues to have huge issues.

Thats exaggeration, i still play WoW, and of course it did not completely remove gold sellers. Funny enough you can find platinum sellers too. So Warframe already has that problem.

 

33 minutes ago, PatternistSlave said:

But I was talking about Diablo 3.  The looter more comparable to Warframe.  With an upfront price even.  That couldn't have an auction house.

How Diablo 3 is more comparable to warframe than for example WoW?

Can you trade weapons? No - In diablo you could, in WoW you can't.
Can you trade equipment? No - In diablo you could, in WoW you can't.
Can you trade armor? No - In diablo you could, in WoW you can't.
Can you trade resources? No - In diablo you could, in WoW you can.
Can you trade currencies? Yes - In diablo you couldn't, in WoW you can.

Oh and there might have been misunderstanding, auction house is just a name. If I would design AH it would be working like this:

• Maximum of 10-20 concurent items
• Items stays for 48h online
• Sell Tax at first 5% then regulate it to make prices more stable
• Only rivens would be allowed to be auctionable, every other item would be just "buy now", you would not be able to make "auction" for prime parts etc.
• Maximum sells per day = your MR rank. After that your actions would become suspended and enabled day after while prolonging expiration time
• AH would be accessible from Maroo bazar as kiosk (there is a meaning for this)
• If you delist your item earlier, it would still take one of your trade per day.
• If it ends but noone buys it - no trades would be deducted from daily trade pool
• Items that you enlisted would be locked in your inventory untill someone buys it or auction (offers) ends.
• No way to change price once you post item to AH.
• Quantity field only allowed for tradeable resources like fish.
• Money for sold items would be getting on your mailbox
• If you win riven from auction you would get item on your mailbox
• Minimum price for various categories ex prime parts min 5p, mods 5p, syndicate weapons 30p, syndicate mods 10p, syndicate archwing parts 10p
• No maximum price
• Buying item would cut one trade per day 

Then i would start monitoring how prices are fluctuating and act if there is something wrong (that is the reason why sell tax is a must)

 

 

Edited February 28, 2018 by Kaminariss

[PatternistSlave]

10 minutes ago, Kaminariss said:

i still play WoW

And you've never wondered why the crafting system is pointless or why it takes months of grinding to equate to a meager pittance in relation to real money?

13 minutes ago, Kaminariss said:

So Warframe already has that problem.

Yeah their trading system discourages abuse, doesn't completely prevent it.  Imagine what would happen if the system didn't.

27 minutes ago, Kaminariss said:

How Diablo 3 is more comparable to warframe than for example WoW?

Well Diablo is at least a horde looter.

 

 

 

 

 

[Kaminariss]

5 minutes ago, PatternistSlave said:

And you've never wondered why the crafting system is pointless or why it takes months of grinding to equate to a meager pittance in relation to real money?

Pointless? No it gets you a pretty decent amount of money. Months of grinding? Wut? Currently by doing pretty much nothing im still earning 2 tokens per month. Crafting professions can earn 4 times as much if you put effort into them.

 

12 minutes ago, PatternistSlave said:

Yeah their trading system discourages abuse, doesn't completely prevent it.  Imagine what would happen if the system didn't.

How is the system preventing abuse? Platinum sellers sell large quantity at once so nothing is there to prevent it. On a local auction website (similar to ebay.com) I can see platinum, prime parts, pretty much everything available for real money. Hundreds of auctions.

 

22 minutes ago, PatternistSlave said:

Well Diablo is at least a horde looter.

Thats probably the only similarity :) On the other hand gear acquisition is completely different. Hardly anything is trully rare in diablo now.

[torsoreaper]

I'm shocked people don't like this idea.  If you have played GW2 or WOW you can see how insanely convenient it is to have an AH.  Aside from how good it is for the players, I think DE could greatly benefit because they could even post a trade tax of 1p to list and 1p to buy which would create a larger platinum sink than what they have now.  I would GLADLY pay 1p to start listing and buying rivens, arcanes, rare mods, etc...

