Cosmetic Armor is a lost gameplay opportunity

[Rayden_Tenno]

On 2018-10-30 at 6:59 PM, FrostDragoon said:

Already is with things like Maiming Strike and Primed Mods with only come out every so many months, so people have to pay hundreds of plat for those mods. It's every bit as p2w (if not more) than what I'm suggesting.

What game are you playing? I've spent almost 500 plats in the last week. I havent bought one single of those plats with real money. I've traded mods and prime parts which i can get for FREE. Maim? Got it for free. Prime sets? Its ridiculously easy to get them if you have friends ingame or the time to pour in. I really don't know what are you talking about p2w. You only pay in this game in order to support the devs and reduce your own farming, not cuz something is behind a paywall.

Primed mods? Are you kidding? Buy them when they are in stock, its not like they're expensive. I made 1k ducats for paracesis in an hour. A single hour. And im lazy af. 

They're not in stock? Get a million creds which is ridiculously easy to get these days with the index available. Get 60-100 plats which once again, its ridiculosuly easy to get. Farm mods and primed parts, sell em. Easy money. Then buy the primed mod you want. 

Warframe its the least p2w game out there. Actually, no. Warframe its the only f2p game that doesnt have any p2w mechanic

Edited October 31, 2018 by Rayden_Tenno

[FrostDragoon]

8 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

@FrostDragoon, 

Please understand that I am not saying your idea has no value or merit. I am saying it is redundant as it relates to the game's existing landscape.

But discussions like that are collaborative efforts...

Bashing people because they don't like your idea, as stated, earns you just exactly as much push-back as you have right now. 

I don't think it's redundant because nothing in the game offers what I'm asking for. I agree that it should be collaborative, but most of these trolls don't even want to discuss it. They come in only looking to bash it without even reading the full context of it. I'm not bashing them for not liking the idea. I bash them for using tired, boring arguments that aren't convincing and for leveling personal attacks at me. Hilariously, they think I shouldn't respond in kind, so it's only okay for them to do it.

That said, I laid out a more concrete example a couple posts up. Maybe people would like to discuss that one? Maybe I should make that a new thread and let this one die?

[FrostDragoon]

1 minute ago, Rayden_Tenno said:

What game are you playing? I've spent almost 500 plats in the last week. I havent bought one single of those plats with real money. I've traded mods and prime parts which i can get for FREE. Maim? Got it for free. Prime sets? Its ridiculously easy to get them if you have friends ingame or the time to pour in. I really don't know what are you talking about p2w. You only pay in this game in order to support the devs and reduce your own farming, not cuz something is behind a paywall.

Primed mods? Are you kidding? Buy them when they are in stock, its not like they're expensive. I made 1k ducats for paracesis in an hour. A single hour. And im lazy af. 

They're not in stock? Get a million creds which is ridiculously easy to get these days with the index available. Get 60-100 plats which once again, its ridiculosuly easy to get. Farm mods and primed parts, sell em. Easy money. Then buy the primed mod you want. 

Warframe its the least p2w game out there. Actually, no. Warframe its the only f2p game thag doesnt have any p2w mechanic

You fail to realize that the plat you get is from other people who bought plat. The p2w aspect was subsidized to you, but it's still there all the same. Anyway, I'm done arguing about that point because it really has nothing to do with what I'm suggesting. Read through the thread. At least the last couple pages.

[MiMiren]

8 minutes ago, FrostDragoon said:

People are very clear that they want cosmetics left alone. I've said it repeatedly, but I will again: Fine. It can be a separate system. 

Read the title of your thread. Pretty sure this topic is over now.

Make a new thread. You are going off-topic in your own thread nonetheless.

[DeMonkey]

1 hour ago, (PS4)watt4hem said:

Pro tip : Actually read what people write, maybe? It helps you understand what they say.

 

Surprised no mod has lock this thread down yet. It's nothing but ad hominems.

