Analysis: The heavy inflation of rivens due to platinum economy and lack of disposition monitoring - leading to unsustainable prices and possible countermeasures

[Yatazanami]

5 minutes ago, Kuez said:

There's one problem with this statement - you could not get these kubrows in anyother whay than plat, whereas with rivens you can reroll them with kuva which is "easily" acquirable through in game activities.

kubrow was meant as a fun edition to the game 

Rivens was meant as a fix for big problem with the core of the game 

see the deference ? i should dont have to invest money and ton of grind to buy rng crutches that i am only going to use with already powerful guns anyway 

its just wrong on so many levels 

[Yatazanami]

Just now, fishworshipper said:

@Yatazanami While I do agree that Dispositions should be updated regularly, you're seriously overestimating the scope of the problem. Riven trading isn't going to kill Warframe.

its making more spaghetti for DE to untangle on top of the mess we have now, wish will lead in the end to the demise of this game sometimes in the near future .

[Kuez]

32 minutes ago, Yatazanami said:

kubrow was meant as a fun edition to the game 

Rivens was meant as a fix for big problem with the core of the game 

That's a good point.

32 minutes ago, Yatazanami said:

i should dont have to invest money and ton of grind to buy rng crutches that i am only going to use with already powerful guns anyway 

its just wrong on so many levels 

Although I still don't agree with the money part. 😄
I agree with the grind part, because at the same time I also agree with the fact that rivens were supposed to bring old weapons back to life.

That's why I proposed:

9 hours ago, Kuez said:

That's one of the reasons why rivens are so expansive - their high disposition. (Repeating myself) Let's prevent that by normalizing their stats and adjusting weapon stats instead.
In my opinion they (dispositions) should not exist, at all.

Warframe is an RNG based game, but rivens are using it in 3 ways: Acquisition, base stats, and values. Why not bring it down to just 2 factors? Acquisition and base stats.
It think that when it comes to usefulness, rivens could fall somewhere in between Rare and Legendary mods or be just a little better that Legendary ones.

 

Edited September 24, 2018 by Kuez

[Yatazanami]

22 minutes ago, LupisV0lk said:

Golly Gee could it be that if they did they community would throw one hell of a temper tantrum when their "god rolls" are touched?

did that ever stop DE from nerfing  Nekros desecrate loot chance , changing pilfering swarm from begin effected by power strength (please dont insult me by saying it was a bug)

making ore gaze augment for atlas cap at 50% chance for loot to drop and much more, because when it comes to DE bottom line

they dont give a flying duck about your feeling

Edited September 24, 2018 by Yatazanami

[-AiLuoLi-]

27 minutes ago, LupisV0lk said:

Golly Gee could it be that if they did they community would throw one hell of a temper tantrum when their "god rolls" are touched?

Riven stats/disposition ever changing was the mechanic since the very beginning. Whining just because their god roll got "nerfed" is just plain dumb.

This should never be the excuse for DE to abandon the riven system.

Edited September 24, 2018 by -AiLuoLi-

[Yatazanami]

6 minutes ago, -AiLuoLi- said:

This should never be the excuse for DE to abandon the riven system

the smug demons never did lol ! check this 

Spoiler

Spoiler

now compare that with this old dog 

Spoiler

if we dont stand up, we're going to see more of this ! i mean we get the same déjà vu 3 times already have mercy DE  ! 😞  

Edited September 24, 2018 by Yatazanami

[Fallen_Echo]

11 hours ago, Omega said:

WHY do we have the riven system in place if you guys are unable to monitor the system and ensure that the rivens provide the most benefits to the weapons that are the most unpopular/underutilized?

From the very begining this promise has failed as some weapons are soo bad not even a godlike impossible riven can save them.

Some day ago i wanted to see what riven i would need for my synoid simulor to turn it into a murder machine atleast against the infested. The riven needed four +300% stats what is impossible to get, i needed +damage, +crit chance, +elemental damage and +critical damage to reach the damage levels of an unrivened sybaris.

[LupisV0lk]

59 minutes ago, Yatazanami said:

the smug demons never did lol ! check this 

  Reveal hidden contents

  Reveal hidden contents

now compare that with this old dog 

  Reveal hidden contents

if we dont stand up, we're going to see more of this ! i mean we get the same déjà vu 3 times already have mercy DE  ! 😞  

You have to be a special kind of stupid to take stock in "leaked" stats being 100% confirmed.