[Spectre-8]

No.

[(PSN)Semyazza1985]

40 minutes ago, Kaminariss said:

Oh and there might have been misunderstanding, auction house is just a name. If I would design AH it would be working like this:

• Maximum of 10-20 concurent items
• Items stays for 48h online
• Sell Tax at first 5% then regulate it to make prices more stable
• Only rivens would be allowed to be auctionable, every other item would be just "buy now", you would not be able to make "auction" for prime parts etc.
• Maximum sells per day = your MR rank. After that your actions would become suspended and enabled day after while prolonging expiration time
• AH would be accessible from Maroo bazar as kiosk (there is a meaning for this)
• If you delist your item earlier, it would still take one of your trade per day.
• If it ends but noone buys it - no trades would be deducted from daily trade pool
• Items that you enlisted would be locked in your inventory untill someone buys it or auction (offers) ends.
• No way to change price once you post item to AH.
• Quantity field only allowed for tradeable resources like fish.
• Money for sold items would be getting on your mailbox
• If you win riven from auction you would get item on your mailbox
• Minimum price for various categories ex prime parts min 5p, mods 5p, syndicate weapons 30p, syndicate mods 10p, syndicate archwing parts 10p
• No maximum price
• Buying item would cut one trade per day 

Then i would start monitoring how prices are fluctuating and act if there is something wrong (that is the reason why sell tax is a must)

Let's start:

• Why? If I get like 200 Growing power Mods just because I farm them and this is my business model to earn money. I need to be banned or limited ?
• Why do mean by that? Do I have to put the same items online once again after 48 hours ? (Loose time) Or I cannot put them never again? (So, great)
• First you told players can get scammed it's unfair let's regulate, now you're are saying let's scammed everyone for 5% and then maybe 2% maybe 25%. Please don't turn DE Evil, they are great people and developers. They make superb game called Warframe and if they wan't to get tax in plat they literally they will implement in trading without turning their heads with AH implementation
•  Some base riven math: If you spend 1500 plat you can have/posses up to 90 rivens. You think it's a big number? NO. WHY? Start with weapons if you assumme that normal/prisma/prime/vandal/wraith/dex verion is one weapon that gives about 150 weapon. Now begin real fun: Melee rivens hat 25 effects sticks with suffixes and prefixes, that's give like 300 variats of two possitives, 300 variants of  two possitives and one negative, 2300 variant of 3 possitive and 2300 variants of 3 possitives and one negative effects in total  5200 variants for each melee weapon and like 4600 variants for primary/secondary weapons. Let's simplify that to average 4800 variants of effects for each weapon that give like 720 000 rivens. You are really want us turn into no-life-farming-kuva-robots just to get the right roll to sell it's at good price?
• It's already working and you know what some people are waiting till 1 AM (my time zone) to make trade cause someone ask for it.
• Why? Seriously do you get scammed every day to punish every seller in game? Think that lately DE just change stats for every primary/secondary weapon that means you have to be punish for not yours decisions? Secondly be aware that have the right to make misstakes they should have right to correct them !!!
• Nothing new.
• Another Why? You're going to add 2048 puplic hubs just to make trades.
• Nothing new.
• You're locking trading just to TH or AH. It's a great limitation.
• Are you trying to scammed all the players who make misstakes in putting price, you're little devil :)
• We already have problems with fishermans or miners durring bouties. You really wan't us to suffer?
• You're locking trading just to TH or AH. It's limitation for those what we have now.
• Yeah. People just like getting 500 mails because they went to holidays. Yay:)
• All fresh players will be thanksful for that. No free Streamline, no free continuity, no free paris prime? Even no free rewards from clan events? (yes some clans do their own events with prizes)
• Nothing new.
• Nothing new.

 

Fluctuations are random deviations of a system from its average state, that occur in a system at equilibrium.

Oscillation - a cyclic change of a certain size, relative to another variable, usually temporary or spatial.