@Letter13

*Insert complaint about there not being enough mods, and how this thread should never have survived 27 hours*

[FreelancerAgentTexas]

3 minutes ago, FrostDragoon said:

I don't think it's redundant because nothing in the game offers what I'm asking for. I agree that it should be collaborative, but most of these trolls don't even want to discuss it. They come in only looking to bash it without even reading the full context of it. I'm not bashing them for not liking the idea. I bash them for using tired, boring arguments that aren't convincing and for leveling personal attacks at me. Hilariously, they think I shouldn't respond in kind, so it's only okay for them to do it.

That said, I laid out a more concrete example a couple posts up. Maybe people would like to discuss that one? Maybe I should make that a new thread and let this one die?

Your more concrete example was far better, and gets your point across much better (Could have done without the insulting people who like cosmetics again). However, it seems unnecessary. You're just looking for ways to add stats to your gear that the current game doesn't allow. It doesn't need to be in the game, and ultimately, I think you've gone too big. 

[FrostDragoon]

3 minutes ago, NotDealwithitdog said:

Your more concrete example was far better, and gets your point across much better (Could have done without the insulting people who like cosmetics again). However, it seems unnecessary. You're just looking for ways to add stats to your gear that the current game doesn't allow. It doesn't need to be in the game, and ultimately, I think you've gone too big. 

Unnecessary doesn't sound like a real reason. I don't mean that dismissively either. I mean that people could have said the same about Rivens, Operators, Archwings, etc (and some did). Ultimately, those things are just more cool things to have and do and add to the experience of the game. I believe this would too.

[FrostDragoon]

7 minutes ago, MiMiren said:

Read the title of your thread. Pretty sure this topic is over now.

Make a new thread. You are going off-topic in your own thread nonetheless.

I just might, but I have to ask... Are people going to mindlessly attack that one with bad arguments and personal attacks too, or will they actually discuss its flaws/merits rationally?

[MasterBurik]

24 minutes ago, NotDealwithitdog said:

From what you've said, this has nothing unique to current mods, whereas arcanes do. You've only stated your idea to affect basic stats. That is less than what mods do. Arcanes may do the same in some situations, but they have specific triggers and are short effects.

Arcane Rage

On Headshot: 10% chance for +120% Damage on Primaries for 16 seconds.

Argon Scope

On Headshot: +135% Crit Chance while aiming for 9 seconds.

IMO, these description parameters are pretty damn similar. You could swap their state from Mod to Arcane and back again without making too much of a difference. The key thing is that that Arcanes and Mods create separate competition pools, giving players an additional level of build customization.

[Oreades]

9 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

*Insert complaint about there not being enough mods, and how this thread should never have survived 27 hours*

I'm legitimately impressed that it existed beyond three pages. 

[FreelancerAgentTexas]

1 minute ago, MasterBurik said:

Arcane Rage

On Headshot: 10% chance for +120% Damage on Primaries for 16 seconds.

Argon Scope

On Headshot: +135% Crit Chance while aiming for 9 seconds.

IMO, these description parameters are pretty damn similar. You could swap their state from Mod to Arcane and back again without making too much of a difference. The key thing is that that Arcanes and Mods create separate competition pools, giving players an additional level of build customization.

IMO, the key there is the 10% chance. Which may not matter to you, but it gives it enough difference in my eyes that it's not a consistent thing.

[MiMiren]

1 minute ago, FrostDragoon said:

I just might, but I have to ask... Are people going to mindlessly attack that one with bad arguments and personal attacks too, or will they actually discuss its flaws/merits rationally?

I don't know what other people told you but it seems quite obvious to me that binding cosmetics to game stats would just be a bad business move for DE. People would focus on getting usefull "cosmetics" and ignore others.

Result: Less cosmetics sold. Less money for DE.

If you are looking to add another stat boost system, then just make another thread about that. This one is done, you admitted it yourself.

[DeMonkey]

Just now, Oreades said:

I'm legitimately impressed that it existed beyond three pages. 