[LupisV0lk]

1 hour ago, -AiLuoLi- said:

This should never be the excuse for DE to abandon the riven system.

It is when people hold DE's income ransom if they don't like what weapon was touched.

[Yatazanami]

1 hour ago, LupisV0lk said:

You have to be a special kind of stupid to take stock in "leaked" stats being 100% confirmed.

i guess so , it seems like a place holder when you read this description :

Born anew, the father of placeholders returns .

1 hour ago, LupisV0lk said:

It is when people hold DE's income ransom if they don't like what weapon was touched.

after i reasoned with you for a whole page of comments you still fanboying DE no matter what ! 

old habits die hard . 😫

 

Edited September 24, 2018 by Yatazanami

[Yatazanami]

1 hour ago, LupisV0lk said:

You have to be a special kind of stupid to take stock in "leaked" stats being 100% confirmed.

Tiberon prime was leaked in the devstream (minus the riven disposition for obvious reasons )

now compare it with the final product :

Spoiler

now look me in the eyes and answer this ! 

are you naive enough to believe all of this was by mere accident ? how many prime accesses/vaults has been passed without any change to this power-creep ?

are you so brainwashed that you think DE will change Gram Prime leaked stats when they admitted they have no plan for Chroma Rework ?

look, Reworking Frames only with Deluxe/Prime access release is LAZY! , but not bothering altogether is so Scummy and Greedy and not Okay !

this is a 50$ package minimum let that sink in , for that kind of money i can buy Shadow die Twice / Red dead redemption 2 / Devil may cry 5 / freaking Monster-hunter world. etc ..

and if we eat this in silence ... then expect to see more of this soon 

you're a consumer like me and we have a common interest , please stand by me 🙂

 

[HugintheCrow]

15 hours ago, Omega said:

Let's start with problem 1.  How do we address too much platinum entering the economy (PC in particular)?  Unlike the PC side of Warframe, the console side pricing is generally more stable due to less platinum available in that economy.  Players are unable to purchase tradeable platinum with a 75% off coupon code.  This means less platinum in the overall economy but that is generally okay as the economy itself is more stable.  Riven prices for consoles hardly go above 2000 platinum for the best rolls for the best weapons.  The console side does get discount coupons for marketplace items which is acceptable because it does not impact the player economy much.  In my opinion, the discount coupons for platinum purchases on the PC side of Warframe should be removed and replaced with same system the console users have in order to stabilize the influx of platinum entering the economy.  I personally don't think it's right for daily tribute RNG to kick in which allows someone to purchase 4k platinum for $50 rather than $200.  One of the reasons why we won't have crossplay is imagine the trading situation between platforms - PC users have a huge advantage with platinum vs console users. At this time we currently have no comparable "platinum sinks" other than rivens so unless something else is available which provides some form of incentive people have no avenue of spending their platinum. At most you'll end up spending 5-6k for all the slots and forma necessary. 

This is not a problem. Not for 99% of the playerbase anyway. It's what most people that don't live in states/canada use to get plat for reasonable prices. Removing it would be a huge mistake on DE's part, both financially and marketing-wise.

Platinum as a "premium" currency does not require nor need "sinks", that's why credits exist. You use plat to obtain premium goods, if a "sink" for platinum existed, the game would become as cancerous as current "triple a" games that abuse microtransactions and dlc to extort money from their playerbase.

[DongInDaWrong]

5 minutes ago, HugintheCrow said:

 

Platinum as a "premium" currency does not require nor need "sinks", that's why credits exist. You use plat to obtain premium goods, if a "sink" for platinum existed, the game would become as cancerous as current "triple a" games that abuse microtransactions and dlc to extort money from their playerbase.

 

Dude you need this "premium" currency to buy basic stuff in the game.... Weapon Slots, Warframe slots,  even a  Credit booster that youre talking..

