Late.for.tea Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 Can't change your mind, because you see it exactly the way it is. If players want a challenge, they should handicap themselves; run suboptimal loadouts. Too bad that's a no go for most of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trst Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 (edited) The cycle is very much true. DE has in-fact given us end-game content many times over but we've either become stronger than it or found methods to cheese it. It isn't even entirely DE's fault. When the game was younger players wanted bigger and better weapons and abilities and the mod system was very 2-dimensional, it was more expected that the old end-game would be phased out eventually. Also every time DE has tried to "balance" the game (which is necessary to have a "proper" long lasting end-game) the community pulls out their pitchforks over it. There is also no real consensus as to what the community even wants as there are always conflicting requests throws around. Demand end-game but refuse all weapon balancing. Demand armor scaling rework (making high-level enemies easier) but also want higher level enemies and end-game. Demand less farm/grind then complain there isn't anything else to do. Players want a proper and functional end-game? Go see how the gun-play is in Conclave and imagine that translated to PvE, the community would absolutely lose their sh*t over it. Forgot to mention, the community has also requested more mechanics related to killing enemies than have them be bullet sponges, yet the enemies that meet that criteria right now are repeatedly complained about (Nullifies, Nox, Scrambus/Comba). Edited April 23, 2018 by trst Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PookieNumnums Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 There can only be two true endgames. Dojo invasions based on average mastery of members in a clan And slappers only operator pvp Clem / fashionframe to to the square root of region chat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PookieNumnums Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 Or, perhaps, a special mode with frames having no abilities and equal stats and unmodded starter gear against progressively harder to kill (not harder hitting) enemies. Put umbra behind that grind and endgame it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NocheLuz Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 19 minutes ago, trst said: Forgot to mention, the community has also requested more mechanics related to killing enemies than have them be bullet sponges, yet the enemies that meet that criteria right now are repeatedly complained about (Nullifies, Nox, Scrambus/Comba). Those enemies can just f**k off!!... I'm kidding lol... I'm just don't get why enemies can 'Disable' our Warframe ability... But not gun... Is there a lore somewhere?? I wanna know. But the enemy jamming us to not use ability is one thing. But enemies that can Disable an already activated ability?? No, god NO!! It was like you fire a misslie then you got jam so you cannot fire a second one. But the one you have already fired flying back to your silo (lol). It was like you light a fire with a matches. Then somebody take your matches your fire just gone... yeah, it was like that. It's Warframe you know!! no other faction can replicate the Warframe even they have the Blueprints. IT'S WARFRAMES!! how can they disable that easily... PS. I'm not fully know the lore of the game but the gimmick should also stay with the lore. Not like using missile weapon in Roman Age right... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oreades Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 My thoughts? Eh I've been blaming Endless modes for all of DEs balance problems for like a small eternity now :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TENNO_NOT_FOUND Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 (edited) I'm a little confused as to why people use "lack of endgame" when critiquing a game, like it is something a game -must- have. Isn't endgame the "what do I do next, when everything is completed" state of a game? I don't think you can demand content specifically designed to keep you playing after you've completed all the content. That, too, will grow stale in time. Once you hit a point where you are no longer interested in playing, you've hit endgame. At that point, it falls on you to either make a reason to continue playing for yourself, or leave. There are lots of other games out there, Chances are slim that people would be happy with the form a solution to "lack of endgame" on most games would take. For those of you that played Nier, endgame is: Leave knowing you completed the game. Help someone else complete the game. I don't think there's any content that can motivate anyone that has completed the game to continue playing short of e-sports and punishing the player for not logging in. And both of those aren't for everyone. Edited April 23, 2018 by C_MAJOR grammar redundancy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDxBarracka Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 The game only ends when you stop playing it GG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unus Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 Forgive me for asking, but, folks, I've gotta ask, what IS this "Change My Mind" thing from? It HAS to be a reference to something, I know, but, what? Endgamewise? I'm not sufficiently qualified to evaluate anything, I'm along for the story. End Game, for me, is when Digital finally stamps the "Done" label on Warframe and creates something at the conclusion that is appetizing for those folks who want to "take it to the next level. Perhaps a rotateing modifier sortie-style version of Simaris' realm, with additional modifiers tacked on every 5 waves and resetting at the 3 maximum, something that could be eternally (or as close as one can get) fun, as well as co-oppetative (fight togethor, face each other.) That could be Warframe's Swansong before it goes into eternal maintainence mode as Digital moves on to it's next Independent Property/ Collapses/ Becomes a metal band under Steve's leadership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gharsan Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 1. Please let's stop using "change my mind". It's purely pointless because the word "discussion" already implies the very thing and it is very cringy. 