Desert Wind seems somewhat underpowered at higher levels.

[DeMonkey]

1 hour ago, Andele3025 said:

Only ignorance on display is you and how to play vs enemies above level 10.

I don't know quite how you've wrapped your head around that.

Regardless, you have claimed that:

1. Baruuk can perform finishers. This is false.

2. Baruuk's weapon can viably deal with Sorties. It can not.

3. Exalted weapon costs are for their "unusual features". Neither Artemis Bow nor the Iron Staff have "unusual features".

One is a beefier Cernos Prime, the other is a very short staff with Primed Reach equipped.

4. You have claimed Corrosive Projection as a solution, despite it blatantly not being one. You'd know this if you'd played him at all.

5. You have attempted to discredit our feedback by claiming we "want a different frame".

6. You have claimed that the design intent of the weapon is CC, despite it actually being really poor for CC, comparatively. You're not the devs and cannot state that this is design intent.

7. You have claimed he has 3-4 layers of "high DR", he obviously does not.

You don't have a clue what you're talking about, your posts are sad.

Edited December 20, 2018 by DeMonkey

[TKDancer]

4 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

No, you are ignoring the point, not only do you and OP seem to not understand hat if you are doing any high end content solo you pick the appropriate weapon (as in you dont crux your killing power on a exalted weapon designed for CC) or in the case of group play armor doesnt matter because 4 corrosive projections (or saryn) remove it all,

my dude, an exalted weapon isnt for CC, its a weapon, they are punches that send energy waves, they are meant to do damage, not only that the "CC" isnt effective as it prevents normal weapon usage, cause ya know, its an exalted weapon! trying to use Serene Storm to ragdoll enemies to then switch to weapons that actually do dmg is incredibly ineffective and nonsensical AND he also already has other CC methods and an ability to negate enemy dmg

and if im in a solo/public game i want to do dmg without having to rely on the armor stripping of others

[(XBOX)Onyx Schnee]

hey OP, mind if i ask for a test build(since i'm on xbox, so we don't have baruuk yet.)

 

could you try this setup out if you've polarized his exalted enough:

 

all 4 duel stat mods for viral and rad.

primed pressure and fury

drifting contact

condition overload.

 

and face off against the highest level corrupt bombard you can(this is my usual test target, but my current level cap is 120.) a corrupt gunner could help as well.

i need to know how this works for future reference.

[Guest]

Just curious, does shattering impact work with Baruuk's exalted in terms of the energy waves?

[DeMonkey]

18 minutes ago, (XB1)Orcus Imperium said:

hey OP, mind if i ask for a test build(since i'm on xbox, so we don't have baruuk yet.)

 

could you try this setup out if you've polarized his exalted enough:

 

all 4 duel stat mods for viral and rad.

primed pressure and fury

drifting contact

condition overload.

 

and face off against the highest level corrupt bombard you can(this is my usual test target, but my current level cap is 120.) a corrupt gunner could help as well.

i need to know how this works for future reference.

I haven't polarised at a, I have some time after work before I head off for a couple of days, will give it a try.

This will however give him (excluding power strength).

221 Impact,

221 Puncture,

221 Slash,

756 Viral,

756 Radiation.

38% Status chance.

I can't personally see this being even remotely effective, sadly. It's not a fast nor agile weapon to use so it would still take awhile to proc status effects, even if it had a 100% chance. 

Then there's absolutely no scaling on the waves, that is the only damage they will ever do.

You also have to consider that repeated hits with the weapon are quite hard due to it knocking enemies away.

Like I said though, I'll give it a try. Even if I can't get all the mods on it shouldn't be too hard to extrapolate.

6 minutes ago, Datam4ss said:

Just curious, does shattering impact work with Baruuk's exalted in terms of the energy waves?

I've read that it does, however see above, it's a fairly slow weapon anyway. Very different from normal sparring weapons that have you zipping around and attacking 20 million times a second.

Edited December 20, 2018 by DeMonkey

[(XBOX)Onyx Schnee]

3 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

I haven't polarised at a, I have some time after work before I head off for a couple of days, will give it a try.

This will however give him (excluding power strength).

221 Impact,

221 Puncture,

221 Slash,

756 Viral,

756 Radiation.

38% Status chance.

I can't personally see this being even remotely effective, sadly. It's not a fast nor agile weapon to use so it would still take awhile to proc status effects, even if it had a 100% chance. 

Then there's absolutely no scaling on the waves, that is the only damage they will ever do.

You also have to consider that repeated hits with the weapon are quite hard due to it knocking enemies away.

Like I said though, I'll give it a try. Even if I can't get all the mods on it shouldn't be too hard to extrapolate.