 

[HugintheCrow]

1 hour ago, Yatazanami said:

Tiberon prime was leaked in the devstream (minus the riven disposition for obvious reasons )

now compare it with the final product :

  Hide contents

now look me in the eyes and answer this ! 

are you naive enough to believe all of this was by mere accident ? how many prime accesses/vaults has been passed without any change to this power-creep ?

are you so brainwashed that you think DE will change Gram Prime leaked stats when they admitted they have no plan for Chroma Rework ?

look, Reworking Frames only with Deluxe/Prime access release is LAZY! , but not bothering altogether is so Scummy and Greedy and not Okay !

this is a 50$ package minimum let that sink in , for that kind of money i can buy Shadow die Twice / Red dead redemption 2 / Devil may cry 5 / freaking Monster-hunter world. etc ..

and if we eat this in silence ... then expect to see more of this soon 

you're a consumer like me and we have a common interest , please stand by me 🙂

 

You've just compared burst mode to auto mode on your picture so talk about dishonest.

And you rage about fanboys not accepting your arguments, while screaming bloody murder at anybody who disagrees with you and dismissing their arguments because you said so.How about you cool down a bit and start arguing like a civil person, and then you will have people arguing with you like civil people.

Don't expect people to take you seriously, if YOU don't take them seriously.

[HugintheCrow]

6 minutes ago, VirginForever said:

 

Dude you need this "premium" currency to buy basic stuff in the game.... Weapon Slots, Warframe slots,  even a  Credit booster that youre talking..

 

It's still premium. You buy it for real money (if you trade for it, someone still bought it for real money).

[SneakyErvin]

12 hours ago, Yatazanami said:

if this mess was completely free then yes , but in this case its called bait and switch, and theres real money involved here mind you 

and its free market my ass when DE is the owner, they can change riven disposition, tweak weapons stats , prime anything , fix things when they feel like it (total control)

and yes its they're game but keep in mind EA Battlefield V did exactly as you suggested quote : 

(they can do whatever they want and we can swallow the hard-to-swallow pill or find a new game)

the fan didn't swallow the ''pill' and the game get woke

hard .

But it is completely free. The player market is just what it is a player market with no control from DE. The players decide the value of things, DE doesnt hold them at gunpoint when they decide on idiotic riven prices. Yet people set these tardo prices with the possible changes to disposition or weapon stats in mind just as others buy them with those same risks in the back of their head.

Player driven exonomies turn out this way most of the time.

If DE would sell perfect rivens on their market for big plat and soon after change the disposition or nerf the weapon it would be bait and switch, but that isnt the case here. It is purely up to the players to decide what a thing is worth. DE arent responsible for any of the fallout that might happen later on. DE also doesnt earn anything on every player to player trade. At times they do, but in many cases it is simply current plat switching hands along with an item or more.

[DongInDaWrong]

15 hours ago, Omega said:

 n my opinion, the discount coupons for platinum purchases on the PC side of Warframe should be removed and replaced with same system the console users have in order to stabilize the influx of platinum entering the economy.  I personally don't think it's right for daily tribute RNG to kick in which allows someone to purchase 4k platinum for $50 rather than $200.   

 

Keep in mind that Platinum and even Prime Access.. which gives good amount of Plat.. is almost half as cheap in Poor countries..

And Warframe Trading isnt country/region restricted...

 

[SneakyErvin]

15 minutes ago, VirginForever said:

 

Keep in mind that Platinum and even Prime Access.. which gives good amount of Plat.. is almost half as cheap in Poor countries..

And Warframe Trading isnt country/region restricted...

 

Except that you forget about possible VAT in those countries that might be payed outside of the purchase aswell. It is also only cheaper if you buy it from a richer country, which in itself would be fraud and very likely bannable. For the residents of those countries it is just as expensive as it is for others.

[HugintheCrow]

25 minutes ago, VirginForever said:

 

Keep in mind that Platinum and even Prime Access.. which gives good amount of Plat.. is almost half as cheap in Poor countries..

And Warframe Trading isnt country/region restricted...

 

Fun fact: a brazilian paying 24 dollars is paying relatively more money than a person from United states paying 50 dollars. Why? Because the brazilian earns less money so they are using a larger percentage of their income than the person from US. It's pretty simple.

What you just did is what some people call first world privilege.

[LupisV0lk]

51 minutes ago, HugintheCrow said:

You've just compared burst mode to auto mode on your picture so talk about dishonest.