If you tell me that "Baro electric mods" price are fluctuating instead of oscillate I will be sure that you haven't play Warframe for long.

 

P.S. Do you work for battle.net/ Activision/ blizzard? I am just curious?

 

[(PSN)KresTias]

Nobody punish sellers except DE 

[PatternistSlave]

1 hour ago, Kaminariss said:

Currently by doing pretty much nothing im still earning 2 tokens per month.

Bull.

1 hour ago, Kaminariss said:

How is the system preventing abuse? Platinum sellers sell large quantity at once so nothing is there to prevent it. On a local auction website (similar to ebay.com) I can see platinum, prime parts, pretty much everything available for real money. Hundreds of auctions.

There is no system that completely prevents abuse.  LoL has no trading whatsoever and there are still people selling skins and such on ebay.  The current system discourages abuse since it requires a relatively large amount of personal involvement that is difficult to replicate with a bot, is inconvenient to use for large quantities, and is ambiguous enough to hinder price manipulation.

2 hours ago, Kaminariss said:

Thats probably the only similarity

Any others you've chosen to ignore or misrepresent.  Weapons can be traded in Warframe like in Diablo for example, but that didn't suit your narrative.

1 hour ago, torsoreaper said:

how insanely convenient it is to have an AH.

Yes it's convenient.  This convenience comes with a price, however.  This convenience allows veterans to easily sell items they otherwise wouldn't that are much more difficult for newer players to obtain.  This convenience makes it easier for marketeers to manipulate prices.  This convenience allows botters to quickly and easily unload items.

2 hours ago, torsoreaper said:

Aside from how good it is for the players,

I dare you to find a game that values your time like Warframe.  Please.  I'll play it.

[Kaminariss]

53 minutes ago, PatternistSlave said:

since it requires a relatively large amount of personal involvement that is difficult to replicate with a bot, is inconvenient to use for large quantities, and is ambiguous enough to hinder price manipulation.

It requires pretty much the same amount of involvement as in other games. You are probably thinking about mailbox but unfortuately for gold sellers, If they would be sending gold to buyers thru mailbox their accounts would be banned pretty fast. If you wanna sell gold in wow for example you gotta involve yourself even more than in warframe. People sometimes goes as far as making proxy accounts, fake guilds to launder gold.

 

1 hour ago, PatternistSlave said:

Weapons can be traded in Warframe like in Diablo for example, but that didn't suit your narrative.

Yeah only special weapons like syndicate weapons. Diablo had open trade system for real money, currently you pretty much cannot trade anything except 2h after dropping and only among the people who were with you in party. I would say Warframe is even closer to TERA than Diablo3 in many aspects.

1 hour ago, PatternistSlave said:

This convenience makes it easier for marketeers to manipulate prices.  This convenience allows botters to quickly and easily unload items.

Manipulating prices with trade limit and limit of concurrent items would be impossible, its easier to manipulate prices using trade chat/warframe.market as I do not even need to own specific item. Botting is super hard in warframe. I thought we already got past those points?

1 hour ago, PatternistSlave said:

I dare you to find a game that values your time like Warframe.  Please.  I'll play it.

If you wanna make real money you can start with Eve online, WoW is decent too as long as you know how to not get banned for selling it.

1 hour ago, PatternistSlave said:

Bull.

Currently im online each day for around 10 minutes in WoW. All I am doing is sending mission for followers for 12 chars. Usually you get 2.5k for such mission and it you get ~1 mission per day. Lets calculate:

12 * 2.5k = 30k per day (5-10 minutes of game time)
now if you assume average month has 30 days it is 900K of pure gold for 300 minutes = 5 hours. 
Token costs 300K in Europeian realms according to https://wowtoken.info/ so I could buy 3 of those tokens in month
Token is equivalent of 1 month of gameplay OR 20 Euro in their shop.
Now if I check prices in auction website, 100K of gold costs 72 PLN = 17.24EUR

If I wanted to buy things from blizzard the 5 hours earns me 60EUR
If I wanted to sell gold directly I can make 153EUR

Now how much can you earn in Warframe during 5 hours of gameplay? Even if you would be on WinStreak for whole 5 hours thats 1000p tops = 25USD.