I've read that it does, however see above, it's a fairly slow weapon anyway. Very different from normal sparring weapons that have you zipping around and attacking 20 million times a second.

so the dmg effects are there(which is what matters with CO, dmg type really doesn't in the end as CO is just that good with what it does.) so the five procs will definitely provide a massive boost once all are applied.

 

hek, just a couple would be enough.

 

but i need to know it's final attack speed with primed fury. as long as it's a good 1.2 or something, it would be technically viable(again, citing my valkyr talon build for this, which takes advantage of speed over status chance since 10% is the bare minimum for CO to be worth using on a weapon.)

 

if it's still too slow with p.fury, then there is a problem

[Guest]

If some thought is given to it, the problem with Baruuk's 4 right now is that it attacks way too slowly or it would be somewhat usable, although not close to being top tier. The lack of status is another deal breaker.

1 minute ago, (XB1)Orcus Imperium said:

 

if it's still too slow with p.fury, then there is a problem

Even with Berserker at 75% the 4 of Baruuk still feels slow. Yes, I have the frame as I saved the plat to get him early and I do like his other 3 skills, with hard CC, a way to revive allies with no danger and a disarm.

Thing is, your Valkyr works because she attacks really fast, can proc a lot anyway and multihits. Baruuk doesn't. I think you will need both berserker and primed fury to even make Baruuk have a decent attack speed.

[(XBOX)Onyx Schnee]

1 minute ago, Datam4ss said:

If some thought is given to it, the problem with Baruuk's 4 right now is that it attacks way too slowly or it would be somewhat usable, although not close to being top tier. The lack of status is another deal breaker.

Even with Berserker at 75% the 4 of Baruuk still feels slow. Yes, I have the frame as I saved the plat to get him early and I do like his other 3 skills, with hard CC, a way to revive allies with no danger and a disarm.

Thing is, your Valkyr works because she attacks really fast, can proc a lot anyway and multihits. Baruuk doesn't. I think you will need both berserker and primed fury to even make Baruuk have a decent attack speed.

oh.

 

i see the issue now.

 

if a crit based weapon still feels slow after that, then it seriously needs buffed.

 

I personally will need to take a crack at him eventually to work it out myself(not undercutting your claims, i'm a "hands on" experimenter.)

personally, i need to know it's base attack speed and compare it to my talons to figure it out. but the multi hit thing compared to baruuk's slow single hits? yikes

[DeMonkey]

2 minutes ago, (XB1)Orcus Imperium said:

so the dmg effects are there(which is what matters with CO, dmg type really doesn't in the end as CO is just that good with what it does.) so the five procs will definitely provide a massive boost once all are applied.

 

hek, just a couple would be enough.

That's just it though, the chances are too small for such a bonus to be viable. 

You'll be lucky to get two, there isn't a hope in hell of 5.

3 minutes ago, (XB1)Orcus Imperium said:

but i need to know it's final attack speed with primed fury. as long as it's a good 1.2 or something, it would be technically viable(again, citing my valkyr talon build for this, which takes advantage of speed over status chance since 10% is the bare minimum for CO to be worth using on a weapon.)

 

if it's still too slow with p.fury, then there is a problem

The numerical stat isn't super relevant, as 1.00 for one weapon can be noticeably slower than 1.00 for another.

Regardless, not only is the weapon very slow to attack, as I mentioned it's slow to use as well. There's limited mobility in the stance and attacking slows you down. Plus you have to chase knocked away enemies as well.

Valkyr's talons hit several times in a single slide attack IIRC, making status certainly viable for it.

[(XBOX)Onyx Schnee]

1 minute ago, DeMonkey said:

That's just it though, the chances are too small for such a bonus to be viable. 

You'll be lucky to get two, there isn't a hope in hell of 5.

The numerical stat isn't super relevant, as 1.00 for one weapon can be noticeably slower than 1.00 for another.

Regardless, not only is the weapon very slow to attack, as I mentioned it's slow to use as well. There's limited mobility in the stance and attacking slows you down. Plus you have to chase knocked away enemies as well.

Valkyr's talons hit several times in a single slide attack IIRC, making status certainly viable for it.

holy hek that's sad.

 

i mean, normally a 1.00 would work(once more, citing my talons.) as even the friggin WAR becomes unstoppable with a CO build.

 

Desert wind could POSSIBLY(very strong on that word.) get away as a heal stick via life strike, since i here it doesn't drain energy...but that'd be very niche.

[DeMonkey]

15 minutes ago, (XB1)Orcus Imperium said:

holy hek that's sad.