2. The definition of endgame is unclear and subjective. Some people think there's already endgame in Warframe. Some people think it's the Sortie. Some people think it's the Conclave. Some people think it's the Riven and the Kuva farming. Some people think it's the new Beast of Sanctuary. Some people think they are not. I don't think anyone's right or wrong, because there's no such thing as definitive "endgame". My personal definition of endgame? Something that makes you keep coming back to the game after you are somewhat confidently "done" with most of its contents (So yes. Although it is a joke, fashion framing CAN be the endgame). 3. The cycle described is true for every single online games that constantly get updated. The "endgame" for WoW a few years ago? Not anymore. The "level 80 endgame boss" in some random game? Not anymore once your level cap increases by 100 along with the new gearset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Timidobserver Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 Same reason that Kuva survival has scaling difficulty but static rewards. The casual minded player would complain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trst Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 2 hours ago, NocheLuz said: Those enemies can just f**k off!!... I'm kidding lol... I'm just don't get why enemies can 'Disable' our Warframe ability... But not gun... Is there a lore somewhere?? I wanna know. But the enemy jamming us to not use ability is one thing. But enemies that can Disable an already activated ability?? No, god NO!! It was like you fire a misslie then you got jam so you cannot fire a second one. But the one you have already fired flying back to your silo (lol). It was like you light a fire with a matches. Then somebody take your matches your fire just gone... yeah, it was like that. It's Warframe you know!! no other faction can replicate the Warframe even they have the Blueprints. IT'S WARFRAMES!! how can they disable that easily... PS. I'm not fully know the lore of the game but the gimmick should also stay with the lore. Not like using missile weapon in Roman Age right... I'm not the biggest lore buff but if I'm not mistaken the Corpus have a lot of ties to the Orokin (even existed at the same time as them) and a lot of Corpus technology is salvaged/re-purposed Orokin tech. I mean Alad V even cobbles his Zanuka together from butchered Warframes so it isn't much of a stretch that such tech made it's way into other Corpus proxies. Also as far as game design goes the existence of the nullifying units gave them a leg to stand on. Grineer have armor, Infested have aura buffs and toxic damage, and Corpus have ability nullification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NocheLuz Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 5 hours ago, trst said: Also as far as game design goes the existence of the nullifying units gave them a leg to stand on. Grineer have armor, Infested have aura buffs and toxic damage, and Corpus have ability nullification. Talking about Armor, this game armor is werid too. It's was like... your skin can stop bullets. No bullets can penetrate your skin. But then you wearing cloth, suddenly you're weak to bullets. You can be killed as long as your wearing the cloth. But if you were strip of the cloth/Armor... you're immune to bullets again... weird right?? But if armor is acting like 'Armor' that is reducing damage as long as you have Armor, and lose the effect when you got strip. Not just one of a Health type where it make you weak to some damage type and can be killed easily with that damage type, but then make you stronger to that damage type when get strip. Shiled also weird... It can stop any bullets from hitting Health point but suddenly 'Slash'!! You lose your health overtime even though bombs cannot even scratch your skin as long as the shiled is up... Toxin damage is one thing, but after you have combine it with other elemental damage... It lose the effect of bypassing the shield... What if I want Toxin and Fire Elemental at the same time but not want to combine them?? There should me more option in modding the gun too... PS. This is just my opinion of playing this game about 4 years long lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindigoTG Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 (edited) 8 hours ago, Unus said: Forgive me for asking, but, folks, I've gotta ask, what IS this "Change My Mind" thing from? It HAS to be a reference to something, I know, but, what? It's a reference to this show https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL3e1orPYt_4ZHGjuivZFsyJ81RL7j7_E1 Edited April 24, 2018 by WindigoTG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unus Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 10 minutes ago, WindigoTG said: It's a reference to this show https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL3e1orPYt_4ZHGjuivZFsyJ81RL7j7_E1 Ah. . . I see. . . what a. . . what a show. Thanks for quenching that broiling fire of curiousity though sir/mam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patzer Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 From my experience, no game has end game to which whole player base seem to agree. So in other words it already has it and never will? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)BOSS_TPH76 Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 "end game" as a playable feature doesn't exist...it is simply "more game". Per definition "end game" is the end of the game. And unless you want the game to have a defined "end" then what you are really asking for is more game at your power level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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