Now the fun part, you can send those missions using mobile app: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.blizzard.wowcompanion
So you might as well not waste any time and send missions during toilet sessions :D

If you still don't belive me, here is my amount of gold owned in WoW: https://i.imgur.com/jXU72UT.png
If i would sell it for real money that would be 3240 PLN = 776 EUR

Before inflation that was worth around 4 times more.

[Mr.Holyroller]

Having an auction house would definitely mean more people would be buying and selling items, which means more plat in circulation and incentive for buying plat, but with cheaper item prices due to better competition for selling.

Which means everybody would benefit from it

[Umbranoir]

Warframe's economy really doesn't allow for a stable 'auction house' in game that wouldn't make trading worthless.

How a traditional MMO's economy handles player auctions is simple:

-In a standard MMORPG lets say the level cap is 100. Gear or items are generally given a 'minimum level' and this gear is typically found at the appropriate point in the game for the minimum level on the item. The higher the minimum level, the more of the playerbase is locked out from the item this adds a little (if any) intrinsic value to it.

-Then there's rarity, again there's rarer items available at each of the levels, the rarer items are generally (but not necessarily) better than common items and this makes some more valuable than others. In most MMORPGs there is some form of 'legendary' or 'elite' items which are typically highly sought after but equally rare or hard to acquire.

-Then of course there's the usefulness of the gear itself. Just because a high level rare item is harder to find, does not make it inherently better than another item. Generally stats have a random aspect to it or there is enough differing rare items at differing stages of the game to cater for different classes/playstyles

The above overlap to make a simple 'loot' system that allows for thousands and thousands of items of different rarity and levels, each of these items have a different value and players can post their gear in an auction house to sell. This generally works as there is a multitude of different options with different levels, rarities and stats that fit different players and whilst there is some competing for the best prices, there isn't an overabundance of one item allowing for prices to be still worth the time to post the gear.

Cut to warframe. Currently the prices of weapons and warframes, Arcanes, mods etc are all over the place. This is both a good and a bad thing. Yes. You have the dunce trying to get 200pl for a Valkyr Prime set but you also have Good Guy Greg trying to get a smooth 80 for his. This would not be the case if an in-game auction house was a thing. Warframe does not have (outside of Rivens) a roster of thousands of randomly generated gear that you can get lucky on or get worthless junk. In comparison its roster of tradeable goods is rather small.

It currently happens on Warframe.market The lowest price for Item A is 100plat. Well Timmy wants his platinum soon, he'll put his up for sale for 90 platinum. Now Warframe Market remains somewhat competitive as not everyone knows of it, and not everyone uses it to sell but what if everyone you see flying by in trade chat with a Ember Prime set for sale or a Maiming strike started putting theirs up on Auction Houses, each one trying to beat the others price. There is a set price clear as day that is the current 'best' price and it's naive to think that everyone would just hold on to their item until the lowest price on AH goes up to something atleast remotely worth it or just put theirs up for a higher price than the current lowest and wait until someone pays more than they have to for an item or that you could just match the lowest price and expect everyone else selling the same item to and wait for your lottery winnings. Best case scenario- Rivens become much easier to sell. Worst case scenario- There isn't nearly enough 'unique' items in the game, it'd be a hundred thousand people trying to sell a prime set, each trying to beat the other's price. Hello 1pl Banshee set.

[Aggh]

45 minutes ago, Mr.Holyroller said:

Having an auction house would definitely mean more people would be buying and selling items, which means more plat in circulation and incentive for buying plat, but with cheaper item prices due to better competition for selling.