 

i mean, normally a 1.00 would work(once more, citing my talons.) as even the friggin WAR becomes unstoppable with a CO build.

 

Desert wind could POSSIBLY(very strong on that word.) get away as a heal stick via life strike, since i here it doesn't drain energy...but that'd be very niche.

I'll record it at various attack speeds for you in a bit.

Edited December 20, 2018 by DeMonkey

[Elementalos]

5 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

if you are doing any high end content solo you pick the appropriate weapon

7 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

just tigris things to death

Telling someone to not bother using a weapon in a thread complaining about said weapon being underpowered sounds more like you're agreeing with him than disagreeing.

[DeMonkey]

@(XB1)Orcus Imperium

Attack Speed

Spoiler

 

Build you asked me to try.

Spoiler

 

Same enemies with Wukong.

Spoiler

 

I'm off now for the weekend, can't do any further testing.

Also, never really noticed this much before. Did you see just how often the attacks missed enemies right in front of me? Yikes...

Edited December 20, 2018 by DeMonkey

[Andele3025]

2 hours ago, Elementalos said:

Telling someone to not bother using a weapon in a thread complaining about said weapon being underpowered sounds more like you're agreeing with him than disagreeing.

Telling someone to stop using a axe as a hammer when trying to hammer nails in instead of chopping wood is not stating that a axe is bad at chopping wood, merely that if you wish to hammer a nail with a bloody damn axe AT LEAST have the decency to not use the blade, but its flat side (as in if doing "group" content treat it with 4 corrosive projections or use baruuks sleep to use the high crit and base damage for finisher kills when solo instead).

[DeMonkey]

7 minutes ago, Andele3025 said:

Telling someone to stop using a axe as a hammer when trying to hammer nails in instead of chopping wood is not stating that a axe is bad at chopping wood, merely that if you wish to hammer a nail with a bloody damn axe AT LEAST have the decency to not use the blade, but its flat side (as in if doing "group" content treat it with 4 corrosive projections or use baruuks sleep to use the high crit and base damage for finisher kills when solo instead).

This analogy is actually mind bogglingly ridiculous, just saying.

It's a weapon, we're trying to use it as a weapon, it's not functioning as a viable weapon.

And please actually read my posts. I've pointed out numerous times that the weapon doesn't have finishers, which makes your funny little side remark where you pretend to be smart equally ridiculous.

Edited December 20, 2018 by DeMonkey

[(XBOX)Vile Slanders]

9 hours ago, DeMonkey said:

3. Exalted weapon costs are for their "unusual features". Neither Artemis Bow nor the Iron Staff have "unusual features".

One is a beefier Cernos Prime, the other is a very short staff with Primed Reach equipped. 

Keep in mind, the Artemis bow predates the Cernos Prime; that multishot was unique to the Artemis Bow for quite a while. So in other words, the Cernos Prime is a cheap knock-off of the Artemis Bow. As for the Iron Staff? It has scaling range which does stack with Primed Reach, which constitutes as a unique feature; though if I'm honest it is pretty underwhelming.

Do they need to be Reworked/Revisted? In Ivara's case, hell no. In Wukong's case, hell yes. Hate to say it, but enemy level 100 isn't that high, and Grineer Heavy gunners don't have quite as high EHP as Grineer Napalms/Corrupted Heavies. While dropping level 100 Grineer heavies in 5 seconds flat may seem impressive, keep in mind the plethora of non-Exalted weaponry that can murder level 100 Armored Heavies in under a second, and don't even get me started on Exalted Monsters with ludicrously high TTK like Exalted Blade, Artemis Bow, Dex Pixia, or Peacekeepers.

With a base 10% status chance, I don't think Condition Overload is all that viable on Desert Storm. Sacrificial Pressure & Sacrificial Steel should boost the crit chance up to 105%, Shattering Impact is an option as well; a build utilizing 105% Crit, Shattering Impact, Berserker, Primed Fury & Gladiator Vice could potentially strip armor on large groups of enemies fairly quickly, but I dunno...

That ragdoll looks annoying as hell, and even with max speed to make use of Shattering Impact, Baruuk's TTK still isn't going to be all that impressive, especially given that the former suggestion uses up 6 of his 8 mod slots on Desert Storm. You could just go critacular with Gladiator Might/Organ Shatter on the last 2 slots, but I'd recommend dialing down the speed and increasing the power, maybe tossing in Drifting Contact if those multi-hitting waves count towards the combo counter. Otherwise, it looks like Baruuk could be absolutely boned in the TTK department.

*EDIT: Also, Desert Storm may not have finisher animations, but won't enemies receive finisher damage multipliers from standard melee attacks if they're asleep? I know it's not the same as a finisher, but it is something...