And you rage about fanboys not accepting your arguments, while screaming bloody murder at anybody who disagrees with you and dismissing their arguments because you said so.How about you cool down a bit and start arguing like a civil person, and then you will have people arguing with you like civil people.

Don't expect people to take you seriously, if YOU don't take them seriously.

Whoa there mate, be careful less you get tarred and feathered as a "fanboy"

[HugintheCrow]

Just now, LupisV0lk said:

Whoa there mate, be careful less you get tarred and feathered as a "fanboy"

I've been called that multiple times before, even though I'm more than comfortable to criticise DE when criticisms are due.

For example I agree with OP that DE completely dropped the ball when it comes to Riven disposition. It is unacceptable that they haven't updated it for so long.

I just really dislike when people try to force their arguments on others. If the issue is as complicated and subjective as this one, then there is no way that one person could be the only one that is right. There is some truth in everyone's perspective.

[Peter]

I do not see any problem in that, all online games have some overpriced item for rarity and demand.

Why not here?

[Yatazanami]

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

But it is completely free. The player market is just what it is a player market with no control from DE. The players decide the value of things, DE doesnt hold them at gunpoint when they decide on idiotic riven prices. Yet people set these tardo prices with the possible changes to disposition or weapon stats in mind just as others buy them with those same risks in the back of their head.

Player driven exonomies turn out this way most of the time.

If DE would sell perfect rivens on their market for big plat and soon after change the disposition or nerf the weapon it would be bait and switch, but that isnt the case here. It is purely up to the players to decide what a thing is worth. DE arent responsible for any of the fallout that might happen later on. DE also doesnt earn anything on every player to player trade. At times they do, but in many cases it is simply current plat switching hands along with an item or more.

give a break , DE is the one who call the shots on what weapon get primed and who get buffed/nerfed so they decide the price for the player directly even a stupid can see that

and this is not a player choice , this is monopoly and bait and switch from they're original goal , do you know what that is ? here we go 

DE promised us the riven system will make weak weapons viable [Bait]

DE made riven universal for all guns so even god-tier one can get one [switch]

even when you put the rarest riven you can in your Harbak/Busrton prime , Tiberon will crap on both of them without one (Tiberon prime have 5 stars disposition mind you)

DE created this failed system and its not fixing the game its doing quite the opposite 

and its not all sunshine and roses when it come to the system itself , i mean they're rng crutches , rng on top on rng on top of mundane kuva farming that also used for rng like WHAT  🤪

and we didnt ask for this crap , we asked for Damage 3.0 and we get this band-aids instead and it still our fault lol, this is why i hate full blown fanboying 

and are you telling me DE earn no money out of this ? please tell me this is a joke xD ! where do you think the traded plat end up in the end hm ? hint hint 

in the sink hole that is called the plat market (potatos, slots , deluxes, syandana ,and the list goes on) and once you spend it there it will not be switch hands anymore you genius
 

Edited September 24, 2018 by Yatazanami

[DongInDaWrong]

26 minutes ago, HugintheCrow said:

Fun fact: a brazilian paying 24 dollars is paying relatively more money than a person from United states paying 50 dollars. Why? Because the brazilian earns less money so they are using a larger percentage of their income than the person from US. It's pretty simple.

What you just did is what some people call first world privilege.

 

Expect that we're talking about digital goods.. and those that can be traded..
A russian/brazilian would have to pay the same amount of money for 1 ounce of gold that a person in the US has to pay..

 

[Yatazanami]

1 hour ago, HugintheCrow said:

You've just compared burst mode to auto mode on your picture so talk about dishonest.

And you rage about fanboys not accepting your arguments, while screaming bloody murder at anybody who disagrees with you and dismissing their arguments because you said so.How about you cool down a bit and start arguing like a civil person, and then you will have people arguing with you like civil people.

Don't expect people to take you seriously, if YOU don't take them seriously.

17 minutes ago, LupisV0lk said:

Whoa there mate, be careful less you get tarred and feathered as a "fanboy"

i am dishonest now eh ? challenge accepted  

leaked stats for Tiberon prime

Spoiler

source

compare it to the the final product :
 

Tiberon_prime_Wiki

 

now both of you do me a favor and eat some CROWS! 

 

Spoiler

(you both still welcome to discuss the heart of the matter without strawmanning if possible ^^ .)