Not sure that's the word I'd use, to be honest I'm leaning more towards "worried".

[(PSN)the-creeperman]

2 minutes ago, Oreades said:

I'm legitimately impressed that it existed beyond three pages. 

Same here. It's definitely been a.. journey. 

Unfortunately, it's been futile.. cosmetics will always be just cosmetics.

[MasterBurik]

23 minutes ago, NotDealwithitdog said:

IMO, the key there is the 10% chance. Which may not matter to you, but it gives it enough difference in my eyes that it's not a consistent thing.

Except not every arcane functions in that manner. There are Operator, Amp, and Zaw Arcanes that give bonuses with or without additional criteria for activation. The same (lack of) rules apply to mods.

Edited October 31, 2018 by MasterBurik

[Rakosta_Kai]

22 minutes ago, FrostDragoon said:

I've said repeatedly that it's not the same as arcanes because arcanes don't offer what I'm talking about.

Arcanes and the Focus System offer exactly the functionality you are speaking of without the flat stats.

...It's why I threw an entirely different idea out there to you.

I'm not misunderstanding what you are saying...I am telling you that the idea is redundant implemented in with our current frames.

DE uses what is probably closest to describe as the Trinity or DnD class system with intended strengths and weaknesses for each frame.

They use their mod mechanic and incomparables to modify these but within what appears to be allowances imo.

19 minutes ago, FrostDragoon said:

I don't think it's redundant because nothing in the game offers what I'm asking for.

Your idea, implemented where you want it would will not get added where you want it without invalidating another feature or being redundant to it. 

Any stat they could add something to can be added via the Arcane or Focus systems now with the distinct trade-off not being able to pick something else.

...DE likes that kinda stuff.

As to the rest...I would personally say your idea has merit, but not where you want it applied... So think of how it can be applied where everyone stands to get something they want.

...I mention crafting because it's a rather static deal right now and costs upticks suggest that DE would like to get it out of our inventory.

DE is definitely interested in expanding this if the pet system is any indicator.

Likewise, it potentially becomes another cash cow for DE along with becoming the new hotness in creating Unique frames designs for players.

DE could literally start buying frame designs, (instead of purely tennogen) from players directly for these extra avatars which means the artists make out too.

...But that's just my opinion.

At the end of the day though, you need these folks to like and sell your idea...You won't get that via insults.

[FreelancerAgentTexas]

9 minutes ago, MasterBurik said:

Except not every arcane functions in that manner. There are Operator, Amp, and Zaw Arcanes that give bonuses with or without additional criteria for activation.

You can't mod those, though. They're essentially stand-ins.

[MasterBurik]

2 minutes ago, NotDealwithitdog said:

You can't mod those, though. They're essentially stand-ins.

Zaws. But that aside, the point remains that mods and arcanes are only different pools because DE chose to make them so. Their functionality is the same.

Edited October 31, 2018 by MasterBurik

[Lisztomaniac]

@FrostDragoonyoure too #*!%ing stupid to hold an argument so please stop trying, ima help you here tho, armors could have  1 socket, per piece, you get farmable modules for armors like:

 "ferrite shoulder armor module"- 50% of your WF armor turns into ferrite- stacks for 100% if equiped on both shoulders.

"Vigorous shoulder armor module" +X Base health

"Reinforced shoulder armor module" +x Base armor

"Energized shoulder armor module" +X base energy

"Erudite shoulder armor module" +X affinity per kill

"Protectors chestplate module" X% of damage received by teammates its redirected to you

"kinetic shoulder armor module" X energy on melee hit.

"ricochet armor module" X% chance of reflecting damage boosting it by xxxx%

"Rebound leg armor module" X% faster recovery speed.

"Karmic Leg armor module" X% chance to knockdown/stagger/kockback enemies in a X radius when knockeddown/staggered/knocked back.

would that be ok with you?  