Which means everybody would benefit from it

The existing supply on anything that can actively be farmed is waaaay to high for it to work out like that.  Think about it, how many games have rare drops with a 33% drop rate?   It's amazing that they're even worth anything.  Even mods like condition overload (which has a .02% drop chance) are only worth 50-60 plat in the current market.  Even with increased demand there would just be way to much supply exposed by an AH for prices to ever recover.  Prime sets would be so cheap that any plat purchases they'd incentivized would be meaningless.    It'd be a net loss for DE and free players. As it is prime sets already go for cheaper than anything on the market and they already drive plat purchases. 

The barrier that current trade system creates between actual supply and demand currently is keeping prices at a good middle ground where most things are affordable and actually worth farming for.  Messing with that for a bit of extra convenience is a bad idea.

Edited March 1, 2018 by Aggh

[Mr.Holyroller]

17 minutes ago, Aggh said:

The existing supply on anything that can actively be farmed is waaaay to high for it to work out like that.  Think about it, how many games have rare drops with a 33% drop rate?   It's amazing that they're even worth anything.  Even mods like condition overload (which has a .02% drop chance) are only worth 50-60 plat in the current market.  Even with increased demand there would just be way to much supply exposed by an AH for prices to ever recover.  Prime sets would be so cheap that any plat purchases they'd incentivized would be meaningless.    It'd be a net loss for DE and free players. As it is prime sets already go for cheaper than anything on the market and they already drive plat purchases. 

The barrier that current trade system creates between actual supply and demand currently is keeping prices at a good middle ground where most things are affordable and actually worth farming for.  Messing with that for a bit of extra convenience is a bad idea.

Except for price gouging rivens or taking advantage of newer players

[Kaminariss]

36 minutes ago, Umbranoir said:

Warframe's economy really doesn't allow for a stable 'auction house' in game that wouldn't make trading worthless.

 

37 minutes ago, Umbranoir said:

Warframe does not have (outside of Rivens) a roster of thousands of randomly generated gear that you can get lucky on or get worthless junk. In comparison its roster of tradeable goods is rather small.

Oh wow, finally a guy who knows what he is talking about, yes, thats the reason why warframe does not need so much auction house. And it is perfectly valid.

40 minutes ago, Umbranoir said:

Best case scenario- Rivens become much easier to sell. Worst case scenario- There isn't nearly enough 'unique' items in the game, it'd be a hundred thousand people trying to sell a prime set, each trying to beat the other's price. Hello 1pl Banshee set.

If a price of banshee prime set would reach 1p nobody would be picking it from loot table. Thats just how supply and demand curve works. If something is worthless, supply will start dropping out. Noone would bother selling prime set for so low if they could just pick some brown items or even forma blueprints since they would be worth more.

 

39 minutes ago, Aggh said:

Prime sets would be so cheap that any plat purchases they'd incentivized would be meaningless.    It'd be a net loss for DE and free players. As it is prime sets already go for cheaper than anything on the market and they already drive plat purchases. 

Read what i wrote above. As soon as the items becomes worthless people will stop supplying them -> price rises.

 

40 minutes ago, Aggh said:

The barrier that current trade system creates between actual supply and demand currently is keeping prices at a good middle ground where most things are affordable and actually worth farming for.  Messing with that for a bit of extra convenience is a bad idea.

Wrong, market would still regulate prices as they are on current level. Add tax to it and median prices will rise. You actually got it the other way around. It is the supply and demand what drives prices. Not some illusionary barrier that doesn't even exist. The only inconvenience now is that you need to copy and paste from warframe.market, paste it to game and invite once he agrees. 

[RistN]

On 25.2.2018. at 12:47 AM, Nakak said:

I'm not able to figure out how trading destroys the game experience for people. I mostly use my trades as giveaways and prizes for the clan I am a part of. 

Maybe because those people don't buy platinum and it is their only source of getting it.Standard in many countries is not the same and if you are not from some western country where it is normal thing to throw lots of money into the game then trade is only place where you can get it.Some are lucky to even have internet.

If you are using trade only to gift stuff then you are surely only getting platinum for money.

I hate bringing this up and I hope no one gets offended by it but thats just how things are.