Edited December 20, 2018 by (XB1)Vile Slanders

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

Telling someone to stop using a axe as a hammer when trying to hammer nails in instead of chopping wood is not stating that a axe is bad at chopping wood, merely that if you wish to hammer a nail with a bloody damn axe AT LEAST have the decency to not use the blade, but its flat side (as in if doing "group" content treat it with 4 corrosive projections or use baruuks sleep to use the high crit and base damage for finisher kills when solo instead).

At this rate, really, with your constant attempts at taking things out of context, I don't know if you are just unaware of what is being discussed or if you are a troll, really.

The whole discussion is only on Desert Wind's viability as an Exalted. It does not care if Baruuk can use another gun/sword because we already know he is an awesome gun truck in the Wukong sense of "unkillable".

[DeMonkey]

1 hour ago, (XB1)Vile Slanders said:

Keep in mind, the Artemis bow predates the Cernos Prime; that multishot was unique to the Artemis Bow for quite a while. So in other words, the Cernos Prime is a cheap knock-off of the Artemis Bow. As for the Iron Staff? It has scaling range which does stack with Primed Reach, which constitutes as a unique feature; though if I'm honest it is pretty underwhelming.

Sure, but therefore Artemis Bow is no longer "unnatural".

And Wukong's staff grows to 200% range, whilst remaining shorter than all other staves. Also not "unnatural". 

For the rest you're agreeing with me, so I shan't comment.

Edited December 20, 2018 by DeMonkey

[(XBOX)Onyx Schnee]

5 hours ago, DeMonkey said:

@(XB1)Orcus Imperium

Attack Speed

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Build you asked me to try.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Same enemies with Wukong.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

I'm off now for the weekend, can't do any further testing.

Also, never really noticed this much before. Did you see just how often the attacks missed enemies right in front of me? Yikes...

Jeez....that’s horribly underwhelming 

[DeMonkey]

15 minutes ago, (XB1)Orcus Imperium said:

Jeez....that’s horribly underwhelming 

Agreed. 

I included the Wukong clip given his Unique weapon is generally considered to be... pretty terrible, just to show how much Baruuk's takes the cake.

Plus it allows me to show off the power of my build, which I don't get to do anywhere near enough.

[DeMonkey]

15 minutes ago, (XB1)Cubic Clem said:

Ever had the thought that Baruuk maybe wasn't meant as a pure damage dealer? 

I did.

I quickly squashed it when I realised how limited the CC potential of his fists are, and how it's supposed to be an edgy, unrestrained rage-esque mode.

At the end of the day, it's a weapon... That doesn't perform as a weapon, you know?

If it's supposed to be CC, then all elements of damage should be removed from it and the CC of it drastically buffed. 

Also remove the fact that it needs to be equipped, really any semblance of it being a weapon, remove it.

Edited December 20, 2018 by DeMonkey

[GPrime96]

3 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

unrestrained rage-esque mode.

Well, there’s already a Frame for that and it’s Valkyr.

[(XBOX)Vile Slanders]

4 minutes ago, (XB1)Cubic Clem said:

Ever had the thought that Baruuk maybe wasn't meant as a pure damage dealer? Only because it's exalted, doesn't mean it has to be on par with CO exalted blade . If they increase its status and CC (can't tell about CC) it's doing its job as it was meant to be. Crowd Control. You know, what Baruuk was advertised for. 

But that's just MO, probably faulty, because I enjoy frames that a different than "cast once and melt" .. oh well how silly I am..

That's fine dude; you can enjoy those types of frames. The problem with an Exalted Weapon Warframe is that they NEED to do damage. You can't use your guns or melee weapons while using your exalted weapon, so an under-performing Exalted Weapon basically locks your damage output. Given that a huge portion of Warframe's progression is based on enemy KPM, being able to dish out the DPS and achieve a competitive TTK is crucial to success.

CC is great when it is combined WITH damage. CC without damage is just stalling. As it currently stands, Vauban is a better option for Damage/CC than Baruuk, because Vauban can combo his CC with high TTK weaponry...

...And we all know how effective Vauban is in the meta...

[DeMonkey]

Just now, (XB1)Cubic Clem said:

You act like de has never ever touched a Warframe after release

I am?

Then why have I made a feedback thread?

Checkmate Clem. 

[DeMonkey]

10 minutes ago, (XB1)Cubic Clem said:

I'm just disagreeing to make it the next aoe exalted blade, that's all.. 😛

I'm not sure it would be, personally. And if such a thing happened it could be tweaked further.

However, if it's a choice between having it as it his now or having it be a conal EB then I'll pick conal EB, because this isn't really usable.