 

 

 

[Rayden_Tenno]

 

46 minutes ago, FrostDragoon said:

You fail to realize that the plat you get is from other people who bought plat. The p2w aspect was subsidized to you, but it's still there all the same. Anyway, I'm done arguing about that point because it really has nothing to do with what I'm suggesting. Read through the thread. At least the last couple pages.

And? I've played for plat myself in the past cuz i wanted to. These devs deserve the support. That doesn't mean that it's p2w. People don't pay in order to get stuff that boost you and that you can't get unless its paying. People pay cuz these devs are a bless. I guess you must be one of those who wants everything handed on a silver plate, see any microtransactions and start screaming p2w.

[Rayden_Tenno]

39 minutes ago, FrostDragoon said:

I just might, but I have to ask... Are people going to mindlessly attack that one with bad arguments and personal attacks too, or will they actually discuss its flaws/merits rationally?

People are argumenting. You just can't stand that people have a different POV from yours. If you can't do that, don't express your opinion on a public forum.

[Corvid]

5 minutes ago, Lisztomaniac said:

@FrostDragoonyoure too #*!%ing stupid to hold an argument so please stop trying, ima help you here tho, armors could have  1 socket, per piece, you get farmable modules for armors like:

 "ferrite shoulder armor module"- 50% of your WF armor turns into ferrite- stacks for 100% if equiped on both shoulders.

"Vigorous shoulder armor module" +X Base health

"Reinforced shoulder armor module" +x Base armor

"Energized shoulder armor module" +X base energy

"Erudite shoulder armor module" +X affinity per kill

"Protectors chestplate module" X% of damage received by teammates its redirected to you

"kinetic shoulder armor module" X energy on melee hit.

"ricochet armor module" X% chance of reflecting damage boosting it by xxxx%

"Rebound leg armor module" X% faster recovery speed.

"Karmic Leg armor module" X% chance to knockdown/stagger/kockback enemies in a X radius when knockeddown/staggered/knocked back.

would that be ok with you?  

 

 

 

And for those of us who leave certain armour slots unused?

[Lisztomaniac]

il y a 5 minutes, Corvid a dit :

And for those of us who leave certain armour slots unused?

good point lol, perhaps a "show piece of armor on/off" could be added the way its on holdsters?

EDIT: sorry let me give a response styled after the OP: "YOU DONT UNDERSTAND YOU JERRY THATS NOT HOW IT WOULD WORK!"

Edited October 31, 2018 by Lisztomaniac

[Rakosta_Kai]

11 minutes ago, MasterBurik said:

Zaws. But that aside, the point remains that mods and arcanes are only different pools because DE chose to make them so. Their functionality is the same.

Very True.

How could the current idea be implemented in the current system without it being potentially duplicated by another mechanic.

[FrostDragoon]

20 minutes ago, Lisztomaniac said:

@FrostDragoonyoure too #*!%ing stupid to hold an argument so please stop trying, ima help you here tho, armors could have  1 socket, per piece, you get farmable modules for armors like:

 "ferrite shoulder armor module"- 50% of your WF armor turns into ferrite- stacks for 100% if equiped on both shoulders.

"Vigorous shoulder armor module" +X Base health

"Reinforced shoulder armor module" +x Base armor

"Energized shoulder armor module" +X base energy

"Erudite shoulder armor module" +X affinity per kill

"Protectors chestplate module" X% of damage received by teammates its redirected to you

"kinetic shoulder armor module" X energy on melee hit.

"ricochet armor module" X% chance of reflecting damage boosting it by xxxx%

"Rebound leg armor module" X% faster recovery speed.

"Karmic Leg armor module" X% chance to knockdown/stagger/kockback enemies in a X radius when knockeddown/staggered/knocked back.

would that be ok with you?  

 

 

 

If you read what I posted on the last page, you'd know that's not what I'm looking for, and the way you're describing it is exactly what people assumed I was talking about when it wasn't.