On the subject of the topic I can only say I am satisfied how things work and in game market would only make every thing worthless at some point.Almost all drops are pure RNG meaning everyone can get some valuable thing if they are lucky enough and some new players would sell it for nothing to get forma or reactor.Imagine how that would influence prices.

[(PSN)Boomstickman98]

33 minutes ago, Kaminariss said:

Wrong, market would still regulate prices as they are on current level. Add tax to it and median prices will rise. You actually got it the other way around. It is the supply and demand what drives prices. Not some illusionary barrier that doesn't even exist. The only inconvenience now is that you need to copy and paste from warframe.market, paste it to game and invite once he agrees. 

What if they are not actually online? What if you are a console player? In the first scenario, you are clearly feigning ignorance on how the warframe.market site's status works. That status is dictated by no algorithm, but the players themselves. In the second scenario you are basically telling console players that it sucks to suck having no easy way to input or even ascertain whether the player is even online or not. This is inherently problematic, as this makes several extra hoops to jump through in order for a chance to get one trade completed for console. You need to remember that PC is not the only platform people play on, as you can clearly see by how I am listed as a PS4 player. Please try to think of a solution that fixes these aforementioned problems, all the other problems previously listed in this thread, and has to work for all platforms. You will quickly see that the argument of warframe.market is not sufficient.

[torsoreaper]

4 hours ago, PatternistSlave said:

Yes it's convenient.  This convenience comes with a price, however.  This convenience allows veterans to easily sell items they otherwise wouldn't that are much more difficult for newer players to obtain.  This convenience makes it easier for marketeers to manipulate prices.  This convenience allows botters to quickly and easily unload items.

I dare you to find a game that values your time like Warframe.  Please.  I'll play it.

First point - wtf are you even talking about.  Market manipulation is soooo ridiculously easy right now.  You don't even need to own an item to say WTS 50p repeatedly in trade chat to try to peg the market down.  You don't even need to own an item to put it up for sale on warframe.market.  Botters? Botters? are you being serious right now? LOL.  That doesn't even dignify a response.

Second point - Way to cut my quote out of context to suite your needs.  I will post the full quote here so people can know how badly you misquoted me: "I think DE could greatly benefit because they could even post a trade tax of 1p to list and 1p to buy which would create a larger platinum sink than what they have now."  I was saying I am happy for DE to have an additional source of revenue, don't try to make it sound like I have an adversarial position against DE making money.  I want DE to make money so they can continue to be successful.  GTFO out with your out of context accusations.

[Kaminariss]

9 minutes ago, RistN said:

and in game market would only make every thing worthless at some point.Almost all drops are pure RNG meaning everyone can get some valuable thing if they are lucky enough and some new players would sell it for nothing to get forma or reactor.Imagine how that would influence prices.

Yeah you are totally right, everything would become worthless so onone would be bothering selling them anymore to get measly 1p for prime parts, that would make supply hit the rock bottom, oh wait! what happens when supply reaches abyssal levels but demand stays the same?

3 minutes ago, (PS4)Boomstickman98 said:

Please try to think of a solution that fixes these aforementioned problems, all the other problems previously listed in this thread, and has to work for all platforms. You will quickly see that the argument of warframe.market is not sufficient.

As far as I know PS4 has web browser built in am i right? You can attach mouse and keyboard to console thats for sure. I am not a console player but I was sure you actually can copy a paste from a their browser: https://www.playstationtrophies.org/forum/ps4-discussion/269950-how-highlight-copy-paste-text-ps4s-internet-browser.html

 

[Loswaith]

9 hours ago, PatternistSlave said:

They are competent and would know a trading system would be utilized to trade.  The level of naivete your assuming is outright absurd.

You're the one attributing what I have said at all to DE being naive. 
Purpose does not define somethings use two years (or more) after the fact. There have been many things DE didn't count on players doing within the game that was never intended.  Not because DE are naive in the slightest, but because DE doesn't see the game the same way as players do.
You seem to see trading all about making platinum, DE (and many of the players that initially asked for trading) saw trading as a way for players to help other players (something a trading post/auction house style system wouldn't have achieved).

Keep in mind only mods and prime parts (only in the void then) could be traded when trading was first added to the game (FYI: update 11, November 2013, still the first year it was in open beta).  While there was also much less to spend plat on out side of the basics as there were very few cosmetics, no gifting, no Riven (u19), No AW (u15), no Syndicates (u15), no Baro (u15) and many other aspects were not even in the game that have made trading more popular and developed an economy around it. 

DE likely wasn't sure the game would even still be going strong 3-4 years later, and have often mentioned they didn't expect Warframe to become as big as it has. 
All those aspects are simple to say "oh but DE must have considered it or must be naive if they didn't".  They aren't omniscient and the game was a hugely different beast back then.  They had no reason at all to actually consider trading would become a fully fledged economy with all its own goals and drives.

 

9 hours ago, PatternistSlave said:

These are issues the biggest game companies in the industry have struggled with.  Blizzard struggled with.  It might literally be impossible to maintain the level of accessibility to free players with an auction house.  Literally impossible.  Comparable games don't have them.

DE already hit on a restriction many of those companies don't use: limited trades per day.  Thus DE decided to try something new that really works, by looking at issues other games have had in the past.  Doesn't take much to realise that they aren't going to stop using those 'fixes' or maybe even try new ideas as well.

Edited March 1, 2018 by Loswaith

[(PSN)Boomstickman98]

1 minute ago, Kaminariss said:

As far as I know PS4 has web browser built in am i right? You can attach mouse and keyboard to console thats for sure. I am not a console player but I was sure you actually can copy a paste from a their browser: https://www.playstationtrophies.org/forum/ps4-discussion/269950-how-highlight-copy-paste-text-ps4s-internet-browser.html

 

That...I actually was unaware of. That said, it just doesn't feel right to me that we are forced to resort to a third-party site just to get trading done because the system that DE is just that fundamentally broken. I and many of the people I talk to about WF all share the opinion the the chat is currently utter garbage. I am honestly surprised DE has not done something by now to mitigate this issue. They know how many players they have. Heck, even using analytics of the amount of players via the steam client with an all time high of 121,377 players online within the past seven days and assuming that only 10% of them are actively using the in game trade chat, that is approximately 12,137 people posting in in trade chat every two minutes. That shows that something needs to be done to protect the sanity of the players if nothing else.

[Kaminariss]

1 minute ago, (PS4)Boomstickman98 said:

I and many of the people I talk to about WF all share the opinion the the chat is currently utter garbage

Well, thats something we agree on. Not only for trade but recruit as well. This game needs a group finder way more than AH.

Unfortunately (trust me, I am developer with about 8+ years of experience, most of them is ecommerce) making AH is no easy task. To make basic AH functionality I would say around 300-600 hours just for the backend (yeah i am backend dev, Im not dealing with visuals). That is 2-3 months of work.

Not only that. Did you know that AH would have more impact on their servers than whole game combined? Currently when you are on a mission you don't connect to their server untill the mission success screen. Mission host (aka. player number 1) is acting as a server for the rest of the players. So server upgrades might be needed before even attempting to write AH.

So that would mean if they would start working on AH right now we wouldn't see any new updates for at least 5+ months. That is the second argument against AH. Their team may be too small for this to happen.

[(PSN)Boomstickman98]

2 minutes ago, Kaminariss said:

So that would mean if they would start working on AH right now we wouldn't see any new updates for at least 5+ months. That is the second argument against AH. Their team may be too small for this to happen.

Hmm, I suppose I could see that. They do have the money to hire on more workers, as they did say that money was not an issue for them a while back. The problem would then lie in training the new employees, ensuring the employees fit in with their teams, they might have to relocate if their Headquarters is not big enough to support new hires, etc. I can honestly see the argument there. Why would they go through all this work for a facet of the game that is not necessarily even something required. All this said though, I at least don't care how long it would take for this change to happen, so long as DE actually went through and did make a better way to trade in-game.

[PatternistSlave]

3 hours ago, Kaminariss said:

All I am doing is sending mission for followers for 12 chars...you can send those missions using mobile app

Apparently Blizzards economy is more broken than I could have imagined.  They pay you not to play the game.  Good call.  Explains why Hearthstone became such pay2win crap.

Oh and we've gone into my not writing a tutorial on how to cheat.  You can't figure it out on your own I guess you'll continue to believe it "impossible".  DE seem aware of it though, designed their system pretty well to discourage it, and it's a good reason an auction house shouldn't happen.

3 hours ago, Mr.Holyroller said:

Having an auction house would definitely mean more people would be buying and selling items, which means more plat in circulation and incentive for buying plat, but with cheaper item prices due to better competition for selling.

You're absolutely correct.  Less value of time compared to money.  More pay2win.

3 hours ago, Mr.Holyroller said:

Which means everybody would benefit from it

Everyone benefits from pay2win?  Dude.

57 minutes ago, torsoreaper said:

You don't even need to own an item to say WTS 50p repeatedly in trade chat to try to peg the market down.  You don't even need to own an item to put it up for sale on warframe.market. 

And you're dumb enough to price items based on either of these things?  Frankly this discussion always gets into very dangerous areas.  This post is a great example.  Granted your method doesn't work well and the current system does discourage this type of thing, but you are teaching anyone reading this a potential way to manipulate prices.  I will not.  You want convenience badly enough to ignore glaring issues there isn't much I could say to change your mind anyway.

1 hour ago, torsoreaper said:

don't try to make it sound like I have an adversarial position against DE making money. 

I didn't.

56 minutes ago, Loswaith said:

You seem to see trading all about making platinum, DE (and many of the players that initially asked for trading) saw trading as a way for players to help other players (something a trading post/auction house style system wouldn't have achieved).

Quite the contrary.  I enjoy and often trade items.

58 minutes ago, Loswaith said:

Thus DE decided to try something new that really works, by looking at issues other games have had in the past.

They did.  Let's not flush that down the toilet for the sake of convenience.

[Kaminariss]

26 minutes ago, PatternistSlave said:

Apparently Blizzards economy is more broken than I could have imagined.

Blizzard economy in WoW is ROCK SOLID compared to soft foam economy from warframe. There is a way in current system that lets you make money by doing only trades. And you don't need to be a genious to figure it out.

I learned this the hard way trying to change a price of one of the resources, just one, pumped 1 milion gold and bought Draenic dusts for anything below 2g per item. Basically bought more than a half of the whole server market. Then tried to sell them all for 2g. While I did earn some gold, maybe few thousands but overall it was gigantic loss of time. Soon after prices stabilized at the levels before my move. That was supply and demand in action.

 

29 minutes ago, PatternistSlave said:

They pay you not to play the game

No, you missed a crucial point from what I wrote. Read this one again: All I am doing is sending mission for followers for 12 chars.

 

37 minutes ago, PatternistSlave said:

And you're dumb enough to price items based on either of these things?  Frankly this discussion always gets into very dangerous areas.  This post is a great example.  Granted your method doesn't work well and the current system does discourage this type of thing, but you are teaching anyone reading this a potential way to manipulate prices.

Unfortunately it does work because there is no such thing as AH. While prices may change for a moment (and it is all we are after, to buy something cheaper) it will be soon stabilized again. But such tactics works on both trade chat and warframe.market.

[(PSN)creativedsign]

This is probably the worst trading experience i've even seen ... trading via chat? First I thought it's a joke, then I realized it's not... and it is instantly reminded me Destiny and how ppl used to use 3rd party LFG site to find raid groups. 

WF trading system is broken. Filters helped a little - but it's literally a patch, not a solution. DE please provide us with a proper trading experience after all this years - economy is a big part of this game. And right now it's broken!